Guest guest Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Barb and Kim, As you guys already know, my dd(11) has been diagnosed with both OCD and Bipolar, and my son (6) has been diagnosed with OCD and probable Bipolar. I just wanted to let you know about an article I had read that you may find interesting. It talked about many kids actually have Bipolar and not OCD when Bipolar runs strong in your family history. The article is from the Bipolar child Newsletter from 2005. It's called, " Obsessional Fears and Aggressive Behaviors in Children and Adolescents with Bipolar Disorder. It states that , An adolescent frequently gets the diagnosis of panic disorder, and the anxiety disorders are not viewed as a possible pre-cursor to a mood disorder. It also says that a new study found that obsessive fear of harm, either of doing harm or fear of harm coming to self, may be closely linked with aggressive behaviors in children with bipolar disorder. Another part I found interesting was where it said, " In other words, if a child has the hallmark features of early-onset bipolar disorder as well as a family history of mood disorders, and scores " high " on the aggressive obsessions section of the Y-BOCS scale, then perhaps the primary diagnosis to be considered would be bipolar disorder rather than OCD. " This really made me think, having two kids with these disorders. This is why I have been trying to distinguish between which of my kids has which or if they both have both OCD and Bipolar. I was also told to treat the Bipolar first , than the OCD would stop and I found that true to an extent with my daughter, but my son is on seroquel and celexa. The celexa is helping with the OCD, but is exacerbating the " suppossed " bipolar. Anyway, I know you are in a similar boat as I am, and I thought you might find that interesting. All along I kept saying , " I know my kids have OCD, but I'm not sure about Bipolar, when all along it may be the other way around.I have also been told by many doctors that the OCD symptoms are all part of the Bipolar, and others say that the Bipolar symptoms are actually part of the OCD. God, How I wish there were a brain scan for our kids to differentiate, so the meds wouldn't have to work against each other!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HUGS Judy Re: Why?/Barb Hi Kim, I had googled " ocd bipolar " and several sites came up. Here is one link -.http://www.bipolarw orld.net/ phelps/ph_ 2000/ph33. htm that describes well what we had diagnosed by one doctor. There are many others and I'm not sure which link led to the actual studies done. But if you google as I did you will get the sites. They were talking about something they referred to as " cylothymic ocd " . I'm a rapid cycler bipolar, so wondered about this possibility with my son and the ocd. Don't know how well accepted this idea is. Given how much controversy there can be just around bipolar diagnosis. We know the ocd comes in waves and I think we all witness this. It just makes sense to me that if there is some aspect of bipolar as well that the two would interplay. Would be great to have more research done on this. From what I understand the bipolar/ocd combo is the most difficult to treat. What works for one can make the other worse. An independent doctor we consuted suggested that if we were to get the bipolar under control the ocd would disappear, as it was only a precurser to full blown bipolar. Her recommendation was to take a high dose of seroquel, or other atypical anti psychotic. Sounded like a miracle solution, but our current doctor sees it differently. We are still uncertain at this point. Kind of a moot point at the moment since our son won't swallow any medication, not even a vitamin... Let me know if you find anything definitive out. Barb > > Hi Barb. My dd has both OCD and bipolar. Can I ask what you have read in > terms of cycling with them both? I have found that when we get control of the > bipolar cycling than the OCD becomes more active. It is hard for us to control > both at the same time, despite the 4 meds she currently takes. Would you mind > sharing what you have read on the subject. Thanks. Kim > > > In a message dated 2/17/2008 4:15:07 P.M. Central Standard Time, > barbnesrallah@ ... writes: > > I have read articles that show a relationship with biplolar and ocd, > with the possibility of the ocd taking on a particular type of > cycling, and/or the ocd being better or worse during time of > depression/mania. Are you familiar at all. Sometimes someone has > access to more cutting edge doctors, so I always like to check. > > > > > > > ************ **Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. > (http://living. aol.com/video/ how-to-please- your-picky- eater/rachel- campos-duffy/ > 2050827?NCID= aolcmp0030000000 2598) > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Thank you for that post. Where can I get a copy of that whole article? Thanks, jchabot wrote: Barb and Kim, As you guys already know, my dd(11) has been diagnosed with both OCD and Bipolar, and my son (6) has been diagnosed with OCD and probable Bipolar. I just wanted to let you know about an article I had read that you may find interesting. It talked about many kids actually have Bipolar and not OCD when Bipolar runs strong in your family history. The article is from the Bipolar child Newsletter from 2005. It's called, " Obsessional Fears and Aggressive Behaviors in Children and Adolescents with Bipolar Disorder. It states that , An adolescent frequently gets the diagnosis of panic disorder, and the anxiety disorders are not viewed as a possible pre-cursor to a mood disorder. It also says that a new study found that obsessive fear of harm, either of doing harm or fear of harm coming to self, may be closely linked with aggressive behaviors in children with bipolar disorder. Another part I found interesting was where it said, " In other words, if a child has the hallmark features of early-onset bipolar disorder as well as a family history of mood disorders, and scores " high " on the aggressive obsessions section of the Y-BOCS scale, then perhaps the primary diagnosis to be considered would be bipolar disorder rather than OCD. " This really made me think, having two kids with these disorders. This is why I have been trying to distinguish between which of my kids has which or if they both have both OCD and Bipolar. I was also told to treat the Bipolar first , than the OCD would stop and I found that true to an extent with my daughter, but my son is on seroquel and celexa. The celexa is helping with the OCD, but is exacerbating the " suppossed " bipolar. Anyway, I know you are in a similar boat as I am, and I thought you might find that interesting. All along I kept saying , " I know my kids have OCD, but I'm not sure about Bipolar, when all along it may be the other way around.I have also been told by many doctors that the OCD symptoms are all part of the Bipolar, and others say that the Bipolar symptoms are actually part of the OCD. God, How I wish there were a brain scan for our kids to differentiate, so the meds wouldn't have to work against each other!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HUGS Judy Re: Why?/Barb Hi Kim, I had googled " ocd bipolar " and several sites came up. Here is one link -.http://www.bipolarw orld.net/ phelps/ph_ 2000/ph33. htm that describes well what we had diagnosed by one doctor. There are many others and I'm not sure which link led to the actual studies done. But if you google as I did you will get the sites. They were talking about something they referred to as " cylothymic ocd " . I'm a rapid cycler bipolar, so wondered about this possibility with my son and the ocd. Don't know how well accepted this idea is. Given how much controversy there can be just around bipolar diagnosis. We know the ocd comes in waves and I think we all witness this. It just makes sense to me that if there is some aspect of bipolar as well that the two would interplay. Would be great to have more research done on this. From what I understand the bipolar/ocd combo is the most difficult to treat. What works for one can make the other worse. An independent doctor we consuted suggested that if we were to get the bipolar under control the ocd would disappear, as it was only a precurser to full blown bipolar. Her recommendation was to take a high dose of seroquel, or other atypical anti psychotic. Sounded like a miracle solution, but our current doctor sees it differently. We are still uncertain at this point. Kind of a moot point at the moment since our son won't swallow any medication, not even a vitamin... Let me know if you find anything definitive out. Barb > > Hi Barb. My dd has both OCD and bipolar. Can I ask what you have read in > terms of cycling with them both? I have found that when we get control of the > bipolar cycling than the OCD becomes more active. It is hard for us to control > both at the same time, despite the 4 meds she currently takes. Would you mind > sharing what you have read on the subject. Thanks. Kim > > > In a message dated 2/17/2008 4:15:07 P.M. Central Standard Time, > barbnesrallah@ ... writes: > > I have read articles that show a relationship with biplolar and ocd, > with the possibility of the ocd taking on a particular type of > cycling, and/or the ocd being better or worse during time of > depression/mania. Are you familiar at all. Sometimes someone has > access to more cutting edge doctors, so I always like to check. > > > > > > > ************ **Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. > (http://living. aol.com/video/ how-to-please- your-picky- eater/rachel- campos-duffy/ > 2050827?NCID= aolcmp0030000000 2598) > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Thank you for that post. Where can I get a copy of that whole article? Thanks, jchabot wrote: Barb and Kim, As you guys already know, my dd(11) has been diagnosed with both OCD and Bipolar, and my son (6) has been diagnosed with OCD and probable Bipolar. I just wanted to let you know about an article I had read that you may find interesting. It talked about many kids actually have Bipolar and not OCD when Bipolar runs strong in your family history. The article is from the Bipolar child Newsletter from 2005. It's called, " Obsessional Fears and Aggressive Behaviors in Children and Adolescents with Bipolar Disorder. It states that , An adolescent frequently gets the diagnosis of panic disorder, and the anxiety disorders are not viewed as a possible pre-cursor to a mood disorder. It also says that a new study found that obsessive fear of harm, either of doing harm or fear of harm coming to self, may be closely linked with aggressive behaviors in children with bipolar disorder. Another part I found interesting was where it said, " In other words, if a child has the hallmark features of early-onset bipolar disorder as well as a family history of mood disorders, and scores " high " on the aggressive obsessions section of the Y-BOCS scale, then perhaps the primary diagnosis to be considered would be bipolar disorder rather than OCD. " This really made me think, having two kids with these disorders. This is why I have been trying to distinguish between which of my kids has which or if they both have both OCD and Bipolar. I was also told to treat the Bipolar first , than the OCD would stop and I found that true to an extent with my daughter, but my son is on seroquel and celexa. The celexa is helping with the OCD, but is exacerbating the " suppossed " bipolar. Anyway, I know you are in a similar boat as I am, and I thought you might find that interesting. All along I kept saying , " I know my kids have OCD, but I'm not sure about Bipolar, when all along it may be the other way around.I have also been told by many doctors that the OCD symptoms are all part of the Bipolar, and others say that the Bipolar symptoms are actually part of the OCD. God, How I wish there were a brain scan for our kids to differentiate, so the meds wouldn't have to work against each other!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HUGS Judy Re: Why?/Barb Hi Kim, I had googled " ocd bipolar " and several sites came up. Here is one link -.http://www.bipolarw orld.net/ phelps/ph_ 2000/ph33. htm that describes well what we had diagnosed by one doctor. There are many others and I'm not sure which link led to the actual studies done. But if you google as I did you will get the sites. They were talking about something they referred to as " cylothymic ocd " . I'm a rapid cycler bipolar, so wondered about this possibility with my son and the ocd. Don't know how well accepted this idea is. Given how much controversy there can be just around bipolar diagnosis. We know the ocd comes in waves and I think we all witness this. It just makes sense to me that if there is some aspect of bipolar as well that the two would interplay. Would be great to have more research done on this. From what I understand the bipolar/ocd combo is the most difficult to treat. What works for one can make the other worse. An independent doctor we consuted suggested that if we were to get the bipolar under control the ocd would disappear, as it was only a precurser to full blown bipolar. Her recommendation was to take a high dose of seroquel, or other atypical anti psychotic. Sounded like a miracle solution, but our current doctor sees it differently. We are still uncertain at this point. Kind of a moot point at the moment since our son won't swallow any medication, not even a vitamin... Let me know if you find anything definitive out. Barb > > Hi Barb. My dd has both OCD and bipolar. Can I ask what you have read in > terms of cycling with them both? I have found that when we get control of the > bipolar cycling than the OCD becomes more active. It is hard for us to control > both at the same time, despite the 4 meds she currently takes. Would you mind > sharing what you have read on the subject. Thanks. Kim > > > In a message dated 2/17/2008 4:15:07 P.M. Central Standard Time, > barbnesrallah@ ... writes: > > I have read articles that show a relationship with biplolar and ocd, > with the possibility of the ocd taking on a particular type of > cycling, and/or the ocd being better or worse during time of > depression/mania. Are you familiar at all. Sometimes someone has > access to more cutting edge doctors, so I always like to check. > > > > > > > ************ **Ideas to please picky eaters. Watch video on AOL Living. > (http://living. aol.com/video/ how-to-please- your-picky- eater/rachel- campos-duffy/ > 2050827?NCID= aolcmp0030000000 2598) > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Hi mm, Separation anxiety can be a major factor in any of the anxiety disorders,(It is an anxiety disorder in itself) including OCD. I would suggest you consider another therapist, and /or question him or her on that one. Hugs Judy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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