Re:Question about 100% calcium hypochlorite

[Guest guest]

I’ve said this before, but worth repeating. Powder

is pretty much close to 100% already. The 65%-70% etc is nothing to

do with content, but about available chlorine. Since the product most

people use is about shocking pools, the chlorine is important to them.

From an MMS2 point of view it’s not so relevant. Hypochlorous acid

is the main event. That depends (as does the percentage chlorine

mentioned previously) on the pH of the water, hence the previous reference to

the need to take lots and lots and lots of water (whatever the pH) –

though acidic *could be* hypochlorous acid, and normally a good alkaline

could neutralise it.

Hello,

As I posted recently, I found a very inexpensive brand of pool shock

that is 100% calcium hypochlorite.

I have posed the question to Jim, and am now awaiting a response, but I

thought I'd see if there are any chemists in the house who have an

opinion...

My question is, should I worry about diluting/cutting it with something

- calcium carbonate maybe - or should it be ok to take as is? I'm

guessing I should at least adjust the amount accordingly, since the same

physical amount will be twice the 'strength' of the 50% version?

I'm mainly just wondering if the calcium carbonate that is part of the

other stuff serves an important need as some kind of buffering agent?

I'd hate to die from a simple experiment on myself...

Thanks again,

__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4667 (20091207) __________The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.http://www.eset.com

[Guest guest]

On 12/7/2009, Bond (pmbond@...) wrote:

> Ive said this before, but worth repeating. Powder is pretty much

> close to 100% already. The 65%-70% etc is nothing to do with

> content, but about available chlorine.

If I understand things correctly, this is simply not correct -

otherwise, why would so many of these data sheets on different brands

refer to BOTH the percentage of calcium hypochlorite AND the amount of

free chlorine as two separate things?

Everytime I've seen a pool shock product, it always says somewhere

around '65% available chlorine', whether the product is advertised as

45% calcium hypo, 65%, 73%, or 100%.

But, I am by no means *absolutely* sure... maybe KGR could chime in (I

just noticed his post that he is definitely 'a chemical man')?

--

Best regards,

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

It’s a bit like saying it’s sodium ascorbate and

declaring the amount of available ascorbic acid to be say 85%.

In the pool shock there might be some calcium chloride,

iron, SiO2 and some trace minerals. I’ve never seen any assay with

anything like mercury, lead or anything of that nature.

Cheers

If

I understand things correctly, this is simply not correct -

otherwise, why would so many of these data sheets on different brands

refer to BOTH the percentage of calcium hypochlorite AND the amount of

free chlorine as two separate things?

Everytime I've seen a pool shock product, it always says somewhere

around '65% available chlorine', whether the product is advertised as

45% calcium hypo, 65%, 73%, or 100%.

But, I am by no means *absolutely* sure... maybe KGR could chime in (I

just noticed his post that he is definitely 'a chemical man')?

--

Best regards,

__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 4669 (20091208) __________The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.http://www.eset.com

[Guest guest]

> But, I am by no means *absolutely* sure... maybe KGR could chime in (I

> just noticed his post that he is definitely 'a chemical man')?

1.Purest form of 100% Calcium Hypochlorite can be either

a) Pure Ca(ClO)2 NON-Hydrated grade--- with a maximum of 50% available

Chlorine or

Ca(ClO)2.4H2O Hydrated grade---- with a maximum of 35% Available

Chlorine

(This percentage calculation is entirely based on the Chemical

formula.)

Hydrated grade is preferable as it dissolves in water very fast when compared to

non Hydrated grade which is very slow to dissolve.

2. When the branded products like 'GLB Super Charge' claim that their 100%

Calcium Hypochlorite contain 65% available Chlorine, what it really means is

that Their product is 100% Hydrated grade which naturally contain 65% of Calcium

Hypochlorite Ca(ClO)2 but definitely NOT 65% 'available Chlorine'.It is a

misleading statement just to woo customers. Under any conditions, it is

impossible to have more than

50% of 'available Chlorine' (Cl2) in any Calcium Hypochlorite product.

4.If the claim is available chlorine is 30%, it means that Calcium Hypochlorite

will be 60%

If the claim is available chlorine is 20%, it means that Calcium Hypochlorite

is 40% and so on.

The balance will be fillers like,CALCIUM CARBONATE,CALCIUM CHLORATE,CALCIUM

CHLORIDE,CALCIUM HYDROXIDE,SODIUM CHLORIDE, and water ...none of them are toxic

in the dosages the protocol suggests.

5.'%age of Available Chlorine' is a measure of the quantity of Hypochlorus acid

i.e HOCl, it can generate.So,higher the available Chlorine, more HOCl it can

generate.

6.Calcium Hypochlorite is nothing but Chlorine gas chemically trapped in solid

powder of Calcium Hydroxide. This chemically trapped chlorine can be released by

acidifying Calcium Hypochlorite with

Acids like Hydrochloric Acid.In highly diluted conditions, near neutral pH

values, say 6-6.8, the same Chlorine gas can exist as Hypochlorous acid

HOCl.That is what interests us.So,in other words by

suitably manipulating concentration and acidity of Calcium Hypochlorite

solution, one can generate either Cl2 or HOCl or both. Jim Humble seems to have

intelligently arrived at the appropriate

concentration and acidity (thro his protocols) so that Chlorine formation is

eliminated. Here the required acidity should have been supplied by stomach

acids.

7. So the drinking of 1 or 2 cups or more of water with MMS2 seems to be very

mandatory in eliminating the formation of Chlorine.

8. In other words,If a person has got too much of acidity problem, diluting

with 2 cups of water may not be sufficient. He may need to take a capsule of

Baking soda to neutralize extra acid generated in

his stomach.

These points are based on whatever little bit knowledge and understanding of

Chemistry I have, if it can benefit even one person I shall feel the purpose of

posting has served.

Thanks and regards

KGR

> > Ive said this before, but worth repeating. Powder is pretty much

> > close to 100% already. The 65%-70% etc is nothing to do with

> > content, but about available chlorine.

>

> If I understand things correctly, this is simply not correct -

> otherwise, why would so many of these data sheets on different brands

> refer to BOTH the percentage of calcium hypochlorite AND the amount of

> free chlorine as two separate things?

>

> Everytime I've seen a pool shock product, it always says somewhere

> around '65% available chlorine', whether the product is advertised as

> 45% calcium hypo, 65%, 73%, or 100%.

>

> But, I am by no means *absolutely* sure... maybe KGR could chime in (I

> just noticed his post that he is definitely 'a chemical man')?

>

> --

>

> Best regards,

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

KGR,

Thank you for your post. It truly will help me. My question is this, I don't

have enough hydrochloric acid in my stomach and take one HCL tablet every

morning. Should i continue taking HCL when taking the MMS or should i just stop

it until i finish the entire course.

Thanks.

> > > Ive said this before, but worth repeating. Powder is pretty much

> > > close to 100% already. The 65%-70% etc is nothing to do with

> > > content, but about available chlorine.

> >

> > If I understand things correctly, this is simply not correct -

> > otherwise, why would so many of these data sheets on different brands

> > refer to BOTH the percentage of calcium hypochlorite AND the amount of

> > free chlorine as two separate things?

> >

> > Everytime I've seen a pool shock product, it always says somewhere

> > around '65% available chlorine', whether the product is advertised as

> > 45% calcium hypo, 65%, 73%, or 100%.

> >

> > But, I am by no means *absolutely* sure... maybe KGR could chime in (I

> > just noticed his post that he is definitely 'a chemical man')?

> >

> > --

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

--- In , " " <@...>

wrote:

>

> KGR,

>

> Thank you for your post. It truly will help me. My question is this, I don't

have enough hydrochloric acid in my stomach and take one HCL tablet every

morning. Should i continue taking HCL when taking the MMS or should i just stop

it until i finish the entire course.

>

> Thanks.

>

>

I feel, as a precautionary measure, you can take Hydrochloric acid as per your

schedule, but space taking MMS atleast for 1 hour before or after,then it should

not matter.Are you taking MMS1 or MMS2 or both? because we do not know how the

MMS with additional Hydrochloric acid will respond in your biological system,

until you experiment with a few doses with acid intake.In any case, taking a

large amount of water along with MMS will sure to minimize any possible

disturbance.

You can decide after taking suggestions from other senior members of the group,

as I am fairly new to this group.

Thanks and regards

KGR

[Guest guest]

On 12/9/2009, KGR (kgrdoss@...) wrote:

> I feel, as a precautionary measure, you can take Hydrochloric acid as

> per your schedule, but space taking MMS atleast for 1 hour before or

> after,then it should not matter.Are you taking MMS1 or MMS2 or both?

> because we do not know how the MMS with additional Hydrochloric acid

> will respond in your biological system, until you experiment with a

> few doses with acid intake.In any case, taking a large amount of

> water along with MMS will sure to minimize any possible disturbance.

> You can decide after taking suggestions from other senior members of

> the group, as I am fairly new to this group.

Hi KGR,

I purchased some 10% liquid HCL, and would like to use this as an

activator for MMS1, but I want to get the strength down (or up) to the

level where it has the same 'activating strength' as the 50% citric acid

solution, so I can use it at a 1-1 ratio with the MMS1.

I have some instructions for a clumsy way to determine this via simple

trial and error and the use of some pH strips, but figured I'd ask...

Is there a way to determine this via some mathematical/chemical formula?

Thanks - I'm still working on a reply to your other very informative

message (thanks!).

--

Best regards,

[Guest guest]

--- In , Tanstaafl <tanstaafl@...>

wrote:

>

> Hi KGR,

>

> I purchased some 10% liquid HCL, and would like to use this as an

> activator for MMS1, but I want to get the strength down (or up) to the

> level where it has the same 'activating strength' as the 50% citric acid

> solution, so I can use it at a 1-1 ratio with the MMS1.

>

> I have some instructions for a clumsy way to determine this via simple

> trial and error and the use of some pH strips, but figured I'd ask...

>

> Is there a way to determine this via some mathematical/chemical formula?

>

> Thanks - I'm still working on a reply to your other very informative

> message (thanks!).

>

> --

>

> Best regards,

>

>

>

Definitely sir, you can calculate and accurately arrive at correct strength of

Hydrochloric Acid.I have already done the calculation.Fortunately, for your

pleasant surprise and relief, 10% Hydrochloric Acid is more or less same as 50%

Citric Acid in activating Sodium ChloriTe. Implying that you don't have to do

any thing with 10% Hydrochloric Acid, just use straight as you use 50% Citric

Acid.(ie 1:1)

For your ready reference I am giving below the equations and other parameters

for calculation:

5 NaClO2 + 4 HCl â " €â " €â " €â†' 5 NaCl + 4 ClO2â†` + 2 H2O

5 NaClO2 + 4 R-COO-H â " €â " €â " €â†' 4 R-COO-Na + NaCl + 4 ClO2â†` + 2 H2O

R-COO-H is Citric Acid

R-COO-Na is Sodium Citrate

NaClO2 is Sodium ChlorIte

ClO2 â†` is Chlorine dioxide gas

Nacl is Sodium ChloriDe

Specific gravity of 50% Ciric Acid is 1.17

Specific Gravity of 28% (22% actual)Sodium ChlorIte is around 1.23-1.25

In other words, as per above equations, Every 100 grams of Sodium ChlorIte will

require 32 grams of HCl OR 187 grams of Citric Acid(All on 100% basis) to

completely react.

---------

I hope that above data is adequate for your needs.

1.Hydrochloric Acid, being a strong acid, will react with Sodium Chlorite very

fast when compared to reacting with Citric Acid. So, in my perception, 3 minutes

wait may be unnecessary, with HCl activation. Anyway, this needs to be confirmed

from Jim Humble. In any case, there is no harm in waiting for 3 minutes.

2.A few drops extra Hydrochloric acid will not make any difference,only it will

add extra few mgs of Chloride in our stomach thats all. So the accuracy of

quantity of HCl need not not a critical factor.

Thanks and regards

KGR

[Guest guest]

Hi

I am presenting the chemical equation once again without special symbols again,

as, the group server does not allow special symbols, and give some junk

characters.

5 NaClO2 + 4 HCl ----> 5 NaCl + 4 ClO2 + 2 H2O

5 NaClO2 + 4 R-COO-H ----> 4 R-COO-Na + NaCl + 4 ClO2 + 2 H2O

KGR

>

> Definitely sir, you can calculate and accurately arrive at correct strength of

Hydrochloric Acid.I have already done the calculation.Fortunately, for your

pleasant surprise and relief, 10% Hydrochloric Acid is more or less same as 50%

Citric Acid in activating Sodium ChloriTe. Implying that you don't have to do

any thing with 10% Hydrochloric Acid, just use straight as you use 50% Citric

Acid.(ie 1:1)

> For your ready reference I am giving below the equations and other parameters

for calculation:

5 NaClO2 + 4 HCl ----> 5 NaCl + 4 ClO2 + 2 H2O

5 NaClO2 + 4 R-COO-H ----> 4 R-COO-Na + NaCl + 4 ClO2 + 2 H2O

>

> R-COO-H is Citric Acid

> R-COO-Na is Sodium Citrate

> NaClO2 is Sodium ChlorIte

> ClO2 �` is Chlorine dioxide gas

> Nacl is Sodium ChloriDe

>

> Specific gravity of 50% Ciric Acid is 1.17

> Specific Gravity of 28% (22% actual)Sodium ChlorIte is around 1.23-1.25

> In other words, as per above equations, Every 100 grams of Sodium ChlorIte

will require 32 grams of HCl OR 187 grams of Citric Acid(All on 100% basis) to

completely react.

> ---------

>

> I hope that above data is adequate for your needs.

> 1.Hydrochloric Acid, being a strong acid, will react with Sodium Chlorite

very fast when compared to reacting with Citric Acid. So, in my perception, 3

minutes wait may be unnecessary, with HCl activation. Anyway, this needs to be

confirmed from Jim Humble. In any case, there is no harm in waiting for 3

minutes.

> 2.A few drops extra Hydrochloric acid will not make any difference,only it

will add extra few mgs of Chloride in our stomach thats all. So the accuracy of

quantity of HCl need not not a critical factor.

> Thanks and regards

> KGR

>

[Guest guest]

On 12/10/2009, KGR (kgrdoss@...) wrote:

> Fortunately, for your pleasant surprise and relief, 10% Hydrochloric

> Acid is more or less same as 50% Citric Acid in activating Sodium

> ChloriTe. Implying that you don't have to do any thing with 10%

> Hydrochloric Acid, just use straight as you use 50% Citric Acid.(ie

> 1:1)

" And there was dancing in the streets, and shouts of joy for the world

to hear! "

Thanks very much... that just simplified things a lot.

> 1. Hydrochloric Acid, being a strong acid, will react with Sodium

> Chlorite very fast when compared to reacting with Citric Acid. So,

> in my perception, 3 minutes wait may be unnecessary, with HCl

> activation. Anyway, this needs to be confirmed from Jim Humble. In

> any case, there is no harm in waiting for 3 minutes.

I'll compare with pH strips, and see how long before the solution

activated with HCL takes to rach the same pH as the solution activated

with 50% citric acid, and reply back when I'm done.

> 2. A few drops extra Hydrochloric acid will not make any

> difference,only it will add extra few mgs of Chloride in our stomach

> thats all. So the accuracy of quantity of HCl need not not a critical

> factor.

Except that if adding to capsules to avoid the chlorine taste/smell, the

less drops of activator required, the more drops of MMS1 you can get in

a single capsule.

Now to see if adding MMS1 activated with 10% HCL will melt a gelatin

capsule before I can get it down.

Again, many thanks for your most helpful and informative responses!

--

Best regards,

[Guest guest]

KGR,

I am first testing the water. I am using it as mouth was for my gums health. I

will venture soon into taking it. Thanks for your advice. I will space it one

hour before taking the initial dose.

>

>

> --- In , " " <@>

wrote:

> >

> > KGR,

> >

> > Thank you for your post. It truly will help me. My question is this, I

don't have enough hydrochloric acid in my stomach and take one HCL tablet every

morning. Should i continue taking HCL when taking the MMS or should i just stop

it until i finish the entire course.

> >

> > Thanks.

> >

> >

>

>

> I feel, as a precautionary measure, you can take Hydrochloric acid as per your

schedule, but space taking MMS atleast for 1 hour before or after,then it should

not matter.Are you taking MMS1 or MMS2 or both? because we do not know how the

MMS with additional Hydrochloric acid will respond in your biological system,

until you experiment with a few doses with acid intake.In any case, taking a

large amount of water along with MMS will sure to minimize any possible

disturbance.

> You can decide after taking suggestions from other senior members of the

group, as I am fairly new to this group.

> Thanks and regards

> KGR

>

[Guest guest]

KGR,

Thanks for your reply to . I can then just buy liquid HCL so that would

cover my needs as well.

>

>

>

> --- In , Tanstaafl <tanstaafl@>

wrote:

> >

> > Hi KGR,

> >

> > I purchased some 10% liquid HCL, and would like to use this as an

> > activator for MMS1, but I want to get the strength down (or up) to the

> > level where it has the same 'activating strength' as the 50% citric acid

> > solution, so I can use it at a 1-1 ratio with the MMS1.

> >

> > I have some instructions for a clumsy way to determine this via simple

> > trial and error and the use of some pH strips, but figured I'd ask...

> >

> > Is there a way to determine this via some mathematical/chemical formula?

> >

> > Thanks - I'm still working on a reply to your other very informative

> > message (thanks!).

> >

> > --

> >

> > Best regards,

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> Definitely sir, you can calculate and accurately arrive at correct strength of

Hydrochloric Acid.I have already done the calculation.Fortunately, for your

pleasant surprise and relief, 10% Hydrochloric Acid is more or less same as 50%

Citric Acid in activating Sodium ChloriTe. Implying that you don't have to do

any thing with 10% Hydrochloric Acid, just use straight as you use 50% Citric

Acid.(ie 1:1)

> For your ready reference I am giving below the equations and other parameters

for calculation:

>

> 5 NaClO2 + 4 HCl â " €â " €â " €â†' 5 NaCl + 4 ClO2â†` + 2 H2O

>

> 5 NaClO2 + 4 R-COO-H â " €â " €â " €â†' 4 R-COO-Na + NaCl + 4 ClO2â†` + 2 H2O

>

> R-COO-H is Citric Acid

> R-COO-Na is Sodium Citrate

> NaClO2 is Sodium ChlorIte

> ClO2 â†` is Chlorine dioxide gas

> Nacl is Sodium ChloriDe

>

> Specific gravity of 50% Ciric Acid is 1.17

> Specific Gravity of 28% (22% actual)Sodium ChlorIte is around 1.23-1.25

> In other words, as per above equations, Every 100 grams of Sodium ChlorIte

will require 32 grams of HCl OR 187 grams of Citric Acid(All on 100% basis) to

completely react.

> ---------

>

> I hope that above data is adequate for your needs.

> 1.Hydrochloric Acid, being a strong acid, will react with Sodium Chlorite

very fast when compared to reacting with Citric Acid. So, in my perception, 3

minutes wait may be unnecessary, with HCl activation. Anyway, this needs to be

confirmed from Jim Humble. In any case, there is no harm in waiting for 3

minutes.

> 2.A few drops extra Hydrochloric acid will not make any difference,only it

will add extra few mgs of Chloride in our stomach thats all. So the accuracy of

quantity of HCl need not not a critical factor.

> Thanks and regards

> KGR

>

[Guest guest]

On 12/10/2009, (@...) wrote:

> Thanks for your reply to . I can then just buy liquid HCL so

> that would cover my needs as well.

Just make sure it is 10% solution.

I bought mine here for anyone ineterested:

http://secure.sciencecompany.com/Hydrochloric-Acid-10-solution-500ml-P6533C670.a\

spx

or

http://tiny.pl/hx2r8

7.50 for 500ml (thats a BUNCH)...