Re: Pseudomonas: the plot thickens... Gallium and Horses...

[Guest guest]

Interesting you should mention horses Penny. I found these links last week when

I was

diagnosed.

This guy Eby (the man who came up with the zinc lozenge for colds) --

found that

treating lame horses with the trace mineral " gallium " restored their energy,

etc., after a

week or so of external rubs and soaks.

But the interesting part was that the people treating horses found that THEIR

pains went

away as well.

http://george-eby-research.com/html/arthritis.html

And even more interesting is this PubMed study that found that gallium inhibits

pseudomonas growth:

http://www.jci.org/cgi/content/abstract/117/4/877

INTERESTING...???

Dan

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Hi, all.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I know that some folks here would prefer that I not post

> > > things

> > > > > > > about

> > > > > > > > the methylation cycle block treatment on this list, but

> > > please

> > > > > > > > forgive me for this one. I think it's a biggie, and I think

> > > > > > > > everybody here should hear about it.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > A woman on the ImmuneSuppport CFS discussion board who is

> > > on the

> > > > > > > > simplified treatment approach for lifting the methylation

> > > cycle

> > > > > > > block

> > > > > > > > just reported that she was able to stop

> > > > > > > > her use of desmopressin (which she had been using since last

> > > > > > > > September to control her heavy urine volume), and her urine

> > > volume

> > > > > > > > did not jump back up, as it formerly did when she stopped

> > > the

> > > > > > > > desmopressin. I think this agrees with Hall's report

> > > some

> > > > > > time

> > > > > > > > ago that restoring his glutathione level corrected his

> > > diabetes

> > > > > > > > insipidus, too. Here is the response I wrote to this woman.

> > > I took

> > > > > > > > her name off to protect her privacy, but she posted to a

> > > public

> > > > > > > > discussion board, and you can read her post there.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Rich

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Hi, _______.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > This is wonderful! It's wonderful both for you and for me

> > > and for

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > whole CFS community, because it provides more observational

> > > > > > support

> > > > > > > > for the GD-MCB hypothesis.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > As you probably know (but I want to make sure other readers

> > > are

> > > > > > > aware

> > > > > > > > of it, too), part of this hypothesis says that the low

> > > production

> > > > > > of

> > > > > > > > antidiuretic hormone (also called arginine vasopressin) in

> > > CFS

> > > > > > > > results from low glutathione in the hypothalamus. This

> > > results in

> > > > > > a

> > > > > > > > (usually mild) case of diabetes insipidus, not to be

> > > confused with

> > > > > > > > diabetes mellitus, which involves high blood sugar and low

> > > > > > insulin.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > " Diabetes " means you have a lot of urine. " Mellitus " means

> > > your

> > > > > > > urine

> > > > > > > > tastes sweet, because it has elevated blood sugar or

> > > glucose in

> > > > > > > > it. " Insipidus " means that your urine tastes insipid, i.e.

> > > it

> > > > > > isn't

> > > > > > > > sweet. Not many people like to diagnose these by tasting

> > > the urine

> > > > > > > > these days, but it's much quicker than doing the lab tests!

> > > (:-)).

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Diabetes insipidus produces high urine volume and low total

> > > blood

> > > > > > > > volume, as well as constant thirst. This is the phenomenon

> > > in CFS

> > > > > > > > that Dr. Teitelbaum refers to as " Pee like a racehorse,

> > > drink

> > > > > > like a

> > > > > > > > fish. "

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The simplified treatment approach, among other things, is

> > > > > > designed

> > > > > > > to

> > > > > > > > allow glutathione levels to come up to normal. When this

> > > happens,

> > > > > > we

> > > > > > > > should expect that the diabetes insipidus will disappear,

> > > and you

> > > > > > > > have verified that it did in your case.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I should make a small correction to what you wrote, in that

> > > while

> > > > > > > > this does involve the hypothalamus, it doesn't actually say

> > > that

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > HPA (hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal) axis has been restored

> > > to

> > > > > > > normal

> > > > > > > > operation. I expect that that will occur as well, but the

> > > > > > > > disappearance of the diabetes insipidus does not prove

> > > that.

> > > > > > > Evidence

> > > > > > > > for improvement in the HPA axis would include things like

> > > blood

> > > > > > > > pressure coming up to normal, decrease in symptoms of

> > > > > > hypoglycemia,

> > > > > > > > cortisol and DHEA levels restored to normal, disappearance

> > > of

> > > > > > > > orthostatic problems such as problems with blood pressure

> > > or heart

> > > > > > > > rate when standing, better ability to cope with stress of

> > > all

> > > > > > sorts,

> > > > > > > > and other cortisol-related things. If you are observing

> > > those

> > > > > > things

> > > > > > > > as well, then I would agree that your HPA axis is doing

> > > better,

> > > > > > too.

> > > > > > > > I fully expect that to happen for you, too, if it hasn't

> > > already,

> > > > > > > > because the same basic mechanism in the biochemistry that

> > > restored

> > > > > > > > ADH should also restore ACTH, which I think will bring the

> > > HPA

> > > > > > axis

> > > > > > > > back to normal operation.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > At the biochemical level, I think this observation also

> > > supports

> > > > > > my

> > > > > > > > more fundamental suggestion that secretory proteins that

> > > contain

> > > > > > > > cysteine double bonds are not being made well in CFS

> > > because of

> > > > > > > > glutathione depletion in the cells in which they are made.

> > > If

> > > > > > this

> > > > > > > is

> > > > > > > > true, it also provides support for my hypotheses to explain

> > > low

> > > > > > > > levels of some of the other secretory proteins in CFS,

> > > including

> > > > > > > > human growth hormone, ACTH, oxytocin, perforin, and

> > > probably some

> > > > > > > > others as well. So this is big, from my point of view!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Thank you so much for posting this, and keep on keeping on!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Rich

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, Dan! This is very big news to me. The info definitely seems to be borne out in other places as well. It's great that it's being studied as a possible treatment for cystic fibrosis as CF patients are very prone to pseudomonas infection. Here's another link to a CF article: http://www.cff.org/aboutCFFoundation/NewsEvents/index.cfm?ID=6169 & TYPE=1670 The articles say gallium not only destroys the bug and biofilm, but that it's an inhibitor of bone resorption. That's a big problem for those of us with rotting jaws/bones, not to mention all those folks with degenerative arthritis due to infection/inflammation. I've even got a frozen shoulder which is mentioned! And Eby says that apparently gallium only settles in the inflamed tissues that need help, not healthy tissue. I

suppose it could be an issue however, if you've got kidney problems or something of the sort. You wouldn't want to be damaging your kidneys or liver. You definitely need to remember it's experimental, but Eby's horse sure seems to be doing fine. I'd be really interested in trying it. If it could slow down the bone rot, eliminate the pseudomonas, the frozen shoulder and the intermittent arthritic type symptoms at the same time, it would be like hitting a grand slam and the lottery all at once! Thanks for these links. Here's another account by Eby: http://arthritistrust.org/Articles/Gallium.pdf Now I'm just trying to figure out where I can get some for a trial. penny p.s. after some searching I found this place that

sells a gallium topical for horses: http://gallium-nitrate.com/ Apparently this is Eby's site as his contact info is there, and the links he has in other articles no longer take you to anything other than zinc. I'd like to find some place that sells it orally. Did you come across anything? The Journal article: Gallium: a new antibacterial agent? New antibacterial strategies are needed because an increasing proportion of bacterial infections are caused by antibiotic-resistant bacteria and because antibiotics are not effective at eradicating chronic bacterial infections. The approach taken by Kaneko and colleagues was to combat bacteria by imposing on them an environment in which they cannot survive, an environment in which their

access to Fe, which is critical for growth, is limited (pages 877–888). The presence of Ga, which is chemically similar to Fe, in culture medium inhibited the growth of Pseudomonas aeruginosa, even multidrug-resistant strains of P. aeruginosa isolated from individuals with cystic fibrosis. Ga also prevented P. aeruginosa from forming biofilms, the multicellular bacterial communities responsible for chronic bacterial infections, and killed both free-living bacteria and bacteria in biofilms. Furthermore, inhalation of Ga protected mice from both acute and chronic P. aeruginosa lung infections. As Ga is already FDA approved for the treatment of hypercalcemia of malignancy, these data suggest that Ga

might be a promising new therapeutic for the treatment of infection with P. aeruginosa. J. Clin. Invest. 117:837 (2007). doi:10.1172/JCI31956.Copyright ©2007 by the American Society for Clinical Investigation http://www.jci.org/cgi/content/full/117/4/837kdrbrill <kdrbrill@...> wrote: Interesting you should mention

horses Penny. I found these links last week when I was diagnosed. This guy Eby (the man who came up with the zinc lozenge for colds) -- found that treating lame horses with the trace mineral "gallium" restored their energy, etc., after a week or so of external rubs and soaks.But the interesting part was that the people treating horses found that THEIR pains went away as well.http://george-eby-research.com/html/arthritis.htmlAnd even more interesting is this PubMed study that found that gallium inhibits pseudomonas growth:http://www.jci.org/cgi/content/abstract/117/4/877INTERESTING...???Dan--- .

[Guest guest]

Also, Dan, where do you buy your Terminalia chebula? This sounds promising as well. Kudos to the remarkable girl and her research not to mention her desire to create a spray delivery form. What an inspiration. I think I'll dissolve some and put it in my nasal irrigator. penny kdrbrill <kdrbrill@...> wrote: Interesting you should mention horses Penny. I found these links last week when I was diagnosed. This guy

Eby (the man who came up with the zinc lozenge for colds) -- found that treating lame horses with the trace mineral "gallium" restored their energy, etc., after a week or so of external rubs and soaks.But the interesting part was that the people treating horses found that THEIR pains went away as well.http://george-eby-research.com/html/arthritis.htmlAnd even more interesting is this PubMed study that found that gallium inhibits pseudomonas growth:http://www.jci.org/cgi/content/abstract/117/4/877INTERESTING...???Dan--- In infections , Penny Houle <pennyhoule@...> wrote:>> Yes, definitely will consider

trying it. That would be great if it can eradicate pseudomonas. Pseudomonas is a big problem for horses so it could have a lot of applications. Even if people are a bit too short sighted to recognize it as a threat, at least horses could possibly benefit. Barb, have you heard of this?> > penny> > kdrbrill <kdrbrill@...> wrote:> I encourage you to look at the link on the east indian herbal remedy again...it killed it, > destroyed the (usually difficult to destroy) outer membrane that it uses to protect itself.> > http://cfvancouver.ca/cms/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=63 & Itemid=38> > d. > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Hi, all.> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I know that some folks here would prefer that I not post > > > things > > > > > > > about> > > > > > > > the methylation cycle block treatment on this list, but > > > please> > > > > > > > forgive me for this one. I think it's a biggie, and I think> > > > > > > > everybody here should hear about it.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A woman on the ImmuneSuppport CFS discussion board who is > > > on the> > > > > > > > simplified treatment approach for lifting the methylation > > > cycle > > > > > > > block> > > > > > > > just reported that she was able to stop> > > > > > > > her use of desmopressin (which she had

been using since last> > > > > > > > September to control her heavy urine volume), and her urine > > > volume> > > > > > > > did not jump back up, as it formerly did when she stopped > > > the> > > > > > > > desmopressin. I think this agrees with Hall's report > > > some > > > > > > time> > > > > > > > ago that restoring his glutathione level corrected his > > > diabetes> > > > > > > > insipidus, too. Here is the response I wrote to this woman. > > > I took> > > > > > > > her name off to protect her privacy, but she posted to a > > > public> > > > > > > > discussion board, and you can read her post there.> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > Rich> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, _______.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is wonderful! It's wonderful both for you and for me > > > and for > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > whole CFS community, because it provides more observational > > > > > > support> > > > > > > > for the GD-MCB hypothesis.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As you probably know (but I want to make sure other readers > > > are > > > > > > > aware> > > > > > > > of it, too), part of this hypothesis says that the low > > > production > > > > > > of> >

> > > > > > antidiuretic hormone (also called arginine vasopressin) in > > > CFS> > > > > > > > results from low glutathione in the hypothalamus. This > > > results in > > > > > > a> > > > > > > > (usually mild) case of diabetes insipidus, not to be > > > confused with> > > > > > > > diabetes mellitus, which involves high blood sugar and low > > > > > > insulin.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Diabetes" means you have a lot of urine. "Mellitus" means > > > your > > > > > > > urine> > > > > > > > tastes sweet, because it has elevated blood sugar or > > > glucose in> > > > > > > > it. "Insipidus" means that your urine tastes insipid,

i.e. > > > it > > > > > > isn't> > > > > > > > sweet. Not many people like to diagnose these by tasting > > > the urine> > > > > > > > these days, but it's much quicker than doing the lab tests! > > > (:-)).> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Diabetes insipidus produces high urine volume and low total > > > blood> > > > > > > > volume, as well as constant thirst. This is the phenomenon > > > in CFS> > > > > > > > that Dr. Teitelbaum refers to as "Pee like a racehorse, > > > drink > > > > > > like a> > > > > > > > fish."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The simplified treatment approach, among other things, is

> > > > > > designed > > > > > > > to> > > > > > > > allow glutathione levels to come up to normal. When this > > > happens, > > > > > > we> > > > > > > > should expect that the diabetes insipidus will disappear, > > > and you> > > > > > > > have verified that it did in your case.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I should make a small correction to what you wrote, in that > > > while> > > > > > > > this does involve the hypothalamus, it doesn't actually say > > > that > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > HPA (hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal) axis has been restored > > > to > > > > > > > normal>

> > > > > > > operation. I expect that that will occur as well, but the> > > > > > > > disappearance of the diabetes insipidus does not prove > > > that. > > > > > > > Evidence> > > > > > > > for improvement in the HPA axis would include things like > > > blood> > > > > > > > pressure coming up to normal, decrease in symptoms of > > > > > > hypoglycemia,> > > > > > > > cortisol and DHEA levels restored to normal, disappearance > > > of> > > > > > > > orthostatic problems such as problems with blood pressure > > > or heart> > > > > > > > rate when standing, better ability to cope with stress of > > > all > > > > > > sorts,> > > > > >

> > and other cortisol-related things. If you are observing > > > those > > > > > > things> > > > > > > > as well, then I would agree that your HPA axis is doing > > > better, > > > > > > too.> > > > > > > > I fully expect that to happen for you, too, if it hasn't > > > already,> > > > > > > > because the same basic mechanism in the biochemistry that > > > restored> > > > > > > > ADH should also restore ACTH, which I think will bring the > > > HPA > > > > > > axis> > > > > > > > back to normal operation.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At the biochemical level, I think this observation also > > > supports > > > > >

> my> > > > > > > > more fundamental suggestion that secretory proteins that > > > contain> > > > > > > > cysteine double bonds are not being made well in CFS > > > because of> > > > > > > > glutathione depletion in the cells in which they are made. > > > If > > > > > > this > > > > > > > is> > > > > > > > true, it also provides support for my hypotheses to explain > > > low> > > > > > > > levels of some of the other secretory proteins in CFS, > > > including> > > > > > > > human growth hormone, ACTH, oxytocin, perforin, and > > > probably some> > > > > > > > others as well. So this is big, from my point of view!> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Thank you so much for posting this, and keep on keeping on!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rich> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >>