Guest guest Posted January 15, 2008 Report Share Posted January 15, 2008 Re scrupe: my son's OCD is scrupe, falls in the severe range. I've gone thru a bit of it myself (from teen years) but not anywhere near what OCD can cause. For me: I didn't grow up going to church. But avoiding things like reading the Bible or going in a church, etc., helped me. Now - my son, , began going to church and I went with him (to the church service, not the Sunday school part) and since 's scrupe began - and so many thoughts about it//scrupe, talking about it, etc. - mine popped back up some. And due partly to my " avoidance " I've always shrugged it off pretty easily, though I can " cringe " at some thoughts. : He didn't grow up going to church either (since I didn't go) but did attend some things; like his AWANAS (if I recall the name right) was through a church, he very occasionally went to a church event maybe (my oldest son went to church until maybe end of 6th grade, he quit on his own). Anyway, 's scrupulosity began BEFORE attending church. He began reading the Bible before bed early in high school. Fine with me. But I did worry about OCD (which he'd had since 6th grade) taking hold of this, causing scrupe to pop up. And in 11th grade it did. We actually talked 2 or 3 times to a coworker's husband who was a minister after 's scrupe began. was taking some things a bit too literally, not all, some. Anyway that helped. But he wanted to begin to attend church, I thought it might help straighten some " misconceptions " (? good word?) out. Plus with his Aspergers Syndrome, he's never really had a social life at all. And some nice teens (I knew from his high school band and other) attended the church he now goes too. It was great for opening things up for him, giving him somewhat of a social life, the youth group there and all. His scrupulosity is better in areas, some things eased up. But the constant " bad thoughts " (cursing God or whatever; he won't talk about it much) are still there; sure he's committed the unpardonable sin, whatever, no chance of Heaven, etc. But he still attends EVERYthing at church, won't miss a day, goes to youth group things, etc. He seems anxious if I mention missing anything and I don't know if that's an OCD thing, he says it's because he enjoys going, which he does (still no social life outside church or college). I, on the other hand, have eased up on attending myself. I try to go about once a month now. It's not because of scrupulosity that I've lessened it, I was never enthused about going or whatever (having grown up not going) but I do think it has helped my own bit of re- emerging thoughts to ease up by not sitting in church. I think if stopped -- well, he'd torture himself, probably think it's adding to his sins. The other side being, everyone there loves , is great to him, he enjoys *that* side of it, not just going because he feels he should. I guess it differs with people. Reading the Bible or sitting in a church or my thinking so much about " wonder what 's thinking? " , LOL, can trigger mine. Not reading the actual Bible or sitting in a church or sitting in a sermon helps mine not be triggered. I can read Bible stuff online, it won't bother me so much as a Bible in my hands. I think 's scrupe isn't triggered like mine (holding Bible, being in a church...) and he will have thoughts - and does - ANYwhere, 24/7. And I've always realized that my thoughts are just that - thoughts - and still can't grasp that concept as to his own problems. Okay I rambled, jumped around, LOL, sorry. You can argue going to church is good exposure (ERP), that's what I tell myself when I'm there sometimes. Well I hope Leigh Anne and all can slowly move towards going back to church. With OCD, I think once you make progress in some behaviors/thoughts, a lot of the other behaviors (not all) can be more easily handled/overcome. Can some of you do church events or read Bible or stories at home but not attend? You might work on a bit of exposure at home with Bible stories or something, maybe just talking/telling one? > > Hey and everyone, > Somehow I missed out on the whole conversation, but I got bits and pieces of some of you talking about your diagnosed child having to quit going to church. We are in the middle of this one right now with our seven year old son. We haven't made him go in months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2008 Report Share Posted January 15, 2008 Of my 3 kids with ocd, one cannot attend church at all, and two have difficulty off and on. Though my son primarily had trouble with the crowds and contamination aspect (he also cannot do anything in proximity to his brother who is " contaminated " so cannot sit near him in van or pew) it then turns into a feeling of unworthiness b/c of missed attendance, which then compounds the obsessiog and avoidance. This is similar for my two daughters as well (not attending for various ocd reasons-but then some scrupulosity sets in over missing mass) but not as severe/consistent. My kids without ocd do not have these problems with church, so I can say it is not church/religion that causes it (as some might suggest and pointing to guilt that thinking about sin might initiate and how that is a " bad " thing about religion for kids). It is the ocd not the religion. We also have had the struggles on Sunday, it turning into a day of heightened ocd behaviors and heightened stress for everyone, so that we don't have that family togetherness any more (finally just gave up on enforcing everyone to attend b/c the absence is not for discipline or defiance reasons- though my husband tends to see it this way and that causes alot of strain-he thinks I caved in, but I just cannot do mass that way). It affects you in the community as well, how other parishioners who know you wonder why your kids are now missing, maybe thinking it is a teen rebellion thing or something... I figure if the ocd gets properly treated eventually, then some of these things will fall back into place. I just cannot control all the ways it affects us. nancy grace > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2008 Report Share Posted January 15, 2008 Sorry Leigh - it's late and I'm tired and I am stuck on your " prisoner of OCD " line and having a little giggle. I am having visions of all these OCD moms behind bars - do you think we would look better in the orange jump suits or the traditional stripes?? Joyce in Seattle --------- Re: Anyone tried to augment their SSRI with Buspiron? > or Inositol? > > lol, > > good one > > > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2008 Report Share Posted January 15, 2008 I vote vertical stripes. They are more slimming :-D BJ > > > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > > more recently. > > > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 15, 2008 Report Share Posted January 15, 2008 I wish I had some answers or advice to share, Leigh Anne, but I don't. I will say, I'm sorry for what you are going through, and I understand. Our son started melting down about God when he was 5. I had no idea he even had OCD (at that time) and had never heard of scrupulosity. I just knew that reading from the Bible freaked him out, and going to church became impossible. As we've progressed through the years and found out what we were dealing with (OCD), I've been afraid to take him to church. I worry all of that old stuff will just flare right back up. So, I've opted to avoid. I'm not sure if that's the best thing to do, but it kept the peace. Then, to make matters worse, you run into people from church who have no idea what you are dealing with and as you try to share, they decide your child is possessed, and psychology and medication is evil. <sigh> I'm not saying all have been that way, but there always seems to be a few in the crowd. If they only knew. If they could walk in our shoes for one day, I'm sure they would change their minds. I assure you they've never seen their child suffer the way most of us have. So, instead of sharing, you end up feeling ashamed of something you shouldn't have to feel ashamed of, and you hide it so you and your child will not be judged harshly. Nobody would make you feel that way if your child had diabetes. Okay. . .Just venting a little here, but I'd bet some of you know exactly what I'm talking about because you've experienced it too. I just hope that someday our son can have a relationship with God, without fear. BJ > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 Hi Leigh Ann: We had a short bout of church refusal. I resolved it by making him go to church with me and we would sit in the parking lot. For the whole service. Then we would go in to the foyer. Fortunately, at our church, the foyer is a cafe with tvs that show the service. So we would sit there together at a table and I would watch the service. On the second trip to the foyer, a friend of his came by and he was so bored that he went off to kids area. The only time this returns now is if we miss a few weeks. Hope it helps. mm > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 Hi Leigh Ann: We had a short bout of church refusal. I resolved it by making him go to church with me and we would sit in the parking lot. For the whole service. Then we would go in to the foyer. Fortunately, at our church, the foyer is a cafe with tvs that show the service. So we would sit there together at a table and I would watch the service. On the second trip to the foyer, a friend of his came by and he was so bored that he went off to kids area. The only time this returns now is if we miss a few weeks. Hope it helps. mm > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 16, 2008 Report Share Posted January 16, 2008 Welcome, Joan! You say it very well: These children are intelligent, creative, and sensitive to the feelings of everything and everyone around them. I'd have some words for that nun. > > Hi all, > I am new to your group - and I am glad I found you! I have a > beautiful 9 year old daughter who is highly gifted, highly > perfectionistic and has OCD. I also have a 5 year old son with > autism. I had to stop taking my daughter to church after her First > Communion last year. We are Catholic, and when the children are > preparing to receive Communion that try " practice hosts " . Well, my > daughter practically threw up on the altar. This blew up into a big > issue - with her teacher telling the nun and telling my daughter that > she HAD to take the host or she would not be making her First > Communion, blah blah blah. I think that initially her reaction was a > sensory one, as she does have sensory issues. Then it turned into an > OCD thing. The last time I took her to church she sat in the pew > crying with me holding her and trying to console her. Needless to > say, we just don't even try anymore. > > I am a person who has no problem explaining my thoughts and feelings > about my children, religion, or any other topic, and I refuse to be > made to feel ashamed by some " less enlightened " individuals! Our kids > are wonderful - they don't need to go to church to be good people, > they are perfect as they were created. > Joan in Chicago > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Not sure I understand-someone who cannot receive and swallow the host cannot receive Communion (one of my daughter's went through a spell of this, and my son currently-but they can still attend mass-if attendance not blocked by ocd as well). Also, if someone cannot receive the host, they can receive it under the form of wine (has this been checked into?). So I don't quite get the concern? Unless someone was unecessarily harsh or rude-which may be the case. If your daughter can continue to practice to take the host (which is not consecrated so no concern over desecration) then why can't she be prepared to receive her First Communion? My son was not able to attend instruction for First Communion last year-because of how his siblings' ocd was taking over our lives-so he is in the class a year late. It is necessary, imo, for the individual to be well instructed to know what they are receiving, before making Communion, so I am ok with the parish postponing his reception, and, in an indirect way, it was, unfortunately, due to ocd (just not his ocd). Anyway, sorry this is happening with your daughter. OCD does not suspend for religious observances ( I would have hoped otherwise) but surely God knows this and there should be no guilt or blame associated with it. nancy grace > > > > Hi all, > > I am new to your group - and I am glad I found you! I have a > > beautiful 9 year old daughter who is highly gifted, highly > > perfectionistic and has OCD. I also have a 5 year old son with > > autism. I had to stop taking my daughter to church after her First > > Communion last year. We are Catholic, and when the children are > > preparing to receive Communion that try " practice hosts " . Well, my > > daughter practically threw up on the altar. This blew up into a big > > issue - with her teacher telling the nun and telling my daughter > that > > she HAD to take the host or she would not be making her First > > Communion, blah blah blah. I think that initially her reaction was > a > > sensory one, as she does have sensory issues. Then it turned into > an > > OCD thing. The last time I took her to church she sat in the pew > > crying with me holding her and trying to console her. Needless to > > say, we just don't even try anymore. > > > > I am a person who has no problem explaining my thoughts and feelings > > about my children, religion, or any other topic, and I refuse to be > > made to feel ashamed by some " less enlightened " individuals! Our > kids > > are wonderful - they don't need to go to church to be good people, > > they are perfect as they were created. > > Joan in Chicago > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Joan, When you say that it turned into an " OCD thing " , I wonder what kind of OCD? My daughter (13) has the scrupulosity variant of OCD and for a long time we didn't attend church because she was plagued by thoughts of going to hell if she didn't do what the OCD told her to do. Church attendance was excruciating for her. During CBT the therapist actually took her (I was along, too) to a church nearby and we worked on the specific things that she found really difficult, like holding the Bible a certain way, or reading from the Bible. In fact, for many exposures before that one she and I would simply drive to nearby churches and sit there in the car until her anxiety lessened. Then we went to our church (in off hours) and stood in the lobby. When she was ready we sat in a pew. I'm happy to say that now we're able to go and her OCD has diminished. I don't know for sure how much of the improvement is due to CBT and how much is meds, but I'm just glad that there's an improvement. I agree with you that the rituals of the church are nice but not necessary for salvation. You have to do what you think best as a parent. Maybe you could develop your own exposures which walk her slowly up the scale since sitting in church seems very difficult for her. Our psychologists emphasized that we should not avoid situations because of OCD - avoiding gives it more power. But starting out slow will give her more of a feeling of accomplishment and confidence. Good luck! I hope all goes well for you. Marilee .....I think that initially her reaction was a > sensory one, as she does have sensory issues. Then it turned into an > OCD thing. The last time I took her to church she sat in the pew > crying with me holding her and trying to console her. Needless to > say, we just don't even try anymore. > > I am a person who has no problem explaining my thoughts and feelings > about my children, religion, or any other topic, and I refuse to be > made to feel ashamed by some " less enlightened " individuals! Our kids > are wonderful - they don't need to go to church to be good people, > they are perfect as they were created. > Joan in Chicago > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 BJ, thanks for the encouragement and just plain old empathy/ understanding. I will vent right along with you that my biggest struggle is that unless a person has walked in our shoes, it is just plain old impossible to understand. I get the feeling from some - not all - people in our church that we should just 'crack down' on our son and get his behavior in line. ha. been there done that. For a long time before I knew he had ocd. Didn't help a thing. Probably made it worse. My son has also been upset up and down about God since he was five. So tough to watch a child walk through. his fears have lessened, and he enjoys some Bible reading. anyway, thanks again for writing. The day will come when fear will be conquered for our guys. hugs, Leigh Anne Re: avoiding church I wish I had some answers or advice to share, Leigh Anne, but I don't. I will say, I'm sorry for what you are going through, and I understand. Our son started melting down about God when he was 5. I had no idea he even had OCD (at that time) and had never heard of scrupulosity. I just knew that reading from the Bible freaked him out, and going to church became impossible. As we've progressed through the years and found out what we were dealing with (OCD), I've been afraid to take him to church. I worry all of that old stuff will just flare right back up. So, I've opted to avoid. I'm not sure if that's the best thing to do, but it kept the peace. Then, to make matters worse, you run into people from church who have no idea what you are dealing with and as you try to share, they decide your child is possessed, and psychology and medication is evil. <sigh> I'm not saying all have been that way, but there always seems to be a few in the crowd. If they only knew. If they could walk in our shoes for one day, I'm sure they would change their minds. I assure you they've never seen their child suffer the way most of us have. So, instead of sharing, you end up feeling ashamed of something you shouldn't have to feel ashamed of, and you hide it so you and your child will not be judged harshly. Nobody would make you feel that way if your child had diabetes. Okay. . .Just venting a little here, but I'd bet some of you know exactly what I'm talking about because you've experienced it too. I just hope that someday our son can have a relationship with God, without fear. BJ > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 BJ, thanks for the encouragement and just plain old empathy/ understanding. I will vent right along with you that my biggest struggle is that unless a person has walked in our shoes, it is just plain old impossible to understand. I get the feeling from some - not all - people in our church that we should just 'crack down' on our son and get his behavior in line. ha. been there done that. For a long time before I knew he had ocd. Didn't help a thing. Probably made it worse. My son has also been upset up and down about God since he was five. So tough to watch a child walk through. his fears have lessened, and he enjoys some Bible reading. anyway, thanks again for writing. The day will come when fear will be conquered for our guys. hugs, Leigh Anne Re: avoiding church I wish I had some answers or advice to share, Leigh Anne, but I don't. I will say, I'm sorry for what you are going through, and I understand. Our son started melting down about God when he was 5. I had no idea he even had OCD (at that time) and had never heard of scrupulosity. I just knew that reading from the Bible freaked him out, and going to church became impossible. As we've progressed through the years and found out what we were dealing with (OCD), I've been afraid to take him to church. I worry all of that old stuff will just flare right back up. So, I've opted to avoid. I'm not sure if that's the best thing to do, but it kept the peace. Then, to make matters worse, you run into people from church who have no idea what you are dealing with and as you try to share, they decide your child is possessed, and psychology and medication is evil. <sigh> I'm not saying all have been that way, but there always seems to be a few in the crowd. If they only knew. If they could walk in our shoes for one day, I'm sure they would change their minds. I assure you they've never seen their child suffer the way most of us have. So, instead of sharing, you end up feeling ashamed of something you shouldn't have to feel ashamed of, and you hide it so you and your child will not be judged harshly. Nobody would make you feel that way if your child had diabetes. Okay. . .Just venting a little here, but I'd bet some of you know exactly what I'm talking about because you've experienced it too. I just hope that someday our son can have a relationship with God, without fear. BJ > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 , How many kids do you have? three with ocd? wow. I have three kids, and my oldest has ocd. my youngest (age 3) is showing signs, and I'm scared to death. We've been through so much, just can't imagine going through it all again with her. . . Anyway, I totally understand what you're saying about not being able to control all the ways it affects your family. Not worth it to try to 'make' it happen/ going to church and all. My husband also tends to see it that i've caved in, and that it is a defiance issue, though it clearly isn't. That can be so tough/ being on different pages with your spouse. We're slowly working it all through. I think you're right - the important things will hopefully fall back into place as the ocd is treated! Good luck with all! Leigh Anne Re: avoiding church Of my 3 kids with ocd, one cannot attend church at all, and two have difficulty off and on. Though my son primarily had trouble with the crowds and contamination aspect (he also cannot do anything in proximity to his brother who is " contaminated " so cannot sit near him in van or pew) it then turns into a feeling of unworthiness b/c of missed attendance, which then compounds the obsessiog and avoidance. This is similar for my two daughters as well (not attending for various ocd reasons-but then some scrupulosity sets in over missing mass) but not as severe/consistent. My kids without ocd do not have these problems with church, so I can say it is not church/religion that causes it (as some might suggest and pointing to guilt that thinking about sin might initiate and how that is a " bad " thing about religion for kids). It is the ocd not the religion. We also have had the struggles on Sunday, it turning into a day of heightened ocd behaviors and heightened stress for everyone, so that we don't have that family togetherness any more (finally just gave up on enforcing everyone to attend b/c the absence is not for discipline or defiance reasons- though my husband tends to see it this way and that causes alot of strain-he thinks I caved in, but I just cannot do mass that way). It affects you in the community as well, how other parishioners who know you wonder why your kids are now missing, maybe thinking it is a teen rebellion thing or something... I figure if the ocd gets properly treated eventually, then some of these things will fall back into place. I just cannot control all the ways it affects us. nancy grace > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have just > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was written 3 > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > more recently. > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 17, 2008 Report Share Posted January 17, 2008 Thanks for 'rambling' and sharing some of your story. I also had a bout with scrupulosity myself after college. Mine was extremely severe for a few months, but hasn't really come back since it was tackled. I do have to also be very careful what preachers/teachers I listen to, but reading the Bible doesn't bother me. Though it did used to, and I am no longer under the felt obligation to read it every day or something. Scrupe does seem very individual, but some similarities. It's wonderful that your son loves his church and is loved very much there. That is hopeful to me. It is so cool to have the freedom to do what works for each of us, huh? is doing well being active in church. You're slowing down with it. I'm avoiding our old church like the plague, but that's another story. . . Smiles, Leigh Anne Re: avoiding church Re scrupe: my son's OCD is scrupe, falls in the severe range. I've gone thru a bit of it myself (from teen years) but not anywhere near what OCD can cause. For me: I didn't grow up going to church. But avoiding things like reading the Bible or going in a church, etc., helped me. Now - my son, , began going to church and I went with him (to the church service, not the Sunday school part) and since 's scrupe began - and so many thoughts about it//scrupe, talking about it, etc. - mine popped back up some. And due partly to my " avoidance " I've always shrugged it off pretty easily, though I can " cringe " at some thoughts. : He didn't grow up going to church either (since I didn't go) but did attend some things; like his AWANAS (if I recall the name right) was through a church, he very occasionally went to a church event maybe (my oldest son went to church until maybe end of 6th grade, he quit on his own). Anyway, 's scrupulosity began BEFORE attending church. He began reading the Bible before bed early in high school. Fine with me. But I did worry about OCD (which he'd had since 6th grade) taking hold of this, causing scrupe to pop up. And in 11th grade it did. We actually talked 2 or 3 times to a coworker's husband who was a minister after 's scrupe began. was taking some things a bit too literally, not all, some. Anyway that helped. But he wanted to begin to attend church, I thought it might help straighten some " misconceptions " (? good word?) out. Plus with his Aspergers Syndrome, he's never really had a social life at all. And some nice teens (I knew from his high school band and other) attended the church he now goes too. It was great for opening things up for him, giving him somewhat of a social life, the youth group there and all. His scrupulosity is better in areas, some things eased up. But the constant " bad thoughts " (cursing God or whatever; he won't talk about it much) are still there; sure he's committed the unpardonable sin, whatever, no chance of Heaven, etc. But he still attends EVERYthing at church, won't miss a day, goes to youth group things, etc. He seems anxious if I mention missing anything and I don't know if that's an OCD thing, he says it's because he enjoys going, which he does (still no social life outside church or college). I, on the other hand, have eased up on attending myself. I try to go about once a month now. It's not because of scrupulosity that I've lessened it, I was never enthused about going or whatever (having grown up not going) but I do think it has helped my own bit of re- emerging thoughts to ease up by not sitting in church. I think if stopped -- well, he'd torture himself, probably think it's adding to his sins. The other side being, everyone there loves , is great to him, he enjoys *that* side of it, not just going because he feels he should. I guess it differs with people. Reading the Bible or sitting in a church or my thinking so much about " wonder what 's thinking? " , LOL, can trigger mine. Not reading the actual Bible or sitting in a church or sitting in a sermon helps mine not be triggered. I can read Bible stuff online, it won't bother me so much as a Bible in my hands. I think 's scrupe isn't triggered like mine (holding Bible, being in a church...) and he will have thoughts - and does - ANYwhere, 24/7. And I've always realized that my thoughts are just that - thoughts - and still can't grasp that concept as to his own problems. Okay I rambled, jumped around, LOL, sorry. You can argue going to church is good exposure (ERP), that's what I tell myself when I'm there sometimes. Well I hope Leigh Anne and all can slowly move towards going back to church. With OCD, I think once you make progress in some behaviors/thoughts, a lot of the other behaviors (not all) can be more easily handled/overcome. Can some of you do church events or read Bible or stories at home but not attend? You might work on a bit of exposure at home with Bible stories or something, maybe just talking/telling one? > > Hey and everyone, > Somehow I missed out on the whole conversation, but I got bits and pieces of some of you talking about your diagnosed child having to quit going to church. We are in the middle of this one right now with our seven year old son. We haven't made him go in months ________________________________________________________________________________\ ____ Never miss a thing. Make your home page. http://www./r/hs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi Leigh Anne, Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr olds have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been hospitalized due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their own ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his ocd kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. We had a normal period of family life before my oldest started having symptoms (did not know it was ocd and I was vacuuming her room washing her bedding etc) around 7th grade when she started school after homeschooling. The next 4 children already here at that point and 2nd daughter had begun homeschooling. I assumed all was well, though my 2nd daughter (placid and exceedingly shy as baby/toddler) was seeming more odd with screaming spells and sensory defensiveness. Her pediatrician suggested autism-but did not quite fit since she had normal if not precocious speech early on. My 6th(little surprise blessing) was not born yet. This is what I try to explain about our large family-we assumed all was well or would be well (b/c I infer at times a sense of blame or irresponsibility attributed to us for having 3 kids with ocd-maybe just among counselors or " dud " therapists we stumbled upon initially). When I learned OCD was genetic to a degree, I got us and extended family enrolled in a university research study (I also have identical twin who functions poorly w/preference to be alone and dh has brother similar) blood draws and interviews. I also thought it might help my dh get it. Kept trying to find right therapy within driving distance and covered by insurance. Our p-doc is out of pocket. It is easier to get customized help with practitioner not in managed care. It was kind of a blow to me when my son started having such classic symptoms, he'd had some transient symptoms in past that I hoped were extent of it. I was on his case too, " how can you let OCD do this when you have seen what your sister's have gone through? " But OCD does not reason that way. I'm always running to appointments. Have two 504/potentially IEP's (for 10 and 15 yr old) in development. My oldest (19) cannot attend away college-though conditionally accepted, so trying to fit one or two community college courses (starting slow) into her schedule (she does not drive yet and was literally homebound if not room-bound before Menninger) plus her therapy. Therapy for my son. Therapy for my 15 yr old. All three see a psychiatrist as well. I actually discontinued therapy apptments for my 15 yr old in Oct (my own health crisis) and she seems better mood-wise due to reduced stress! I don't know where to focus sometimes, but fortunately my other 3 do just fine. The hardest has been not being on same page with my husband, I know this has been hard for our affected kids. So I can't say, as I'd wish to, " it is just the ocd, not family dynamics " . My husband trys but repeatedly lapses into frustration, blaming (often me) or temper over some of the behaviors and/or limitations. Sometimes I think is more frustration than true sentiments that come out, but my kids cannot be expected to see that. So the affected kids avoid him. (And the other siblings wary). They are less inclined to see OCD as the culprit at times b/c angry or hurt over dad. We've done the family therapy, but still he has these lapses. It so happens that he needs a strict routine and planned expectations to function well himself so all the disruptions stressful. He took up running which helps, I do see a change it is like medication for him. Yet with a recent injury the mood/temper flared again. Not to say I have no part in passing on some ocd or neuro-dysfunction. My dh and I both fit into shadow syndrome category I think. nancy grace > > , > How many kids do you have? three with ocd? wow. I have three kids, and my oldest has ocd. my youngest (age 3) is showing signs, and I'm scared to death. We've been through so much, just can't imagine going through it all again with her. . . > Anyway, I totally understand what you're saying about not being able to control all the ways it affects your family. Not worth it to try to 'make' it happen/ going to church and all. My husband also tends to see it that i've caved in, and that it is a defiance issue, though it clearly isn't. That can be so tough/ being on different pages with your spouse. We're slowly working it all through. > I think you're right - the important things will hopefully fall back into place as the ocd is treated! > Good luck with all! > Leigh Anne > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi Leigh Anne, Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr olds have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been hospitalized due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their own ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his ocd kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. We had a normal period of family life before my oldest started having symptoms (did not know it was ocd and I was vacuuming her room washing her bedding etc) around 7th grade when she started school after homeschooling. The next 4 children already here at that point and 2nd daughter had begun homeschooling. I assumed all was well, though my 2nd daughter (placid and exceedingly shy as baby/toddler) was seeming more odd with screaming spells and sensory defensiveness. Her pediatrician suggested autism-but did not quite fit since she had normal if not precocious speech early on. My 6th(little surprise blessing) was not born yet. This is what I try to explain about our large family-we assumed all was well or would be well (b/c I infer at times a sense of blame or irresponsibility attributed to us for having 3 kids with ocd-maybe just among counselors or " dud " therapists we stumbled upon initially). When I learned OCD was genetic to a degree, I got us and extended family enrolled in a university research study (I also have identical twin who functions poorly w/preference to be alone and dh has brother similar) blood draws and interviews. I also thought it might help my dh get it. Kept trying to find right therapy within driving distance and covered by insurance. Our p-doc is out of pocket. It is easier to get customized help with practitioner not in managed care. It was kind of a blow to me when my son started having such classic symptoms, he'd had some transient symptoms in past that I hoped were extent of it. I was on his case too, " how can you let OCD do this when you have seen what your sister's have gone through? " But OCD does not reason that way. I'm always running to appointments. Have two 504/potentially IEP's (for 10 and 15 yr old) in development. My oldest (19) cannot attend away college-though conditionally accepted, so trying to fit one or two community college courses (starting slow) into her schedule (she does not drive yet and was literally homebound if not room-bound before Menninger) plus her therapy. Therapy for my son. Therapy for my 15 yr old. All three see a psychiatrist as well. I actually discontinued therapy apptments for my 15 yr old in Oct (my own health crisis) and she seems better mood-wise due to reduced stress! I don't know where to focus sometimes, but fortunately my other 3 do just fine. The hardest has been not being on same page with my husband, I know this has been hard for our affected kids. So I can't say, as I'd wish to, " it is just the ocd, not family dynamics " . My husband trys but repeatedly lapses into frustration, blaming (often me) or temper over some of the behaviors and/or limitations. Sometimes I think is more frustration than true sentiments that come out, but my kids cannot be expected to see that. So the affected kids avoid him. (And the other siblings wary). They are less inclined to see OCD as the culprit at times b/c angry or hurt over dad. We've done the family therapy, but still he has these lapses. It so happens that he needs a strict routine and planned expectations to function well himself so all the disruptions stressful. He took up running which helps, I do see a change it is like medication for him. Yet with a recent injury the mood/temper flared again. Not to say I have no part in passing on some ocd or neuro-dysfunction. My dh and I both fit into shadow syndrome category I think. nancy grace > > , > How many kids do you have? three with ocd? wow. I have three kids, and my oldest has ocd. my youngest (age 3) is showing signs, and I'm scared to death. We've been through so much, just can't imagine going through it all again with her. . . > Anyway, I totally understand what you're saying about not being able to control all the ways it affects your family. Not worth it to try to 'make' it happen/ going to church and all. My husband also tends to see it that i've caved in, and that it is a defiance issue, though it clearly isn't. That can be so tough/ being on different pages with your spouse. We're slowly working it all through. > I think you're right - the important things will hopefully fall back into place as the ocd is treated! > Good luck with all! > Leigh Anne > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi, Grace, I am really new to all this and am still trying to understand terms. What is a shadow symptom? Bren nancy grace <nmlinnen@...> wrote: Hi Leigh Anne, Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr olds have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been hospitalized due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their own ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his ocd kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. We had a normal period of family life before my oldest started having symptoms (did not know it was ocd and I was vacuuming her room washing her bedding etc) around 7th grade when she started school after homeschooling. The next 4 children already here at that point and 2nd daughter had begun homeschooling. I assumed all was well, though my 2nd daughter (placid and exceedingly shy as baby/toddler) was seeming more odd with screaming spells and sensory defensiveness. Her pediatrician suggested autism-but did not quite fit since she had normal if not precocious speech early on. My 6th(little surprise blessing) was not born yet. This is what I try to explain about our large family-we assumed all was well or would be well (b/c I infer at times a sense of blame or irresponsibility attributed to us for having 3 kids with ocd-maybe just among counselors or " dud " therapists we stumbled upon initially). When I learned OCD was genetic to a degree, I got us and extended family enrolled in a university research study (I also have identical twin who functions poorly w/preference to be alone and dh has brother similar) blood draws and interviews. I also thought it might help my dh get it. Kept trying to find right therapy within driving distance and covered by insurance. Our p-doc is out of pocket. It is easier to get customized help with practitioner not in managed care. It was kind of a blow to me when my son started having such classic symptoms, he'd had some transient symptoms in past that I hoped were extent of it. I was on his case too, " how can you let OCD do this when you have seen what your sister's have gone through? " But OCD does not reason that way. I'm always running to appointments. Have two 504/potentially IEP's (for 10 and 15 yr old) in development. My oldest (19) cannot attend away college-though conditionally accepted, so trying to fit one or two community college courses (starting slow) into her schedule (she does not drive yet and was literally homebound if not room-bound before Menninger) plus her therapy. Therapy for my son. Therapy for my 15 yr old. All three see a psychiatrist as well. I actually discontinued therapy apptments for my 15 yr old in Oct (my own health crisis) and she seems better mood-wise due to reduced stress! I don't know where to focus sometimes, but fortunately my other 3 do just fine. The hardest has been not being on same page with my husband, I know this has been hard for our affected kids. So I can't say, as I'd wish to, " it is just the ocd, not family dynamics " . My husband trys but repeatedly lapses into frustration, blaming (often me) or temper over some of the behaviors and/or limitations. Sometimes I think is more frustration than true sentiments that come out, but my kids cannot be expected to see that. So the affected kids avoid him. (And the other siblings wary). They are less inclined to see OCD as the culprit at times b/c angry or hurt over dad. We've done the family therapy, but still he has these lapses. It so happens that he needs a strict routine and planned expectations to function well himself so all the disruptions stressful. He took up running which helps, I do see a change it is like medication for him. Yet with a recent injury the mood/temper flared again. Not to say I have no part in passing on some ocd or neuro-dysfunction. My dh and I both fit into shadow syndrome category I think. nancy grace > > , > How many kids do you have? three with ocd? wow. I have three kids, and my oldest has ocd. my youngest (age 3) is showing signs, and I'm scared to death. We've been through so much, just can't imagine going through it all again with her. . . > Anyway, I totally understand what you're saying about not being able to control all the ways it affects your family. Not worth it to try to 'make' it happen/ going to church and all. My husband also tends to see it that i've caved in, and that it is a defiance issue, though it clearly isn't. That can be so tough/ being on different pages with your spouse. We're slowly working it all through. > I think you're right - the important things will hopefully fall back into place as the ocd is treated! > Good luck with all! > Leigh Anne > > > > --------------------------------- Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi, Grace, I am really new to all this and am still trying to understand terms. What is a shadow symptom? Bren nancy grace <nmlinnen@...> wrote: Hi Leigh Anne, Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr olds have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been hospitalized due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their own ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his ocd kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. We had a normal period of family life before my oldest started having symptoms (did not know it was ocd and I was vacuuming her room washing her bedding etc) around 7th grade when she started school after homeschooling. The next 4 children already here at that point and 2nd daughter had begun homeschooling. I assumed all was well, though my 2nd daughter (placid and exceedingly shy as baby/toddler) was seeming more odd with screaming spells and sensory defensiveness. Her pediatrician suggested autism-but did not quite fit since she had normal if not precocious speech early on. My 6th(little surprise blessing) was not born yet. This is what I try to explain about our large family-we assumed all was well or would be well (b/c I infer at times a sense of blame or irresponsibility attributed to us for having 3 kids with ocd-maybe just among counselors or " dud " therapists we stumbled upon initially). When I learned OCD was genetic to a degree, I got us and extended family enrolled in a university research study (I also have identical twin who functions poorly w/preference to be alone and dh has brother similar) blood draws and interviews. I also thought it might help my dh get it. Kept trying to find right therapy within driving distance and covered by insurance. Our p-doc is out of pocket. It is easier to get customized help with practitioner not in managed care. It was kind of a blow to me when my son started having such classic symptoms, he'd had some transient symptoms in past that I hoped were extent of it. I was on his case too, " how can you let OCD do this when you have seen what your sister's have gone through? " But OCD does not reason that way. I'm always running to appointments. Have two 504/potentially IEP's (for 10 and 15 yr old) in development. My oldest (19) cannot attend away college-though conditionally accepted, so trying to fit one or two community college courses (starting slow) into her schedule (she does not drive yet and was literally homebound if not room-bound before Menninger) plus her therapy. Therapy for my son. Therapy for my 15 yr old. All three see a psychiatrist as well. I actually discontinued therapy apptments for my 15 yr old in Oct (my own health crisis) and she seems better mood-wise due to reduced stress! I don't know where to focus sometimes, but fortunately my other 3 do just fine. The hardest has been not being on same page with my husband, I know this has been hard for our affected kids. So I can't say, as I'd wish to, " it is just the ocd, not family dynamics " . My husband trys but repeatedly lapses into frustration, blaming (often me) or temper over some of the behaviors and/or limitations. Sometimes I think is more frustration than true sentiments that come out, but my kids cannot be expected to see that. So the affected kids avoid him. (And the other siblings wary). They are less inclined to see OCD as the culprit at times b/c angry or hurt over dad. We've done the family therapy, but still he has these lapses. It so happens that he needs a strict routine and planned expectations to function well himself so all the disruptions stressful. He took up running which helps, I do see a change it is like medication for him. Yet with a recent injury the mood/temper flared again. Not to say I have no part in passing on some ocd or neuro-dysfunction. My dh and I both fit into shadow syndrome category I think. nancy grace > > , > How many kids do you have? three with ocd? wow. I have three kids, and my oldest has ocd. my youngest (age 3) is showing signs, and I'm scared to death. We've been through so much, just can't imagine going through it all again with her. . . > Anyway, I totally understand what you're saying about not being able to control all the ways it affects your family. Not worth it to try to 'make' it happen/ going to church and all. My husband also tends to see it that i've caved in, and that it is a defiance issue, though it clearly isn't. That can be so tough/ being on different pages with your spouse. We're slowly working it all through. > I think you're right - the important things will hopefully fall back into place as the ocd is treated! > Good luck with all! > Leigh Anne > > > > --------------------------------- Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Grace: Your story is amazing. You must be a very strong woman to deal with the many facets of OCD you face each day. Really gives me some perspective. > > > > , > > How many kids do you have? three with ocd? wow. I have three > kids, and my oldest has ocd. my youngest (age 3) is showing signs, > and I'm scared to death. We've been through so much, just can't > imagine going through it all again with her. . . > > Anyway, I totally understand what you're saying about not being > able to control all the ways it affects your family. Not worth it to > try to 'make' it happen/ going to church and all. My husband also > tends to see it that i've caved in, and that it is a defiance issue, > though it clearly isn't. That can be so tough/ being on different > pages with your spouse. We're slowly working it all through. > > I think you're right - the important things will hopefully fall > back into place as the ocd is treated! > > Good luck with all! > > Leigh Anne > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi Bren, " Shadow syndrome " is a term to describe sub-clinical symptoms of a psychiatric disorder. In other words symptoms do not interfere with normal life but may cause some distress. For example in realm of OCD, one can have mild degree of germ/washing type concerns, or symmetry/order concerns, or checking so on. I think a book on the subject coined the term. nancy grace -- In , Pailes <swordovfire@...> wrote: > > Hi, Grace, > I am really new to all this and am still trying to understand terms. What is a shadow symptom? > Bren > > nancy grace <nmlinnen@...> wrote: > Hi Leigh Anne, > Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr olds > have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff > does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been hospitalized > due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty > generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty > treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their own > ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one > mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate > treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his ocd > kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi Grace, Thanks for the info. I'm still trying to figure out what's going on with my daughter as most of the trouble goes on inside her head (obsessing over a particular thought). One of the big things that upsets her is if she thinks I am the least bit upset or frustrated. Frequently, it's all her ocd stuff and not us being upset. It's like I'm constantly walking on eggshells because if I do the least little thing she refuses to go on with anything until she says " It's settled " . Since we are homeschooling, we just lose more school time. She is already a year behind but she will not accept that. Any suggestions? Bren nancy grace <nmlinnen@...> wrote: Hi Bren, " Shadow syndrome " is a term to describe sub-clinical symptoms of a psychiatric disorder. In other words symptoms do not interfere with normal life but may cause some distress. For example in realm of OCD, one can have mild degree of germ/washing type concerns, or symmetry/order concerns, or checking so on. I think a book on the subject coined the term. nancy grace -- In , Pailes <swordovfire@...> wrote: > > Hi, Grace, > I am really new to all this and am still trying to understand terms. What is a shadow symptom? > Bren > > nancy grace <nmlinnen@...> wrote: > Hi Leigh Anne, > Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr olds > have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff > does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been hospitalized > due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty > generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty > treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their own > ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one > mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate > treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his ocd > kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. > > --------------------------------- Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 ((((hugs back)))) Leigh Anne BJ > > > > > > > > I am meeting with my sons' psychiatrist on Thursday to discuss next > > > > moves with his medications. So far, he appears to be med resistant > > > > and has tried 3 different SSRI's, over a 2 year period, with no > > > > notable difference. He is currently on Celexa (and yes, appears to > > > > have gained weight... probably about 10 lbs.) and she wants to > > > > introduce the tranquilizer Buspiron to augment the Celexa. She says > > > > it is a non-addicting, low side effect tranquilizer. > > > > > > > > The idea of giving him this has been hard for me to take. I have > just > > > > read in an old post that there is an OTC B Vitamin called Inositol > > > > that has been used in augmentation as well, but the post was > written 3 > > > > years ago, and I would like to find someone who has gone this route > > > > more recently. > > > > > > > > I am currently reading Dr. March's book on pediatric OCD. It was > > > > written in 2007, and appears to be very current. If I am reading it > > > > correctly, he thinks that there should be no other med category for > > > > OCD treatment other than an SSRI. I have read in other places that > > > > Buspiron should only be used for Generalized Anxiety Disorder > > > > treatment and not OCD. I am completely overwhelmed with making these > > > > decisions and thought I would reach out to the group for help. > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > > Never miss a thing. Make your home page. > > > http://www.. com/r/hs > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi Bren, If your daughter seeing a therapist? (if not go to files to see how to locate therapist and what to look for). I don't think most kids with ocd are willing to give up obsessions and inner or outer rituals without therapy-too much anxiety and doubt. The family and individual has to be primed for undergoing therapy, by a professional naming the OCD, so the child knows it is " real " and that a doctor says so (but that rituals are not valid for conquering fears), and learning it is not their fault, nor anyone's. Then getting information about it, learning how therapy works (bossing back the OCD by messing up rituals, or delaying them, or not doing them) and getting motivated to try. On a day to day basis, without active participation in therapy established (either because not in therapy yet, or or the child refuses to partcipate) you can try not to accommodate rituals by telling your daughter you do not have to to do what OCD says,and she should try not to do what it says as well. It can seems to help by calling the irrational behavior " OCD " (or a name the child chooses), that you won't cooperate with, so she'll know that the reasonable person you can help and cooperate with is your daughter-not her OCD. nancy grace > > Hi Leigh Anne, > > Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr > olds > > have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff > > does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been > hospitalized > > due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty > > generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty > > treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their > own > > ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one > > mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate > > treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his > ocd > > kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi Grace, Yes, she just started seeing a therapist from our church. She is professionally trained but is not a specialist in ocd. She told her to make cards with scriptures on them and every time she had one of these thoughts to read the cards until she felt better. She didn't reread at all for about 4 days and then started getting upset about thinking we're mad. We couldn't see her this week because our church is having an international missionary conference and she (our therapist) had to work there. In fact, Lacey has to dance in it tonight and I've tried to be so careful today so she wouldn't go off on a tangent. There are going to be thousands of people there (literally). She and four college students are opening the conference. We got off to a rocky start this morning, but I told her she was obsessing and finally got her out of it. Thanks for the advice. My husband is not really on board with understanding this and has not been willing to look for an ocd specialist. Bren nancy grace <nmlinnen@...> wrote: Hi Bren, If your daughter seeing a therapist? (if not go to files to see how to locate therapist and what to look for). I don't think most kids with ocd are willing to give up obsessions and inner or outer rituals without therapy-too much anxiety and doubt. The family and individual has to be primed for undergoing therapy, by a professional naming the OCD, so the child knows it is " real " and that a doctor says so (but that rituals are not valid for conquering fears), and learning it is not their fault, nor anyone's. Then getting information about it, learning how therapy works (bossing back the OCD by messing up rituals, or delaying them, or not doing them) and getting motivated to try. On a day to day basis, without active participation in therapy established (either because not in therapy yet, or or the child refuses to partcipate) you can try not to accommodate rituals by telling your daughter you do not have to to do what OCD says,and she should try not to do what it says as well. It can seems to help by calling the irrational behavior " OCD " (or a name the child chooses), that you won't cooperate with, so she'll know that the reasonable person you can help and cooperate with is your daughter-not her OCD. nancy grace > > Hi Leigh Anne, > > Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr > olds > > have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff > > does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been > hospitalized > > due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty > > generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty > > treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their > own > > ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one > > mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate > > treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his > ocd > > kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem fine. > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 18, 2008 Report Share Posted January 18, 2008 Hi Bren, Would it be possible to at least consult with someone who specifically treats OCD? They would state they use CBT and exposure and response prevention(ERP). Some practitioners give a free initial consult. Try for referral from a research/teaching hospital or university based psychiatric dept. I think it is very important to rule out OCD (or rule it in) before choosing a therapist, b/c your daughter's behaviors do sound like OCD. Try looking at the files (to left of this board) for more info. The scripture reading assignment suggests to me someone who has little experience with clinical (more severe, biologically based) anxiety-much less OCD. Though the therapist probably wants to help a fellow parishioner,if you are dealing with OCD, possibly she could be either wasting your time/money, or could even make the anxiety worse.... nancy grace , Pailes <swordovfire@...> wrote: > > Hi Grace, > Yes, she just started seeing a therapist from our church. She is professionally trained but is not a specialist in ocd. She told her to make cards with scriptures on them and every time she had one of these thoughts to read the cards until she felt better. She didn't reread at all for about 4 days and then started getting upset about thinking we're mad. We couldn't see her this week because our church is having an international missionary conference and she (our therapist) had to work there. In fact, Lacey has to dance in it tonight and I've tried to be so careful today so she wouldn't go off on a tangent. There are going to be thousands of people there (literally). She and four college students are opening the conference. We got off to a rocky start this morning, but I told her she was obsessing and finally got her out of it. Thanks for the advice. My husband is not really on board with understanding this and has not been willing to look for an ocd specialist. > > Bren > > nancy grace <nmlinnen@...> wrote: > Hi Bren, If your daughter seeing a therapist? (if not go to files to > see how to locate therapist and what to look for). I don't think > most kids with ocd are willing to give up obsessions and inner or > outer rituals without therapy-too much anxiety and doubt. > > The family and individual has to be primed for undergoing therapy, by > a professional naming the OCD, so the child knows it is " real " and > that a doctor says so (but that rituals are not valid for conquering > fears), and learning it is not their fault, nor anyone's. Then > getting information about it, learning how therapy works (bossing > back the OCD by messing up rituals, or delaying them, or not doing > them) and getting motivated to try. > > On a day to day basis, without active participation in therapy > established (either because not in therapy yet, or or the child > refuses to partcipate) you can try not to accommodate rituals by > telling your daughter you do not have to to do what OCD says,and she > should try not to do what it says as well. It can seems to help by > calling the irrational behavior " OCD " (or a name the child chooses), > that you won't cooperate with, so she'll know that the reasonable > person you can help and cooperate with is your daughter-not her OCD. > nancy grace > > > > > Hi Leigh Anne, > > > Thanks for your understanding (re spouses). My 19, 15, and 10 yr > > olds > > > have OCD diagnoses, not to say plenty other neuro-stuff > > > does not go on too. My 19 and 15 yr old girls have been > > hospitalized > > > due to OCD, one at UCLA, other at Menninger (our insurance pretty > > > generous, but after years of haggling to realize non-specialty > > > treatment a waste of money). They both still struggle, have their > > own > > > ways and timetable, but are better. It is the comorbidities (one > > > mood disorder spectrum, the other aspie spectrum) that complicate > > > treatment. My 10 yr old son is on homebound tutoring now, as his > > ocd > > > kicked in severe just this year. My 13, 8, and 5 yr olds seem > fine. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------- > > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with > Search. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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