Re: DMSO/ACA

[Guest guest]

I've read everything the Germans have to say about ACA.

ACA and AEG are identicle looking- and the only difference is

the interlukin profile taken from a biopsy.

ABx treatment of elderly Germans with untreated late stage Lyme (with

the thrid stage of ACA- it has 3 stages - inflammatory - chronic and

tertiary) is a small pool of people- 85% of THOSE people were mis-dx

for 25 years- so their treatment came as late as mine did for Lyme.

While there's some improvement - the lesions do not completely go

away.

The German theory is that Lyme is host-adapted by that point- and

what ever form it's in is resistant to everything. Stained biopsied

in Germany show a yet to be named variant they're not sure what it is-

a supposed host adapted Lyme variant - There's just not a large pool

of people to investigate- and even less interest to do so.

I've had 4 biopsies - and the language (pervivascular infiltrates

of monocytes and .. etc blah blah blah ) is identical for both AEG

and ACA in the literature.

The US pathologists don't go that extra step to look at the cytokine

profile of which interlukins present or not present- specific

interlukins are thought to be necessary to clear a pathogen related

lesion.

US pathologists are just looking at the cellular profile.

Now that I'm educated in ACA - I suspect I had the inflammatory stage

years ago.. so I'm not sure if when I received my abx in 2002 if ACA

was in the 2nd or 3rd stage.

As far as the nomenclature - Annulare just means circular -

Elastoylic just means affaceting the elastin and Granuloma is a

generic word used to describe alot of lesions.

And look at the nomenclature for ACA Acrodermis Chronica Atrophicans -

you can figure that one out.

I can only go by the info written. And these old Germans still have

the remnants and skinproblems from ACA- even though abx has releived

most of them of their other Lyme sysptoms... Once they've had abx the

cultures only yield a pathogen profile less than 20% of the time..

So I think there's even less interest to persue this line of

investigation.

I have read theories thought where cases of venus insufficiency or

vascultits is mis dx'd when it's really late stage ACA. The problem

is these people are OLD..

I can see- that in another 10 years- I'll be told these are

excellerated age related skin changes and that -yet again- nothing to

do about it.

I'll ley you know how it goes.

I've started my treatment. 2 lesions are painted with nail polish-

the normal areas of skin have sloughed the nail polish off but the

polish over the lesions has interestingly become my skin.

The others are getting the DMSO treatment. SOmething happened after

the 3rd treatment (stinging for 15 minutes). Some actually look a

little better, but it's too early to tell.

I'll keep you posted.

I gotta run-

I'll post a site where you can see some pictures on line later.

Barb

>

> Is ACA supposed to be granulomatous? Annular elastolytic granuloma

*is*

> granulomatous, right? Unless ACA is also granulomatous, then, you'd

> think the dermatologist could tell them apart by examining a biopsy

for

> granulomas under a light microscope... ?

>

>

> > And if they ARE late stage Lyme ACA- abx isn't going to fix it..

>

> Well... do you believe it? Abx are also supposedly ineffective for

post-

> treatment lyme disease syndrome, or whatever they call it.

>

>

> > or I can just starve one of all oxygen and

> > see what happens. Thats my next step if the DMSO doen't work.

>

> Thing is, putting something on your epidermis wouldn't deprive the

> dermis of any O2 it might recieve from the circulatory system. I

don't

> know if the dermis receives most of its O2 through the epidermis or

> from the capillaries, but my first guess would be the latter.

>

[Guest guest]

> As far as the nomenclature - Annulare just means circular -

> Elastoylic just means affaceting the elastin and Granuloma is a

> generic word used to describe alot of lesions.

Not in my experience... I've always seen the word refer to a tight

focus of monocyte/macrophages, with an outer ring of lymphocytes

surrounding it. Sometimes with other features like giant cells, central

necrosis, fibrin deposition, or calcification. Granulomatous

inflammation is commonly distinguished from non-granulomatous.

[Guest guest]

We're saying the same thing.

I didn't say anything about Giant cells.

read this is you can get the full paper:

" Differential Expression of Cytokine mRNA in Skin SPecimens from

Patients with Erythema Migrans or Acrodermatitis Chronica Atrophicans "

EM LESIONS:

Mild to marked perivascular infiltrates in the papillary more than

the reticular dermis. The infiltrates were composed primarily of

Lymphocytes amd machrophages intermihgles with a small amount of

plasma cells " ....

and it's too long for me to copy the ACA profile.

Then look up AEG. They're veri similar.

I think you're thinking of caseating and non- caseating granuloma.

In any case- the name doesn't matter to me any more I have

4 biopsies using exactly the same language as 2 Lyme papers on ACA.

I German0 and the above one from Tufts.

Got any ideas for getting rid of them?

I'm almost fresh out.

Barb

>

>

> > As far as the nomenclature - Annulare just means circular -

> > Elastoylic just means affaceting the elastin and Granuloma is a

> > generic word used to describe alot of lesions.

>

> Not in my experience... I've always seen the word refer to a tight

> focus of monocyte/macrophages, with an outer ring of lymphocytes

> surrounding it. Sometimes with other features like giant cells,

central

> necrosis, fibrin deposition, or calcification. Granulomatous

> inflammation is commonly distinguished from non-granulomatous.

>