le the Chiro

[Guest guest]

le,

Where do you practice??

I am a 32 year old female with MS and use LDN and have been looking

into trying Chiro but have been afraid and nervous as I do not know

if the one that I try will have any knowlege of MS and what if

anything different treatment for me would entail.

Could you please help and if you know of anyone in Downtown Toronto

Canada that would be good that would help too.

Thanks

Jen

[Guest guest]

Hi Jen,

I practice just outside of Pittsburgh, PA, so I prpbably can't help

you but I can look into finding someone in Toronto for you. I have

several classmates in Canada. I'll e-mail you off the board with

names and addresses.

le

>

> le,

> Where do you practice??

> I am a 32 year old female with MS and use LDN and have been looking

> into trying Chiro but have been afraid and nervous as I do not know

> if the one that I try will have any knowlege of MS and what if

> anything different treatment for me would entail.

> Could you please help and if you know of anyone in Downtown Toronto

> Canada that would be good that would help too.

> Thanks

> Jen

[Guest guest]

dimas, My neuro says chiro is fine but don.t let them touch your neck. He

is the leading neurologis in Mich. Have you hears anything about the neck

thing?? Edie

[low dose naltrexone] le the Chiro

>

>

> le,

> Where do you practice??

> I am a 32 year old female with MS and use LDN and have been looking

> into trying Chiro but have been afraid and nervous as I do not know

> if the one that I try will have any knowlege of MS and what if

> anything different treatment for me would entail.

> Could you please help and if you know of anyone in Downtown Toronto

> Canada that would be good that would help too.

> Thanks

> Jen

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

No,

I do not know much about Chiro but I have heard no matter waht MS or

not no neck adjustments as it may cause a stroke

--- In low dose naltrexone , " edie " <edie1015@c...>

wrote:

> dimas, My neuro says chiro is fine but don.t let them touch your

neck. He

> is the leading neurologis in Mich. Have you hears anything about

the neck

> thing?? Edie

> [low dose naltrexone] le the Chiro

>

>

> >

> >

> > le,

> > Where do you practice??

> > I am a 32 year old female with MS and use LDN and have been

looking

> > into trying Chiro but have been afraid and nervous as I do not

know

> > if the one that I try will have any knowlege of MS and what if

> > anything different treatment for me would entail.

> > Could you please help and if you know of anyone in Downtown

Toronto

> > Canada that would be good that would help too.

> > Thanks

> > Jen

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

right. We just discussed that here. My chiros have been adjusting me from head to toe since 1989, MS and all; C5 lesions, T5 area of sclerosis, and L5 SBO that they told me on my first visit they thought I had.

One person had a stroke a gazillion years ago in Toronto and they blamed it on her chiropractor. Maybe she'd have had a stroke anyway. Ok, also, maybe not all chiros are A students.. some could be D students. Gotta pick who you feel comfortable with, they have your life force in their hands, for sure.

[low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

No,I do not know much about Chiro but I have heard no matter waht MS or not no neck adjustments as it may cause a stroke> dimas, My neuro says chiro is fine but don.t let them touch your neck. He > is the leading neurologis in Mich. Have you hears anything about the neck > thing?? Edie>

[Guest guest]

Your so right about the "D " student thing I was in to one once that gave me such a cranking around that I was shuddering uncontrollably and had tears running out of my eyes, and not from laughter either, after asking around I was told by others that this guy would more than likely bury you,

It wasn't long and he was no longer in town but I also heard he got out of business later too.

Since then I always ask for referals from people who have been to them previously, had some darn good results too.

Reg.

-- Re: [low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

right. We just discussed that here. My chiros have been adjusting me from head to toe since 1989, MS and all; C5 lesions, T5 area of sclerosis, and L5 SBO that they told me on my first visit they thought I had.

One person had a stroke a gazillion years ago in Toronto and they blamed it on her chiropractor. Maybe she'd have had a stroke anyway. Ok, also, maybe not all chiros are A students.. some could be D students. Gotta pick who you feel comfortable with, they have your life force in their hands, for sure.

[low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

No,I do not know much about Chiro but I have heard no matter waht MS or not no neck adjustments as it may cause a stroke> dimas, My neuro says chiro is fine but don.t let them touch your neck. He > is the leading neurologis in Mich. Have you hears anything about the neck > thing?? Edie>

[Guest guest]

Reg/Larry/All:

There are clearly good chiros and bad chiros, but overall, it's a

pretty safe mode of treatment, I think. Can chiropractic adjustment

cause a stroke? Here's a study that found a positive correlation in

patients under 45, but not those over 45.

http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/32/5/1054

Here's a chiropractic journal article disputing the prior one:

http://www.worldchiropracticalliance.org/positions/stroke.htm

A great stat from that article-- " It has been estimated that (the risk

of stroke caused by chiropractic adjustment) is even less than that

of " beauty parlor stroke syndrome " -- a rare occurrence triggered

when a customer leans her head back on a sink to get her hair washed. "

So is there a risk? Yes. Is it a large risk? Doesn't seem like one,

but it's not zero. For contrast, see this article just published

about medication mistakes and their effects:

http://tinyurl.com/3usjh

" Between 44,000 and 98,000 hospitalized Americans die every year from

medical errors of all kinds. " And those are just the ones in the

hospital, not outpatient.

So, giving medicine the benefit of the doubt, let's say 200 people

die per year from chiropractic adustments. Contrast that to 44,000

to 98,000 dead every year from medical errors. Hell, the FDA

estimates that Vioxx alone contributed to 27,000 deaths between 1999

an 2003; that's 5,400 per year just from one medication:

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/vioxx_estimates.html

Sorry for the rant, but my point is that neither medical treatment

nor any other treatment, including chiropractic, is risk free; as

patients (i.e. informed consumers), we must weigh the risks for every

procedure/medication/etc. ourselves.

[Guest guest]

Thank you for your answer,

I have been offline for the last few days due to a death in the

family. Yes, there is a chance of stroke and injury from a neck

adjustment. Is it common....NO absolutely not. There is a much

greater risk of injury or death due to taking prescription drugs or

having surgery. If the stroke risk was high there would be no chiros

in business because our malpractice would be astronomical(and it's

not). I have received thousands of neck adjustments and have given

thousands this year alone. Would I be in business if I was injuring

or killing people....NO. I am familiar with the first study

posted and it was done by who?..a bunch of neuros. Neuros believe in

chiropractic as much as they believe in LDN (as Larry nicely put it).

Get recommendations from friends or family when looking for a decent

chiropractor. Like any other profession, there are good ones and not

so good ones. Check out the American Chiropractic Associations

website. I believe they have a search for chiropractors in your area.

Since this is rather " Off topic, " feel free to e-mail me off the

board to discuss further.

le Marra, DC

>

> Reg/Larry/All:

>

> There are clearly good chiros and bad chiros, but overall, it's a

> pretty safe mode of treatment, I think. Can chiropractic

adjustment

> cause a stroke? Here's a study that found a positive correlation

in

> patients under 45, but not those over 45.

> http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/32/5/1054

>

> Here's a chiropractic journal article disputing the prior one:

> http://www.worldchiropracticalliance.org/positions/stroke.htm

>

> A great stat from that article-- " It has been estimated that (the

risk

> of stroke caused by chiropractic adjustment) is even less than that

> of " beauty parlor stroke syndrome " -- a rare occurrence triggered

> when a customer leans her head back on a sink to get her hair

washed. "

>

> So is there a risk? Yes. Is it a large risk? Doesn't seem like

one,

> but it's not zero. For contrast, see this article just published

> about medication mistakes and their effects:

>

> http://tinyurl.com/3usjh

>

> " Between 44,000 and 98,000 hospitalized Americans die every year

from

> medical errors of all kinds. " And those are just the ones in the

> hospital, not outpatient.

>

> So, giving medicine the benefit of the doubt, let's say 200 people

> die per year from chiropractic adustments. Contrast that to 44,000

> to 98,000 dead every year from medical errors. Hell, the FDA

> estimates that Vioxx alone contributed to 27,000 deaths between

1999

> an 2003; that's 5,400 per year just from one medication:

> http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/vioxx_estimates.html

>

> Sorry for the rant, but my point is that neither medical treatment

> nor any other treatment, including chiropractic, is risk free; as

> patients (i.e. informed consumers), we must weigh the risks for

every

> procedure/medication/etc. ourselves.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

thanks for the website......under the listing of technique used it stated Pierce....what is this

DeLores

decrosby@...

-----Original Message-----From: le [mailto:drdlm2000@...] Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2004 10:51 AMlow dose naltrexone Subject: [low dose naltrexone] Re: le the ChiroThank you for your answer,I have been offline for the last few days due to a death in the family. Yes, there is a chance of stroke and injury from a neck adjustment. Is it common....NO absolutely not. There is a much greater risk of injury or death due to taking prescription drugs or having surgery. If the stroke risk was high there would be no chiros in business because our malpractice would be astronomical(and it's not). I have received thousands of neck adjustments and have given thousands this year alone. Would I be in business if I was injuring or killing people....NO. I am familiar with the first study posted and it was done by who?..a bunch of neuros. Neuros believe in chiropractic as much as they believe in LDN (as Larry nicely put it). Get recommendations from friends or family when looking for a decent chiropractor. Like any other profession, there are good ones and not so good ones. Check out the American Chiropractic Associations website. I believe they have a search for chiropractors in your area. Since this is rather "Off topic," feel free to e-mail me off the board to discuss further.le Marra, DC> > Reg/Larry/All:> > There are clearly good chiros and bad chiros, but overall, it's a > pretty safe mode of treatment, I think. Can chiropractic adjustment > cause a stroke? Here's a study that found a positive correlation in > patients under 45, but not those over 45.> http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/32/5/1054> > Here's a chiropractic journal article disputing the prior one:> http://www.worldchiropracticalliance.org/positions/stroke.htm> > A great stat from that article--"It has been estimated that (the risk > of stroke caused by chiropractic adjustment) is even less than that > of "beauty parlor stroke syndrome" -- a rare occurrence triggered > when a customer leans her head back on a sink to get her hair washed."> > So is there a risk? Yes. Is it a large risk? Doesn't seem like one, > but it's not zero. For contrast, see this article just published > about medication mistakes and their effects:> > http://tinyurl.com/3usjh> > "Between 44,000 and 98,000 hospitalized Americans die every year from > medical errors of all kinds." And those are just the ones in the > hospital, not outpatient.> > So, giving medicine the benefit of the doubt, let's say 200 people > die per year from chiropractic adustments. Contrast that to 44,000 > to 98,000 dead every year from medical errors. Hell, the FDA > estimates that Vioxx alone contributed to 27,000 deaths between 1999 > an 2003; that's 5,400 per year just from one medication:> http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/vioxx_estimates.html> > Sorry for the rant, but my point is that neither medical treatment > nor any other treatment, including chiropractic, is risk free; as > patients (i.e. informed consumers), we must weigh the risks for every > procedure/medication/etc. ourselves. > > >

[Guest guest]

Has this article come up in conversation?

http://www.news-medical.net/?id=4689

-----Original Message-----From: delores crosby [mailto:decrosby@...]Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2004 11:05 AMlow dose naltrexone Subject: RE: [low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

thanks for the website......under the listing of technique used it stated Pierce....what is this

DeLores

decrosby@...

-----Original Message-----From: le [mailto:drdlm2000@...] Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2004 10:51 AMlow dose naltrexone Subject: [low dose naltrexone] Re: le the ChiroThank you for your answer,I have been offline for the last few days due to a death in the family. Yes, there is a chance of stroke and injury from a neck adjustment. Is it common....NO absolutely not. There is a much greater risk of injury or death due to taking prescription drugs or having surgery. If the stroke risk was high there would be no chiros in business because our malpractice would be astronomical(and it's not). I have received thousands of neck adjustments and have given thousands this year alone. Would I be in business if I was injuring or killing people....NO. I am familiar with the first study posted and it was done by who?..a bunch of neuros. Neuros believe in chiropractic as much as they believe in LDN (as Larry nicely put it). Get recommendations from friends or family when looking for a decent chiropractor. Like any other profession, there are good ones and not so good ones. Check out the American Chiropractic Associations website. I believe they have a search for chiropractors in your area. Since this is rather "Off topic," feel free to e-mail me off the board to discuss further.le Marra, DC> > Reg/Larry/All:> > There are clearly good chiros and bad chiros, but overall, it's a > pretty safe mode of treatment, I think. Can chiropractic adjustment > cause a stroke? Here's a study that found a positive correlation in > patients under 45, but not those over 45.> http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/32/5/1054> > Here's a chiropractic journal article disputing the prior one:> http://www.worldchiropracticalliance.org/positions/stroke.htm> > A great stat from that article--"It has been estimated that (the risk > of stroke caused by chiropractic adjustment) is even less than that > of "beauty parlor stroke syndrome" -- a rare occurrence triggered > when a customer leans her head back on a sink to get her hair washed."> > So is there a risk? Yes. Is it a large risk? Doesn't seem like one, > but it's not zero. For contrast, see this article just published > about medication mistakes and their effects:> > http://tinyurl.com/3usjh> > "Between 44,000 and 98,000 hospitalized Americans die every year from > medical errors of all kinds." And those are just the ones in the > hospital, not outpatient.> > So, giving medicine the benefit of the doubt, let's say 200 people > die per year from chiropractic adustments. Contrast that to 44,000 > to 98,000 dead every year from medical errors. Hell, the FDA > estimates that Vioxx alone contributed to 27,000 deaths between 1999 > an 2003; that's 5,400 per year just from one medication:> http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/vioxx_estimates.html> > Sorry for the rant, but my point is that neither medical treatment > nor any other treatment, including chiropractic, is risk free; as > patients (i.e. informed consumers), we must weigh the risks for every > procedure/medication/etc. ourselves. > > >

[Guest guest]

See here for commentary (bostoncure.org:

http://tinyurl.com/6nrct

> Has this article come up in conversation?

>

> http://www.news-medical.net/?id=4689

>

[Guest guest]

Very sorry to hear about your loss le..our prayers are with you.

Glad though that we have a chiropractor in our midst as I totally

believe in this most excellent therapy. Would also, probably be much

worse off without chiropractic adjustments for the past (almost 30)

years! We all heard about the 1 pt. who suffered an unfortunate stroke

after a neck adjustment, but like many of our alternative supplements

and therapies, there are those out there who would love to blow it

totally out of proportion.

Mankind could not begin to list the people who have died due to

misdiagnosis from General Practitioners or Surgeons or drug reactions

that our governments seem to turn a blind eye to. Mainstream medicine

is very slowly accepting the fact that like other alternative

therapies, chiropractors are not going to go away; because more and

more people are finding drastically improved health by even just a

couple of visits. I remember signing the consent form at my

chiropractors office after that " 1 " very unfortunate incident. How

many people died because of Vioxx and now Celebrex??? I can only pray

that judgment day will soon arrive for these money hungry drug

companies!

On 22-Dec-04, at 8:51 AM, le wrote:

>

> Thank you for your answer,

>

> I have been offline for the last few days due to a death in the

> family. Yes, there is a chance of stroke and injury from a neck

> adjustment. Is it common....NO absolutely not. There is a much

> greater risk of injury or death due to taking prescription drugs or

> having surgery. If the stroke risk was high there would be no chiros

> in business because our malpractice would be astronomical(and it's

> not). I have received thousands of neck adjustments and have given

> thousands this year alone. Would I be in business if I was injuring

> or killing people....NO. I am familiar with the first study

> posted and it was done by who?..a bunch of neuros. Neuros believe in

> chiropractic as much as they believe in LDN (as Larry nicely put it).

> Get recommendations from friends or family when looking for a decent

> chiropractor. Like any other profession, there are good ones and not

> so good ones. Check out the American Chiropractic Associations

> website. I believe they have a search for chiropractors in your area.

> Since this is rather " Off topic, " feel free to e-mail me off the

> board to discuss further.

>

> le Marra, DC

>

>

> >

> > Reg/Larry/All:

> >

> > There are clearly good chiros and bad chiros, but overall, it's a

> > pretty safe mode of treatment, I think.  Can chiropractic

> adjustment

> > cause a stroke?  Here's a study that found a positive correlation

> in

> > patients under 45, but not those over 45.

> > http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/32/5/1054

> >

> > Here's a chiropractic journal article disputing the prior one:

> > http://www.worldchiropracticalliance.org/positions/stroke.htm

> >

> > A great stat from that article-- " It has been estimated that (the

> risk

> > of stroke caused by chiropractic adjustment) is even less than that

> > of " beauty parlor stroke syndrome " -- a rare occurrence triggered

> > when a customer leans her head back on a sink to get her hair

> washed. "

> >

> > So is there a risk?  Yes. Is it a large risk?  Doesn't seem like

> one,

> > but it's not zero.  For contrast, see this article just published

> > about medication mistakes and their effects:

> >

> > http://tinyurl.com/3usjh

> >

> > " Between 44,000 and 98,000 hospitalized Americans die every year

> from

> > medical errors of all kinds. "   And those are just the ones in the

> > hospital, not outpatient.

> >

> > So, giving medicine the benefit of the doubt, let's say 200 people

> > die per year from chiropractic adustments.  Contrast that to 44,000

> > to 98,000 dead every year from medical errors.  Hell, the FDA

> > estimates that Vioxx alone contributed to 27,000 deaths between

> 1999

> > an 2003; that's 5,400 per year just from one medication:

> > http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/vioxx_estimates.html

> >

> > Sorry for the rant, but my point is that neither medical treatment

> > nor any other treatment, including chiropractic, is risk free; as

> > patients (i.e. informed consumers), we must weigh the risks for

> every

> > procedure/medication/etc. ourselves. 

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you for verification kathy, my hisband, as i have said before almost died from lipitor. he was in a coma for a week. Edie aka roxanne

Re: [low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

Very sorry to hear about your loss le..our prayers are with you. Glad though that we have a chiropractor in our midst as I totally believe in this most excellent therapy. Would also, probably be much worse off without chiropractic adjustments for the past (almost 30) years! We all heard about the 1 pt. who suffered an unfortunate stroke after a neck adjustment, but like many of our alternative supplements and therapies, there are those out there who would love to blow it totally out of proportion. Mankind could not begin to list the people who have died due to misdiagnosis from General Practitioners or Surgeons or drug reactions that our governments seem to turn a blind eye to. Mainstream medicine is very slowly accepting the fact that like other alternative therapies, chiropractors are not going to go away; because more and more people are finding drastically improved health by even just a couple of visits. I remember signing the consent form at my chiropractors office after that "1" very unfortunate incident. How many people died because of Vioxx and now Celebrex??? I can only pray that judgment day will soon arrive for these money hungry drug companies! On 22-Dec-04, at 8:51 AM, le wrote:

Thank you for your answer,I have been offline for the last few days due to a death in the family. Yes, there is a chance of stroke and injury from a neckadjustment. Is it common....NO absolutely not. There is a much greater risk of injury or death due to taking prescription drugs or having surgery. If the stroke risk was high there would be no chiros in business because our malpractice would be astronomical(and it's not). I have received thousands of neck adjustments and have given thousands this year alone. Would I be in business if I was injuring or killing people....NO. I am familiar with the first study posted and it was done by who?..a bunch of neuros. Neuros believe in chiropractic as much as they believe in LDN (as Larry nicely put it). Get recommendations from friends or family when looking for a decent chiropractor. Like any other profession, there are good ones and not so good ones. Check out the American Chiropractic Associationswebsite. I believe they have a search for chiropractors in your area. Since this is rather "Off topic," feel free to e-mail me off the board to discuss further.le Marra, DC> > Reg/Larry/All:> > There are clearly good chiros and bad chiros, but overall, it's a > pretty safe mode of treatment, I think. Can chiropracticadjustment > cause a stroke? Here's a study that found a positive correlationin > patients under 45, but not those over 45.> http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/32/5/1054> > Here's a chiropractic journal article disputing the prior one:> http://www.worldchiropracticalliance.org/positions/stroke.htm> > A great stat from that article--"It has been estimated that (the risk > of stroke caused by chiropractic adjustment) is even less than that > of "beauty parlor stroke syndrome" -- a rare occurrence triggered > when a customer leans her head back on a sink to get her hair washed."> > So is there a risk? Yes. Is it a large risk? Doesn't seem like one, > but it's not zero. For contrast, see this article just published > about medication mistakes and their effects:> > http://tinyurl.com/3usjh> > "Between 44,000 and 98,000 hospitalized Americans die every year from > medical errors of all kinds." And those are just the ones in the > hospital, not outpatient.> > So, giving medicine the benefit of the doubt, let's say 200 people > die per year from chiropractic adustments. Contrast that to 44,000 > to 98,000 dead every year from medical errors. Hell, the FDA > estimates that Vioxx alone contributed to 27,000 deaths between 1999 > an 2003; that's 5,400 per year just from one medication:> http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/vioxx_estimates.html> > Sorry for the rant, but my point is that neither medical treatment > nor any other treatment, including chiropractic, is risk free; as > patients (i.e. informed consumers), we must weigh the risks for every > procedure/medication/etc. ourselves. > > >

[Guest guest]

Chiropractic techniques have been around much longer than 'modern' medicine. As in any field, I am sure there are some 'quacks' there (for lack of a better word) just like in traditional medicine. I've read somewhere that doctors & hospitals are very high on the list for unnecessary deaths, so I'm not going to be one of those followers who thinks that a 'real MD' has all the answers. Any half-way intelligent person should be able to make a decision based on what they are comfortable with, without criticism from anyone.

Marcie

[Guest guest]

LarryGC,

If you look at the studies, they're talking about *hundreds* of cases of strokes

and

artery dissections which are normally rare but occurring 5X as often in people

who

had received chiropractic treatment to their necks. That is much different than

one

case 'a gazillion' years ago. Although I have neck pain, I would *NEVER* let a

chiropractor touch my neck.

Isn't there something wrong with having to go back repeatedly for 'adjustments'

over

the course of 15 years? I don't want to start a flame war here, but for a

technique

that has little to no scientific basis, chiropractors have done an amazing job

with PR,

so much so that many insurance companies will cover some treatments. This is

about

money and job security for them, rather than getting to the source of your

illness or

helping your body heal.

While no doubt there could be a great placebo effect to having someone rub on

you,

making popping and cracking noises come from your spine, given the liklihood of

harm (and monetary loss!) coming to you, you'd be much better off going to a

massage or bodywork therapist, a physical therapist, acupuncturist, or a D.O.

for

treatment, rather than a 'chiro' who'll keep you coming back week after week,

and

could very well be doing you more harm than good.

Just MO.

Happy New year, everyone!

-skat

> > dimas, My neuro says chiro is fine but don.t let them touch your

> neck. He

> > is the leading neurologis in Mich. Have you hears anything about

> the neck

> > thing?? Edie

> >

[Guest guest]

> If you look at the studies, they're talking about *hundreds* of

cases of strokes and artery dissections which are normally rare but

occurring 5X as often in people who had received chiropractic

Hi,

I would appreciate any links to specific studies on this. All I could

find was the canadian study, and it is summed up as low risk vs.

potential benefit ( " nine of the 582 stroke patients had undergone a

neck manipulation within one week of their stroke...Other studies,

including one covering a 28-year period reviewing 110 million

chiropractic visits, showed conclusively that the risk of stroke from

chiropractic adjustments is so small that it's statistically

insignificant " ). http://my.webmd.com/content/article/32/1728_80109

Also, I found some research from Journal of Subluxation saying that

adjustments benefit MS & PD

http://www.jvsr.com/abstracts/index.asp?id=205

" 40 of 44 (91%) MS cases and 34 of 37 (92%) PD cases showed

symptomatic improvement and no further disease progression during the

[5 yr] care period "

I went to the chiro for the first time 12/27, and 3 days later

suddenly burst into a normal stride w/o stiffness at physical

therapy. So I am encouraged to continue, but also always wary! I

appreciate the chance to debate these important issues with this

group.

SammyJo

[Guest guest]

Not long ago, maybe in Aug '04, upper cervicle injuries were mentioned as possibly contributing to MS. Some study was done there also. I guess if we look hard enough, we can find justification for anything. Doesn't matter which side of the fence we're on! Personally, a good chiro is hard to beat!

Marcie

In a message dated 1/4/2005 1:39:28 AM Central Standard Time, redtruck99@... writes:

I went to the chiro for the first time 12/27, and 3 days later suddenly burst into a normal stride w/o stiffness at physical therapy. So I am encouraged to continue, but also always wary! I appreciate the chance to debate these important issues with this group.

SammyJo

[Guest guest]

Perhaps those who are prone to stroke seek chiropractic adjustments. Who knows if/when they'd have had a stroke if they never went to the chiro, maybe a lot sooner. Who knows how drastic the stroke would be if they didn't go.

I also read a statistic that said 98% of Driver caused accidents happened with drivers behind the wheel. Other than wondering who the heck was driving in that 2%, it should certainly keep you from ever driving.

I guess you would have to know your medical history, know what you're experiencing, and make your own choices.

Why do you have to brush your teeth? I already brushed them when I was 5, why do I have to keep doing it every day, day in, day out, day in day out.

Heck, I've been taking LDN 629 days now, why do I have to keep taking it? Why can't I just take it once and be done with it?

Why is it recommended I go see a doctor every 3 months and a neuro every 6 months?

How come someone who enters therapy at age 18 is still going to the same therapist 20 years later at 38? Not only that, but most of them aren't any better than they were at 18.

Everyone makes their own choices.

I can't fathom how life would have transpired after 12/89 when I started chiropractic. I can't fathom how life would have transpired if I didn't find Wayne Dyer in 1993. I can't fathom how my MS memory issues would have destroyed my career and life if I hadn't found lin Time Management in 1995.

And I can't imagine how the last 629 days would have been if I hadn't started LDN when I did. I was going down hill fast.

There's no placebo effect in any of the 4 things I have found that helps me greatly. And now knowing I have MS, it helps me even more. The 3 were helping me before I knew I had MS, and now LDN is working well with everything else. I Hope it stands the test of time, too.

Happy New Year to you too.

[low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

LarryGC,If you look at the studies, they're talking about *hundreds* of cases of strokes and artery dissections which are normally rare but occurring 5X as often in people who had received chiropractic treatment to their necks. That is much different than one case 'a gazillion' years ago. Although I have neck pain, I would *NEVER* let a chiropractor touch my neck.Isn't there something wrong with having to go back repeatedly for 'adjustments' over the course of 15 years? I don't want to start a flame war here, but for a technique that has little to no scientific basis, chiropractors have done an amazing job with PR, so much so that many insurance companies will cover some treatments. This is about money and job security for them, rather than getting to the source of your illness or helping your body heal.While no doubt there could be a great placebo effect to having someone rub on you, making popping and cracking noises come from your spine, given the liklihood of harm (and monetary loss!) coming to you, you'd be much better off going to a massage or bodywork therapist, a physical therapist, acupuncturist, or a D.O. for treatment, rather than a 'chiro' who'll keep you coming back week after week, and could very well be doing you more harm than good.

[Guest guest]

Those who know, do; those who fear, criticize.

Re: [low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

Chiropractic techniques have been around much longer than 'modern' medicine. As in any field, I am sure there are some 'quacks' there (for lack of a better word) just like in traditional medicine. I've read somewhere that doctors & hospitals are very high on the list for unnecessary deaths, so I'm not going to be one of those followers who thinks that a 'real MD' has all the answers. Any half-way intelligent person should be able to make a decision based on what they are comfortable with, without criticism from anyone.

[Guest guest]

Well said, Larry.

Re: [low dose naltrexone] Re: le the Chiro

Perhaps those who are prone to stroke seek chiropractic adjustments. Who knows if/when they'd have had a stroke if they never went to the chiro, maybe a lot sooner. Who knows how drastic the stroke would be if they didn't go.

I also read a statistic that said 98% of Driver caused accidents happened with drivers behind the wheel. Other than wondering who the heck was driving in that 2%, it should certainly keep you from ever driving.