Re: MMS uses / parvo and campy @ Tom

[Guest guest]

Canine Parvovirus on a hard surface has a CT of 5000 for

a complete kill using chlorine dioxide. This means that if you have a

concentration of 500 PPM, it needs to be in contact with the pathogen for 10

minutes. If that high a concentration can't be tolerated, you can drop

back to a concentration of 100 PPM, but then the contact time needs to be

lengthened to 50 minutes.

By the way, this is one of the most difficult viruses for

chlorine dioxide to kill.

One reason success is difficult is because 500 PPM free

chlorine dioxide is not well tolerated. For example, the sanitizing

solution I talk so much about only has 60 PPM. It seems possible that

lower concentrations given more frequently may also work, but that has not been

well studied.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Tom, are we talking SC or ASC? To my understanding

the virus lives in the gut. What would be talking about in real life

terms to get it to the gut in the ppm range that would be effective taking into

consideration traveling the gi tract with some diminished ppm from the

travels. Rectal implants are viable consideration also.

Hope I'm phrasing questions in readable fashion J

In response to carole's question on mms baths and added

protocols to bath water...what about using SC or ASC in conjunction with CS

oral or parvaid (herbs for parvo)...any issues mixing such? Parvaid can

help in gut situations other than parvo btw.

Parvaid's Certified Organic Ingredients:

· Peppermint – Antimicrobial, antispasmodic

- aids digestion and alleviates vomiting, expels intestinal gas, carminative,

anti-inflammatory and anti-ulcer properties. Common uses: Intestinal colic,

irritable bowel syndrome, nausea, vomiting, and motion sickness.

· Spearmint - Antiemetic, antiseptic,

antispasmodic, carminative, diuretic, restorative, stimulant, stomachic and

tonic. Useful for fevers, bronchitis, chills, cramps, chronic gastritis, common

cold, headaches, indigestion, morning sickness, motion sickness, nasal

congestion, nausea, halitosis, etc.

· Chamomile - Anti-inflammatory, antispasmodic,

expels intestinal gas, sedative, antimicrobial, antiseptic, antibacterial,

nervine (calms nerves), carminative, analgesic, mild wormer.

· Plantain - Antidiarrheal, mucilanginous

properties very similar to slippery elm, anti-inflammatory, stimulates the

immune system. Lubricates, soothes, and protects internal mucous membranes,

emollient, astringent, stops bleeding. Soothes inflamed tissues in the

intestinal tract.

· Echinacea - Builds the immune system,

antimicrobial, anti-inflammatory, antiviral, etc.

· Berberis Aquifolium aka Oregon Grape - An

antimicrobial, anti-inflammatory, tonic, antiparasitic. Strongest affinities:

liver and digestive system, mucous membranes

· Rose hips - Antimicrobial, antispasmodic,

combats stress, astringent, nutritive, and full of vitamin C and bioflavinoids

· Yarrow - Used for hemorrhaging, internal and

external bleeding, anti-inflammatory, antibacterial, carminative, and

antispasmodic.

· Garlic - Antiviral, antibacterial, antifungal,

antiparasitic, digestive aid, stimulates the immune system, antioxidant,

nutritive, tonic, great for ailments of the circulatory, urinary, respiratory,

and digestive tract.

· Hydrastis Canadensis aka Goldenseal-

Antimicrobial, improves appetite, tonic, antiparasitic, stimulates production

of bile which assists digestion, especially good for gastric disturbances,

cases of painful digestion, and bleeding.

· Hibiscus Flowers - Antiseptic, antispasmodic,

digestive aid - helps with nausea.

· Alcohol - Brings out the properties in the herbs

and preserves the tincture.

· Distilled Water

Also what about SC or ASC with campy? Any test there?

As far as CS more stable but weaker…there are

brands of CS on the market that are 500 ppm, I think made with, oh what the

heck is it, brain fog tonight, that keep it stable at 500 ppm. Since turning

blue is not an issue *smile* what about that kind of CS in a situation

of parvo etc. ah, WaterOz has a very strong ppm silver, swear up and down

nothing added but the CS list dispelled that myth.

>>>>>Water Oz is not forthcoming in saying

exactly what their silver product

is or how it's made. The analysis by other people I

remember reading

about pegged it as a silver salt. It is one commercial

product that has

been associated with several cases of argyria in people

who used larger

doses than are recommended by the manufacturer.

Mike D.

List owner<<<<

>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It

would seem that the product is actually silver nitrate. Any who is

ingesting this product on a continual basis is at risk

for argyria.

Most of their other products that they call ionic

solutions are chloride

salt solutions (i.e. gold chloride, copper chloride,

selenium chloride,

etc).

K<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Thanks so much,

rose

[Guest guest]

DO YOU TAKE A DAILY DOSE OF MMS1? IF SO DO YOU THINK 8 DROPS DAILY IS OK? HOW MUCH DO YOU TAKE DAILY?

From: palulukon <palulukon@...> Sent: Fri, July 16, 2010 11:37:14 PMSubject: RE: [ ] Re: MMS uses / parvo and campy @ Tom

Canine Parvovirus on a hard surface has a CT of 5000 for a complete kill using chlorine dioxide. This means that if you have a concentration of 500 PPM, it needs to be in contact with the pathogen for 10 minutes. If that high a concentration can't be tolerated, you can drop back to a concentration of 100 PPM, but then the contact time needs to be lengthened to 50 minutes.

By the way, this is one of the most difficult viruses for chlorine dioxide to kill.

One reason success is difficult is because 500 PPM free chlorine dioxide is not well tolerated. For example, the sanitizing solution I talk so much about only has 60 PPM. It seems possible that lower concentrations given more frequently may also work, but that has not been well studied.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Tom, are we talking SC or ASC? To my understanding the virus lives in the gut. What would be talking about in real life terms to get it to the gut in the ppm range that would be effective taking into consideration traveling the gi tract with some diminished ppm from the travels. Rectal implants are viable consideration also.

Hope I'm phrasing questions in readable fashion J

In response to carole's question on mms baths and added protocols to bath water...what about using SC or ASC in conjunction with CS oral or parvaid (herbs for parvo)...any issues mixing such? Parvaid can help in gut situations other than parvo btw.

Parvaid's Certified Organic Ingredients:

· Peppermint – Antimicrobial, antispasmodic - aids digestion and alleviates vomiting, expels intestinal gas, carminative, anti-inflammatory and anti-ulcer properties. Common uses: Intestinal colic, irritable bowel syndrome, nausea, vomiting, and motion sickness.

· Spearmint - Antiemetic, antiseptic, antispasmodic, carminative, diuretic, restorative, stimulant, stomachic and tonic. Useful for fevers, bronchitis, chills, cramps, chronic gastritis, common cold, headaches, indigestion, morning sickness, motion sickness, nasal congestion, nausea, halitosis, etc.

· Chamomile - Anti-inflammatory, antispasmodic, expels intestinal gas, sedative, antimicrobial, antiseptic, antibacterial, nervine (calms nerves), carminative, analgesic, mild wormer.

· Plantain - Antidiarrheal, mucilanginous properties very similar to slippery elm, anti-inflammatory, stimulates the immune system. Lubricates, soothes, and protects internal mucous membranes, emollient, astringent, stops bleeding. Soothes inflamed tissues in the intestinal tract.

· Echinacea - Builds the immune system, antimicrobial, anti-inflammatory, antiviral, etc.

· Berberis Aquifolium aka Oregon Grape - An antimicrobial, anti-inflammatory, tonic, antiparasitic. Strongest affinities: liver and digestive system, mucous membranes

· Rose hips - Antimicrobial, antispasmodic, combats stress, astringent, nutritive, and full of vitamin C and bioflavinoids

· Yarrow - Used for hemorrhaging, internal and external bleeding, anti-inflammatory, antibacterial, carminative, and antispasmodic.

· Garlic - Antiviral, antibacterial, antifungal, antiparasitic, digestive aid, stimulates the immune system, antioxidant, nutritive, tonic, great for ailments of the circulatory, urinary, respiratory, and digestive tract.

· Hydrastis Canadensis aka Goldenseal- Antimicrobial, improves appetite, tonic, antiparasitic, stimulates production of bile which assists digestion, especially good for gastric disturbances, cases of painful digestion, and bleeding.

· Hibiscus Flowers - Antiseptic, antispasmodic, digestive aid - helps with nausea.

· Alcohol - Brings out the properties in the herbs and preserves the tincture.

· Distilled Water

Also what about SC or ASC with campy? Any test there?

As far as CS more stable but weaker…there are brands of CS on the market that are 500 ppm, I think made with, oh what the heck is it, brain fog tonight, that keep it stable at 500 ppm. Since turning blue is not an issue *smile* what about that kind of CS in a situation of parvo etc. ah, WaterOz has a very strong ppm silver, swear up and down nothing added but the CS list dispelled that myth.

>>>>>Water Oz is not forthcoming in saying exactly what their silver product

is or how it's made. The analysis by other people I remember reading

about pegged it as a silver salt. It is one commercial product that has

been associated with several cases of argyria in people who used larger

doses than are recommended by the manufacturer.

Mike D.

List owner<<<<

>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It would seem that the product is actually silver nitrate. Any who is

ingesting this product on a continual basis is at risk for argyria.

Most of their other products that they call ionic solutions are chloride

salt solutions (i.e. gold chloride, copper chloride, selenium chloride,

etc).

K<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Thanks so much,

rose

[Guest guest]

DO

YOU TAKE A DAILY DOSE OF MMS1? IF SO DO YOU THINK 8 DROPS DAILY IS OK? HOW MUCH

DO YOU TAKE DAILY?

Evening

,

No

I do not take it daily. I personally would not take mms to ward off

disease bc it’s not my particular intention to be in the warding off

stance. I have taken it and would take it in the future to gently

stimulate the production of new red blood cells which is what oxidative therapy

can do. My motto is stimulate not annihilate.

When

I did daily for awhile I used this protocol…

1/8

teaspoon UNactivated SC (28%) in gallon of water, drank thru out the day.

sometimes it was the only water I drank, sometimes drank plain water and

switched around.

A

friend who does foster pups had some arrivals with various skin conditions,

served the above recipe and noticed a big diff in a few days (some over night).

After a week Tom advised cutting that dosage in half for long term maintenance.

Apparently the low dosage was just enough to produce healthy red blood

cells. We think we saw the results faster because pups metabolize at a

diff rate than humans.

rose

[Guest guest]

Hello Rose,

We are talking about free chlorine dioxide.

If the virus is in the gut, then chlorine dioxide won't do the job because it

won't last long enough to get there.

This is where, I think, chlorous acid comes in. Unfortunately, chlorous acid

dose not kill off, but stabilizes to eliminate growth. I am not sure if that

was clear, so let's try it this way. Acidified sodium chlorite is used to keep

bacteria from forming on food products. Chickens have salmonella inside them.

When they are butchered, the salmonella infects the meat. If not cleaned up, it

makes people sick. After butchering, the carcass is washed off, then dipped or

sprayed with a chilled solution of ASC. Any remaining salmonella is kept from

growing to an amount that would cause sickness. Since ASC is somewhat like

timed release, it holds the salmonella colonies in check until you cook the

chicken and kill them.

Once again let's look at the sanitizing solution. To kill Parvovirus you need

500 PPM free chlorine dioxide for 10 minutes. The sanitizing solution has about

60 PPM free chlorine dioxide. While this is not strong enough to kill it, it is

strong enough to hold it in check. If the humidity is just right, it may kill

it off if the solution doesn't dry out before 84 minutes have passed. However,

that is a real long shot. This is why you first need to clean before

disinfecting.

The most effective use of chlorine dioxide in a bath is to use it alone. When

you add other things to the bath, this gives the chlorine dioxide something to

react with that is not the pathogen. This is the same thing that happens when

people get up to a very strong dose of MMS and they have an adverse reaction to

the taste. By adding juice to the mixture, turbidity is added and the chlorine

dioxide reacts with the turbid particles and this removes them from the dose.

With the concentration of chlorine dioxide reduced, the dose is easier to take.

In the case of the bath, the concentration of chlorine dioxide is kept low to

avoid respiratory irritation, so you can't afford to loose the chlorine dioxide

by adding other things to the water.

If you want to take an herb bath, take an herb bath.

If you want to take a chlorine dioxide bath, take a chlorine dioxide bath.

If you want to take a chlorine dioxide and herb bath, take an herb bath...

Tom

--- In , " palulukon " <palulukon@...>

wrote:

>

> Canine Parvovirus on a hard surface has a CT of 5000 for a complete kill

> using chlorine dioxide. This means that if you have a concentration of 500

> PPM, it needs to be in contact with the pathogen for 10 minutes. If that

> high a concentration can't be tolerated, you can drop back to a

> concentration of 100 PPM, but then the contact time needs to be lengthened

> to 50 minutes.

>

>

>

> By the way, this is one of the most difficult viruses for chlorine dioxide

> to kill.

>

>

>

> One reason success is difficult is because 500 PPM free chlorine dioxide is

> not well tolerated. For example, the sanitizing solution I talk so much

> about only has 60 PPM. It seems possible that lower concentrations given

> more frequently may also work, but that has not been well studied.

>

>

>

> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

>

>

>

> Tom, are we talking SC or ASC? To my understanding the virus lives in the

> gut. What would be talking about in real life terms to get it to the gut in

> the ppm range that would be effective taking into consideration traveling

> the gi tract with some diminished ppm from the travels. Rectal implants are

> viable consideration also.

>

>

>

> Hope I'm phrasing questions in readable fashion J

>

>

>

>

>

> In response to carole's question on mms baths and added protocols to bath

> water...what about using SC or ASC in conjunction with CS oral or parvaid

> (herbs for parvo)...any issues mixing such? Parvaid can help in gut

> situations other than parvo btw.

>

>

>

> Parvaid's Certified Organic Ingredients:

>

>

>

> . Peppermint - Antimicrobial, antispasmodic - aids digestion and alleviates

> vomiting, expels intestinal gas, carminative, anti-inflammatory and

> anti-ulcer properties. Common uses: Intestinal colic, irritable bowel

> syndrome, nausea, vomiting, and motion sickness.

>

> . Spearmint - Antiemetic, antiseptic, antispasmodic, carminative, diuretic,

> restorative, stimulant, stomachic and tonic. Useful for fevers, bronchitis,

> chills, cramps, chronic gastritis, common cold, headaches, indigestion,

> morning sickness, motion sickness, nasal congestion, nausea, halitosis, etc.

>

> . Chamomile - Anti-inflammatory, antispasmodic, expels intestinal gas,

> sedative, antimicrobial, antiseptic, antibacterial, nervine (calms nerves),

> carminative, analgesic, mild wormer.

>

> . Plantain - Antidiarrheal, mucilanginous properties very similar to

> slippery elm, anti-inflammatory, stimulates the immune system. Lubricates,

> soothes, and protects internal mucous membranes, emollient, astringent,

> stops bleeding. Soothes inflamed tissues in the intestinal tract.

>

> . Echinacea - Builds the immune system, antimicrobial, anti-inflammatory,

> antiviral, etc.

>

> . Berberis Aquifolium aka Oregon Grape - An antimicrobial,

> anti-inflammatory, tonic, antiparasitic. Strongest affinities: liver and

> digestive system, mucous membranes

>

> . Rose hips - Antimicrobial, antispasmodic, combats stress, astringent,

> nutritive, and full of vitamin C and bioflavinoids

>

> . Yarrow - Used for hemorrhaging, internal and external bleeding,

> anti-inflammatory, antibacterial, carminative, and antispasmodic.

>

> . Garlic - Antiviral, antibacterial, antifungal, antiparasitic, digestive

> aid, stimulates the immune system, antioxidant, nutritive, tonic, great for

> ailments of the circulatory, urinary, respiratory, and digestive tract.

>

> . Hydrastis Canadensis aka Goldenseal- Antimicrobial, improves appetite,

> tonic, antiparasitic, stimulates production of bile which assists digestion,

> especially good for gastric disturbances, cases of painful digestion, and

> bleeding.

>

> . Hibiscus Flowers - Antiseptic, antispasmodic, digestive aid - helps with

> nausea.

>

> . Alcohol - Brings out the properties in the herbs and preserves the

> tincture.

>

> . Distilled Water

>

>

>

>

>

> Also what about SC or ASC with campy? Any test there?

>

>

>

> As far as CS more stable but weaker.there are brands of CS on the market

> that are 500 ppm, I think made with, oh what the heck is it, brain fog

> tonight, that keep it stable at 500 ppm. Since turning blue is not an issue

> *smile* what about that kind of CS in a situation of parvo etc. ah, WaterOz

> has a very strong ppm silver, swear up and down nothing added but the CS

> list dispelled that myth.

>

>

>

> >>>>>Water Oz is not forthcoming in saying exactly what their silver product

>

>

> is or how it's made. The analysis by other people I remember reading

>

> about pegged it as a silver salt. It is one commercial product that has

>

> been associated with several cases of argyria in people who used larger

>

> doses than are recommended by the manufacturer.

>

>

>

> Mike D.

>

> List owner<<<<

>

>

>

> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> It would seem that the product is actually silver nitrate.

> Any who is

>

> ingesting this product on a continual basis is at risk for argyria.

>

>

>

> Most of their other products that they call ionic solutions are chloride

>

> salt solutions (i.e. gold chloride, copper chloride, selenium chloride,

>

> etc).

>

> K<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

>

>

>

> Thanks so much,

>

>

>

> rose

>

[Guest guest]

K, thanks tom.

Parvaid is not for the bath however. It is oral administered herbs.

However I 'get it' that if you use herbs and ASC it reduces the dosage.

So...ASC will not work on parvo. The chlorus acid tho could keep the virus

from multiplying if I read correctly. But it seems we don't know how long

chlorus stays in the system right? It does make it to the gut right?

That brings me to the 500 ppm silver products that are around. Since pup

turning blue is not a consideration do you know what ppm would be effective

on parvo? Just thought it might have come up on the CS list.

What about Campylobacteriosis...any test on that?

Got a chuckle on this...

If you want to take an herb bath, take an herb bath.

If you want to take a chlorine dioxide bath, take a chlorine dioxide bath.

If you want to take a chlorine dioxide and herb bath, take an herb bath...

Tom

[Guest guest]

What about ASC as rectal implant...like would that just be too intense.

Then again the parvo virus is pretty intense. If it is activated then could

it maybe since it is a gas take just a little at high ppm to be effective?

As a gas could it kind of fumigate the colon?

There is a new virus circulating now seen here and in Au that looks like but

is not parvo is the reason we are all asking so many questions.

Thanks,

rose

[Guest guest]

Hello Rose,

That is where more testing is needed.

Chlorine dioxide breaks down into chlorite in the body. Studies have shown that

the half life of chlorite in animals is a little over 40 hours, and it reaches

all of the organs including passing through the blood brain barrier. Chlorite

also oxidizes, so there is a possibility that chlorite is what is causing the

positive results.

Chlorite has been well studied, and higher concentrations and long term exposure

are not healthy.

Chlorous acid may be the " wild card, " but that has not been studied.

Campylobacter has a CT of 15 on hard surfaces. It is easy to kill off.

Tom

--- In , " palulukon " <palulukon@...>

wrote:

>

> K, thanks tom.

>

> Parvaid is not for the bath however. It is oral administered herbs.

> However I 'get it' that if you use herbs and ASC it reduces the dosage.

> So...ASC will not work on parvo. The chlorus acid tho could keep the virus

> from multiplying if I read correctly. But it seems we don't know how long

> chlorus stays in the system right? It does make it to the gut right?

>

> That brings me to the 500 ppm silver products that are around. Since pup

> turning blue is not a consideration do you know what ppm would be effective

> on parvo? Just thought it might have come up on the CS list.

>

> What about Campylobacteriosis...any test on that?

>

> Got a chuckle on this...

>

>

>

> If you want to take an herb bath, take an herb bath.

>

> If you want to take a chlorine dioxide bath, take a chlorine dioxide bath.

>

> If you want to take a chlorine dioxide and herb bath, take an herb bath...

>

> Tom

>

[Guest guest]

Hello Rose,

That sounds like a reasonable place to start, but keep in mind that activated

sodium chlorite can also penetrate mucous layers. You would have to pay

attention to the strength of the solution.

In addition, it makes sense to treat the other end too. Perhaps some sodium

chlorite activated with water...

With a virus that is air borne, you may want to take a look at adding trace

amounts of chlorine dioxide to the air. If the animals are outside, this won't

be effective, but if they go into a sheltered area to sleep, that is different.

The key to this is to keep the concentration low. Find someone with a sensitive

nose, if your sense of smell is off, and have them check the area. The ideal

concentration seems to be about half the amount that is the threshold of

detection. At any rate, the idea is that if you can detect it, it is too

strong.

We used this last winter with several elderly people who were very concerned

with contracting the swine flu, or any other flu for that matter. It was a

great success, no one caught a cold or the flu. While I am hesitant to credit

chlorine dioxide with the success because we were also educating and helping to

make sure they had balanced meals, if we go another winter with the same record,

it will become significant.

Tom

--- In , " palulukon " <palulukon@...>

wrote:

>

> What about ASC as rectal implant...like would that just be too intense.

> Then again the parvo virus is pretty intense. If it is activated then could

> it maybe since it is a gas take just a little at high ppm to be effective?

> As a gas could it kind of fumigate the colon?

>

> There is a new virus circulating now seen here and in Au that looks like but

> is not parvo is the reason we are all asking so many questions.

>

> Thanks,

>

> rose

>

[Guest guest]

Campylobacter

has a CT of 15 on hard surfaces. It is easy to kill off.

Ah, this is something that I've been trying to solve for

a few years...even posted to the CS list, silver pets, dmso list...never a

reply.

For three months we had to haul water waiting till we

found someone that actually knew how to deal with a collapsed well. In aprox

200 gallons of spring water I added homemade CD one gallon, ppm, what 15 to

20. Campy hit this area hard...vets didn't even know what it was, called

it mystery parvo. I had an alert email from one of my list so when it hit

here I knew what it was. Should have spread thru here like a wildfire but

we only lost 2 kitties within minutes of each other. Two dogs got really

sick for 24 hours, one of the oldest and a small 5 week old pup we found on the

hwy. we used cs, parvaid, vibractra plus (ambertech who makes

parvaid). and I got mildly sick ourselves bc we were in direct

contact nonstop tending to the discharge from the 2 dogs. That was

it. The only thing that could have made a diff is we were all drinking

water treated so minutely...but it worked. My vet fully expected we would

have them dropping like flies bc campy goes for the weak and elderly...and we

are a special needs sanctuary so that is the bulk of our population.

rose

[Guest guest]

That sounds like a reasonable place to start, but keep in

mind that activated sodium chlorite can also penetrate mucous layers. You

would have to pay attention to the strength of the solution.

Can we put this in plain English for me? 500 ppm for 10

min...or 60 for 84 min...or somewhere in between. As rectal implant in theory it

could be held in the colon for at least a bit. Some would be absorbed by the

lining right? And keep giving off gasses?

rose

[Guest guest]

Hello Rose,

The plain English version is that it takes a high concentration to be effective.

Outside the body this is not an issue, but inside the body you have to consider

the effects of oxidative damage on other cells in the body.

A " wild guess " starting place may be to use 1 ml of 5% sodium chlorite activated

with 1 ml of 10% citric acid for 10 minutes and then dilute to make a total of

500 ml. This will give you a solution with 60 PPM available chlorine dioxide

and about 6 PPM of that as free chlorine dioxide.

Tom

--- In , " palulukon " <palulukon@...>

wrote:

>

> That sounds like a reasonable place to start, but keep in mind that

> activated sodium chlorite can also penetrate mucous layers. You would have

> to pay attention to the strength of the solution.

>

>

>

> Can we put this in plain English for me? 500 ppm for 10 min...or 60 for 84

> min...or somewhere in between. As rectal implant in theory it could be held

> in the colon for at least a bit. Some would be absorbed by the lining

> right? And keep giving off gasses?

>

>

>

> rose

>

[Guest guest]

This will give you a solution with 60 PPM available

chlorine dioxide and about 6 PPM of that as free chlorine dioxide.

Tom

K, but how would this do any good if I need 60PPM free

chlorine dioxide as per…

To kill Parvovirus you need 500 PPM free chlorine dioxide

for 10 minutes. The sanitizing solution has about 60 PPM free chlorine

dioxide. While this is not strong enough to kill it, it is strong enough

to hold it in check. If the humidity is just right, it may kill it off if

the solution doesn't dry out before 84 minutes have passed.

I’m not ‘getting it’ on the diff

between chlorine dioxide and free chlorine dioxide…sry

rose

[Guest guest]

Hello Rose,

To understand this you will have to endure some math, and learn some

terminology.

Microbiology looks at the amount of pathogens in a standard sample before and

after treatment. A microscope can be used to get a total count in the sample,

but it includes living and dead microorganisms. With bacteria and fungus,

colony forming units are counted. CFU looks at how many viable pathogens are in

the sample.

In food for human consumption, the limit is 1000000 CFU/ml or 1000000 CFU/g.

When the tests show under a million CFU, the food is eatable when properly

cooked. If the count exceeds a million, people get sick because normal cooking

does not destroy all the pathogens.

When you are trying to disinfect something, you are trying to lower the amount

of pathogens to a level that can be tolerated. In contrast, if you want to

sanitize something, you want to eliminate all of the pathogens.

Chlorine dioxide testing is often looking at totally eliminating pathogens.

Chlorous acid testing, what little there is, generally shows a slight reduction,

but the goal is to keep the numbers from growing larger.

In technical terms, a bioCIDE kills everything where a bioSTAT tries to

stabilize the situation and prevent the numbers of pathogens from increasing.

Let's look at fresh shrimp. When shrimp are pulled from the water, there is no

odor associated with them. However, as they sit bacteria forms and you end up

with a fishy odor. The higher the concentration of bacteria, the stronger the

odor.

Now, let's make up some numbers to see how this works.

Let's say we have some " stinking " shrimp that are tested to have 10 million

CFU/g. If we treat them with a chlorous acid solution, about the best we can

hope for is a 1 log reduction. A 1 log reduction means that 90% of the

pathogens are killed. This would bring the CFU level down to 1 million, which

is the upper limit for being acceptable.

While " acceptable, " you still have to remember that there are 1 million

pathogens per gram still there.

The CT values indicate what is needed to entirely kill or what is needed to

produce a 5 - 6 log kill. If we start with 10000000, a 6 log kill means that

there are only 10 left. We have reduced the pathogens from 10 million to 10.

To kill Parvovirus you need 500 PPM free chlorine dioxide for 10 minutes. If

chlorous acid is effective, it has the possibility of knocking the Parvovirus

down by a 1 log reduction or 90%. Since Parvovirus is so difficult to kill, the

chlorous acid may not be able to achieve a full log reduction, but it may be

able to reduce it to a point where the bodies immune system can do the rest. It

would be interesting to see some test results on this.

I hope this helps to gain perspective on how these chemicals work. It may seem

that 90% is a huge reduction, but it is my understanding that some pathogens

only need very small numbers to make someone sick. A friend had an operation

and developed a staph infection. The surgeon blamed it on a single staph germ

that survived the sanitizing process in the operating room, or survived the

scrub process the surgeon utilizes prior to operating. The infection was caught

early and quickly taken care of, but in this case 1 remaining was too many.

Sodium chlorite is referred to as stabilized chlorine dioxide. When you mix a

solution, you have available chlorine dioxide in relation to the amount of

sodium chlorite and dilution you use. This gives you an idea of the strength of

the solution. When the solution is activated, some of the available chlorine

dioxide is released as free chlorine dioxide. Under ideal conditions, and given

enough time, all of the available chlorine dioxide can be eventually released as

free chlorine dioxide.

Tom

--- In , " palulukon " <palulukon@...>

wrote:

>

> This will give you a solution with 60 PPM available chlorine dioxide and

> about 6 PPM of that as free chlorine dioxide.

>

>

>

> Tom

>

>

>

> K, but how would this do any good if I need 60PPM free chlorine dioxide as

> per.

>

>

>

> To kill Parvovirus you need 500 PPM free chlorine dioxide for 10 minutes.

> The sanitizing solution has about 60 PPM free chlorine dioxide. While this

> is not strong enough to kill it, it is strong enough to hold it in check.

> If the humidity is just right, it may kill it off if the solution doesn't

> dry out before 84 minutes have passed.

>

>

>

> I'm not 'getting it' on the diff between chlorine dioxide and free chlorine

> dioxide.sry

>

>

>

> rose

>

[Guest guest]

500ppm silver is silver protein and that is what made the " blue man " blue. He

calls it CS but it is silver protein.

--- In , " palulukon " <palulukon@...>

wrote:

>

> K, thanks tom.

>

> Parvaid is not for the bath however. It is oral administered herbs.

> However I 'get it' that if you use herbs and ASC it reduces the dosage.

> So...ASC will not work on parvo. The chlorus acid tho could keep the virus

> from multiplying if I read correctly. But it seems we don't know how long

> chlorus stays in the system right? It does make it to the gut right?

>

> That brings me to the 500 ppm silver products that are around. Since pup

> turning blue is not a consideration do you know what ppm would be effective

snip

[Guest guest]

500ppm silver is silver protein and that is what made the " blue man " blue.

He calls it CS but it is silver protein.

Ah thanks ...hey, didn't realize you were on this list too...*wave*

I'm thinking, wondering, if it might be just the thing to have on hand for

parvo. Maybe Tom can let us know what ppm silver is needed for treating

parvo.

Who sells it, do you know?

Xxx

rose

[Guest guest]

Hello Rose,

To understand this you will have to endure some math, and learn some

terminology.

This is just so wonderful Tom. I've read this twice and going to reread

today again as many times as it takes to gel. It is gel-ing btw. I love

learning like this. In the 'past' when confronted with ie parvo it was use

a protocol, it worked, thought we had found 'the answer', next time nada.

Scratch head, start over. But it was certainly like walking around in the

dark. Now you are opening up a whole new arena of 'seeing' how things work

and with that 'seeing' we can know what we are working with and what might

be the wisest choices.

I LOVE learning how to be effective. Can't thank you enough

Xxx

rose