Re: Sudden Onset Breast Pain???

[Guest guest]

Good point!! There is a real possibility that this is not pathological. The

intermittent quality and the timing of the symptoms point to what Lynn wrote.

In addition to that, did the original post say that the mother was taking

fenugreek? Perhaps let-down is so strong that baby is resisting it?

.. . .and if there is a yeast infection on the nipple, that could be unrelated. .

.. .

in NY

>

> My letdown when full is *always* painful. The emptier I am (was) the less

> it would hurt. By the time I got to 3-4 mo and my breasts were more supply

> and demand instead of trying to stay full all the time, it wasn't painful

> unless I missed a feed for some reason. But I could always stand still,

> not feeding, and know how full I was just by how my breasts felt, even

> untouched. Touching would be very uncomfortable. So it might be worth

> clarifying more with mom before assuming this is pathological, especially

> given that it sounds like she is making ductwork like gangbusters.

>

> Lynn in MO

>

[Guest guest]

This is so interesting. I saw a mom this week with a history of depression. She

came off all meds for pregnancy. Baby 3 weeks old and she is having deep breast

pain. She is presently overwhelmed and in what I would call desperate mode right

now. I would love to read the research on this! Thanks for bringing this to

light.

ine

www.BirthingWisdom.com

Sent from my iPad

>

> Lea,

>

> This is an interesting thought...

>

> This mom has a history of mental health issues and is in the midst of

> planning a big out of state move and getting ready to take the CPA exam.

> It definitely would be worth having a conversation with her regarding

> PPD.

>

> As a former family therapist, this link is intriguing to me. Thanks for

> the idea

>

> Carroll, ee, KS

>

>

>

>>

>> Sudden mental connection between two possible links...

>>

>> The research about muscle spasm/contracture and the research I

> presented on women from Mexico who describe deep breast pain, which was

> related to their score on a PPD screen at 2 weeks post partum.

>>

>> Could the sudden onset of episodic breast pain be a somatic symptom of

> risk for PPD?

>>

>> The women I have spoken with describe it as a deep, shooting, burning

> pain and it was an OB from Ecuador who identified the link (I just

> backed it up with some screening and data). Basically, lack of support,

> fear and general feeling overwhelmed seems to present itself as deep

> breast pain.

>>

>> I don't know if this is relevant to your client's situation but it may

> be worth thinking about in the future.

>>

>> Lea Todaro

>> Brooklyn, NY

>>

>

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>

>

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> ------------------------------------

>

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[Guest guest]

Lol! That means I should write it up

If you really want to see it I'd be happy to email it to you.

Lea

[Guest guest]

Psychologists know that depression can cause pain. The drug companies exploit

this in their advertisement for an ever increasing number of medications for

depression.

Best regards,

E. Burger, MHS, PhD, IBCLC

[Guest guest]

This mom is on a drug for ADHD and has this history: " 29 y.o. mom, hx of luteal

phase defect, PCOS, infertility, gastric sleeve, depression, anxiety, ADHD,

induced difficult vag birth.  Minor breast changes in pregnancy. "

This is all the kind of story you would see with multi-generational, epigenetic

gut damage. The last thing I would do is more gut damage with abx!

ly, I would be thinking about magnesium first. Metformin can cause B12

deficiency. Then look at iodine, zinc, getting off the inflammatory foods that

cause PCOS/depression/anxiety and beginning to nourish her body. Everything else

is just a slippery slope in the wrong direction, IMO.

Tow, IBCLC, CT/USA & Paris, France

>

>

>

> Subject: Sudden Onset Breast Pain???

> To:

> Date: Wednesday, May 23, 2012, 10:59 PM

>

>

>

>  

>

>

>

>

> Need your help wise ones.... Permission to post of course

> 29 y.o. mom, hx of luteal phase defect, PCOS, infertility, gastric sleeve,

depression, anxiety, ADHD, induced difficult vag birth.  Minor breast changes

in pregnancy.

> Baby had seizures on day 2, in NICU for 7days, was NPO at first then formula

fed, now getting both formula and Bm.  No reason was ever found for seizures. 

Baby is on phenobarbitol.  Oral exam normal except for strong suction. 

Visually baby appears completely normal. 

> Prior to seeing me in late Feb, mom had taken fenugreek, Reglan and power

pumped but after poor start and w/ hormonal hx, still was not getting good

results.  After seeing me, went back on Metformin, started taking goat's rue

and domperidone (no more reglan!).   Also started a much more rigorous pumping

schedule with different pump flanges in addition to putting baby to breast

regularly.  Paced bottlefeeding and lots of work on latch.

> 3 weeks after starting new plan, breasts had become more full and she had

doubled her output but still was not making enough to wean from formula (with

both test weights and pumping, mom hovers at about 1.2-1.3oz total per

feeding). 

> At that point (mid-March), she said her breasts, " ache on and off that I can

only assume is growing pains that you normally get during pregnancy when your

breasts are developing "   She described the pain as very mild and

intermittent.  No other S/S.

> She called me a couple of days ago, stating she had sudden onset breast pain

on Friday.  Hurts less when pumping then feeding.  I have questioned her about

latch changes, teething, baby illness, yeast symptoms, plugged duct symptoms. 

Mom says no external signs of trauma, no redness, bruising, nipple wounds,

blanching, etc.  This is her story...

>

> I'm having an issue. It suddenly started hurting when I'm breastfeeding my

daughter. I went to the dr and they sent me home and said call back in 2 days if

it's still happening.

>

> On friday we were in the car all day, Rowan didn't want to eat in the car very

well, my breasts weren't very emptied, I forgot to bring the breast pump. It

felt slightly uncomfortable like when your just a bit full.

>

> Friday evening we got into the hotel. I fed her as much as I could, expressed

as much as I could, got in the hot tub at the hotel and then tried to

breastfeed, and they got much more empty.

>

> Both were hurting my left more (but it creates more milk)

>

> We got home Sunday night I started using that nipple ointment and it helped a

bit I think.

>

> Went to dr 9:40am Tuesday. suppose to call back in 2 days if no change. nurse

practitioner did not think it was yeast, but thought it was a duct problem. if

it doesn't feel better in 2 days, suppose to have an ultra sound to see what's

going on.

>

> So the pain. It hurts when they are full of milk. The smaller the amount of

milk in them, the less they hurt when you touch them. When you touch them, the

nipple does not hurt it hurts inside somewhere, behind the nipple.

>

> When I am feeding Rowan, it hurts when she first starts, then toward the end,

not as much, as soon as she stops, pain is gone. But it hurts REALLY bad when

she first starts. Not crying bad, but where you might set your jaw and struggle

through until the pain lets up. Which usually doesn't take a really long time.

>

> If I pump, it doesn't hurt very much, maybe I can feel a little pinch or so

inside, but nothing I think isn't ordinary.

>

> The pain feels like... deep inside. where you can " feel " the let down. When

your really full and it starts getting empty it kinda feels good, but if you

made that feeling more intense it would hurt. That's the kind of hurt it is.

>

> So, what I am doing now pumping or feeding her very often, trying to use heat

to relax the breast tissue to help with the letdown, and using that nipple

ointment the dr office gave me a while back.

>

> Suggestions, ideas? Any idea what this might be or what to look for?

> Can your let down reflex suddenly become extremely painful due to the goats

rue or the domperidone raising your prolactin levels?

>

> I'm sitting here going to power pump, just pumped to empty my breast and

waiting my 10 min or so before going a bit longer and I'm feeling in my left

side what almost feels like my breast filling up again or releasing some milk

like let down reflex so it can fill up better.

>

> The only other question I have is can something mildly irritate the ducts

inside. Just enough I can feel it since my let down reflex is pretty strong,

just I never considered it painful. Perhaps a mild irritation is just making me

feel it worse.

> She just told me tonight that she feels like her breasts have at least doubled

in size since I saw her (still at 1.2oz/pump or feed though).  She also just

disclosed tonight that she is taking Vyvanse (L3) as well as more milk plus with

goat's rue, extra fenugreek, metoformin, probiotics, domperidone 60mg divided

into 3 doses/24 hr, and the mini pill (month 3 of this).  She is on so much

stuff and is such a complex case that I have no clue what could be causing her

breast pain.  Yikes!

> Any ideas would be appreciated.  Thanks so much!

> Carroll

>