Re: Some comments on spiro and other meds/drugs that cause decreased male hormones

[Guest guest]

I got the obvious breast enlargement - we could clearly see the difference, though it was slight, and definitely the pain on spiro. But both are gone and went away as the dose of spiro decreased. No problems with either now.

Some things definitely decrease testosterone and contribute to the "feminization" of men, such as opioid pain medications, methadone being the most studied, that is often ignored, but widely widely widely prescribed. This is lately a topic getting more and more discussion because as we have seen the chronic and epidemic use of opioids, prescribed or not, being used, the incidence of decreased testosterone is rising and a more feminization of men occuring. But many women complaining more of low libido and not in the mood - opioids decrease a womens T which they need to feel in the mood more. Not much studies available I can find as to how we adapt after that when stopping pain meds. They decrease bone density too.

It is known they decrease testosterone and LH, and increase prolactin and GH. In addition they may also - well studies say they do - contribute to insulin resistance which then contributes to alot of other things..

I used to spend easy half the day, if not more, just dealing in pain meds. My clinic friends up the street said it is a little above 60% for them - pain med refill and pain related visits. It has become beyond an epidemic and deaths from PRESCRIPTION pain medicine surpassed car accidents for the first time this year. I am not against them, but I am getting there.

Working in family medicine I would see people all the time who preached "holistic care" UNTIL they wanted to refill their pain meds, then they would take them, but they were always in "pain" and any discussion in the men of impotence and pain meds, or low libido and pain meds wasn't met positively because they always "needed" their pain meds. They'd stop and/or change BP meds, change cholesterol meds, but never change pain meds. If I stopped them they went somewhere else.. Sadly, as an aside, I knew and could tell they most often seemed to be treating depression and stress with opioids - and I do feel they are life's real antidepressants because they alone, with cocaine, cause honest and true euphoria and positive mood (euphora doesn't always mean someone is dancing on the ceiling - it often means they felt more toward their own baseline.) If we can harvest it, and get rid of the damn

baggage of addiction and dependence we would actually have a cure for depression since SSRI's are one of the biggest scams on people ever known in my opinion. But either way people realize they help other things beside pain, but have to have pain to be able to stay on them, and the abuse is rampant.

But it's the baggage of addiction and tolerance (needing more and more), or people "aniticipating" future stress so they start taking more and ahead of schedule, that is the downfall. and making the issues with men especially. Plus I have my own hunch, given the Heath Ledgers and others that even when not taken in high doses they seem to causing something. I suspect it's not always the breathing as we are assuming killed these stars like ledger and Corey Haim and , but something (and we find them all also on ambien or benzo's) is a fatal arrythmia of some type due to a mix of something.

Alot of people are or have been on both spiro and chronic pain meds. This may exacerbate and speed up alot of things in men and women,

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22515135

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20955216

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19903933

http://www.mensfaq.com/en/gynecomastia/

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/580813_4

From: <jclark24p@...>Subject: Re: Some comments on spiro and test and a brief history of Aldosterone Stimulating Hormone AKA renin and AII. Maybe more that you wanted to know on Hx of aldo.hyperaldosteronism Date: Friday, May 4, 2012, 4:30 PM

Here are three studies that I found in less than 15 minutes - Guess I will leave the care of my boobs in Dr. Webster's hands!Cytomorphology of male breast lesions: diagnostic pitfalls and clinical implications. M, Masood S. SourceDepartment of Pathology and Laboratory Medicine, University of Florida College of Medicine-ville, ville, Florida 32209, USA.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22246937Breast cancer in males.http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21951882Gynecomastia – evaluation and current treatment options Ruth E , A Kermott, and M Hassan Muradhttp://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3071351/pdf/tcrm-7-145.pdf> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since I decided to give Cortisol a rest I > > got> > > > bored> > > > > > > > and decided I'd see what "extras" Spironolactone might be> > > > doing> > > > > > for> > > > > > > > the ladies, didn't have to look far!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hypoactive sexual desire disorder in> > > > premenopausal> > > > > > > > women: case studies.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22314119> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do you really need less Androgen?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >>

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[Guest guest]

, how long were you on spiro and what dose? (I have read if under a year

regression is likely.) I was on methadone and oxycodone and my 20+ years on you

probably didn't help! All reasons I advocate a good HX and testing if one is

going to RX a drug!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Since I decided to give Cortisol a rest I

> > > got

> > > > > bored

> > > > > > > > > and decided I'd see what " extras " Spironolactone might be

> > > > > doing

> > > > > > > for

> > > > > > > > > the ladies, didn't have to look far!

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hypoactive sexual desire disorder in

> > > > > premenopausal

> > > > > > > > > women: case studies.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22314119

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do you really need less Androgen?

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