Guest guest Posted October 10, 2000 Report Share Posted October 10, 2000 Hi, Hud, >I appeciate your comments on the matter. But let me point out that by >saying, " However, it seems that there are many, apparently deliberate, >holes >in the reporting that went into it " are you not admitting that you have >not actually read Hooper's work and therefore that your opinion on the >matter is rooted in hearsay? True enough - I am relying on the local newspaper coverage and statements made by the Wistar Institute, U. Penn, and Koprowski. >The fact that no SIV/HIV has yet been found in any of the vaccines tested >is >not surprising because the institutions which still possess some of these >vaccine pools have mostly refused to release them for testing. They did for a while, but have since released two lots for testing. These are the tests Koprowski referred to. These are production lots. It is possiblel that the testing was done after 'The River' was written. I agree to reply to anything else back-channel. And I do want to read it = just don't want to buy it. Jerry _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2004 Report Share Posted December 3, 2004 I'm not too sure what the premise of the " The River " is, but this much I know. In the religion of Orthodox Medicine, the priests concoct all kinds of theories to explain the unexplainable. In earlier times, they blamed disease on evil spirits. Until someone discovered the different types of fluids in the body and then blamed disease on bad " humours. " And then someone invented the microscope and germs became the cause of disease.. When it comes to health, the medical community doesn't have a clue. They study dis-ease, and even there they misunderstand it. Dis-ease is a process not an entity or collection of entities as the medical orthodoxy views it. Fighting disease is fighting the body's own healing and cleansing processes. By the way, does Hooper's theory explain why AIDS peaked in the US in 1993 snd has been dying out ever since? In a message dated 12/3/2004 4:07:52 PM Eastern Standard Time, argonaut@... writes: I did some years ago come by Hooper's theory of how the Aids epidemic began, which he argued for in his book " The River " .I remember I was quite perplexed then by its information, allthough I never read the book but only extracts online.With time I almost forgot about it, but recently I was again chocked due to a french documentary about this topic. I really don't know what to make of it, specially now since I've become an Aids dissident.Does any of you on this list have knowledge of this theory and what are youre viewpoints on it. A really curious guy ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 I borrowed " The River: A source to the Journey of HIV and AIDS " this year from the library... it is such a long book I couldn't finish it before it was due back to the library. Scary stuff within. worth reading... It's also hard to get your hands on... Few places sell it, and it's expensive... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 If you don't have time to read The River, then please do read the following 3 sentences which IMO are a great summary of what's laid out in the book, the aidsorigins.com website, and The Origin of AIDS documentary. This key quote is from a recent article posted at Ed Hoopers site: http://www.aidsorigins.com/content/view/201/2/ " A paper co-written by a statistician and myself, and which has still to be submitted for publication, finds a " highly significant " correlation between the towns and villages in Africa where CHAT vaccine was fed in 1957-60 and the earliest appearances in the world of HIV-1. (In a separate study, the correlation with the earliest cases of AIDS is found to be " significant " .) This means that the CHAT vaccinations in Africa represent both a viable and highly plausible source of the human AIDS pandemic. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2007 Report Share Posted January 4, 2007 It is so deeply disturbing > > If you don't have time to read The River, then please do read the > following 3 sentences which IMO are a great summary of what's laid out > in the book, the aidsorigins.com website, and The Origin of AIDS > documentary. This key quote is from a recent article posted at Ed > Hoopers site: > > http://www.aidsorigins.com/content/view/201/2/ > > " A paper co-written by a statistician and myself, and which has still > to be submitted for publication, finds a " highly significant " > correlation between the towns and villages in Africa where CHAT > vaccine was fed in 1957-60 and the earliest appearances in the world > of HIV-1. (In a separate study, the correlation with the earliest > cases of AIDS is found to be " significant " .) This means that the CHAT > vaccinations in Africa represent both a viable and highly plausible > source of the human AIDS pandemic. " > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2007 Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 The River is 700 pages. I've read it. And basically I can't tell you where I stand on the issue of where HIV originated. Not becuase it's a secret, but rather because I don't know what to think. The River (if true) really shows the competition and corners cut to be the sole discoverer of a new pathogen. Barb > > This is dedicated to my brother, who when a youngster, spent time > staring at an iron lung. > > ....and our studies show that all 23 volunteer mice survived.' > > Here we will not only connect Gallo's herpesviruses to simians and > humans, but to polio and Q fever as well. If Lyme disease is > transmitted by Ixodes scapularis, most,(likely including Rosner) > fail to include early evolutionary studies of the vector into their > argument. Although the politic(k)s of I. scapularis identity is some > years old, it is still pertinent as we will consider differences: > namely, the evolutionary event which the Russians claim happened > only once, and the American (Chinese) demigod of acarology's claim > that it happened several times. For when the continents were not > separated, the evolutionary evetn that made I. scapularis in the > U.S. different from the variant forms found in Europe indeed only > happened once (that is to say, first). > > While now having established a closer link to tick-borne rickettsiae > than previously in this thread, it is time to show an important > pivotal difference in the symptoms of Q fever: > > Wikipedia: > > 'In Europe, it appears as hepatitis rather than pneumonia as in the > United States.' > > But Q fever was first discovered in Australia, where too Blumberg > first discovered the Australian antigen of hepatitis B. How this > links to Gallo's herpesvirus will be expounded upon later. For now, > Gallo's HTLV-1 and HIV-1 will suffice. In Hooper's book, The > River, we are told that (OPV) feedings of poliovirus vaccine may > have exacerbated parameters for the origin of HIV/AIDS. While > apparently for some, this has been resolved by the following report: > > 'These data re-inforce earlier findings on thistopic providing no > evidence to support the contention that poliovirus vaccination was > reponsible for the introduction of HIV into humans and sparking the > AIDS pandemic.' > (Berry N, A, J, C, Wood D, Schild G, Bottinger > M, Holmes H, Minor P, Almond N, Mitochondrial DNA and Retroviral RNA > Analyses of Archival Oral Polio Vaccine (OPV CHAT) Materials: > Evidence of Macaque Nuclear Sequences Confirms Substrate Identity, > Vaccine 23 (2005): 1639-1648) > > It is urged that the reader (re)acquaint themselves with Hooper's > book. There is currently virtually no discourse about this on the > internet. Like the workers mentioned in the above, Hooper as well > fails to include important parameters involved in the scrutiny of > the OPV/HIV/AIDS theory. > > Thus, geographical differences in immune response between Europeans > and those in the Western hemisphere, for example, have bearing on > therapies for such things as chronic lyme borreliosis > idiopathically, aside from the pure mechanics involved against the > pathogen. > > Burrascano / Lyme Disease Therapy > http://www.faim.org/lymenews.htm#tan > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2007 Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 Hi allI am doing well.The River was made into a documentary called the origins of aids. You can watch this from on of the links on this pagehttp://www.documentary-film.net/search/video-listings.php?e=5There is a concerted campaign to stop the documentary from being shown. I am the owner of doc-film-net and have been threatened with an onslaught of legal action for showing this doc. The politics are interesting behind this. As it turns out Pathe have bought out the distribution rights from Gala (the producers) and are now (it would appear) actively quashing this. Hooper has writing a fair bit of detail bout the politics in the background which you can see here:http://www.aidsorigins.com/One of the best reads about the early conspiracy can be read on this pdf.http://www.aidsorigins.com/pdfs/lincei/hooper03.pdfa most interesting read.I can tell you that the counter claims disputing the OPV hypothesis are feeble on examination.The majority of evidence still swings in favor of the OPV hypothesis. The attempts to hack it lend even more credence to it.There is more that has not been reviled at this stage because witnesses have in the past been subject to pressure and blackmail. There is another dimension to this saga that would suggest the old boy network are very actively involved in the conspiracy (to quash it).bleu On 10 Apr 2007, at 17:34, Barb Peck wrote:The River is 700 pages. I've read it. And basically I can't tell you where I stand on the issue of where HIV originated. Not becuase it's a secret, but rather because I don't know what to think.The River (if true) really shows the competition and corners cut to be the sole discoverer of a new pathogen.Barb>> This is dedicated to my brother, who when a youngster, spent time > staring at an iron lung.> > ....and our studies show that all 23 volunteer mice survived.'> > Here we will not only connect Gallo's herpesviruses to simians and > humans, but to polio and Q fever as well. If Lyme disease is > transmitted by Ixodes scapularis, most,(likely including Rosner) > fail to include early evolutionary studies of the vector into their > argument. Although the politic(k)s of I. scapularis identity is some > years old, it is still pertinent as we will consider differences: > namely, the evolutionary event which the Russians claim happened > only once, and the American (Chinese) demigod of acarology's claim > that it happened several times. For when the continents were not > separated, the evolutionary evetn that made I. scapularis in the > U.S. different from the variant forms found in Europe indeed only > happened once (that is to say, first).> > While now having established a closer link to tick-borne rickettsiae > than previously in this thread, it is time to show an important > pivotal difference in the symptoms of Q fever:> > Wikipedia:> > 'In Europe, it appears as hepatitis rather than pneumonia as in the > United States.'> > But Q fever was first discovered in Australia, where too Blumberg > first discovered the Australian antigen of hepatitis B. How this > links to Gallo's herpesvirus will be expounded upon later. For now, > Gallo's HTLV-1 and HIV-1 will suffice. In Hooper's book, The > River, we are told that (OPV) feedings of poliovirus vaccine may > have exacerbated parameters for the origin of HIV/AIDS. While > apparently for some, this has been resolved by the following report:> > 'These data re-inforce earlier findings on thistopic providing no > evidence to support the contention that poliovirus vaccination was > reponsible for the introduction of HIV into humans and sparking the > AIDS pandemic.'> (Berry N, A, J, C, Wood D, Schild G, Bottinger > M, Holmes H, Minor P, Almond N, Mitochondrial DNA and Retroviral RNA > Analyses of Archival Oral Polio Vaccine (OPV CHAT) Materials: > Evidence of Macaque Nuclear Sequences Confirms Substrate Identity, > Vaccine 23 (2005): 1639-1648)> > It is urged that the reader (re)acquaint themselves with Hooper's > book. There is currently virtually no discourse about this on the > internet. Like the workers mentioned in the above, Hooper as well > fails to include important parameters involved in the scrutiny of > the OPV/HIV/AIDS theory.> > Thus, geographical differences in immune response between Europeans > and those in the Western hemisphere, for example, have bearing on > therapies for such things as chronic lyme borreliosis > idiopathically, aside from the pure mechanics involved against the > pathogen.> > Burrascano / Lyme Disease Therapy> http://www.faim.org/lymenews.htm#tan> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2007 Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 Hi allI am doing well.The River was made into a documentary called the origins of aids. You can watch this from on of the links on this pagehttp://www.documentary-film.net/search/video-listings.php?e=5There is a concerted campaign to stop the documentary from being shown. I am the owner of doc-film-net and have been threatened with an onslaught of legal action for showing this doc. The politics are interesting behind this. As it turns out Pathe have bought out the distribution rights from Gala (the producers) and are now (it would appear) actively quashing this. Hooper has writing a fair bit of detail bout the politics in the background which you can see here:http://www.aidsorigins.com/One of the best reads about the early conspiracy can be read on this pdf.http://www.aidsorigins.com/pdfs/lincei/hooper03.pdfa most interesting read.I can tell you that the counter claims disputing the OPV hypothesis are feeble on examination.The majority of evidence still swings in favor of the OPV hypothesis. The attempts to hack it lend even more credence to it.There is more that has not been reviled at this stage because witnesses have in the past been subject to pressure and blackmail. There is another dimension to this saga that would suggest the old boy network are very actively involved in the conspiracy (to quash it).bleu On 10 Apr 2007, at 17:34, Barb Peck wrote:The River is 700 pages. I've read it. And basically I can't tell you where I stand on the issue of where HIV originated. Not becuase it's a secret, but rather because I don't know what to think. The River (if true) really shows the competition and corners cut to be the sole discoverer of a new pathogen. Barb >> This is dedicated to my brother, who when a youngster, spent time > staring at an iron lung.> > ....and our studies show that all 23 volunteer mice survived.'> > Here we will not only connect Gallo's herpesviruses to simians and > humans, but to polio and Q fever as well. If Lyme disease is > transmitted by Ixodes scapularis, most,(likely including Rosner) > fail to include early evolutionary studies of the vector into their > argument. Although the politic(k)s of I. scapularis identity is some > years old, it is still pertinent as we will consider differences: > namely, the evolutionary event which the Russians claim happened > only once, and the American (Chinese) demigod of acarology's claim > that it happened several times. For when the continents were not > separated, the evolutionary evetn that made I. scapularis in the > U.S. different from the variant forms found in Europe indeed only > happened once (that is to say, first).> > While now having established a closer link to tick-borne rickettsiae > than previously in this thread, it is time to show an important > pivotal difference in the symptoms of Q fever:> > Wikipedia:> > 'In Europe, it appears as hepatitis rather than pneumonia as in the > United States.'> > But Q fever was first discovered in Australia, where too Blumberg > first discovered the Australian antigen of hepatitis B. How this > links to Gallo's herpesvirus will be expounded upon later. For now, > Gallo's HTLV-1 and HIV-1 will suffice. In Hooper's book, The > River, we are told that (OPV) feedings of poliovirus vaccine may > have exacerbated parameters for the origin of HIV/AIDS. While > apparently for some, this has been resolved by the following report:> > 'These data re-inforce earlier findings on thistopic providing no > evidence to support the contention that poliovirus vaccination was > reponsible for the introduction of HIV into humans and sparking the > AIDS pandemic.'> (Berry N, A, J, C, Wood D, Schild G, Bottinger > M, Holmes H, Minor P, Almond N, Mitochondrial DNA and Retroviral RNA > Analyses of Archival Oral Polio Vaccine (OPV CHAT) Materials: > Evidence of Macaque Nuclear Sequences Confirms Substrate Identity, > Vaccine 23 (2005): 1639-1648)> > It is urged that the reader (re)acquaint themselves with Hooper's > book. There is currently virtually no discourse about this on the > internet. Like the workers mentioned in the above, Hooper as well > fails to include important parameters involved in the scrutiny of > the OPV/HIV/AIDS theory.> > Thus, geographical differences in immune response between Europeans > and those in the Western hemisphere, for example, have bearing on > therapies for such things as chronic lyme borreliosis > idiopathically, aside from the pure mechanics involved against the > pathogen.> > Burrascano / Lyme Disease Therapy> http://www.faim.org/lymenews.htm#tan> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2007 Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 That's funny, I happened to read the wiki entry on the OPV hypothesis last week. The evidence against it may be weak (a lot of things, not necessarily true, are hard to disprove or even to argue against). And it wouldn't surprise me if scientists were *somewhat* prejudiced against it. But is there any evidence *for* it? (On that note, is there any evidence for dehydration in CFS?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 11, 2007 Report Share Posted April 11, 2007 watch that doc, and read the pdf I sent, you will find more on the hooper site. hes made a 20 year investigation into it and remains convinced. The evidence is compelling. On 11 Apr 2007, at 00:52, wrote:That's funny, I happened to read the wiki entry on the OPV hypothesis last week. The evidence against it may be weak (a lot of things, not necessarily true, are hard to disprove or even to argue against). And it wouldn't surprise me if scientists were *somewhat* prejudiced against it. But is there any evidence *for* it?(On that note, is there any evidence for dehydration in CFS?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 12, 2007 Report Share Posted April 12, 2007 A combined keyword search at Pubmed such as 'cfs[AND]dehydration' won't do it; a search such as 'mapk[AND]cfs' will lead to 'mapk[AND] dehydration' yielding 10 refs. > > That's funny, I happened to read the wiki entry on the OPV hypothesis > last week. The evidence against it may be weak (a lot of things, not > necessarily true, are hard to disprove or even to argue against). And > it wouldn't surprise me if scientists were *somewhat* prejudiced > against it. But is there any evidence *for* it? > > (On that note, is there any evidence for dehydration in CFS?) > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 11, 2007 Report Share Posted September 11, 2007 You know a dream is like a river, ever changing as it flows.And a dreamer's just a vessel that must follow where it goes.Trying to learn from what's behind you and never knowing what's in storemakes each day a constant battle just to stay between the shores.And I will sail my vessel 'til the river runs dry.Like a bird upon the wind, these waters are my sky.I'll never reach my destination if I never try,So I will sail my vessel 'til the river runs dry.Too many times we stand aside and let the water slip away.To what we put off 'til tomorrow has now become today.So don't you sit upon the shore and say you're satisfied.Choose to chance the rapids and dare to dance the tides.-Garth , song "The River" co-written with ShawMy love to you all!Stefanie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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