WDBs

[Guest guest]

,

You wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong, but you seem to believe that if we (collectively as a society) eliminate WDBs, people would not be exposed to mold products.

Okay. You are wrong. I think the same thing you do. WDB's and Mold aren't the problem. Lack of awareness as to the importance to address both the water damaged building and the occupant in the water damaged building before they become really sick, is the problem. But, why would building owners, occupants and physicians understand the importance of early intervention?

We all know that this whole issue is just a result of hysteria, media hype, trial lawyers and Junk Science, right?

Sharon

Tis the same argument made by folks that state: Guns kill people, therefore eliminate all guns and people will not die from gunfire. Buildings, like firearms, are inanimate, constructed devices, that are the product of their manufacture, operation, and maintenance. It is the occupants/owners that dictate/decide the performance of the device. And if the device is damaged, used improperly and/or not maintained, then could people be harmed BECAUSE of the poor decisions/actions of people. The device IS NOT the route cause of a person’s injury.Yes....many WDBs, are damaged by the forces of nature. But it takes the forces of people to restore it back to a pre-damaged condition. Moreover, in the case of hot, humid climate zones, the forces of nature are trying real hard to corrode and decompose everything that is man-made, and we (as a society) must work equally hard to mitigate the forces of nature. WBDs have been a subject of human health for thousands of years (read Leviticus) and it is not going to change in our life time or future generations. We need to accept the fact the WDBs happen. The course of action we take when confronted with a WDB is a discussion of merit.For what it is worth.....

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[Guest guest]

Sharon:

I only jump into this wonderful discourse between you and Tony to provide my perspective to what you constantly assume to be WDBs and the atypical environment.

Perspective......Here in the southwest, when a roof leaks during a violent thunderstorm and that leak soaks the inside of a building, AND the occupants/owners of the building FAIL to mitigate the moisture and damage, and mold ensues.....Yes, that is a WDB. In the southeast, when a hurricane blows and a tree falls through a roof/wall assembly and the rain soaks the inside of a building, AND the occupants/owners of the building FAIL to mitigate the moisture and damage, and mold ensues......Yes, that is a WDB. In the northeast, when an ice dam forms and water seeps inside a building, AND the occupants/owners of the building FAIL to mitigate the moisture and damage, and mold ensues.....Yes, that is a WDB. And Yes....In these cases they are not typical indoor environments until the damage (and moisture) is mitigated. However, in the hot, humid southeast where mold grows on almost all surfaces because of high humidity and/or condensation from humid air coming into contact with cold air conditioned surfaces........Does this also represent a WDB? In this case I think not, and in this case it IS a typical indoor environment, i.e., moist and moldy. Moreover, as in the examples above and in many circumstances I have been involved with, it is often the lack of mitigating action on the part of occupants/owners of a building that typically result in a WDB, and of course the resulting mold growth and exposure that occurs due to the damage that was not mitigated. If it is damaged, fix it!

(As an aside, this tread is of most significance for tenants of rental housing. Assuming that tenants have no contributing factors to the moisture and/or damage, which is often not the case, the lack of action by landlords warrants intervention by others. Rental housing warrants protection, with the caveat of route cause apportionment.)

I, for one, often cringe, bristle, and get annoyed at your choice of words, because all too often you seem to equate WDBs with the route cause of mold and people’s exposure to mold and mold products. Correct me if I am wrong, but you seem to believe that if we (collectively as a society) eliminate WDBs, people would not be exposed to mold products. Tis the same argument made by folks that state: Guns kill people, therefore eliminate all guns and people will not die from gunfire. Buildings, like firearms, are inanimate, constructed devices, that are the product of their manufacture, operation, and maintenance. It is the occupants/owners that dictate/decide the performance of the device. And if the device is damaged, used improperly and/or not maintained, then could people be harmed BECAUSE of the poor decisions/actions of people. The device IS NOT the route cause of a person’s injury.

Yes....many WDBs, are damaged by the forces of nature. But it takes the forces of people to restore it back to a pre-damaged condition. Moreover, in the case of hot, humid climate zones, the forces of nature are trying real hard to corrode and decompose everything that is man-made, and we (as a society) must work equally hard to mitigate the forces of nature. WBDs have been a subject of human health for thousands of years (read Leviticus) and it is not going to change in our life time or future generations. We need to accept the fact the WDBs happen. The course of action we take when confronted with a WDB is a discussion of merit.

For what it is worth.....

Tony,

Excellent Question! You write:

QUESTION: Can you show me a single study that scientifically demonstrates

that indoor mycotoxins in typical indoor environment* are causing adverse

health affects other than allergy?

* Hospitals are not typical, nor are farming environments, swine houses,

sewage facilities, etc.

Tony

Answer: No. Nor do I believe that mycotoxins within a typical indoor environment are causing adverse health effects including allergy. Why?

Because water damaged structures are not typical indoor environments. They are contained, closed in areas where people with varying immune systems and varying susceptibilities breathe, eat and touch the various toxins, including myco, that are present in the WDB for varying periods of time and in varying quantities. These are atypical (meaning not typical) environments in which people from all across the USA are complaining of symptoms indicative of poisoning after their atypical exposures to these poisons in these atypical environments. And...I am not aware that mycotoxins cause allergy.

Question for you: Can you show me a single study that scientifically demonstrates

indoor microbial toxins in an atypical, water damaged indoor environment* are not causing adverse human health affects indicative of poisoning? (it has to be actual research, not a bogus, litigation defense friendly, position paper)

Sharon

[Guest guest]

Please forgive a newbie for asking. I've tried to search this out before asking, but what is a WDB? Thanks, Geyer wrote: Sharon:I only jump into this wonderful discourse between you and Tony to provide my perspective to what you constantly assume to be WDBs and the atypical environment.

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