Re: Re: OT: More to Love?

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I don't know anything about this show - but I don't watch much TV so I doubt I will. Kassia raised a good point about the media and body image though - I was so shocked by this - and I was meaning to post about it - but just haven't had the time, but now since we're talking about it, I will!The other day my DD told me she didn't like the way she looked - now she is 6 (or will be on Sunday!) I didn't think this stuff happened quite so soon. When I was 6 I'm not even sure I considered how I looked. So, I questioned her a bit about it and she told me that she didn't like her hair b/c it doesn't lay flat (she has very fine blonde hair, so it is prone to fly-aways!) - so I told her no one's hair lays perfectly flat and then she told me that she saw a picture in a magazine and there was a lady in the magazine whose hair laid flat. So, we discussed that to get the lady's hair to look like that probably took several

hours, a stylist, a blow-drier, and lots of styling product plus some touching up on the photo to eliminate any fly-aways ad make the model look "perfect" - I stressed to her that magazine pictures are not "real" they are the product of hours of work and then touching up the photos after the fact. Hopefully my talk did some good. It is amazing though how early this stuff starts with the kids - and the girls especially. I'm really glad that we don't watch a whole lot of TV and the stuff she watches is still PBS-animal shows.

My mother was very self-critical about her looks and everything else about herself and it took me a long time to get over that in myself. Now, I'm pretty happy with the way I look. I don't look like model, I'm not without imperfections - but who cares??

Kassia - I like Hell's Kitchen, too and the other one he did where he visited the restaurants....what was the name of that one? It was pretty funny, sometimes gross, and certainly made me wonder about some of the places where i may have eaten!Take care,

Donna

[Guest guest]

oh yeah kitchen nightmares. it was originally a BBC thing he did in britian then brought over here. tell ya the american version MADE tv b/c of how more embarrassing the ppl in america acted over britian. donna i have to agree we are over bombarded with images of perfection and beauty. while its nice to play dress and be glamorous there is almost no looking at the other side of things and if some magazines do its with such negativity that its hard to see ourselves as "pretty" when celebs with the same "flaws" with get chastize for it in a magazine. i read one standing line one day about katherine heigel and her "saggy butt". she didn't really have a saggy butt but she is like a kettlebell queen like darcy and i so i took a little offense that this thin woman who can hoist heavy bells with the best of can't be given a positive spin. okay she is

not perfect but she is a strong lady to take on such a tough routine from a tough trainer! they sure as heck don't say that! i have a bit of belly buldge that hates to go away the older i get. its hard to say gosh i am strong i workout hard when i have the body of britney when everybody called her fat.shoot i would have like to have been britney fat LOL she was still in better shape then my abs look now. i have serious self esteem issues b/c i was raised by somebody in the same fashion. never looking on the bright side or the positives or even praising when it was good time too. just always negative negative could be better etc. there are millions like me too! like i said i won't blame media on ALL of it but they have their hands in a big chunk of it. i give a shout out to all my curvy girls though b/c real men love curves and a woman who isn't afraid to order more then just a light salad on a date. kassia

[Guest guest]

oh paul i wasn't attacking you at all. i was have just been bombarded with the commercials for these damn things. i must have saw it like 20 times in two hours last night when i was trying to watch house and lie to me. it seems what they strive to promote over say lie to me which is an excellent show. hell burn notice is an awesome show and it doesn't not get near the promotion the crappy reality shows do and they to ME seem to expliot ppls weaknesses. now do a show with our therapy sessions and you will have some tv LOL there is some reality ppl can live in horror with hahaha well not that funny but if ppl want reality just my story alone can haunt them imagine ppl that have it worse then me. kassia

[Guest guest]

Totally understand, and agree with a lot of it .  I've said it a million times, but the most " sickening " thing to me is when people say they don't have time, or call me lucky because I look the way I do.  Whatever.  Some of us do have more time than others, yes, that's a fact.  But, I have a hard time believing that there are that many out there who can't give themselves 20 minutes a day a few times a week............

DarcyOn Tue, Jul 28, 2009 at 12:06 PM, revaddict <revaddict@...> wrote:

 

Wow, it looks like I really started something here. I didn't think the discussion would get this intense so fast.

Kassia has a great point that the media wrongly portrays how people--especially women--should look. I'm not in favor of that at all.

My suspicion about this show is that it may normalize obesity by showing what a great thing it is that such a woman can find a guy.

Now, before everybody throws rotten tomatoes (or worse) at me, let me make myself clear. I know it's not realistic to expect every woman to be a miniature size, and I wish the media didn't put that pressure out there. At the same time, approving of obesity is not a healthy message to send either. I suspect the tone of the show will be " See, here's a guy who's not too shallow to date a heavy woman unlike the rest of you shallow American men, so there's nothing wrong with being fat. "

To which my response is: Yes, there is something wrong with that. It's hazardous to your health. Where is the personal responsibility of those who are overweight? How can anybody--male or female--live a lifestyle that contributes to obesity and all the health problems that come with it and yet expect that other people should just overlook the problems of being in a relationship with an obese person?

Maybe the guy on the show does have a problem with women so he needs something pathetic like this show to get a date. (Of course he's also doing it for the money.) But if he's smart, why would he get into a relationship with a woman who is on a collision course with a heart attack and could be dead in a few years?

Of course, not all obesity is within our ability to control. I've known people with thyroid problems and things that make them obese no matter what. I don't blame them for the way they are, and I feel sorry for them. But I have no sympathy for the growing number of people in this country--both men and women--who are to darned lazy and undisciplined to take responsibility for keeping themselves healthy. Face it; that's what most of American obesity is.

I bust my butt down there in the workout room 5 or 6 days a week just like a lot of you. I don't think I have a right to expect that a woman should fall in love with me if decide to let myself blow up to 300 lbs. Willingly letting your health go down the drain like that is selfish, short-sighted and says a lot about your personality.

Okay, can I come out from cover now? :-)

>

> oh yeah kitchen nightmares. it was originally a BBC thing he did in britian then brought over here. tell ya the american version MADE tv b/c of how more embarrassing the ppl in america acted over britian.

>

> donna i have to agree we are over bombarded with images of perfection and beauty. while its nice to play dress and be glamorous there is almost no looking at the other side of things and if some magazines do its with such negativity that its hard to see ourselves as " pretty " when celebs with the same " flaws " with get chastize for it in a magazine.

>

> i read one standing line one day about katherine heigel and her " saggy butt " . she didn't really have a saggy butt but she is like a kettlebell queen like darcy and i so i took a little offense that this thin woman who can hoist heavy bells with the best of can't be given a positive spin. okay she is not perfect but she is a strong lady to take on such a tough routine from a tough trainer! they sure as heck don't say that!

>

> i have a bit of belly buldge that hates to go away the older i get. its hard to say gosh i am strong i workout hard when i have the body of britney when everybody called her fat.shoot i would have like to have been britney fat LOL she was still in better shape then my abs look now. i have serious self esteem issues b/c i was raised by somebody in the same fashion. never looking on the bright side or the positives or even praising when it was good time too. just always negative negative could be better etc. there are millions like me too! like i said i won't blame media on ALL of it but they have their hands in a big chunk of it.

>

> i give a shout out to all my curvy girls though b/c real men love curves and a woman who isn't afraid to order more then just a light salad on a date.

>

> kassia

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I agree with what you say about "normalizing obesity" - that really shouldn't be our goal. We shouldn't judge people for what they look like, what size they are, etc. but, it is a fact that being overweight is a health risk and what we should do is try to give those who need (and want to) to lose weight help and support in doing so. Take care,

Donna

From: revaddict <revaddict@...>Subject: Re: OT: More to Love? Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 1:06 PM

Wow, it looks like I really started something here. I didn't think the discussion would get this intense so fast.Kassia has a great point that the media wrongly portrays how people--especially women--should look. I'm not in favor of that at all.My suspicion about this show is that it may normalize obesity by showing what a great thing it is that such a woman can find a guy.Now, before everybody throws rotten tomatoes (or worse) at me, let me make myself clear. I know it's not realistic to expect every woman to be a miniature size, and I wish the media didn't put that pressure out there. At the same time, approving of obesity is not a healthy message to send either. I suspect the tone of the show will be "See, here's a guy who's not too shallow to date a heavy woman unlike the rest of you shallow American men, so there's nothing wrong with being fat."To which my response is: Yes, there is something wrong with that.

It's hazardous to your health. Where is the personal responsibility of those who are overweight? How can anybody--male or female--live a lifestyle that contributes to obesity and all the health problems that come with it and yet expect that other people should just overlook the problems of being in a relationship with an obese person?Maybe the guy on the show does have a problem with women so he needs something pathetic like this show to get a date. (Of course he's also doing it for the money.) But if he's smart, why would he get into a relationship with a woman who is on a collision course with a heart attack and could be dead in a few years?Of course, not all obesity is within our ability to control. I've known people with thyroid problems and things that make them obese no matter what. I don't blame them for the way they are, and I feel sorry for them. But I have no sympathy for the growing number of people in this country--both men

and women--who are to darned lazy and undisciplined to take responsibility for keeping themselves healthy. Face it; that's what most of American obesity is.I bust my butt down there in the workout room 5 or 6 days a week just like a lot of you. I don't think I have a right to expect that a woman should fall in love with me if decide to let myself blow up to 300 lbs. Willingly letting your health go down the drain like that is selfish, short-sighted and says a lot about your personality.Okay, can I come out from cover now? :-)>> oh yeah kitchen nightmares. it was originally a BBC thing he did in britian then brought over here. tell ya the american version MADE tv

b/c of how more embarrassing the ppl in america acted over britian. > > donna i have to agree we are over bombarded with images of perfection and beauty. while its nice to play dress and be glamorous there is almost no looking at the other side of things and if some magazines do its with such negativity that its hard to see ourselves as "pretty" when celebs with the same "flaws" with get chastize for it in a magazine. > > i read one standing line one day about katherine heigel and her "saggy butt". she didn't really have a saggy butt but she is like a kettlebell queen like darcy and i so i took a little offense that this thin woman who can hoist heavy bells with the best of can't be given a positive spin. okay she is not perfect but she is a strong lady to take on such a tough routine from a tough trainer! they sure as heck don't say that! > > i have a bit of belly buldge that hates to go away the older i get.

its hard to say gosh i am strong i workout hard when i have the body of britney when everybody called her fat.shoot i would have like to have been britney fat LOL she was still in better shape then my abs look now. i have serious self esteem issues b/c i was raised by somebody in the same fashion. never looking on the bright side or the positives or even praising when it was good time too. just always negative negative could be better etc. there are millions like me too! like i said i won't blame media on ALL of it but they have their hands in a big chunk of it. > > i give a shout out to all my curvy girls though b/c real men love curves and a woman who isn't afraid to order more then just a light salad on a date. > > kassia>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I agree with what you say about "normalizing obesity" - that really shouldn't be our goal. We shouldn't judge people for what they look like, what size they are, etc. but, it is a fact that being overweight is a health risk and what we should do is try to give those who need (and want to) to lose weight help and support in doing so. Take care,

Donna

From: revaddict <revaddict@...>Subject: Re: OT: More to Love? Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 1:06 PM

Wow, it looks like I really started something here. I didn't think the discussion would get this intense so fast.Kassia has a great point that the media wrongly portrays how people--especially women--should look. I'm not in favor of that at all.My suspicion about this show is that it may normalize obesity by showing what a great thing it is that such a woman can find a guy.Now, before everybody throws rotten tomatoes (or worse) at me, let me make myself clear. I know it's not realistic to expect every woman to be a miniature size, and I wish the media didn't put that pressure out there. At the same time, approving of obesity is not a healthy message to send either. I suspect the tone of the show will be "See, here's a guy who's not too shallow to date a heavy woman unlike the rest of you shallow American men, so there's nothing wrong with being fat."To which my response is: Yes, there is something wrong with that.

It's hazardous to your health. Where is the personal responsibility of those who are overweight? How can anybody--male or female--live a lifestyle that contributes to obesity and all the health problems that come with it and yet expect that other people should just overlook the problems of being in a relationship with an obese person?Maybe the guy on the show does have a problem with women so he needs something pathetic like this show to get a date. (Of course he's also doing it for the money.) But if he's smart, why would he get into a relationship with a woman who is on a collision course with a heart attack and could be dead in a few years?Of course, not all obesity is within our ability to control. I've known people with thyroid problems and things that make them obese no matter what. I don't blame them for the way they are, and I feel sorry for them. But I have no sympathy for the growing number of people in this country--both men

and women--who are to darned lazy and undisciplined to take responsibility for keeping themselves healthy. Face it; that's what most of American obesity is.I bust my butt down there in the workout room 5 or 6 days a week just like a lot of you. I don't think I have a right to expect that a woman should fall in love with me if decide to let myself blow up to 300 lbs. Willingly letting your health go down the drain like that is selfish, short-sighted and says a lot about your personality.Okay, can I come out from cover now? :-)>> oh yeah kitchen nightmares. it was originally a BBC thing he did in britian then brought over here. tell ya the american version MADE tv

b/c of how more embarrassing the ppl in america acted over britian. > > donna i have to agree we are over bombarded with images of perfection and beauty. while its nice to play dress and be glamorous there is almost no looking at the other side of things and if some magazines do its with such negativity that its hard to see ourselves as "pretty" when celebs with the same "flaws" with get chastize for it in a magazine. > > i read one standing line one day about katherine heigel and her "saggy butt". she didn't really have a saggy butt but she is like a kettlebell queen like darcy and i so i took a little offense that this thin woman who can hoist heavy bells with the best of can't be given a positive spin. okay she is not perfect but she is a strong lady to take on such a tough routine from a tough trainer! they sure as heck don't say that! > > i have a bit of belly buldge that hates to go away the older i get.

its hard to say gosh i am strong i workout hard when i have the body of britney when everybody called her fat.shoot i would have like to have been britney fat LOL she was still in better shape then my abs look now. i have serious self esteem issues b/c i was raised by somebody in the same fashion. never looking on the bright side or the positives or even praising when it was good time too. just always negative negative could be better etc. there are millions like me too! like i said i won't blame media on ALL of it but they have their hands in a big chunk of it. > > i give a shout out to all my curvy girls though b/c real men love curves and a woman who isn't afraid to order more then just a light salad on a date. > > kassia>

[Guest guest]

i know a few like this and it stems further then just weight.its self esteem and lack of mental ability to do so,so their pattern is to make fun of others in some way or try to find a weak spot. whose to say where it started but they choose in some way to continue the pattern.obviously these women must be proud of themselves to have the confidence to be on tv and that is great but my issue is all these shows with average women or size 2 gals, always exploit drama and this one i am afraid will go for the social jugular with the weight and what ppl think of them and their weight and judge them for weight and looks. some of them look very pretty and seem so sweet. like i say before i have a bit of a belly bulge and it bothers me i am trying to work on it,but i have one bitch at work that will just point out and be negative like this little

bulge defines who i am. there is more to me then a little stomach. there are just as many ppl like the evil woman i work with(whom is naturally thin good for her but eats like crap and parties like she is 20 again but won't come weight lift with me hhhmm) who will be willinging to define you to other based on how you look and its almost that repeat pattern again of ppl judging you. even working out they expect me to be thin like pari hilton or something when i am looking for strength and ability. overall its a media frenzy of looks! well i don't seem ppl on this group on any magazine covers and they are more of an inspiration and more beautiful then celebs and reality 15 min of fame stars. but not everybody would appreciate the beauty of each of us b/c they are so wrapped up in working out for looks then they are about health and strength and i blame a lot of tv for that. kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting I just lose all patience with people who whine about their obesity or poor health even though they have made the choices that made them that way.---

[Guest guest]

i know a few like this and it stems further then just weight.its self esteem and lack of mental ability to do so,so their pattern is to make fun of others in some way or try to find a weak spot. whose to say where it started but they choose in some way to continue the pattern.obviously these women must be proud of themselves to have the confidence to be on tv and that is great but my issue is all these shows with average women or size 2 gals, always exploit drama and this one i am afraid will go for the social jugular with the weight and what ppl think of them and their weight and judge them for weight and looks. some of them look very pretty and seem so sweet. like i say before i have a bit of a belly bulge and it bothers me i am trying to work on it,but i have one bitch at work that will just point out and be negative like this little

bulge defines who i am. there is more to me then a little stomach. there are just as many ppl like the evil woman i work with(whom is naturally thin good for her but eats like crap and parties like she is 20 again but won't come weight lift with me hhhmm) who will be willinging to define you to other based on how you look and its almost that repeat pattern again of ppl judging you. even working out they expect me to be thin like pari hilton or something when i am looking for strength and ability. overall its a media frenzy of looks! well i don't seem ppl on this group on any magazine covers and they are more of an inspiration and more beautiful then celebs and reality 15 min of fame stars. but not everybody would appreciate the beauty of each of us b/c they are so wrapped up in working out for looks then they are about health and strength and i blame a lot of tv for that. kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting I just lose all patience with people who whine about their obesity or poor health even though they have made the choices that made them that way.---

[Guest guest]

As someone who researches this this is a very interesting thread.I am right now 20lb overweight - I have no excuse except that stupid snooze button! I keep trying and I know I will get back into shape... just with healthcare reform my work hours are lets say - crazy...... I need those 6 hours...... next week I can get up at 5am and not go to work but go workout!One of my current research is looking at fit and 'fat' people. There is growing evidence that those that are a bit overweight but who are working out are in better shape and have less risk for future health issues than those that are thin but do not workout. We have all seen skinny smokers, look at drug addicts and alcoholics many are tiny but in miserable healthI am sure you saw the research publicized

about the "cost of obesity is 10% medical costs" this study does not control for fitness (plus has a lot of other flaws). I did a similar research but when I controlled for physical activity this amount declines alot! So I am on the crusade for being fit and eating healthy is what matters (the body will follow for some the change will be faster than other but the body will change)Anyway - body image is one thing but if you understand you are bigger (like me) but want to change (like me) that is different then those that just think it is ok to walk around with these bad health habits........ ok off my soap box.judy sFrom: Kassia <ldy_solana@...> Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 2:39:49 PMSubject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love?

i know a few like this and it stems further then just weight.its self esteem and lack of mental ability to do so,so their pattern is to make fun of others in some way or try to find a weak spot. whose to say where it started but they choose in some way to continue the pattern.obviously these women must be proud of themselves to have the confidence to be on tv and that is great but my issue is all these shows with average women or size 2 gals, always exploit drama and this one i am afraid will go for the social jugular with the weight and what ppl think of them and their weight and judge them for weight and looks. some of them look very

pretty and seem so sweet. like i say before i have a bit of a belly bulge and it bothers me i am trying to work on it,but i have one bitch at work that will just point out and be negative like this little

bulge defines who i am. there is more to me then a little stomach. there are just as many ppl like the evil woman i work with(whom is naturally thin good for her but eats like crap and parties like she is 20 again but won't come weight lift with me hhhmm) who will be willinging to define you to other based on how you look and its almost that repeat pattern again of ppl judging you. even working out they expect me to be thin like pari hilton or something when i am looking for strength and ability. overall its a media frenzy of looks! well i don't seem ppl on this group on any magazine covers and they are more of an inspiration and more beautiful then celebs and reality 15 min of fame stars. but not everybody would appreciate the beauty of each of us b/c they are so wrapped up in working out for looks then they are about health and strength and i blame a lot of tv for that. kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting I just lose all patience with people who whine about their obesity or poor health even though they have made the choices that made them that way.---

[Guest guest]

As someone who researches this this is a very interesting thread.I am right now 20lb overweight - I have no excuse except that stupid snooze button! I keep trying and I know I will get back into shape... just with healthcare reform my work hours are lets say - crazy...... I need those 6 hours...... next week I can get up at 5am and not go to work but go workout!One of my current research is looking at fit and 'fat' people. There is growing evidence that those that are a bit overweight but who are working out are in better shape and have less risk for future health issues than those that are thin but do not workout. We have all seen skinny smokers, look at drug addicts and alcoholics many are tiny but in miserable healthI am sure you saw the research publicized

about the "cost of obesity is 10% medical costs" this study does not control for fitness (plus has a lot of other flaws). I did a similar research but when I controlled for physical activity this amount declines alot! So I am on the crusade for being fit and eating healthy is what matters (the body will follow for some the change will be faster than other but the body will change)Anyway - body image is one thing but if you understand you are bigger (like me) but want to change (like me) that is different then those that just think it is ok to walk around with these bad health habits........ ok off my soap box.judy sFrom: Kassia <ldy_solana@...> Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 2:39:49 PMSubject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love?

i know a few like this and it stems further then just weight.its self esteem and lack of mental ability to do so,so their pattern is to make fun of others in some way or try to find a weak spot. whose to say where it started but they choose in some way to continue the pattern.obviously these women must be proud of themselves to have the confidence to be on tv and that is great but my issue is all these shows with average women or size 2 gals, always exploit drama and this one i am afraid will go for the social jugular with the weight and what ppl think of them and their weight and judge them for weight and looks. some of them look very

pretty and seem so sweet. like i say before i have a bit of a belly bulge and it bothers me i am trying to work on it,but i have one bitch at work that will just point out and be negative like this little

bulge defines who i am. there is more to me then a little stomach. there are just as many ppl like the evil woman i work with(whom is naturally thin good for her but eats like crap and parties like she is 20 again but won't come weight lift with me hhhmm) who will be willinging to define you to other based on how you look and its almost that repeat pattern again of ppl judging you. even working out they expect me to be thin like pari hilton or something when i am looking for strength and ability. overall its a media frenzy of looks! well i don't seem ppl on this group on any magazine covers and they are more of an inspiration and more beautiful then celebs and reality 15 min of fame stars. but not everybody would appreciate the beauty of each of us b/c they are so wrapped up in working out for looks then they are about health and strength and i blame a lot of tv for that. kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting I just lose all patience with people who whine about their obesity or poor health even though they have made the choices that made them that way.---

[Guest guest]

This has been an interesting thread!

Judy had some good points, too that you can be thin or "average" size and still be unhealthy. I do know many "thin" people who have high BP, high cholesterol, who are unable to walk up a flight of stairs, etc.

And, I do agree with Kassia that there are some people who just can't - for whatever reason- make the leap to lose weight, even though they may "intellectually" know that they should. My SIL is one of those people. She is in the medical profession but she is horribly overweight - I see her once a year and each year I see her she is bigger. She developed Type 2 Diabetes in her '30's. I think she knows intellectually that she needs to lose weight to improve her health, but for whatever reason, I'm sure it is emotional, she just doesn't make changes to do so. She talks a good game, but doesn't make any lasting changes. And in fact, she has probably convinced herself that she is one of those "fit but fat" people 0- which I don't think she is - certainly not with Type 2 Diabetes, High Blood Pressure, and High Cholesterol.

My DH is overweight, he is a "foodie" - he knows what he has to do to make changes - lately he has been doing so and has lost a bit over 20 lbs. I'm cautiously optimistic, but in the many years that we have been together he tends to "fall off the wagon" quite often. I think this time he may have been scared into dropping weight b/c he started having an irregular heartbeat - it turned out to be nothing - but it scared him into going to see a cardiologist and it got him on track with eating right. He isn't following any plan - just plain old ordinary counting calories and making wiser choices based on reading labels. My DH is also not a big "exercise for the sake of exercise" guy - he is fine going for a hike, or bike ride, or doing yard work, but he is definately not one to get up at the crack of dawn (like me) to put in an exercise DVD or take a walk or jog on the TM. But, I'll take what i

can get, the weight loss alone has reduced his BP and we'll find out about his cholesterol once he has his blood test this week - I suspect it will be improved due to the weight loss.

Sorry to go on!Donna

From: revaddict <revaddict@...>Subject: Re: OT: More to Love? Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 2:31 PM

Thanks, everybody. Donna, I'll even go a little further than you did. I think it is fair to make a judgment about people who won't lose weight. (Not those who for medical reasons CAN'T but those who just WON'T.) It does say something about you and what you think of the people who love you if you're not willing to make your own health a priority. I'm all in favor of supporting those who want to improve themselves. I just lose all patience with people who whine about their obesity or poor health even though they have made the choices that made them that way.> >> > oh yeah kitchen nightmares. it was originally a BBC thing he did in britian then brought over here. tell ya the american version MADE tv b/c of how more embarrassing the ppl in america acted over britian. > > > > donna i have to agree we are over bombarded with images of perfection and beauty. while its nice to play

dress and be glamorous there is almost no looking at the other side of things and if some magazines do its with such negativity that its hard to see ourselves as "pretty" when celebs with the same "flaws" with get chastize for it in a magazine. > > > > i read one standing line one day about katherine heigel and her "saggy butt". she didn't really have a saggy butt but she is like a kettlebell queen like darcy and i so i took a little offense that this thin woman who can hoist heavy bells with the best of can't be given a positive spin. okay she is not perfect but she is a strong lady to take on such a tough routine from a tough trainer! they sure as heck don't say that! > > > > i have a bit of belly buldge that hates to go away the older i get. its hard to say gosh i am strong i workout hard when i have the body of britney when everybody called her fat.shoot i would have like to have been britney fat LOL she was

still in better shape then my abs look now. i have serious self esteem issues b/c i was raised by somebody in the same fashion. never looking on the bright side or the positives or even praising when it was good time too. just always negative negative could be better etc. there are millions like me too! like i said i won't blame media on ALL of it but they have their hands in a big chunk of it. > > > > i give a shout out to all my curvy girls though b/c real men love curves and a woman who isn't afraid to order more then just a light salad on a date. > > > > kassia> >>

[Guest guest]

Oh my gosh! I saw this post and just had to write...............I didn't read all the responses yet so if I am repeating anything someone else said I apologize. I just saw a commercial for this today and was very surprised and disappointed.

I am 48 years old. My mom and dad are 69 and 73 respectively. I have watched both of them age - One VERY gracefully, one not so much at all. I absolutely hate ANYTHING that makes it seem like being obese is ok. Because lets face it, it is not. My mother has been between 2 and 300 pounds for as long as I can remember. I used to try really hard to get her to work out and watch what she eats, anything and everything you can think of to help her. I have even suggested therapy to get to the bottom of her food addiction. In part because I have spent a lifetime watching her destroy her health by over eating. She is a 3 time cancer survivor and because I also had cancer a couple of years ago, I have learned a LOT about risk factors. Obesity for a LOT of cancers increases your risk up to 50 percent. Not to mention the heart risks. I won't stay on this long because I know this isn't a cancer support group but I think it bears mentioning. When I was diagnosed, I was at a good weight eating pretty decent and exercising almost every day. I was young to get it too, only 45. I was told by all of the doctors treating me that they were amazed the cancer was so well behaved, that more often in younger women it is very aggressive. Thank God mine wasn't. They credited how well I took care of myself over and over for how easy the experience was for me. I have REALLY focused on that as part of continuing to take care of myself. And feel like being at a healthy weight really benefited me.

My dad has been an exerciser for as long as I can remember and his health has been great. He is still extremely active especially for a man his age. He still mtn bikes! I have watched what her being overweight has done to him. After a while you start to resent the person for it, because they are constantly making comments about their weight or often expecting special treatment because of it. Obviously this is something I feel very strongly about because it has been so personal:-) But a show that puts this out there as fine and showing people maybe starting a relationship with this kind of baggage shows very poor judgement. I don't in any way mean offense to anyone that has weight issues because of a health problem. But for just your average person, probably most of us would be overweight if we didn't work so hard at staying fit. It is a choice.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

Oh my gosh! I saw this post and just had to write...............I didn't read all the responses yet so if I am repeating anything someone else said I apologize. I just saw a commercial for this today and was very surprised and disappointed.

I am 48 years old. My mom and dad are 69 and 73 respectively. I have watched both of them age - One VERY gracefully, one not so much at all. I absolutely hate ANYTHING that makes it seem like being obese is ok. Because lets face it, it is not. My mother has been between 2 and 300 pounds for as long as I can remember. I used to try really hard to get her to work out and watch what she eats, anything and everything you can think of to help her. I have even suggested therapy to get to the bottom of her food addiction. In part because I have spent a lifetime watching her destroy her health by over eating. She is a 3 time cancer survivor and because I also had cancer a couple of years ago, I have learned a LOT about risk factors. Obesity for a LOT of cancers increases your risk up to 50 percent. Not to mention the heart risks. I won't stay on this long because I know this isn't a cancer support group but I think it bears mentioning. When I was diagnosed, I was at a good weight eating pretty decent and exercising almost every day. I was young to get it too, only 45. I was told by all of the doctors treating me that they were amazed the cancer was so well behaved, that more often in younger women it is very aggressive. Thank God mine wasn't. They credited how well I took care of myself over and over for how easy the experience was for me. I have REALLY focused on that as part of continuing to take care of myself. And feel like being at a healthy weight really benefited me.

My dad has been an exerciser for as long as I can remember and his health has been great. He is still extremely active especially for a man his age. He still mtn bikes! I have watched what her being overweight has done to him. After a while you start to resent the person for it, because they are constantly making comments about their weight or often expecting special treatment because of it. Obviously this is something I feel very strongly about because it has been so personal:-) But a show that puts this out there as fine and showing people maybe starting a relationship with this kind of baggage shows very poor judgement. I don't in any way mean offense to anyone that has weight issues because of a health problem. But for just your average person, probably most of us would be overweight if we didn't work so hard at staying fit. It is a choice.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

This has been an interesting thread!

Judy had some good points, too that you can be thin or "average" size and still be unhealthy. I do know many "thin" people who have high BP, high cholesterol, who are unable to walk up a flight of stairs, etc.

And, I do agree with Kassia that there are some people who just can't - for whatever reason- make the leap to lose weight, even though they may "intellectually" know that they should. My SIL is one of those people. She is in the medical profession but she is horribly overweight - I see her once a year and each year I see her she is bigger. She developed Type 2 Diabetes in her '30's. I think she knows intellectually that she needs to lose weight to improve her health, but for whatever reason, I'm sure it is emotional, she just doesn't make changes to do so. She talks a good game, but doesn't make any lasting changes. And in fact, she has probably convinced herself that she is one of those "fit but fat" people 0- which I don't think she is - certainly not with Type 2 Diabetes, High Blood Pressure, and High Cholesterol.

My DH is overweight, he is a "foodie" - he knows what he has to do to make changes - lately he has been doing so and has lost a bit over 20 lbs. I'm cautiously optimistic, but in the many years that we have been together he tends to "fall off the wagon" quite often. I think this time he may have been scared into dropping weight b/c he started having an irregular heartbeat - it turned out to be nothing - but it scared him into going to see a cardiologist and it got him on track with eating right. He isn't following any plan - just plain old ordinary counting calories and making wiser choices based on reading labels. My DH is also not a big "exercise for the sake of exercise" guy - he is fine going for a hike, or bike ride, or doing yard work, but he is definately not one to get up at the crack of dawn (like me) to put in an exercise DVD or take a walk or jog on the TM. But, I'll take what i

can get, the weight loss alone has reduced his BP and we'll find out about his cholesterol once he has his blood test this week - I suspect it will be improved due to the weight loss.

Sorry to go on!Donna

From: revaddict <revaddict@...>Subject: Re: OT: More to Love? Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 2:31 PM

Thanks, everybody. Donna, I'll even go a little further than you did. I think it is fair to make a judgment about people who won't lose weight. (Not those who for medical reasons CAN'T but those who just WON'T.) It does say something about you and what you think of the people who love you if you're not willing to make your own health a priority. I'm all in favor of supporting those who want to improve themselves. I just lose all patience with people who whine about their obesity or poor health even though they have made the choices that made them that way.> >> > oh yeah kitchen nightmares. it was originally a BBC thing he did in britian then brought over here. tell ya the american version MADE tv b/c of how more embarrassing the ppl in america acted over britian. > > > > donna i have to agree we are over bombarded with images of perfection and beauty. while its nice to play

dress and be glamorous there is almost no looking at the other side of things and if some magazines do its with such negativity that its hard to see ourselves as "pretty" when celebs with the same "flaws" with get chastize for it in a magazine. > > > > i read one standing line one day about katherine heigel and her "saggy butt". she didn't really have a saggy butt but she is like a kettlebell queen like darcy and i so i took a little offense that this thin woman who can hoist heavy bells with the best of can't be given a positive spin. okay she is not perfect but she is a strong lady to take on such a tough routine from a tough trainer! they sure as heck don't say that! > > > > i have a bit of belly buldge that hates to go away the older i get. its hard to say gosh i am strong i workout hard when i have the body of britney when everybody called her fat.shoot i would have like to have been britney fat LOL she was

still in better shape then my abs look now. i have serious self esteem issues b/c i was raised by somebody in the same fashion. never looking on the bright side or the positives or even praising when it was good time too. just always negative negative could be better etc. there are millions like me too! like i said i won't blame media on ALL of it but they have their hands in a big chunk of it. > > > > i give a shout out to all my curvy girls though b/c real men love curves and a woman who isn't afraid to order more then just a light salad on a date. > > > > kassia> >>

[Guest guest]

Donna:so your DH is what the public health community is trying to promote. Make sensible food choices and add activity to your life! Take steps walk more, read food labels etc... seriously not everyone has over 50 exercise dvds (ok I think I am close to that!)judyFrom: Donna M-P <donna112520@...> Sent:

Tuesday, July 28, 2009 3:09:55 PMSubject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love?

This has been an interesting thread!

Judy had some good points, too that you can be thin or "average" size and still be unhealthy. I do know many "thin" people who have high BP, high cholesterol, who are unable to walk up a flight of stairs, etc.

And, I do agree with Kassia that there are some people who just can't - for whatever reason- make the leap to lose weight, even though they may "intellectually" know that they should. My SIL is one of those people. She is in the medical profession but she is horribly overweight - I see her once a year and each year I see her she is bigger. She developed Type 2 Diabetes in her '30's. I think she knows intellectually that she needs to lose weight to improve her health, but for whatever reason, I'm sure it is emotional, she just doesn't make changes to do so. She talks a good game, but doesn't make any lasting changes. And in fact, she has probably convinced herself that she is one of those "fit but fat" people 0- which I don't think she is - certainly not with Type 2 Diabetes, High Blood Pressure, and High Cholesterol.

My DH is overweight, he is a "foodie" - he knows what he has to do to make changes - lately he has been doing so and has lost a bit over 20 lbs. I'm cautiously optimistic, but in the many years that we have been together he tends to "fall off the wagon" quite often. I think this time he may have been scared into dropping weight b/c he started having an irregular heartbeat - it turned out to be nothing - but it scared him into going to see a cardiologist and it got him on track with eating right. He isn't following any plan - just plain old ordinary counting calories and making wiser choices based on reading labels. My DH is also not a big "exercise for the sake of exercise" guy - he is fine going for a hike, or bike ride, or doing yard work, but he is definately not one to get up at the crack of dawn (like me) to put in an exercise DVD or take a walk or jog on the TM. But, I'll take what i

can get, the weight loss alone has reduced his BP and we'll find out about his cholesterol once he has his blood test this week - I suspect it will be improved due to the weight loss.

Sorry to go on!Donna

From: revaddict <revaddict (DOT) com>Subject: Re: OT: More to Love?Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 2:31 PM

Thanks, everybody. Donna, I'll even go a little further than you did. I think it is fair to make a judgment about people who won't lose weight. (Not those who for medical reasons CAN'T but those who just WON'T.) It does say something about you and what you think of the people who love you if you're not willing to make your own health a priority. I'm all in favor of supporting those who want to improve themselves. I just lose all patience with people who whine about their obesity or poor health even though they have made the choices that made them that way.> >> > oh yeah kitchen nightmares. it was originally a BBC thing he did in britian then brought over here. tell ya the american version MADE tv b/c of how more embarrassing the ppl in america acted over britian. > > > > donna i have to agree we are over bombarded with images of perfection and beauty. while its nice to play

dress and be glamorous there is almost no looking at the other side of things and if some magazines do its with such negativity that its hard to see ourselves as "pretty" when celebs with the same "flaws" with get chastize for it in a magazine. > > > > i read one standing line one day about katherine heigel and her "saggy butt". she didn't really have a saggy butt but she is like a kettlebell queen like darcy and i so i took a little offense that this thin woman who can hoist heavy bells with the best of can't be given a positive spin. okay she is not perfect but she is a strong lady to take on such a tough routine from a tough trainer! they sure as heck don't say that! > > > > i have a bit of belly buldge that hates to go away the older i get. its hard to say gosh i am strong i workout hard when i have the body of britney when everybody called her fat.shoot i would have like to have been britney fat LOL she was

still in better shape then my abs look now. i have serious self esteem issues b/c i was raised by somebody in the same fashion. never looking on the bright side or the positives or even praising when it was good time too. just always negative negative could be better etc. there are millions like me too! like i said i won't blame media on ALL of it but they have their hands in a big chunk of it. > > > > i give a shout out to all my curvy girls though b/c real men love curves and a woman who isn't afraid to order more then just a light salad on a date. > > > > kassia> >>

[Guest guest]

Your husband sounds kind of like mine Donna. Like you I am cautiously optimistic, but he has been at it for 8 months now and is still slowly losing. The best thing we can continue to do is be encouraging and set a good example I think.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

Your husband sounds kind of like mine Donna. Like you I am cautiously optimistic, but he has been at it for 8 months now and is still slowly losing. The best thing we can continue to do is be encouraging and set a good example I think.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

Kassia

I am sorry you have a co worker that is so insensitive to say things like that to you. I don't understand people who feel like they have to give you their two cents worth, when you didn't even ask. Some people I know that weigh more than me like to call me 'frail' because I am thinner than them. With the weights I work out with I KNOW I am not frail:-) But it used to bother me a lot, that they would say that. I think jealousy has so much to do with the comments. I am guessing your co worker is jealous of your dedication to working out and wishes she had that kind of staying power, saying things to you in some way makes her feel better. I am sorry.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

Kassia

I am sorry you have a co worker that is so insensitive to say things like that to you. I don't understand people who feel like they have to give you their two cents worth, when you didn't even ask. Some people I know that weigh more than me like to call me 'frail' because I am thinner than them. With the weights I work out with I KNOW I am not frail:-) But it used to bother me a lot, that they would say that. I think jealousy has so much to do with the comments. I am guessing your co worker is jealous of your dedication to working out and wishes she had that kind of staying power, saying things to you in some way makes her feel better. I am sorry.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

I agree there is such a double standard for women and what is expected of them. I see some fashion magazines and the model's arms are so skinny, it is like seriously how do they work:-) That sends such a bad message in the other direction. And there are a LOT of health risks being at that end of the spectrum too.

I feel like a healthy weight for a woman or man for that matter is pretty much what the height/ weight chart show for us. In my opinion there just needs to be a balance. I don't feel a 12 or 14 is obese by any means. Some of the women I saw in the commercial though looked much larger. I do feel it is exploiting too and just a shame that they are making a show like this.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

I agree there is such a double standard for women and what is expected of them. I see some fashion magazines and the model's arms are so skinny, it is like seriously how do they work:-) That sends such a bad message in the other direction. And there are a LOT of health risks being at that end of the spectrum too.

I feel like a healthy weight for a woman or man for that matter is pretty much what the height/ weight chart show for us. In my opinion there just needs to be a balance. I don't feel a 12 or 14 is obese by any means. Some of the women I saw in the commercial though looked much larger. I do feel it is exploiting too and just a shame that they are making a show like this.

A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps!

[Guest guest]

hi judy

yeah i saw something like that about even being slightly overweight but

still having good habits goes a long way for your health and sometimes

you are in better shape then others who may be naturally smaller but do

not have the same healthy habits. ppl have and always will come in

different shapes and sizes but seems some sizes are more reverred.

nowadays a beautiful size12-14 marilyn monroe wouldnt' stand a chance.

and gosh was she ever a beautiful glamour queen who was the same size

as ME

my problem is portions whether its over snacking on junk, eating to much at mealtime(even healthy foods) not enough water the list can go on. when i work my schedule is crazy i will go nearly 4 hours without food but half time i want to go to the gym after work but not on a full stomach so it seems like i am always snacking. i obviously workout and workout hard a lot of days and i am sure i am pretty strong and able to move freely without pain but many have this perceived notion that exercise=thin and its horrible. its horrible how that woman at work treats me b/c i can't share my positive love of working out without turning into "well you just not thin enough to actually be working out hard". its hurtful and i am sure these women on this stupid show will be drug through mud b/c ppl will tune it. i figure i am one more person who won't do that who won't use that drama to entertain ratings. kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting From: Judy S <k9sports4gsps@...>Subject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love? Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 2:53 PM

As someone who researches this this is a very interesting thread.I am right now 20lb overweight - I have no excuse except that stupid snooze button! I keep trying and I know I will get back into shape... just with healthcare reform my work hours are lets say - crazy...... I need those 6 hours...... next week I can get up at 5am and not go to work but go workout!One of my current research is looking at fit and 'fat' people. There is growing evidence that those that are a bit overweight but who are working out are in better shape and have less risk for future health issues than those that are thin but do not workout. We have all seen skinny smokers, look at drug addicts and alcoholics many are tiny but in miserable healthI am sure you saw the research publicized

about the "cost of obesity is 10% medical costs" this study does not control for fitness (plus has a lot of other flaws). I did a similar research but when I controlled for physical activity this amount declines alot! So I am on the crusade for being fit and eating healthy is what matters (the body will follow for some the change will be faster than other but the body will change)Anyway - body image is one thing but if you understand you are bigger (like me) but want to change (like me) that is different then those that just think it is ok to walk around with these bad health habits........ ok off my soap box.judy s

[Guest guest]

keep it up you will be better for it in the long runI too struggle with portions. I can eat a whole bag of carrots (or chips!) without realizing it!we will be better off though with our work and support systemjFrom: Kassia <ldy_solana@...> Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 3:58:02 PMSubject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love?

hi judy

yeah i saw something like that about even being slightly overweight but

still having good habits goes a long way for your health and sometimes

you are in better shape then others who may be naturally smaller but do

not have the same healthy habits. ppl have and always will come in

different shapes and sizes but seems some sizes are more reverred.

nowadays a beautiful size12-14 marilyn monroe wouldnt' stand a chance.

and gosh was she ever a beautiful glamour queen who was the same size

as ME

my problem is portions whether its over snacking on junk, eating to much at mealtime(even healthy foods) not enough water the list can go on. when i work my schedule is crazy i will go nearly 4 hours without food but half time i want to go to the gym after work but not on a full stomach so it seems like i am always snacking. i obviously workout and workout hard a lot of days and i am sure i am pretty strong and able to move freely without pain but many have this perceived notion that exercise=thin and its horrible. its horrible how that woman at work treats me b/c i can't share my positive love of working out without turning into "well you just not thin enough to actually be working out hard". its hurtful and i am sure these women on this stupid show will be drug through mud b/c ppl will tune it. i figure i am one more person who won't do that who won't use that drama to entertain ratings. kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting From: Judy S <k9sports4gsps>Subject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love?Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 2:53 PM

As someone who researches this this is a very interesting thread.I am right now 20lb overweight - I have no excuse except that stupid snooze button! I keep trying and I know I will get back into shape... just with healthcare reform my work hours are lets say - crazy...... I need those 6 hours...... next week I can get up at 5am and not go to work but go workout!One of my current research is looking at fit and 'fat' people. There is growing evidence that those that are a bit overweight but who are working out are in better shape and have less risk for future health issues than those that are thin but do not workout. We have all seen skinny smokers, look at drug addicts and alcoholics many are tiny but in miserable healthI am sure you saw the research publicized

about the "cost of obesity is 10% medical costs" this study does not control for fitness (plus has a lot of other flaws). I did a similar research but when I controlled for physical activity this amount declines alot! So I am on the crusade for being fit and eating healthy is what matters (the body will follow for some the change will be faster than other but the body will change)Anyway - body image is one thing but if you understand you are bigger (like me) but want to change (like me) that is different then those that just think it is ok to walk around with these bad health habits...... .. ok off my soap box.judy s

[Guest guest]

keep it up you will be better for it in the long runI too struggle with portions. I can eat a whole bag of carrots (or chips!) without realizing it!we will be better off though with our work and support systemjFrom: Kassia <ldy_solana@...> Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 3:58:02 PMSubject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love?

hi judy

yeah i saw something like that about even being slightly overweight but

still having good habits goes a long way for your health and sometimes

you are in better shape then others who may be naturally smaller but do

not have the same healthy habits. ppl have and always will come in

different shapes and sizes but seems some sizes are more reverred.

nowadays a beautiful size12-14 marilyn monroe wouldnt' stand a chance.

and gosh was she ever a beautiful glamour queen who was the same size

as ME

my problem is portions whether its over snacking on junk, eating to much at mealtime(even healthy foods) not enough water the list can go on. when i work my schedule is crazy i will go nearly 4 hours without food but half time i want to go to the gym after work but not on a full stomach so it seems like i am always snacking. i obviously workout and workout hard a lot of days and i am sure i am pretty strong and able to move freely without pain but many have this perceived notion that exercise=thin and its horrible. its horrible how that woman at work treats me b/c i can't share my positive love of working out without turning into "well you just not thin enough to actually be working out hard". its hurtful and i am sure these women on this stupid show will be drug through mud b/c ppl will tune it. i figure i am one more person who won't do that who won't use that drama to entertain ratings. kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting From: Judy S <k9sports4gsps>Subject: Re: Re: OT: More to Love?Date: Tuesday, July 28, 2009, 2:53 PM

As someone who researches this this is a very interesting thread.I am right now 20lb overweight - I have no excuse except that stupid snooze button! I keep trying and I know I will get back into shape... just with healthcare reform my work hours are lets say - crazy...... I need those 6 hours...... next week I can get up at 5am and not go to work but go workout!One of my current research is looking at fit and 'fat' people. There is growing evidence that those that are a bit overweight but who are working out are in better shape and have less risk for future health issues than those that are thin but do not workout. We have all seen skinny smokers, look at drug addicts and alcoholics many are tiny but in miserable healthI am sure you saw the research publicized

about the "cost of obesity is 10% medical costs" this study does not control for fitness (plus has a lot of other flaws). I did a similar research but when I controlled for physical activity this amount declines alot! So I am on the crusade for being fit and eating healthy is what matters (the body will follow for some the change will be faster than other but the body will change)Anyway - body image is one thing but if you understand you are bigger (like me) but want to change (like me) that is different then those that just think it is ok to walk around with these bad health habits...... .. ok off my soap box.judy s

[Guest guest]

gosh girl i am gonna need you when i get back to work LOL its very hard for me to talk sense into senseless ppl and they are truly horrible on the topic. i am glad i have this place to talk positive about working out and ppl don't judge they are just there with you. i don't talk to brag or think i am better i just LOVE to workout. some days its rough but most of the time i can't wait to get into the gym and i just love my cardio kickboxing and running.kassia fitness blogSpecial Needs Scouting --- On

Tue, 7/28/09, Judy S <k9sports4gsps@...> wrote:keep it up you will be better for it in the long runI too struggle with portions. I can eat a whole bag of carrots (or chips!) without realizing it!we will be better off though with our work and support systemj