Re: Someone asked about the MP? (Bob-Herx)

[Guest guest]

It's not " all or nothing " . Herx doesn't

t happen only with a " total " die-off - but some criteria do have to

be met to call it herx...

And there are certain antibiotics that can lessen herx (by inhibing

both the toxins reuling from dead Gneg bacteria- and the immune

systms repose to same) from a massive die-off of gram negative

bacteria, and there are antibioics that can worsen (by increasing the

chemicals involved in herx.). It's a combo of the NUMBER of GRAM

NEGATIVE bacteris that are killed and the CHEMISTRY of the chemical

that killed them and some COMPONENTS of the immune system and it

results in an adverse SYSTEMIC reaction.

Barb

> > > > > > As for the 1,25D levels I may take you up on that. I

don't

> > have

> > > > the

> > > > > > info right at hand, but I do know it is out there. I

looked

> > into

> > > > > > this before starting the MP. The big Danish study TM

> > references

> > > > > > wasn't online, but I have seen it referenced

elsewhere. There

> > > are

> > > > > > many small studies online which show very similar

results. As

> > I

> > > > > > recall the Mean ranged from 27-30 with a SD of 7-10.

If I get

> > > > > > motivated I will look them up again.

> > > > >

> > > > > 1,25(OH)2D levels are affected differently in every

condition,

> > so

> > > > > that it's impossible to make any general statement

about 1,25

> > (OH)

> > > 2D

> > > > > and inflammation. For example, in RA, increased disease

> > activity

> > > > > results in decreased 1,25(OH)2D levels, even though

it's been

> > > > proven

> > > > > that TH1 1,25(OH)2D production occurs in RA. This is

due to

> > bone

> > > > > loss that occurs in RA. Only in a few specific

conditions has

> > it

> > > > > been found that increased disease activity coorelates

with

> > > > increased

> > > > > 1,25(OH)2D levels. In most other conditions, other

factors such

> > > as

> > > > > calcium metabolism and hormones will be of much greater

> > influence

> > > > on

> > > > > 1,25(OH)2D serum levels than TH1 generated 1,25(OH)2D.

> > > > >

> > > > > > Mark -- I think there are valid reasons to expect an

immune

> > > > response

> > > > > > to the death of cwd bacteria and their host cells.

> > > > >

> > > > > The medical literature does not support your claim.

There is no

> > > > > support in the medical literature for any reaction from

any

> > > > bacteria

> > > > > die off, except in a true herx response, which is only

known to

> > > > occur

> > > > > with a few specific complex bacteria. And even then, a

true

> > herx

> > > > > only occurs in some people with those infections, but

not

> > > > everyone.

> > > > > And even then it only occurs on the first dose of abx.

> > > > >

> > > > > Also, I've seen no proof that the MP causes a

significant die

> > off

> > > > of

> > > > > host cells, i.e. white cells in which the CWD are

supposed to

> > > > live.

> > > > > White cells die off all the time, so an increase in die

off

> > > > shouldn't

> > > > > cause any herx type reaction. If there was a huge die

off,

> > > perhaps

> > > > > one would get a reaction, but in that case, a lab test

should

> > be

> > > > able

> > > > > to prove that is happening, in which case a lab test

should

> > have

> > > > been

> > > > > designed by now by the MP, to test for " real "

reactions, in

> > order

> > > > to

> > > > > distiguish them for side effects, or something else.

> > > > >

> > > > > All abx drugs have numerous different side effects, not

to

> > > mention

> > > > > that some can kill off good bacteria. Feeling bad

symptoms from

> > > > abx

> > > > > doesn't necessarily prove that such symptoms are due to

the die

> > > off

> > > > > of bad bacteria.

> > > > >

> > > > > The MP states not just a few, but many unsupported

claims which

> > > are

> > > > > not supported by the medical literature. True science

is based

> > on

> > > > > supported facts. I'm willing to perhaps believe in one

or two

> > new

> > > > > medical facts. But when someone presents me with

numerous ones

> > in

> > > > > order to support their theory, I'm more likely to

believe that

> > > it's

> > > > a

> > > > > case of cognitive dissonance. - Mark

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>