Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 well, this isn't scientific, but here's my thought. my daughter is still breastfeeding, and gets colicky if i eat garlic. and when i accidentally ate kimchi (not realizing there was garlic in it!) she was SO colicky that night we thought we'd never get through it. i'd only eaten a condiment-sized amount, but the fermenting really packs a punch, it seems. so, given that data, it seems to me that one possible hypothesis would be that the negatives of the chemicals would also be increased? i'm not sure there's anything to bear out that hypothesis, so get your grain of salt ready, but for what it's worth, there it is. At 11:10 AM 1/20/2004, you wrote: >can anyone think of any reason *not* to eat 1/2 to 1 lb. of kimchi daily? >Since I discoverd an inexpensive raw commercial brand, i've been chowing >down royally on the stuff. it isn't organic, unfortunately, but i'm thinking >the anti-cancer and detoxifying compounds would negate or neutralize any >man-made chemical residue. any comment on that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 >can anyone think of any reason *not* to eat 1/2 to 1 lb. of kimchi daily? >Since I discoverd an inexpensive raw commercial brand, i've been chowing >down royally on the stuff. it isn't organic, unfortunately, but i'm thinking >the anti-cancer and detoxifying compounds would negate or neutralize any >man-made chemical residue. any comment on that? I would guess your average Korean can eat that much (they eat it 3x a day, and might have 4 types of kimchi at one meal). However, I did get a migraine from chowing down on some commercial stuff, maybe because it had MSG (I don't usually react to MSG, but I did eat a lot of it!). >when i get a harsch crock one day, i'll eat a lot more homemade kimchi, but >for now i make it in ball jars and it's labor-intensive enough for me not to >eat large quantities. the availability of the commercial stuff lets me load >up. I keep having " extras " in Ball jars and actually it turns out pretty good. This last batch I couldn't use the crock because it had something else going in it, so I did it all in jars, some of it in old kimchi jars. I folded a cabbage leaf over the top and salted the cabbage leaf, and didn't worry about " submersing " and all that. It came out fine. A lot of the Korean recipes *don't* submerse the cabbage ... they soak it in water first, then, say, wrap some stuff up in a cabbage leaf and tie it, and set the little bundles in a jar. You would think it would mold, but I guess it doesn't -- maybe from the salt-soak. Also I tried letting it go a bit less than 48 hours -- the commercial kimchi I've been getting is NOT sour, and when I talked to a Korean girl about kimchi, she mentioned that " when it goes, you know, sour, you should make it into soup " . So I put it in the fridge after it started looking soft (about a day and a half). One thing I noticed in the Kimchi book is that they say the " ideal kimchi temp " is rather low -- something like 40-50 degrees, and set for a couple of months. Anyway, my not-sour batch is really, really good! It has probably a cup of pulverized dried shrimp in it too, to 2 heads of Napa. I've been chowing down on that ... -- Heidi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 One other thing about kimchi garlic ... it is RAW, and there is a lot more of it than most of us could ever eat raw. That is one reason they are studying it in relation to SARS. And there are a lot of other chemicals in kimchi too. -- Heidi >well, this isn't scientific, but here's my thought. >my daughter is still breastfeeding, and gets colicky if i eat garlic. and >when i accidentally ate kimchi (not realizing there was garlic in it!) she >was SO colicky that night we thought we'd never get through it. i'd only >eaten a condiment-sized amount, but the fermenting really packs a punch, it >seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ > can anyone think of any reason *not* to eat 1/2 to 1 lb. of kimchi daily? > Since I discoverd an inexpensive raw commercial brand, i've been chowing > down royally on the stuff. it isn't organic, unfortunately, but i'm thinking > the anti-cancer and detoxifying compounds would negate or neutralize any > man-made chemical residue. any comment on that? @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ my 2 cups per day of kimchi works out to be about 1/2 lb, doesn't seem like 1lb would be that much. in terms of quantities of veggies 1lb of kimchi is definitely less than i eat in non-winter seasons. i think the main reason i don't eat more kimchi is that it would be too overwhelming to make more than i have already, which was a bit of an ordeal (37 heads of cabbage is a lot to deal with for one very busy person)... also, depending on the ingredients (traditional baechu- kimchi recipes call for a lot of green onions and mustard leaves, which are potassium powerhouses) the potassium/sodium ratio could be a concern in larger quantities. commercial kimchi tends to be pretty bastardized in this area and cabbage is not enough of a potassium powerhouse to compensate. supposing 1lb of kimchi has (i'm picking an arbitrary number probably in the ballpark) 200g of nappa cabbage and a typical 2% salt by weight content, going by the data for celtic sea salt (the only data i have for salt), that would be about 1300mg sodium and 500mg potassium. presumably the ratio would worse for cheaper salt and for a commercially produced food. if you're eating seasonally (i.e. not just going to the supermarket to get some kale) it would be non-trivial to compensate for the potassium deficit in the winter. i added a lot of kale to my winter kimchi and eat more sprouts in the winter. i would check on the presence of synthetic MSG in the commercial kimchi... Mike SE Pennsylvania Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 > One other thing about kimchi garlic ... it is RAW, and there > is a lot more of it than most of us could ever eat raw. > That is one reason they are studying it in relation > to SARS. And there are a lot of other chemicals > in kimchi too. true, and i've gotten into the habit of eating raw garlic daily anyways. so i'm getting it whether i eat kimchi or not. you are talking about beneficial chemicals it seems, and katja was talking about " negatives " - although i don't know if she was referring to the food-based compounds, or man-made chemical residue. Suze Fisher Lapdog Design, Inc. Web Design & Development http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine http://www.westonaprice.org ---------------------------- " The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " -- Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher. The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics <http://www.thincs.org> ---------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 > so, given that data, it seems to me that one possible hypothesis would be > that the negatives of the chemicals would also be increased? i'm not sure > there's anything to bear out that hypothesis, so get your grain of salt > ready, but for what it's worth, there it is. do you mean the man-made chemical residues on the veggies? if so, they should be reduced by the fermentation, not increased, due to the detoxifying compounds (like indole) that are present in kimchi and sauerkraut. Suze Fisher Lapdog Design, Inc. Web Design & Development http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine http://www.westonaprice.org ---------------------------- " The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " -- Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher. The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics <http://www.thincs.org> ---------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 > > I folded a cabbage leaf over the top and salted the > cabbage leaf, and didn't worry about " submersing " and all that. > It came out fine. A lot of the Korean recipes *don't* submerse > the cabbage ... they soak it in water first, then, say, wrap some > stuff up in a cabbage leaf and tie it, and set the little bundles in > a jar. You would think it would mold, but I guess it doesn't -- maybe > from the salt-soak. i might try that next time. i like to ferment mine at room temp for several weeks - the problem is it gets dry, starting from the top down :-( the commercial brand i'm getting (sunja's) has LOTS of juice. i like drinking it when i finish a jar. i will probably use it as a starter for my homemade batches as well, as you've suggested in the past. Suze Fisher Lapdog Design, Inc. Web Design & Development http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine http://www.westonaprice.org ---------------------------- " The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " -- Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher. The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics <http://www.thincs.org> ---------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 yeah, that's what i meant! i just didn't know how the process would affect them. so, yay! At 12:06 PM 1/20/2004, you wrote: >do you mean the man-made chemical residues on the veggies? if so, they >should be reduced by the fermentation, not increased, due to the detoxifying >compounds (like indole) that are present in kimchi and sauerkraut. atg technical support support@... 1-800-RING ATG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 chemical residue. and the garlic part is only negative while it gives amber colic. after that it's a TOTAL benefit! At 12:06 PM 1/20/2004, you wrote: >true, and i've gotten into the habit of eating raw garlic daily anyways. so >i'm getting it whether i eat kimchi or not. you are talking about beneficial >chemicals it seems, and katja was talking about " negatives " - although i >don't know if she was referring to the food-based compounds, or man-made >chemical residue. atg technical support support@... 1-800-RING ATG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@ > > my 2 cups per day of kimchi works out to be about 1/2 lb, doesn't > > seem like 1lb would be that much. > > interesting...my 1 lb. looks to be about 2 cups. @@@@@@@@@@@@@ i guess that would be liquid content... the sample i used was from the top of the jar, not much liquid... should've taken two samples... i dole it out by volume and do volume/mass conversions on a per-jar basis... @@@@@@@@@@@@@ > this brand has 1% sodium in a 1 lb. container. don't know how much > potassium. a description and ingredients are here: > http://www.sunjas.com/page2.html @@@@@@@@@@@@@ looks a cut above typical commercial kimchi (much of which is also hand-made in small batches) in terms of veggie content, so you're pretty lucky... shame they don't use fish/shrimp apparently... shame her ideas on nutrition are not very sophisticated... i see they use " friendly fermentation " ! i would just email them for an exact recipe and compute stuff from that, or at least get a clarification on the salt:cabbage ratio and compute Na:K off that, throwing in a fudge factor for the bits of other veggies... Mike SE Pennsylvania Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 >true, and i've gotten into the habit of eating raw garlic daily anyways. so >i'm getting it whether i eat kimchi or not. you are talking about beneficial >chemicals it seems, and katja was talking about " negatives " - although i >don't know if she was referring to the food-based compounds, or man-made >chemical residue Sometimes the " beneficial " s and the " negatives " are the same compound! -- Heidi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 20, 2004 Report Share Posted January 20, 2004 HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!! RE: kimchi overdose? HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!! HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!! HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!! HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!!Sometimes the " beneficial " s and the HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!! " negatives " are the same compound! HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!! HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!!-- Heidi true - what is the saying.... " the dose makes the poison " ? Suze Fisher Lapdog Design, Inc. Web Design & Development http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine http://www.westonaprice.org ---------------------------- " The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " -- Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher. The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics <http://www.thincs.org> ---------------------------- HAZELNUT BUTTER-slurp!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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