Guest guest Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 Nope just watch a video and voila your an animal chiropractor Dr. A Caughlin DC CAC155 NW 1st Ave Day, Or. 97845 office fax To: oregondcs From: bluepearl2001@...Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2012 20:32:41 +0000Subject: VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 Hello Ann Yes I have gotten some payments in the past from the VA. The patient needs to get a prescription from their VA Doctor. It is usually difficult to get more than 6 per year, in my experience. Sometimes they will cover therapies and exams but mostly it was spinal adjustments only. Although I have had one patient receive a few months of consistent care at a much higher level, but he has been the only one. I think this takes persistence on the part of the patient and also for the gentlemen who received more visits, his social worker was also an advocate for him, plus he was considered 100% disabled. Hope that helps good luck. Elliott Mantell DC To: oregondcs Sent: Tuesday, April 3, 2012 1:32 PMSubject: VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2012 Report Share Posted April 3, 2012 Ok Ann there you go getting me fired up again ha!  Yes, back in 2002 Congress instructed by law the VA to provide full chiropractic services to all veterans via on-station services or by MD referral and there be the rub the MD controlled VA system has been dragging their feet here in Oregon.  As usual your only trade organization the “Oregon Chiropractic Association†networking with other stakeholders is all over it. Attached are the glaring statistics which show the huge disparity between Washington State and Oregon as per who is taking care of their veterans and getting needed chiropractic services to their veterans…versus more opioid narcotics! Go to page 5 for VISN 20 statistics (V20) and compare first Portland to Puget Sound (Seattle) and tell me who is taking care of their veterans with chiropractic care and who is not?...and Oregon has a higher per capita veteran population than Washington state by leaps and bounds! I got this document to Congressman Kurt Schrader’s in-district Veterans issues staffer who I’ve met with a couple of times and he is taking it to their quarterly high level meeting with VA officials and has demanded this issue be on the agenda and this staffer confirmed its time to no longer deal with the “underlings†in the VA system, it’s time to go to the top of the chain of command. The Congressman is not happy nor are our Veterans, this quarterly regular meeting is only a fact finding meeting by this staff person prior to a key face to face meeting of Congressman Schrader, many other stake holders, the Governor’s office, various veterans groups and State Representatives and Senators who are veterans themselves and who strongly supported the OCA’s  “House Joint Memorial 201†(also attached) which the OCA introduced and that which was passionately passed through the Oregon House and Senate with some very pointed House floor speeches directed at the Portland VA Medical Center..most notably Rep. Phil Barnhart (Eugene) a chiropractic patient himself of our wonderful colleague Dr. Sunny Kierstyn. Congressman Schrader will be hand delivering the OCA’s HJM-201 to the Portland VA Medical Director and will spearhead the discussion with all the stakeholders about getting chiropractic services to our honored veterans, the OCA has attempted to work through the supposed chain of command since 2008 and gotten nothing but stonewalling, well that ends. So…in short the Oregon Chiropractic Association is all over it!!! To the Continued Good Fight! Vern Saboe From: oregondcs [mailto:oregondcs ] On Behalf Of bluepearl2001@...Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 1:33 PMTo: oregondcs Subject: VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann 2 of 2 File(s) OCA Joint Memorial HJM 201, Feb. 2012.pdf OCA VA Numbers of Patients Visits per VISN March 2012.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012  Ann, I have to concur with Dr. Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients who decided to go onto the VA program. We were able to get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that a second time. I was paid at the federal rate @ $33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. The patient tried to get more treatment, but the prescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost the patient. Christian Mathisen, D.C. VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 $33/ visit? I’m afraid I won’t be accepting VA program patients. That’s just ridiculous. I don’t care if they gave unlimited visits. ph Medlin D.C. From: Christian Mathisen Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 8:27 AM To: Dr. Elliott Mantell ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits?  Ann, I have to concur with Dr. Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients who decided to go onto the VA program. We were able to get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that a second time. I was paid at the federal rate @ $33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. The patient tried to get more treatment, but the prescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost the patient. Christian Mathisen, D.C. VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 I have found that for those VA patients the coverage is so worth it. They are so appreciative of the Humana coverage that it just feels good to help! Yes we get paid at about the level of our overhead. Is that ok? It sure is to help someone who needs it. It is usually paperwork free for me because my staff is able to do most of the justifications. Colwell  $33/ visit?  I’m afraid I won’t be accepting VA program patients. That’s just ridiculous. I don’t care if they gave unlimited visits.   ph Medlin D.C.  From: Christian Mathisen Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 8:27 AM To: Dr. Elliott Mantell ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits?    Ann, I have to concur with Dr. Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients who decided to go onto the VA program. We were able to get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that a second time. I was paid at the federal rate @ $33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. The patient tried to get more treatment, but the prescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost the patient.  Christian Mathisen, D.C.  ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr. Elliott Mantell To: bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:10 PM Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits?   Hello Ann  Yes I have gotten some payments in the past from the VA. The patient needs to get a prescription from their VA Doctor. It is usually difficult to get more than 6 per year, in my experience. Sometimes they will cover therapies and exams but mostly it was spinal adjustments only.  Although I have had one patient receive a few months of consistent care at a much higher level, but he has been the only one. I think this takes persistence on the part of the patient and also for the gentlemen who received more visits, his social worker was also an advocate for him, plus he was considered 100% disabled. Hope that helps good luck. Elliott Mantell DC  From: "bluepearl2001@..." To: oregondcs Sent: Tuesday, April 3, 2012 1:32 PM Subject: VA Chiro benefits?   Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits? Right or wrong? Many thanks, Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 That's why I carry on with Medicare pateints ... theya re SO grateful for the help. skSunny Kierstyn, RN DC Fibromyalgia Care Center of Oregon 2677 Willakenzie Road, 7CEugene, Oregon, 97401541- 654-0850; Fx; 541- 654-0834www.drsunnykierstyn.com To: spinetree@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: johncc48@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 08:52:45 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I have found that for those VA patients the coverage is so worth it.They are so appreciative of the Humana coverage that it just feelsgood to help! Yes we get paid at about the level of our overhead. Isthat ok? It sure is to help someone who needs it. It isusually paperwork free for me because my staff is able to do most ofthe justifications. Colwell $33/ visit? I’m afraid I won’t be accepting VA programpatients. That’s just ridiculous. I don’t care ifthey gave unlimited visits. ph Medlin D.C. From: ChristianMathisen Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 8:27AMTo: Dr.Elliott Mantell ; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs Subject: Re: VA Chirobenefits?  Ann,I have to concur with Dr.Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients whodecided to go onto the VA program. We were ableto get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that asecond time. I was paid at the federal rate @$33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. Thepatient tried to get more treatment, but theprescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost thepatient. Christian Mathisen, D.C. ----- OriginalMessage ----- From:Dr.Elliott Mantell To: bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs Sent:Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:10 PMSubject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? Hello Ann Yes I have gotten some paymentsin the past from the VA. The patientneeds to get a prescription from their VADoctor. It is usually difficult to get more than6 per year, in my experience. Sometimesthey will cover therapies and exams butmostly it was spinal adjustments only. AlthoughI have had onepatient receive a few months of consistentcareat a much higher level, but he hasbeen the only one. I think this takespersistence on the part of the patient andalso for the gentlemenwho received more visits, hissocial worker was also an advocate forhim, plus he was considered 100% disabled.Hope that helps good luck.Elliott Mantell DC From:"bluepearl2001@..."To:oregondcs Sent:Tuesday, April 3, 2012 1:32 PMSubject: VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thoughtVets had be granted chirobenefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 I can appreciate all of that. Insurance and payment aside, it’s always fulfilling to help someone out especially when they are grateful for the care. That being said, one must decide for ones self what Insurance plans they wish to be members of. Some folks take Medicare and VA, but shun ASHN or CHP or ASN like the plague. It could be argued that there are indeed patients with those insurance plans that are “grateful†and appreciate the care to a high degree as well. Personally, I am a member of enough of the undercutting types of HMO’s that I don’t wish to get entangled with any more. Medicare for me is an absolute nightmare in it’s requirements, reimbursement, codes, average appointment times etc. etc....And the VA proffering up 33$ visits isn’t very enticing either. A vet with a unique circumstance would find Free care in our office, but I have no wish to see the masses at 33$. From my experience people tend to be even more grateful and appreciative when they pay a fair out of pocket fee for “at time of service†and that’s what we do for these folks. ph Medlin D.C. From: Sunny Kierstyn Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 9:02 AM To: DC ; joe medlin Cc: commongroundchiropractic@... ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs ; Christian Mathisen Subject: RE: VA Chiro benefits? That's why I carry on with Medicare pateints ... theya re SO grateful for the help. sk Sunny Kierstyn, RN DC Fibromyalgia Care Center of Oregon 2677 Willakenzie Road, 7CEugene, Oregon, 97401541- 654-0850; Fx; 541- 654-0834www.drsunnykierstyn.com To: spinetree@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: johncc48@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 08:52:45 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I have found that for those VA patients the coverage is so worth it. They are so appreciative of the Humana coverage that it just feels good to help! Yes we get paid at about the level of our overhead. Is that ok? It sure is to help someone who needs it. It is usually paperwork free for me because my staff is able to do most of the justifications. Colwell $33/ visit?$ I’m afraid I won’t be accepting VA program patients. That’s just ridiculous. I don’t care if they gave unlimited visits. ph Medlin D.C. From: Christian Mathisen Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 8:27 AM To: Dr. Elliott Mantell ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits?  Ann, I have to concur with Dr. Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients who decided to go onto the VA program. We were able to get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that a second time. I was paid at the federal rate @ $33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. The patient tried to get more treatment, but the prescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost the patient. Christian Mathisen, D.C. VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2012 Report Share Posted April 4, 2012 Would one of you docs who has successfully billed the VA please e-mail me the details of this off list. Even with a referral we have been getting benefits denied. I will need to make sure I am sending it to the right place and with the correct codes. We were told our adjustment codes would not be paid. Respectfully, Franchesca Vermillion, DCVermillion & Bloom, PCBalance & Fitness throughChiropractic Rehabilitation1750 Blankenship Rd Ste 295West Linn, OR 97068www.vermillionbloom.com To: johncc48@...; skrndc1@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: spinetree@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 09:53:02 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I can appreciate all of that. Insurance and payment aside, it’s always fulfilling to help someone out especially when they are grateful for the care. That being said, one must decide for ones self what Insurance plans they wish to be members of. Some folks take Medicare and VA, but shun ASHN or CHP or ASN like the plague. It could be argued that there are indeed patients with those insurance plans that are “grateful†and appreciate the care to a high degree as well. Personally, I am a member of enough of the undercutting types of HMO’s that I don’t wish to get entangled with any more. Medicare for me is an absolute nightmare in it’s requirements, reimbursement, codes, average appointment times etc. etc....And the VA proffering up 33$ visits isn’t very enticing either. A vet with a unique circumstance would find Free care in our office, but I have no wish to see the masses at 33$. From my experience people tend to be even more grateful and appreciative when they pay a fair out of pocket fee for “at time of service†and that’s what we do for these folks. ph Medlin D.C. From: Sunny Kierstyn Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 9:02 AMTo: DC ; joe medlin Cc: commongroundchiropractic@... ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs ; Christian Mathisen Subject: RE: VA Chiro benefits? That's why I carry on with Medicare pateints ... theya re SO grateful for the help. skSunny Kierstyn, RN DC Fibromyalgia Care Center of Oregon 2677 Willakenzie Road, 7CEugene, Oregon, 97401541- 654-0850; Fx; 541- 654-0834www.drsunnykierstyn.com To: spinetree@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: johncc48@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 08:52:45 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I have found that for those VA patients the coverage is so worth it. They are so appreciative of the Humana coverage that it just feels good to help! Yes we get paid at about the level of our overhead. Is that ok? It sure is to help someone who needs it. It is usually paperwork free for me because my staff is able to do most of the justifications. Colwell $33/ visit?$ I’m afraid I won’t be accepting VA program patients. That’s just ridiculous. I don’t care if they gave unlimited visits. ph Medlin D.C. From: Christian Mathisen Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 8:27 AMTo: Dr. Elliott Mantell ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits?  Ann,I have to concur with Dr. Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients who decided to go onto the VA program. We were able to get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that a second time. I was paid at the federal rate @ $33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. The patient tried to get more treatment, but the prescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost the patient. Christian Mathisen, D.C. VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2012 Report Share Posted April 5, 2012 You have to use 839 cpt's. I got paid with authorization but now they want their money back claiming it was not authorized even though they have a copy of the authorization.Dr. A Caughlin DC CAC155 NW 1st Ave Day, Or. 97845 office fax To: oregondcs From: dr-harper@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 19:22:17 -0700Subject: RE: VA Chiro benefits? Would one of you docs who has successfully billed the VA please e-mail me the details of this off list. Even with a referral we have been getting benefits denied. I will need to make sure I am sending it to the right place and with the correct codes. We were told our adjustment codes would not be paid. Respectfully, Franchesca Vermillion, DCVermillion & Bloom, PCBalance & Fitness throughChiropractic Rehabilitation1750 Blankenship Rd Ste 295West Linn, OR 97068www.vermillionbloom.com To: johncc48@...; skrndc1@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: spinetree@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 09:53:02 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I can appreciate all of that. Insurance and payment aside, it’s always fulfilling to help someone out especially when they are grateful for the care. That being said, one must decide for ones self what Insurance plans they wish to be members of. Some folks take Medicare and VA, but shun ASHN or CHP or ASN like the plague. It could be argued that there are indeed patients with those insurance plans that are “grateful†and appreciate the care to a high degree as well. Personally, I am a member of enough of the undercutting types of HMO’s that I don’t wish to get entangled with any more. Medicare for me is an absolute nightmare in it’s requirements, reimbursement, codes, average appointment times etc. etc....And the VA proffering up 33$ visits isn’t very enticing either. A vet with a unique circumstance would find Free care in our office, but I have no wish to see the masses at 33$. From my experience people tend to be even more grateful and appreciative when they pay a fair out of pocket fee for “at time of service†and that’s what we do for these folks. ph Medlin D.C. From: Sunny Kierstyn Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 9:02 AMTo: DC ; joe medlin Cc: commongroundchiropractic@... ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs ; Christian Mathisen Subject: RE: VA Chiro benefits? That's why I carry on with Medicare pateints ... theya re SO grateful for the help. skSunny Kierstyn, RN DC Fibromyalgia Care Center of Oregon 2677 Willakenzie Road, 7CEugene, Oregon, 97401541- 654-0850; Fx; 541- 654-0834www.drsunnykierstyn.com To: spinetree@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: johncc48@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 08:52:45 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I have found that for those VA patients the coverage is so worth it. They are so appreciative of the Humana coverage that it just feels good to help! Yes we get paid at about the level of our overhead. Is that ok? It sure is to help someone who needs it. It is usually paperwork free for me because my staff is able to do most of the justifications. Colwell $33/ visit?$ I’m afraid I won’t be accepting VA program patients. That’s just ridiculous. I don’t care if they gave unlimited visits. ph Medlin D.C. From: Christian Mathisen Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 8:27 AMTo: Dr. Elliott Mantell ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits?  Ann,I have to concur with Dr. Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients who decided to go onto the VA program. We were able to get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that a second time. I was paid at the federal rate @ $33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. The patient tried to get more treatment, but the prescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost the patient. Christian Mathisen, D.C. VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 5, 2012 Report Share Posted April 5, 2012 Sorry wrong info 839 is for OWCP so dis regard last postDr. A Caughlin DC CAC155 NW 1st Ave Day, Or. 97845 office fax From: caughlindrc@...To: dr-harper@...; oregondcs Subject: RE: VA Chiro benefits?Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2012 15:27:11 +0000You have to use 839 cpt's. I got paid with authorization but now they want their money back claiming it was not authorized even though they have a copy of the authorization.Dr. A Caughlin DC CAC155 NW 1st Ave Day, Or. 97845 office fax To: oregondcs From: dr-harper@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 19:22:17 -0700Subject: RE: VA Chiro benefits? Would one of you docs who has successfully billed the VA please e-mail me the details of this off list. Even with a referral we have been getting benefits denied. I will need to make sure I am sending it to the right place and with the correct codes. We were told our adjustment codes would not be paid. Respectfully, Franchesca Vermillion, DCVermillion & Bloom, PCBalance & Fitness throughChiropractic Rehabilitation1750 Blankenship Rd Ste 295West Linn, OR 97068www.vermillionbloom.com To: johncc48@...; skrndc1@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: spinetree@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 09:53:02 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I can appreciate all of that. Insurance and payment aside, it’s always fulfilling to help someone out especially when they are grateful for the care. That being said, one must decide for ones self what Insurance plans they wish to be members of. Some folks take Medicare and VA, but shun ASHN or CHP or ASN like the plague. It could be argued that there are indeed patients with those insurance plans that are “grateful†and appreciate the care to a high degree as well. Personally, I am a member of enough of the undercutting types of HMO’s that I don’t wish to get entangled with any more. Medicare for me is an absolute nightmare in it’s requirements, reimbursement, codes, average appointment times etc. etc....And the VA proffering up 33$ visits isn’t very enticing either. A vet with a unique circumstance would find Free care in our office, but I have no wish to see the masses at 33$. From my experience people tend to be even more grateful and appreciative when they pay a fair out of pocket fee for “at time of service†and that’s what we do for these folks. ph Medlin D.C. From: Sunny Kierstyn Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 9:02 AMTo: DC ; joe medlin Cc: commongroundchiropractic@... ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs ; Christian Mathisen Subject: RE: VA Chiro benefits? That's why I carry on with Medicare pateints ... theya re SO grateful for the help. skSunny Kierstyn, RN DC Fibromyalgia Care Center of Oregon 2677 Willakenzie Road, 7CEugene, Oregon, 97401541- 654-0850; Fx; 541- 654-0834www.drsunnykierstyn.com To: spinetree@...CC: commongroundchiropractic@...; bluepearl2001@...; oregondcs ; cmathdc@...From: johncc48@...Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2012 08:52:45 -0700Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits? I have found that for those VA patients the coverage is so worth it. They are so appreciative of the Humana coverage that it just feels good to help! Yes we get paid at about the level of our overhead. Is that ok? It sure is to help someone who needs it. It is usually paperwork free for me because my staff is able to do most of the justifications. Colwell $33/ visit?$ I’m afraid I won’t be accepting VA program patients. That’s just ridiculous. I don’t care if they gave unlimited visits. ph Medlin D.C. From: Christian Mathisen Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 8:27 AMTo: Dr. Elliott Mantell ; bluepearl2001@... ; oregondcs Subject: Re: VA Chiro benefits?  Ann,I have to concur with Dr. Mantell. I've seen a couple of patients who decided to go onto the VA program. We were able to get one fellow 6 visits then renewed that a second time. I was paid at the federal rate @ $33 per visit with adjustment and therapies. The patient tried to get more treatment, but the prescribing MD wouldn't budge and I lost the patient. Christian Mathisen, D.C. VA Chiro benefits? Somewhere along the line I thought Vets had be granted chiro benefits?Right or wrong?Many thanks,Ann Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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