Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

[Guest guest]

On 7/19/2008, loveandlight1111 (loveandlight1111@...) wrote:

> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

How are you taking it? Meaning, what are you using for a activator

(citric acid? vinegar? lemon juice?)? Mixer? Chaser? Are you taking it

right before, during or right after food (full or empty stomach)?

There are a lot of variables that you can tweak to address this kind of

reaction.

[Guest guest]

HI Joyce,

Yes, I have experienced this problem. I had gotten up to 12 drops on the MMS and my tongue became very coated, my scalp itchy, hair falling out, and vaginal irritation. I stopped taking it for a while. When I started again I started at a much lower dose. I now take 5-6 drops 2x/day. I find that this dose helps to break up the fungus and then supplementing with a lot of good probiotics (I use pb8, Healthy Trinity, and Threelac) help to control this problem. But if I go up higher than 6 drops the yeast returns. Granted, my diet is not the strictest in terms of sugars and starches and this may account for lack of further improvement.

It is very important to supplement with high potency probiotics while on MMS. Although, not as strong as antibiotics in terms of killing the good bacteria, it nonetheless does affect it.

S.

-- [ ] MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Hi Joyce and An interesting thing about fungus is that it has aravenous appetite for sugar and may account forour sugar cravings. I would be interested to knowif as the fungus dies off, do you have less desire or craving for sugar?I find as I continue to take the green powders I mentioned before, I do not desire as much sweets. Although I usually only have about one chocolate bar a week or even less, I now don't seem to care if I

have it all. So judging fromthat I think eat lots of green stuff would be good, too.Wishing you both the best,Helen From: susan <ssiegel5@...>Subject: Re: [ ] MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ????? Date: Saturday, July 19, 2008, 11:37 AM

HI Joyce,

Yes, I have experienced this problem. I had gotten up to 12 drops on the MMS and my tongue became very coated, my scalp itchy, hair falling out, and vaginal irritation. I stopped taking it for a while. When I started again I started at a much lower dose. I now take 5-6 drops 2x/day. I find that this dose helps to break up the fungus and then supplementing with a lot of good probiotics (I use pb8, Healthy Trinity, and Threelac) help to control this problem. But if I go up higher than 6 drops the yeast returns. Granted, my diet is not the strictest in terms of sugars and starches and this may account for lack of further improvement.

It is very important to supplement with high potency probiotics while on MMS. Although, not as strong as antibiotics in terms of killing the good bacteria, it nonetheless does affect it.

S.

-- [miracle_mineral_ supplement] MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

------------ --------- --------- ------

[Guest guest]

Hi Joyce!

Yes! I have noticed vaginal irritation since starting back on the MMS

again, even at the low dose of 4 drops right now. I was trying to

sleuth out what may have triggered it. Thanks for your post!

Ballady

>

> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

>

[Guest guest]

Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.From: ballady4 <ballady4@...>Subject: [ ] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ????? Date: Sunday, July 20, 2008, 3:40 AM

Hi Joyce!

Yes! I have noticed vaginal irritation since starting back on the MMS

again, even at the low dose of 4 drops right now. I was trying to

sleuth out what may have triggered it. Thanks for your post!

Ballady

>

> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

>

[Guest guest]

All I know is that all my yeast symptoms were more or less under control, until I got over a certain amount of drops on the MMS. Even Jim HUmble says to take probiotics with it.

-- [miracle_mineral_ supplement] MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

------------ --------- --------- ------

[Guest guest]

Yeah, I'm having to watch this, too.

's comment sheds some light for me since black walnut/wormwood

tincture has helped. I've wondered why it's so helpful for me. Maybe

I'm killing off the layers. I think it must be helpful because it

gets the parasites and the yeast at the same time. At least that's

what it seems like right now.

I'm still only at 6 drops, but the symptoms I'm having could be

described as waves of different things going on every few days. I'll

have yeast symptoms, then heavy metal symptoms, then symptoms of some

infection (chills for a day or two).

I've had candida problems for about twenty years and almost

completely wiped it out just before getting sick with Lyme.

Trace minerals also really seem to help my body keep a balanced with

yeast. That has actually been the most important element over the

years for me. I think parasites eat up things that we need to stay

balanced and then the yeast probably has an open door to keep

growing.

I've also had the same success with spirulina regarding sugar

cravings.

So, thanks everyone and . That little exchange really helped.

>

> From: susan <ssiegel5@...>

> Subject: Re: [ ] MMS and Candida,

Yeast,fungus

> ?????

>

> Date: Saturday, July 19, 2008, 11:37 AM

>

>

> HI Joyce,

>

> Yes, I have experienced this problem. I had gotten up to 12 drops

on the

> MMS and my tongue became very coated, my scalp itchy, hair falling

out, and

> vaginal irritation. I stopped taking it for a while. When I

started again

> I started at a much lower dose. I now take 5-6 drops 2x/day. I

find that

> this dose helps to break up the fungus and then supplementing with

a lot of

> good probiotics (I use pb8, Healthy Trinity, and Threelac) help to

control

> this problem. But if I go up higher than 6 drops the yeast

returns.

> Granted, my diet is not the strictest in terms of sugars and

starches and

> this may account for lack of further improvement.

>

> It is very important to supplement with high potency probiotics

while on MMS

> Although, not as strong as antibiotics in terms of killing the

good

> bacteria, it nonetheless does affect it.

>

> S.

>

>

> -- [miracle_mineral_ supplement] MMS and Candida,

Yeast,fungus ?????

>

> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida.

First I

> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

>

>

> ------------ --------- --------- ------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Giving a dog MMS is a good thing--can give them lots of energy and get rid of parasites. But the very best thing to quickly get rid of yeasty ears in dogs is Blue Ear treatment. Google it and you will find the recipe. It is simple to make--a quart (?) of rubbing alcohol, x amount of boric acid and gentian violet. Sorry, can't remember the exact amounts of each that you use, but you will find it on Google. This works very quickly, but do it outside as when you put some in the ears the dog will shake out the excess and it can stain clothing blue. So wear older clothes and do it outside so you don't get a stain on any furniture.

Samala,

-- [ ] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ????? Date: Sunday, July 20, 2008, 3:40 AM

Hi Joyce!Yes! I have noticed vaginal irritation since starting back on the MMSagain, even at the low dose of 4 drops right now. I was trying tosleuth out what may have triggered it. Thanks for your post!Ballady>> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce>

[Guest guest]

I have a question regarding the yeast. I have a cat that is rubbing her ear a lot and scooting her head on one side on the carpet . I have looked in her ears looking for mites and only see what i think is wax what color would the yeast be? Thanks TedWILLIAM GREENAMYER <greenamyer@...> wrote: Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS,

it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments. From: ballady4 <ballady4 >Subject: [ ] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ????? Date: Sunday, July 20, 2008, 3:40 AM Hi Joyce!Yes! I have noticed vaginal irritation since starting back on the MMSagain, even at the low dose of 4 drops right now. I was trying tosleuth out what may have triggered it. Thanks for your post!Ballady>> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce>

[Guest guest]

Hi Everyone, Thanks soooooo much for all the replys. I

was doing pretty good in Nov 07 and was having hope of getting well.I

live in Santa Crruz, Calif and we were sprayed by planes over our

houses for 9hrs. I totally got knocked back health wise. The

lyme,Babesia and Erlicia reared their heads big time.I thought I was

going to die. Thought I would have to move to who knows where as we

were to be sprayed again.The whole bay area fought to stop it. Its

been almost a year and almost back to where I was. With all the stress

and being so ill I started blowing my diet. I am now back eating well.

This has probably added to yeast problem. I am doing lemon with MMS. I

pretty much follow the Body Ecology Diet by Donna Gates. She says

citric acid feeds candida. When I had used citric I felt really sick.

Not a herx. Soooo not sure if that added to the problem. I do good

probiotics,But will try some of these suggested. Its good to be back

on line after all these months, and seeing all my favorite people

here. My Dr said the spray toxins knocked my immune system down.

Probably why I went backwards. Peace and healing Blessings Joyce

, " loveandlight1111 "

<loveandlight1111@...> wrote:

>

> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

>

[Guest guest]

The Chihuahua with yeast in only one year has very small ear canals and you can't get anything but a very free flowing liquid into the ear. I have been trying with a cream (pushing it in) with some success but still not as good as H2O2. Even liquids have a hard time getting into this super small ear.

From: ballady4 <ballady4 (DOT) com>Subject: [miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????miracle_mineral_ supplementDate: Sunday, July 20, 2008, 3:40 AM

Hi Joyce!Yes! I have noticed vaginal irritation since starting back on the MMSagain, even at the low dose of 4 drops right now. I was trying tosleuth out what may have triggered it. Thanks for your post!Ballady>> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce>

[Guest guest]

Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

Blue Power is a liquid. The borax does not make a paste and the gentian violet is liquid. The amount of these things added to the alcohol does not even thicken the liquid--but somehow does seem to make the mix very powerful for getting rid of yeast. It normally only takes 2 or 3 applications to clear the ears completely. I used it once every few days to fix my dogs ears and the problem was gone after 2 applications one time, and a few years later when the problem came back, after 3 applications it was cleared up.

Samala,

-- [miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????miracle_mineral_ supplementDate: Sunday, July 20, 2008, 3:40 AM

Hi Joyce!Yes! I have noticed vaginal irritation since starting back on the MMSagain, even at the low dose of 4 drops right now. I was trying tosleuth out what may have triggered it. Thanks for your post!Ballady>> Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am> having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I> thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.> Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce>

[Guest guest]

MMS does kill yeast, but it will take it a long time to kill the external yeast in the ears via oral use of MMS. Much better, faster, to use Blue Ear treatment for this problem.

Just be careful with the Tea tree oil. It is very bad for cats, though dogs aren't as sensitive to it as cats.

I have tried cleaning ears daily, putting various oils on, plain alcohol, some of my anti-fungal tinctures, but nothing ever worked as quick as Blue Ear. Someone on a dog list told me about it, I mixed it up (cheap and the ingredients easy to get) and it worked almost immediately. Plus, my one dog that had long ears that would always get the yeast back after using other methods to clean the ears, took a few YEARS before the yeast came back again.

Back then if I'd have known about MMS he probably never would have gotten the yeast back after a Blue Ear treatment, because the treatment would have given the MMS time to work internally on the yeast problem.

Samala,

-------Original Message-------

Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

It certainly can be mites. Treat for mites anyway, even if the ears seem clean. Putting a few drops of olive oil in will smother mites. My cat always seemed to have pretty clean ears, we never saw her scratch at her ears. Then one day one of her ears puffed up HUGE. I took her to the vet and he said it was due to her scratching her ears, and he put a tiny camera in her ears and showed on a screen how bad the mites were. There were mites literally on top of mites! He said there was nothing much to be done for the ear because if he operated (cutting open the swelling to drain it) that the ear would just collapse, and leaving the swelling to drain on its own would also collapse the ear. They call it a cauliflower ear. As he didn't want to drain it manually because he said then it is open to infection, we just allowed the body to absorb the fluid--which left the ear to kind of crumple up instead of it (the top flat part) falling over. So now she has one normal ear and one crumply ear. :-) But the mites took some heavy duty professional medicine to kill.

So putting in some olive oil every so often (every few months) is a good idea. They can get mites anytime, even if right now the ears are clean.

Samala,

-------Original Message-------

I have a question regarding the yeast. I have a cat that is rubbing her ear a lot and scooting her head on one side on the carpet . I have looked in her ears looking for mites and only see what i think is wax what color would the yeast be? Thanks Ted

[Guest guest]

I am not sure if this has been discussed or not but I use a

mixture of 1/2 vinegar and 1/2 colloidal

silvers (water can be substituted for C¢¢s) whenever my dogs have an ear

problem. Clears it up every time and I

have been using this formula for 13 years for any kind of yeast or ear

infection. Make sure there is no open

cut or abrasion because it will burn and cause your pet great discomfort.

Seth

[ ] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

citric acid feeds candida? does that mean lemon juice feeds candida??

[Guest guest]

On 7/21/2008 2:28 PM, Sauve wrote:

> citric acid feeds candida? does that mean lemon juice feeds candida??

citric acid has nothing to do with citrus fruits...

[Guest guest]

Mixed vinegar with everything you could think of. What took it out in the Toy Poodles was H2O2. It took it out in the left ear on the Chihuahua but the right ear comes back and now I have not been able to get rid of it. Trying to get whatever I use down to the ear drum but she has such small ear canals that is hard to do. Tried MMS without any effect so I am guessing that there is an external source and possibly moisture. Might need surgery to open the ear canals. Don't know yet.From: seth sato <sethsato@...>Subject: Re: [ ] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????To:

Date: Monday, July 21, 2008, 10:34 AM

I am not sure if this has been discussed or not but I use a

mixture of 1/2 vinegar and 1/2 colloidal

silvers (water can be substituted for C¢¢s) whenever my dogs have an ear

problem. Clears it up every time and I

have been using this formula for 13 years for any kind of yeast or ear

infection. Make sure there is no open

cut or abrasion because it will burn and cause your pet great discomfort. Seth [miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to

some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

I don't know what H2O2 is, so this may be a really dumb question :-

Have you used Hydrogen Peroxide to open up and clean the ear passages

so it'll be easier to insert whatever best cures the ear problem? I always do that.

Gaele.

[miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

H2O2 is H2O (water) with an extra oxygen atom. This is Hydrogen Peroxide. This is along the same lines as DMSO and DMSO2. Many people know DMSO but many don't know DMSO2. It happens to be MSM. Again, the only difference is one oxygen atom.

From: seth sato <sethsato (DOT) com>Subject: Re: [miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????miracle_mineral_ supplementDate: Monday, July 21, 2008, 10:34 AM

I am not sure if this has been discussed or not but I use a mixture of 1/2 vinegar and 1/2 colloidal silvers (water can be substituted for C¢¢s) whenever my dogs have an ear problem. Clears it up every time and I have been using this formula for 13 years for any kind of yeast or ear infection. Make sure there is no open cut or abrasion because it will burn and cause your pet great discomfort.

Seth

[miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

Ah. Thanks for the info. I haven't figured out what DMSO is, or MSM.

If you don't mind explaining, it'd be a help to me...

Gaele.

[miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

Have you tried coning the ear? If liquid is not getting to

the root of the problem then coning may help, it can pull things out that

liquid cannot reach. For myself if the tried and true is less than what

is needed I always give my boys colloidal silver. I have found it has to

be administered orally ( 1 ounce) and every 2 hours for a day or two and that can really

turn the corner for many problems. Seth

[miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the

yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to

some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C

[Guest guest]

Hi Joyce,I explain the answer to your candida question on my video blog. You can get there through my website: www.TrueHealthDC.com. Click on " Video Blog " then " MMS "

Feel free to share my video blogs, website and testimonials with others that you think could benefit from care with us. They will thank you.

To your Health,

Brady Hurst DC, CCCN (Clinical Neurologist)

True Health: Advanced Alternative Medicine + Chiropractic

Office: 404.475.0402

Fax: 404.475.0443

eFax: 678.306.1841

1401 Peachtree St. #160 Atlanta GA, 30309 Office: 404.475.0402 Direct: 404.295.5722 Fax: 404.475.0443 E-Fax: 678.306.1841

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On Sat, Jul 19, 2008 at 12:53 PM, loveandlight1111 <loveandlight1111@...> wrote:

Has anyone had problems taking mms and it causing candida etc? I am

having extreme stomach bloating and other symptoms of candida. First I

thought it was that mms turns into salt. I have a problem with salt.

Any thoughts would be appreciated. Joyce

[Guest guest]

Our dog has also been plagued with this problem for years now off and on. We was so bad at one point that his ears were bleeding! We ended up taking him to a holistic vet and they tested him for food allergies. Turned out he was allergic to every grain and pork products. Once we took these away he got better. Now when they act up we know it is probably a reaction to something he ate and we have to check all the ingredients in bones we buy.

If you can find a holistic vet to test your dog, it is worth the extra expense to test for allergies.

-- Re: [ ] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ????? Date: Monday, July 21, 2008, 10:34 AM

I am not sure if this has been discussed or not but I use a mixture of 1/2 vinegar and 1/2 colloidal silvers (water can be substituted for Cʼʼs) whenever my dogs have an ear problem. Clears it up every time and I have been using this formula for 13 years for any kind of yeast or ear infection. Make sure there is no open cut or abrasion because it will burn and cause your pet great discomfort.

Seth

[miracle_mineral_ supplement] Re: MMS and Candida, Yeast,fungus ?????

Interesting topic. I have been trying to treat a couple dogs with ear yeast. No affect yet but according to the information on MMS, it should be taking out the yeast. Maybe it takes out the good bacteria to some extent too and without taking something like Acidophilus (easy to obtain) on a regular basis, the bad bacteria can get a foot-hold to quickly between treatments.I have found that Tea Tree Oil works great on dog ear problems, as well as my own. The dogs aren't crazy about it, but it seems to clear things right up (dogs) or at least help (my own). C