Guest guest Posted July 31, 2012 Report Share Posted July 31, 2012 Ghaffaar,So you are starting with the assumption that all these people, because they are operators?, have essentially the same brains, and you can train them all the same? Unless you have a very unusual population, some of them will be anxious, some impulsive, some obsessive, some daydreamy, etc. Unlike temperature training, which is a simple way of teaching a client to become aware of stress fight/flight states, brain training offers the abiity to affect energy patterns in the EEG that relate to how we think, learn, pay attention, perform, feel and control ourselves. It IS more complicated than temp training. Depending on what you are hoping to improve (if there is a general target), something like HEG, which can generally improve prefrontal function in most of us, thus improving motivation, working memory, organization, self regulation of emotions/behaviors and attention. It is simple to learn and do, requires no hookup or cleanup time. If you hope to train EEG, though, you need to be aware that there are plenty of people whose performance issues are related to having TOO MUCH alpha--not too little. Pete-- Van Deusenpvdtlc@...http://www.brain-trainer.com USA 678 224 5895BR 47 3346 6235The Learning Curve, Inc. On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 1:08 PM, ghaffaar <malekkho@...> wrote: Hi everyone I want to work with some operators to enhance their cognitive and work functions. I have some temperature biofeedback sessions in my program, but I've been confused with the protocols of neurofeedback. I want to try a peak performance protocol but the authors have suggested different kinds of training and I know which can be better. For increasing Alpha which cites are better? I need the guidance of who has some experience in this issue. Thanks Ghaffar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 Dear , Thank you for your attention and guidance. Truly this is a research program that I want to design for plant operators as a package. That will be my doctoral Thesis through Randomized Control Trial. So I think I should try nearly the same way for 25 subjects of intervention group vs. 25 participants of control group and I have a limited time and budget for it. The samples will be assessed before and after interventions. Therefore I am trying the effectiveness of this method for these people. It's because I should follow a simple way. I hope that your directions will help me a lot. Best Regards, Ghaffar > > > ** > > > > > > Hi everyone > > I want to work with some operators to enhance their cognitive and work > > functions. I have some temperature biofeedback sessions in my program, but > > I've been confused with the protocols of neurofeedback. > > I want to try a peak performance protocol but the authors have suggested > > different kinds of training and I know which can be better. For increasing > > Alpha which cites are better? I need the guidance of who has some > > experience in this issue. > > Thanks > > Ghaffar > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 1, 2012 Report Share Posted August 1, 2012 I would strongly recommend HEG (and perhaps HeartRate variability). Both will be easy to use and easy to learn. You'll be able to start using them immediately and use the same protocol with each person. HEG should help with executive functions such as motivation, attention, focus, self-regulation of emotions/behavior, social skills, working memory, organization/planning and ability to understand meaning of things. HRV is a useful system for reducing stress and anxiety. The whole package would cost around U$1750. Pete-- Van Deusenpvdtlc@...http://www.brain-trainer.com USA 678 224 5895BR 47 3346 6235The Learning Curve, Inc. On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 6:05 AM, ghaffaar <malekkho@...> wrote: Dear , Thank you for your attention and guidance. Truly this is a research program that I want to design for plant operators as a package. That will be my doctoral Thesis through Randomized Control Trial. So I think I should try nearly the same way for 25 subjects of intervention group vs. 25 participants of control group and I have a limited time and budget for it. The samples will be assessed before and after interventions. Therefore I am trying the effectiveness of this method for these people. It's because I should follow a simple way. I hope that your directions will help me a lot. Best Regards, Ghaffar > > > ** > > > > > > Hi everyone > > I want to work with some operators to enhance their cognitive and work > > functions. I have some temperature biofeedback sessions in my program, but > > I've been confused with the protocols of neurofeedback. > > I want to try a peak performance protocol but the authors have suggested > > different kinds of training and I know which can be better. For increasing > > Alpha which cites are better? I need the guidance of who has some > > experience in this issue. > > Thanks > > Ghaffar > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 3, 2012 Report Share Posted August 3, 2012 , I really enjoy that you are ready to reply all the time. It seems you have no rest. Thank you. I agree with you in all the issues. ly I should say that I've been worried that my work seems worthless as a PhD proposal in clinical psychology. One expects me that try a psychotherapy method or the same. I selected this title because of my interest and experience in BFB & NFB. So I want the research not to be too simple!! I have the definitions of tasks of 35 kinds of electric industry operators prepared by the managers for employment. By using that I explored some common abilities such as stress tolerant, vigilance attention and /detailed focus (or divided attention) auditory (or visual) response/recognition ability, social ability, reliability, reaction speed (or time), consistency, stability, impulsivity control, work in shift. I want to prepare a checklist on the base of general tasks (likert scale) for supervisors to fill for all of the plant operators in 1 or 2 regions and then I select the sample (N=50) from who have lowest scores. Then randomizing and pre test - interventions – post test. The additional assessment are NEO-PI-R - QEEG- IVA Continues performance test - three of measurements of Vieena Test system(Schuhfried)( stress tolerance - memory- Reaction speed) that can be used culture free and independent to language and are available in Iran. I expect that the intervention group will improve on the scores of objective assessment devices. I hope that this Research can be fundamental and applied and data of QEEG and /or NEO can be used for fundamental results and find (or doesn't) the relationship between some traits and / or EEG pattern with job or cognitive function. The best, Ghaffar >> Ghaffar,> > What are you doing with the QEEG's? That would be like taking a snapshot> of someone before and after they spent 20 days doing a walking program.> Perhaps you'll see changes, perhaps not. As I'm sure you are aware, the> brain is constantly shifting and changing. The QEEG will give you hundreds> of means and standard deviations, hundreds of z-scores. You'll really need> to have some kind of idea of which of all those data points you think will> be worth tracking and which ones might have an effect on the rather broad> categories of things you hope to change (stress management, work> performance and cognitive functions).> > How are you going to measure outcomes? Is there some measure of operator> performance that can be tracked objectively? Or are you actually going to> try to measure stress levels pre and post, job performance pre and post and> "relevant" cognitive functions (which would be what?) Are you just> assuming that an operator who reduces stress will improve performance? Or> that stress reduction will relate to cognitive functions? Those are three> very different things, and they may or may not relate to one another.> > HRV can be measured on a ProComp. HEG as well (though only pIR, not nIR).> I'm not sure of the cost for the sensor setups, and I'm not sure what> software is available, but you can do it. One question perhaps worth> considering is what might the outcome of your study be? Let's say you> showed significant improvement against a control group of trainers who did> HEG and HRV. Does a plant then need to pay $5000 to get a procomp/infiniti> setup and teach someone how to use it? HRV can easily be taught using> EmWave ($260) with perhaps a racing game ($99), and HEG can be trained> using a Pendant/Headband/BioExplorer package that will cost around $1480.> For well below $2000 a plant could purchase an easy-to-use system that> operators can use to train themselves.> > As far as EEG training is concerned, in terms of your study, you'll pretty> much need to train everyone using the same protocol. You are doing a QEEG,> so that could be used (by someone who knows what he is doing) to determine> suggested training approaches for each person, but you won't be able to> implement that. And as far as usefulness for plants, assuming you show a> benefit, they now have to face learning to find sites and place electrodes> to verify good signal quality to do EEG. It's a lot messier and more> complicated. The main benefit of EEG would be the ability to train> individual brains to change their own specific patterns. That's not what> you are looking for.> > Pete> --> Van Deusen> pvdtlc@...> http://www.brain-trainer.com> USA 678 224 5895> BR 47 3346 6235> The Learning Curve, Inc.> > > On Fri, Aug 3, 2012 at 9:32 AM, ghaffar malekkhosravi malekkho@...wrote:> > > **> >> >> >> > ,> > ****> > My proposal title is "The effectiveness of biofeedback and neurofeedback> > on stress management and improvement of work abilities and relevant> > cognitive functions in electric industry operators". ****> > Should I change my title if I use HEG? ****> > I have Procomp device. I think HEG works with this instrument. Doesn't it?> > ****> > I have worked with HRV mixed with temperature, but I thought> > that temperature biofeedback is easier to access for patients.****> > I do QEEG for both groups as pre and post test. Can it helpful or not?****> > What is the price of HEG?****> > Regard,****> > Ghaffar> >> >> > > >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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