Any successes with Cowden protocol?

[Guest guest]

Just wondering of any of you with children on the autism spectrum have

tried the Cowden protocol for lyme and coinfections as listed here:

http://www.bionatus.com/nutramedix/pdfs/L-Protocol-cowden.pdf

If so, what have the results been?

It looks pretty intensive, and I am very curious what kind of outcomes

the kids have been having.

Thanks,

Beth

[Guest guest]

Not yet. I am studying it now. I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far. Hopefully, in a few months, I will have implemented it or something close to it and be able to give a testimony on it.

Right now we are on Resveratrol as Buhner promotes, and I am seeing improvements in social activity and happiness. As a matter of fact, I ran out and some symptoms returned of depressed mood and less socially active. Since I added Resveratrol, my 4 year old twins have begun running around the house, wrestling and being quite loud, more rambunxious than they have ever been before, not hyperactivity, genuine boy stuff.

I did try samento (both Buhner and Cowden promote Samento) for a day without the Resveratrol and it also seemed to help. I am now taking both samento and Resveratrol, myself only, to see what would happen. Well I am a little dizzy, so that is herxing for me. It makes me quite happy. If I am herxing, then that means the critters are dying instead of hiding. But I also have Bartonella, so it could be from them dying. One can't know at this point.

The Resveratrol took away my numbness in my left arm and legs as well. It returned when I ran out. Now that I am back on it, the numbness is away again. Got to love this stuff. The Burbur, from Cowden's protocol, really helps keep my energy up and helps me concentrate. I am so busy with all these kids and all, but I hope to find time to study some more tonight.

Heidi N

Just wondering of any of you with children on the autism spectrum have tried the Cowden protocol for lyme and coinfections as listed here:http://www.bionatus.com/nutramedix/pdfs/L-Protocol-cowden.pdfIf so, what have the results been? It looks pretty intensive, and I am very curious what kind of outcomes the kids have been having.Thanks,BethCreate a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home.

[Guest guest]

Beth,

I would really like to hear some feedback from parents or adults treating

themselves, who have implemented Dr. Lee Cowden's herbal protocol for at

least 6 months. At the few other Yahoo groups I subscribe to, I do not seem

to find any who has at least implemented Dr. Lee Cowden's herbal protocol

for a half year. I wonder which groups might be appropriate for this

post/question and can generate more replies.

We did two rounds of LED (Laser Energetic Detoxification) based upon Dr. Lee

Cowden's protocol last summer and around last Christmas. We detoxed the

toxins from Borrelia, Babesia, Lead, Mercury, and Aluminum among other

things. The results were great. My son made good progress in cognitive

development and receptive language almost immediately. His improvements

also correlated to the good metals pulls in UTM tests, for which we

collected urine samples on the third day after each LED session.

We then started herbal protocol (rotating Banderol and Cumanda) for

Borreliosis in December and intracellular parasite protocol (VRM4) in

February. However, I am not as certain to these protocols as I was to LED.

First of all, I do not observe immediate, noticeable improvements in my son.

Secondly, my son's metal pulls are dropping. Thirdly, my son never has any

Herxheimer reaction to these herbal remedies. Fourthly, the viral aspect

seems to be a missing link, as the protocol/herbs mostly address bacterial

infections, and my son has quite a load of Measles, Rubella, EBV, and CMV.

Fifthly, my son's gut continues to be quite messy - indigestion and diarrhea

occur now and then.

In general, I often have doubts on the long-term use of anti-microbial, as

it suppresses the bugs instead of working on awakening the immune system.

Early last year, I moved away from Yasko's gut herb protocol to sequential

homeopathy for this very reason. At the first LIA conference last year, I

realized that my son might have Borreliosis and decided to set aside

sequential homeopathy and give Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol a try. So far, we

love LED but feel ambivalent about NutriMedix herbs. I hope someone in this

group who has used the herbs extensively can provide some feedback and

guidance. Thank you.

One key point of the herbal protocol is to rotate at least two out of the

four herbs (Samento, Banderol, Quina, and Cumanda) 12 days on with a 36-hour

break in between. The idea is to give the bacteria a false sense of safety

during the break, give them a chance to turn into the vulnerable, spirochete

form, and hit them next with an unexpected, different anti-microbial herb.

Borrelia and many of the co-infectors are stealthy, intelligent. I concern

that the long-term use of the anti-microbial would force the bacteria morph

into CWD form or Cyst form for a longer duration of time, and the herbs and

the immune system would not be able to eliminate them.

I will continue with the herbal protocol for a few months and then

re-evaluate it. Meanwhile, any comment, suggestion, and advice are

appreciated.

Limin

Any successes with Cowden

protocol?

> Just wondering of any of you with children on the autism spectrum have

> tried the Cowden protocol for lyme and coinfections as listed here:

>

> http://www.bionatus.com/nutramedix/pdfs/L-Protocol-cowden.pdf

>

> If so, what have the results been?

>

> It looks pretty intensive, and I am very curious what kind of outcomes

> the kids have been having.

>

> Thanks,

>

> Beth

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Limen,

> I would really like to hear some feedback from parents or adults

treating > themselves, who have implemented Dr. Lee Cowden's herbal

protocol for at > least 6 months. At the few other Yahoo groups I

subscribe to, I do not seem > to find any who has at least

implemented Dr. Lee Cowden's herbal protocol > for a half year. I

wonder which groups might be appropriate for this > post/question

and can generate more replies.

Well it looks as though YOU are the most expereinced on this list

with the Cowden protocol; so looks like you are leading the way,

like it or not. of course has had much experience with Dr

Cowden too, but I believe does most of his stuff on her own nowadays

as she went to his trainings. I do not know if there is a list

where you could find more Cowden patients other than maybe 's

group " reversing autism " ? His name comes up there a lot, but I do

not believe many on her list have actually taken their child to see

him. As you know he is super expensive and the LED treamtents are

tricky in that it is so difficult to avoid electromagnetic fields

between treatments. How did you manage?

> We did two rounds of LED (Laser Energetic Detoxification) based

upon Dr. Lee > Cowden's protocol last summer and around last

Christmas. We detoxed the > toxins from Borrelia, Babesia, Lead,

Mercury, and Aluminum among other > things. The results were

great. My son made good progress in cognitive

> development and receptive language almost immediately. His

improvements > also correlated to the good metals pulls in UTM

tests, for which we > collected urine samples on the third day after

each LED session.

>

Wow, great! Congratulations.

> We then started herbal protocol (rotating Banderol and Cumanda)

for > Borreliosis in December and intracellular parasite protocol

(VRM4) in > February. However, I am not as certain to these

protocols as I was to LED.

> First of all, I do not observe immediate, noticeable improvements

in my son. > Secondly, my son's metal pulls are dropping. Thirdly,

my son never has any > Herxheimer reaction to these herbal

remedies. Fourthly, the viral aspect > seems to be a missing link,

as the protocol/herbs mostly address bacterial > infections, and my

son has quite a load of Measles, Rubella, EBV, and CMV. > Fifthly,

my son's gut continues to be quite messy - indigestion and diarrhea

> occur now and then.

A lot of doubts there, and I can understand your concerns. We see

Dr Derksen (who trained under Klinghardt) and she muscle tests via

ART. She is also a believer in the Cowden herbs. My son was

determined by ART to have: Rubella, Strep, and Lyme as key

stressors. She wants him on Cumanda and Samento, but instead of

alternating these, she has prescribed them each daily, one in AM and

one in afternoon. This is for Lyme and Strep. For Strep also she

prescribed Transfer Factor STP by Researched Nutritionals. And for

Rubella she prescribed a homeopathic called SOMMR (presumably

effective for mumps and measles too). These are part of a larger

Biofilm protocol where we are using Virastop and EDTA along with a

bit of Lauricidin, and also Uva Ursi. And our binder is Cholacol II.

So a little different than the Cowden protocol but with some of the

Cowden herbs mixed in. I have not strarted the new protocol yet, so

we will have to see how it goes. I proabably won't have my products

for a week or more.

>

> In general, I often have doubts on the long-term use of anti-

microbial, as > it suppresses the bugs instead of working on

awakening the immune system.

Yes I see it as a temporary measure to get the pathogenic load down

to give the immune system some relief. At the same time you also

are doing other measures to strengthen the immune system (diet,

colostrum, transfer factors, other immune modulators, etc.)

> Early last year, I moved away from Yasko's gut herb protocol to

sequential > homeopathy for this very reason.

Who are you wroking with for sequential? Whose protocol?

At the first LIA conference last year, I > realized that my son

might have Borreliosis and decided to set aside > sequential

homeopathy and give Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol a try. So far, we

> love LED but feel ambivalent about NutriMedix herbs. I hope

someone in this > group who has used the herbs extensively can

provide some feedback and > guidance.

I hope we can find some others to comment on their experience witht

he Cowden herbs. There are probably a lot of adults on his protocol

on the various Lyme lists no doubt. I really don't know of any kids

with autism currently seeing him except I think a guy named Emanuele

from 's group took his son to him a year or 2 ago, but am not

sure if he is still with him or not.

I am looking to true clasical homeopathy as an adjunct to what we

are doing. Thinking of seeing Dr Luc actually.

Beth

[Guest guest]

Hi Heidi,

Thanks for your reply.

" I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far. "

Was that on yourself or your child(ren)?

" Right now we are on Resveratrol as Buhner promotes, and I am

seeing improvements in social activity and happiness. As a matter

of fact, I ran out and some symptoms returned of depressed mood

and less socially active. "

Heidi, if you want to buy some unopened bottles of Resveratrol

(Source Naturals brand) at a discount call me. We did the Buhner

protocol with some success last summer prior to seeing Dr Derksen

for energy testing of supplemetns, and I still have a couple

unopened bottles in stock. PM me if interested. We ran into

trouble with andrographis I beleive but resveratrol was a good one,

but was equivocal when energy tested. She prefered the cat's claw

for my son, and is actually moving him from Raintree capsules to

Samento tinture now. I do like the Buhner protocol though, and how

much he has written to back up his protocol and that he has a q & a

board available.

" I did try Samento (both Buhner and Cowden promote Samento) for a

day without the Resveratrol and it also seemed to help. I am now

taking both samento and Resveratrol, myself only, to see what would

happen. Well I am a little dizzy, so that is herxing for me. It

makes me quite happy. If I am herxing, then that means the critters

are dying instead of hiding. But I also have Bartonella, so it

could be from them dying. One can't know at this point. "

Do you find that the Burbur helps with the herxing? I see you

posted that it helps with your energy and concentration. But not so

much with the dizziness? Do you find your children herxing too? If

so, what are their herx symptoms? Do you also give them Burbur?

Dr Derkesn is putting on Samento, Cumanda, Burbur, for lyme

(and strep) as well as Transfer Factor STP by Researched

Nutritionals (for strep) and Phospholipid Exchange (an oral solution

of disodium EDTA and phospholipids) as well as keeping him on

Virastop adn Uva Ursi. So we will be attacking these pathogens with

a biofilm protocol approach. A little different than the Cowden

protocol but using a few of his products.

I will let you know how it goes.

She owuld also like to get after the MMR, specifically Rubella with

a homeopathic remedy called SOMMR, but we are liely movign to

classical homeopathy with Dr Luc soon, so need to see what he says

about the remedy first. I doubt he will like it as he is a

classical homeopath.

Beth

[Guest guest]

Beth, Heidi,

I just want to provide you with a bit more information on Burbur. Dr. Lee

Cowden usually recommends Burbur to go with any kind of anti-microbial

protocol, in order to reduce herxing reactions induced by anti-microbial

herbs. He actually suggests that when herxing symptoms intensify, take 8

drops of Burbur 8 times a day until the symptoms are relieved, and then drop

to twice a day.

Limin

Re:Any successes with Cowden

protocol?

> Hi Heidi,

>

> Thanks for your reply.

>

> " I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far. "

>

> Was that on yourself or your child(ren)?

>

> " Right now we are on Resveratrol as Buhner promotes, and I am

> seeing improvements in social activity and happiness. As a matter

> of fact, I ran out and some symptoms returned of depressed mood

> and less socially active. "

>

> Heidi, if you want to buy some unopened bottles of Resveratrol

> (Source Naturals brand) at a discount call me. We did the Buhner

> protocol with some success last summer prior to seeing Dr Derksen

> for energy testing of supplemetns, and I still have a couple

> unopened bottles in stock. PM me if interested. We ran into

> trouble with andrographis I beleive but resveratrol was a good one,

> but was equivocal when energy tested. She prefered the cat's claw

> for my son, and is actually moving him from Raintree capsules to

> Samento tinture now. I do like the Buhner protocol though, and how

> much he has written to back up his protocol and that he has a q & a

> board available.

>

> " I did try Samento (both Buhner and Cowden promote Samento) for a

> day without the Resveratrol and it also seemed to help. I am now

> taking both samento and Resveratrol, myself only, to see what would

> happen. Well I am a little dizzy, so that is herxing for me. It

> makes me quite happy. If I am herxing, then that means the critters

> are dying instead of hiding. But I also have Bartonella, so it

> could be from them dying. One can't know at this point. "

>

> Do you find that the Burbur helps with the herxing? I see you

> posted that it helps with your energy and concentration. But not so

> much with the dizziness? Do you find your children herxing too? If

> so, what are their herx symptoms? Do you also give them Burbur?

>

> Dr Derkesn is putting on Samento, Cumanda, Burbur, for lyme

> (and strep) as well as Transfer Factor STP by Researched

> Nutritionals (for strep) and Phospholipid Exchange (an oral solution

> of disodium EDTA and phospholipids) as well as keeping him on

> Virastop adn Uva Ursi. So we will be attacking these pathogens with

> a biofilm protocol approach. A little different than the Cowden

> protocol but using a few of his products.

>

> I will let you know how it goes.

>

> She owuld also like to get after the MMR, specifically Rubella with

> a homeopathic remedy called SOMMR, but we are liely movign to

> classical homeopathy with Dr Luc soon, so need to see what he says

> about the remedy first. I doubt he will like it as he is a

> classical homeopath.

>

> Beth

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Limen,

Thank you!! It is on order with the Cumanda and Samento. What do

herxing reactions look liek in your child?

Beth

>

> Beth, Heidi,

>

> I just want to provide you with a bit more information on Burbur.

Dr. Lee

> Cowden usually recommends Burbur to go with any kind of anti-

microbial

> protocol, in order to reduce herxing reactions induced by anti-

microbial

> herbs. He actually suggests that when herxing symptoms intensify,

take 8

> drops of Burbur 8 times a day until the symptoms are relieved, and

then drop

> to twice a day.

>

> Limin

>

> Re:Any successes

with Cowden

> protocol?

>

>

> > Hi Heidi,

> >

> > Thanks for your reply.

> >

> > " I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far. "

> >

> > Was that on yourself or your child(ren)?

> >

> > " Right now we are on Resveratrol as Buhner promotes, and I am

> > seeing improvements in social activity and happiness. As a

matter

> > of fact, I ran out and some symptoms returned of depressed mood

> > and less socially active. "

> >

> > Heidi, if you want to buy some unopened bottles of Resveratrol

> > (Source Naturals brand) at a discount call me. We did the Buhner

> > protocol with some success last summer prior to seeing Dr Derksen

> > for energy testing of supplemetns, and I still have a couple

> > unopened bottles in stock. PM me if interested. We ran into

> > trouble with andrographis I beleive but resveratrol was a good

one,

> > but was equivocal when energy tested. She prefered the cat's

claw

> > for my son, and is actually moving him from Raintree capsules to

> > Samento tinture now. I do like the Buhner protocol though, and

how

> > much he has written to back up his protocol and that he has a q & a

> > board available.

> >

> > " I did try Samento (both Buhner and Cowden promote Samento) for

a

> > day without the Resveratrol and it also seemed to help. I am

now

> > taking both samento and Resveratrol, myself only, to see what

would

> > happen. Well I am a little dizzy, so that is herxing for me. It

> > makes me quite happy. If I am herxing, then that means the

critters

> > are dying instead of hiding. But I also have Bartonella, so it

> > could be from them dying. One can't know at this point. "

> >

> > Do you find that the Burbur helps with the herxing? I see you

> > posted that it helps with your energy and concentration. But

not so

> > much with the dizziness? Do you find your children herxing

too? If

> > so, what are their herx symptoms? Do you also give them Burbur?

> >

> > Dr Derkesn is putting on Samento, Cumanda, Burbur, for

lyme

> > (and strep) as well as Transfer Factor STP by Researched

> > Nutritionals (for strep) and Phospholipid Exchange (an oral

solution

> > of disodium EDTA and phospholipids) as well as keeping him on

> > Virastop adn Uva Ursi. So we will be attacking these pathogens

with

> > a biofilm protocol approach. A little different than the Cowden

> > protocol but using a few of his products.

> >

> > I will let you know how it goes.

> >

> > She owuld also like to get after the MMR, specifically Rubella

with

> > a homeopathic remedy called SOMMR, but we are liely movign to

> > classical homeopathy with Dr Luc soon, so need to see what he

says

> > about the remedy first. I doubt he will like it as he is a

> > classical homeopath.

> >

> > Beth

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Beth,

This is the thing - my son's not having herxing reactions to Cumanda and

Banderol makes me doubt the effectiveness of the herbs. Dr. Lee Cowden gave

us his recommendation as precaution. I did put my son on 8 drops of Burbur

4 times a day for 7 days in a low, when we first introduced VRM4 for

intracellular, microscopic parasites. Because 2 moms from UK told me that

their children regressed on VRM, I wanted to be cautious when using it. My

son did not herx on VRM4 either. He is a non-responder or slow-responder to

most of the things I tried, except for LED. We also had some success in the

past when on high dose vitamin A, L-lysine and Vitamin C. This tells me

that viral load is a problem for us. This is why I want to give LDM100 a

try. Have you had some experience with LDM100? Thanks.

Limin

Re:Any successes

> with Cowden

>> protocol?

>>

>>

>> > Hi Heidi,

>> >

>> > Thanks for your reply.

>> >

>> > " I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far. "

>> >

>> > Was that on yourself or your child(ren)?

>> >

>> > " Right now we are on Resveratrol as Buhner promotes, and I am

>> > seeing improvements in social activity and happiness. As a

> matter

>> > of fact, I ran out and some symptoms returned of depressed mood

>> > and less socially active. "

>> >

>> > Heidi, if you want to buy some unopened bottles of Resveratrol

>> > (Source Naturals brand) at a discount call me. We did the Buhner

>> > protocol with some success last summer prior to seeing Dr Derksen

>> > for energy testing of supplemetns, and I still have a couple

>> > unopened bottles in stock. PM me if interested. We ran into

>> > trouble with andrographis I beleive but resveratrol was a good

> one,

>> > but was equivocal when energy tested. She prefered the cat's

> claw

>> > for my son, and is actually moving him from Raintree capsules to

>> > Samento tinture now. I do like the Buhner protocol though, and

> how

>> > much he has written to back up his protocol and that he has a q & a

>> > board available.

>> >

>> > " I did try Samento (both Buhner and Cowden promote Samento) for

> a

>> > day without the Resveratrol and it also seemed to help. I am

> now

>> > taking both samento and Resveratrol, myself only, to see what

> would

>> > happen. Well I am a little dizzy, so that is herxing for me. It

>> > makes me quite happy. If I am herxing, then that means the

> critters

>> > are dying instead of hiding. But I also have Bartonella, so it

>> > could be from them dying. One can't know at this point. "

>> >

>> > Do you find that the Burbur helps with the herxing? I see you

>> > posted that it helps with your energy and concentration. But

> not so

>> > much with the dizziness? Do you find your children herxing

> too? If

>> > so, what are their herx symptoms? Do you also give them Burbur?

>> >

>> > Dr Derkesn is putting on Samento, Cumanda, Burbur, for

> lyme

>> > (and strep) as well as Transfer Factor STP by Researched

>> > Nutritionals (for strep) and Phospholipid Exchange (an oral

> solution

>> > of disodium EDTA and phospholipids) as well as keeping him on

>> > Virastop adn Uva Ursi. So we will be attacking these pathogens

> with

>> > a biofilm protocol approach. A little different than the Cowden

>> > protocol but using a few of his products.

>> >

>> > I will let you know how it goes.

>> >

>> > She owuld also like to get after the MMR, specifically Rubella

> with

>> > a homeopathic remedy called SOMMR, but we are liely movign to

>> > classical homeopathy with Dr Luc soon, so need to see what he

> says

>> > about the remedy first. I doubt he will like it as he is a

>> > classical homeopath.

>> >

>> > Beth

>> >

>> >

>> > ------------------------------------

>> >

>> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Limen,

Yes I suspect my child is a viral kid too. (he is also no doubt a

big bacterial kid as well), and has had protozoa in the past. Thsu

why I am on this list! Here is why I think he is a viral kid:

1. He rarely gets sick, but..

2. When he does gets a fever which is rare, his ASD symptoms

improve quite a bit, better social connectivity, better eye contact,

language, lower stims, lower aggitation, lower OCD, lower anxiety.

3. He regressed terribly after the MMR/Varicella, and had

subsequent clinical bowel disease as a result. Scoped by Krigsman

and found to have " marked colitis " at age 4.

4. He received 3 separate immunizations within a year and a half

period between ages 2 months and 18 months of a 5-in-one vaccine

called Pentocel containing ACT-HIB, DTaP, and Polio. (Haemophilus

influenzae type b (HIB), diptheria, Tetnus, Pertussis, and Polio)

all wrapped up into one lovely (not!!) shot.

5. He has been laregly a non or poor responder to DAN stuff

including chelation. Diets have however made a difference in him,

especially allergy rotation diets, whole foods, high nutrient

density diets, eliminating allergenic foods.

6. Amy Derksen via ART determined his big remaining issues are

Strep, Lyme, and RUBELLA.

7. He broke out in an all over 4 day body rash that looked like

measles on LDM-100. He also got a fever on it and while feverish,

ASD symptoms resolved. Yes, we went to see Dr Kampol and he put him

on this. He stayed on it for 2 months, and then Dr Derksen said it

wasn;t needed anymore (ART testing).

8. His pattern has been one of waxing and waning, 4 steps forward

and 3 steps backward.

Limen, do you think that your prophylactic use of Burbur has

prevented the herx reactions you were hoping to see as evidence of

die off? Am I misunderstanding your post about Burbur -did you only

use it with the VRM, or did you also use it prophylactically with

the Cowden herbs?

When we start the Cowden herbs, we will definitely give the Burbur.

This along wiht the other binder I have in place which is Cholacol

II (bentonite clay, collisonia root, and purified bile salts. I

give it twice a day on an empty stomach about 2 hours after the

herbs. http://www.becomehealthynow.com/supps/cholacolii.shtml

Other ideas. What about working on breaking down the biofilm prior

to giving the herbs? We are using Virastop as the enzyme along with

Chewable EDTA to help punch holes inthe biofilm and bind to released

metals. Going to alternate this with Phospholipid exchange which

also contains EDTA. Maybe the biofilm is preventing the Cowden

herbs from reaching the pathogens?

Alos, have you used any other natural antivirals? We have or have

had in our arsenal: Virastop, Olive Leaf Extract, Lauricidin, Cat's

Claw, and high dose A. I know you have used high dose A and

lysine, but what about the others? Again, with biofilm breakdown.

Have you ever considered classical homeopathy?

Beth

[Guest guest]

Hi Heidi,Thanks for your reply."I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far."Was that on yourself or your child(ren)?

Heidi's Answer: I and two children just started Samento. I am now exploring Burbur with juice, and have just started with some of my children.

Do you find that the Burbur helps with the herxing? I see you posted that it helps with your energy and concentration. But not so much with the dizziness? Do you find your children herxing too? If so, what are their herx symptoms? Do you also give them Burbur?

Heidi's Answer: I was only dizzy the one day. When I took more Burbur, it did go away. My children seem to have a slight increase in irritability or anger. I just started one child on Burbur, thus, I need more time to answer that question.

Dr Derkesn is putting on Samento, Cumanda, Burbur, for lyme (and strep) as well as Transfer Factor STP by Researched Nutritionals (for strep) and Phospholipid Exchange (an oral solution of disodium EDTA and phospholipids) as well as keeping him on Virastop adn Uva Ursi. So we will be attacking these pathogens with a biofilm protocol approach. A little different than the Cowden protocol but using a few of his products.I will let you know how it goes.She owuld also like to get after the MMR, specifically Rubella with a homeopathic remedy called SOMMR, but we are liely movign to classical homeopathy with Dr Luc soon, so need to see what he says about the remedy first. I doubt he will like it as he is a classical homeopath.Beth

Heidi's answer: It sounds like you have a good doc. I am happy to see such good treatment. Thanks for sharing. I am doing so well on the Resveratrol and Samento (Cat's Claw) that I just may continue this treatment for awhile to see what happens. Right now I am basking in the refreshing feeling that my pathogens are dying (at least some of them).

Heidi NPlanning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.

[Guest guest]

Ok, not Beth here, but just want to add that I actually have some LDM100 in my cupboard right now. I am not sure when I will take the plunge and use it. I guess I am working on getting used to the Samento right now. Any information you want to share on using the LDM100?

Heidi N

"Have you had some experience with LDM100? Thanks.Limin"Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides.

[Guest guest]

limin, Dr. Cowden had prescribed building up to 15 drops of either Cumanda or

Samento

(keep in mind that my son weighs less than forty pounds) to be taken on a empty

stomach

before breakfast and dinner. For some reason he told me to give the Cumanda

straight

instead of in water. We have experienced very challenging herxing in this

protocol...

Like explained in her posts the protocol is very detailed oriented and

highly

individualized. For instance there is a lot of attention as far as the timing

and grouping

of all these supplements and it took some time to have it all figured out and

organized in

a daily routine...

Emanuele

> >>

> >> Beth, Heidi,

> >>

> >> I just want to provide you with a bit more information on Burbur.

> > Dr. Lee

> >> Cowden usually recommends Burbur to go with any kind of anti-

> > microbial

> >> protocol, in order to reduce herxing reactions induced by anti-

> > microbial

> >> herbs. He actually suggests that when herxing symptoms intensify,

> > take 8

> >> drops of Burbur 8 times a day until the symptoms are relieved, and

> > then drop

> >> to twice a day.

> >>

> >> Limin

> >>

> >> Re:Any successes

> > with Cowden

> >> protocol?

> >>

> >>

> >> > Hi Heidi,

> >> >

> >> > Thanks for your reply.

> >> >

> >> > " I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far. "

> >> >

> >> > Was that on yourself or your child(ren)?

> >> >

> >> > " Right now we are on Resveratrol as Buhner promotes, and I am

> >> > seeing improvements in social activity and happiness. As a

> > matter

> >> > of fact, I ran out and some symptoms returned of depressed mood

> >> > and less socially active. "

> >> >

> >> > Heidi, if you want to buy some unopened bottles of Resveratrol

> >> > (Source Naturals brand) at a discount call me. We did the Buhner

> >> > protocol with some success last summer prior to seeing Dr Derksen

> >> > for energy testing of supplemetns, and I still have a couple

> >> > unopened bottles in stock. PM me if interested. We ran into

> >> > trouble with andrographis I beleive but resveratrol was a good

> > one,

> >> > but was equivocal when energy tested. She prefered the cat's

> > claw

> >> > for my son, and is actually moving him from Raintree capsules to

> >> > Samento tinture now. I do like the Buhner protocol though, and

> > how

> >> > much he has written to back up his protocol and that he has a q & a

> >> > board available.

> >> >

> >> > " I did try Samento (both Buhner and Cowden promote Samento) for

> > a

> >> > day without the Resveratrol and it also seemed to help. I am

> > now

> >> > taking both samento and Resveratrol, myself only, to see what

> > would

> >> > happen. Well I am a little dizzy, so that is herxing for me. It

> >> > makes me quite happy. If I am herxing, then that means the

> > critters

> >> > are dying instead of hiding. But I also have Bartonella, so it

> >> > could be from them dying. One can't know at this point. "

> >> >

> >> > Do you find that the Burbur helps with the herxing? I see you

> >> > posted that it helps with your energy and concentration. But

> > not so

> >> > much with the dizziness? Do you find your children herxing

> > too? If

> >> > so, what are their herx symptoms? Do you also give them Burbur?

> >> >

> >> > Dr Derkesn is putting on Samento, Cumanda, Burbur, for

> > lyme

> >> > (and strep) as well as Transfer Factor STP by Researched

> >> > Nutritionals (for strep) and Phospholipid Exchange (an oral

> > solution

> >> > of disodium EDTA and phospholipids) as well as keeping him on

> >> > Virastop adn Uva Ursi. So we will be attacking these pathogens

> > with

> >> > a biofilm protocol approach. A little different than the Cowden

> >> > protocol but using a few of his products.

> >> >

> >> > I will let you know how it goes.

> >> >

> >> > She owuld also like to get after the MMR, specifically Rubella

> > with

> >> > a homeopathic remedy called SOMMR, but we are liely movign to

> >> > classical homeopathy with Dr Luc soon, so need to see what he

> > says

> >> > about the remedy first. I doubt he will like it as he is a

> >> > classical homeopath.

> >> >

> >> > Beth

> >> >

> >> >

> >> > ------------------------------------

> >> >

> >> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Beth,

Thank you for the link to the product information of Cholacol II. I have

not done any colon support for quite some time. It is about time for us to

do a spring cleanse.

We are also on a revised version of biofilm protocol. We do not use NaEDTA,

which my son reacts badly. Here are the things we use:

- Enzymes: Lambrokinase, Virastop, Mucostop, and Candex.

- Rotating anti-fungal at 4-day intervals to treat Candida: Biocidin,

Allimax (garlic), Goldenseal, Uva Ursi (in Organic Lavage), and Oil of

Oregano.

- Rotating Lyme herbs: Banderol and Cumanda for 12 days on with a 36-hour

break.

- Caprylic Acid with Psyllium stem/seed powder to treat Klebsiella.

- Rotating Quina and Samando to treat Strep bacteria. (Samando is more

effective than Quina in this regard, as Samando works on most strains of

Strep, whereas Quina works on some.)

- PectaSol Chelation Complex to mop up toxins released by fungal/bacterial

die-off and metal toxins in the gut.

- Chelate with low dose ALA/DMSA and NDF (Chlorrela) on Andy Cutler's

schedule.

My son is also on a " fat cocktail " , as we call it in our household. The

cocktail contains PC, PS, vitamin A, vitamin D, vitamin K, Black Currant

Oil, DMAE, Grape Seed PCO Phytosome, L-Carnitine, Pentothenic Acid, and

Folic Acid. I have been chelating my son for two years. When metal toxins

come out, they tear apart the cell membranes to come out. And the cells

will need time to repair. I found supplementing with the lipid cocktail we

created help my son in repairing the cell membranes and maintaining cell

membrane fluidity. Dr. Amy Yakso once comments that if the cell membranes

are rigid, the transmission of intercellular signals will be poor.

Maintaining a good level of cell membrance fluidity helps in cell-to-cell

communication.

It is possible that, as you suggested, Burbur might have been prophylactical

for us. I read about Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol in the mid year 2007 and

right away started supplementing my son with Burbur and Pinella (detoxing

MSG and glutamate) for about a half year, prior to taking my son to see him

in order to get an Asyra screening. My son has also been using Methyl B12

injections, reduced Glutathione in low dose, and homeopathic organ drainage.

Perhaps all these supplements have prepared his detox organs for the

powerful anti-microbial, anti-parasitic herbs. When starting VRM4, I

increased Burbur from twice a day to 4 times a day for the initial 7 days,

and then dropped back to twice a day.

However, it is also possible that my son's chronic lyme is mostly in the

form of cell-wall-deficient bacteria, which the herbs cannot effectively

attack, because they work most effecitvely in killing off spirachetes. In

the beginning of 2007, we did a live blood analysis on my son. Observing

from a dark field microscopy, we found that his blood exhibits an unusually

high level of plaque-like, unassimilated materials collectively referred to

as symplatsts. Many of these can be explained in terms of poor nutrient

utilization, gut dysbiosisi, chronic immune challenges and inflammatory

conditions. Furthermore, the researcher who did the analysis told us that

some of these symplasts strongly resemble markers for cell-wall-deficient

bacteria also known as stealth pathogens. My son had one tick bite instance

in early 2005. Not until we met with this researcher did we realize the

significance of that tick bite and its insult on his already

vaccines/metals-weaken immune system. Unfortunately, he is a tick charmer

and got another two tick bite instances in 2007.

I started sequential homeopathy right after the live blood screening. The

researcher was also a trainer who teaches sequential/isopahtic homeopathy

practitioners to use live blood screening as diagnostic tool. I initially

learned from him and took off to choose remedies on my own according to my

observation of my son's prognosis. My son had initial bacterial die-off and

had very bad diarrhea and lost of appetite for about 3 weeks. Then his

diarrhea cleared up, good appeitite bounced back, and he was happy, alert,

calm, and produced the best stools (in terms of color, texture, and shape)

we have even had during our close-to 3 years of biomed journey. I did

sequential homeopathy about 5, 6 months. Gradually choosing appropriate

remedies became more and more difficult for me. As I am not a registered or

licensed healthcare provider, valid information on products and protocols

and training materials are not readily accessible. At the same time I

learned more about Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol, so I set sequential homeopathy

aside and took my son to receive LED. I always think that sequential

homeopathy is worthy of revisit.

I am now considering consulting with Coyle

(http://www.childrensexcelcenter.com/doctors.html). She is a

homotoxicologist, and she is all about detox. I want to collect some

parents' feedback on her first. I am also waiting for my son's IgeneX test

result and will take it from there.

Appoligize for this long post. Thank you for reading.

Limin

Re:Any successes with Cowden

protocol?

> Hi Limen,

>

> Yes I suspect my child is a viral kid too. (he is also no doubt a

> big bacterial kid as well), and has had protozoa in the past. Thsu

> why I am on this list! Here is why I think he is a viral kid:

>

> 1. He rarely gets sick, but..

>

> 2. When he does gets a fever which is rare, his ASD symptoms

> improve quite a bit, better social connectivity, better eye contact,

> language, lower stims, lower aggitation, lower OCD, lower anxiety.

>

> 3. He regressed terribly after the MMR/Varicella, and had

> subsequent clinical bowel disease as a result. Scoped by Krigsman

> and found to have " marked colitis " at age 4.

>

> 4. He received 3 separate immunizations within a year and a half

> period between ages 2 months and 18 months of a 5-in-one vaccine

> called Pentocel containing ACT-HIB, DTaP, and Polio. (Haemophilus

> influenzae type b (HIB), diptheria, Tetnus, Pertussis, and Polio)

> all wrapped up into one lovely (not!!) shot.

>

> 5. He has been laregly a non or poor responder to DAN stuff

> including chelation. Diets have however made a difference in him,

> especially allergy rotation diets, whole foods, high nutrient

> density diets, eliminating allergenic foods.

>

> 6. Amy Derksen via ART determined his big remaining issues are

> Strep, Lyme, and RUBELLA.

>

> 7. He broke out in an all over 4 day body rash that looked like

> measles on LDM-100. He also got a fever on it and while feverish,

> ASD symptoms resolved. Yes, we went to see Dr Kampol and he put him

> on this. He stayed on it for 2 months, and then Dr Derksen said it

> wasn;t needed anymore (ART testing).

>

> 8. His pattern has been one of waxing and waning, 4 steps forward

> and 3 steps backward.

>

> Limen, do you think that your prophylactic use of Burbur has

> prevented the herx reactions you were hoping to see as evidence of

> die off? Am I misunderstanding your post about Burbur -did you only

> use it with the VRM, or did you also use it prophylactically with

> the Cowden herbs?

>

> When we start the Cowden herbs, we will definitely give the Burbur.

> This along wiht the other binder I have in place which is Cholacol

> II (bentonite clay, collisonia root, and purified bile salts. I

> give it twice a day on an empty stomach about 2 hours after the

> herbs. http://www.becomehealthynow.com/supps/cholacolii.shtml

>

> Other ideas. What about working on breaking down the biofilm prior

> to giving the herbs? We are using Virastop as the enzyme along with

> Chewable EDTA to help punch holes inthe biofilm and bind to released

> metals. Going to alternate this with Phospholipid exchange which

> also contains EDTA. Maybe the biofilm is preventing the Cowden

> herbs from reaching the pathogens?

>

> Alos, have you used any other natural antivirals? We have or have

> had in our arsenal: Virastop, Olive Leaf Extract, Lauricidin, Cat's

> Claw, and high dose A. I know you have used high dose A and

> lysine, but what about the others? Again, with biofilm breakdown.

>

> Have you ever considered classical homeopathy?

>

> Beth

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Emanuele,

Thank you for sharing. We are rotating 30 drops of Cumanda and Banderol

each. My son is about 47 pounds.

Are you still on this herbal protocol? Have NutriMedix herbs completely

wiped out Borreliosis for you? Any test followed up to confirm? What

improvements and gains have you observed in your child? Did you implement

any other protocols at the same time when using the herbs? Thanks again.

Limin

Re:Any successes

>> > with Cowden

>> >> protocol?

>> >>

>> >>

>> >> > Hi Heidi,

>> >> >

>> >> > Thanks for your reply.

>> >> >

>> >> > " I have tried Samento and Burbur with very good results so far. "

>> >> >

>> >> > Was that on yourself or your child(ren)?

>> >> >

>> >> > " Right now we are on Resveratrol as Buhner promotes, and I am

>> >> > seeing improvements in social activity and happiness. As a

>> > matter

>> >> > of fact, I ran out and some symptoms returned of depressed mood

>> >> > and less socially active. "

>> >> >

>> >> > Heidi, if you want to buy some unopened bottles of Resveratrol

>> >> > (Source Naturals brand) at a discount call me. We did the Buhner

>> >> > protocol with some success last summer prior to seeing Dr Derksen

>> >> > for energy testing of supplemetns, and I still have a couple

>> >> > unopened bottles in stock. PM me if interested. We ran into

>> >> > trouble with andrographis I beleive but resveratrol was a good

>> > one,

>> >> > but was equivocal when energy tested. She prefered the cat's

>> > claw

>> >> > for my son, and is actually moving him from Raintree capsules to

>> >> > Samento tinture now. I do like the Buhner protocol though, and

>> > how

>> >> > much he has written to back up his protocol and that he has a q & a

>> >> > board available.

>> >> >

>> >> > " I did try Samento (both Buhner and Cowden promote Samento) for

>> > a

>> >> > day without the Resveratrol and it also seemed to help. I am

>> > now

>> >> > taking both samento and Resveratrol, myself only, to see what

>> > would

>> >> > happen. Well I am a little dizzy, so that is herxing for me. It

>> >> > makes me quite happy. If I am herxing, then that means the

>> > critters

>> >> > are dying instead of hiding. But I also have Bartonella, so it

>> >> > could be from them dying. One can't know at this point. "

>> >> >

>> >> > Do you find that the Burbur helps with the herxing? I see you

>> >> > posted that it helps with your energy and concentration. But

>> > not so

>> >> > much with the dizziness? Do you find your children herxing

>> > too? If

>> >> > so, what are their herx symptoms? Do you also give them Burbur?

>> >> >

>> >> > Dr Derkesn is putting on Samento, Cumanda, Burbur, for

>> > lyme

>> >> > (and strep) as well as Transfer Factor STP by Researched

>> >> > Nutritionals (for strep) and Phospholipid Exchange (an oral

>> > solution

>> >> > of disodium EDTA and phospholipids) as well as keeping him on

>> >> > Virastop adn Uva Ursi. So we will be attacking these pathogens

>> > with

>> >> > a biofilm protocol approach. A little different than the Cowden

>> >> > protocol but using a few of his products.

>> >> >

>> >> > I will let you know how it goes.

>> >> >

>> >> > She owuld also like to get after the MMR, specifically Rubella

>> > with

>> >> > a homeopathic remedy called SOMMR, but we are liely movign to

>> >> > classical homeopathy with Dr Luc soon, so need to see what he

>> > says

>> >> > about the remedy first. I doubt he will like it as he is a

>> >> > classical homeopath.

>> >> >

>> >> > Beth

>> >> >

>> >> >

>> >> > ------------------------------------

>> >> >

>> >> >

[Guest guest]

Limen,

Wow, you certainly have a lot going on, and have a lot of

knowledge. Are you currently under the care of a doc, where you can

bounce some of your ideas and questions off of? What about Dr

Cowden? What does he have to say about this point in the road with

your son?

Is he just a see him once doctor and you are on your own? Or does

he follow up with the long course of ups and downs?

Beth

>

> Hi Beth,

>

> Thank you for the link to the product information of Cholacol II.

I have

> not done any colon support for quite some time. It is about time

for us to

> do a spring cleanse.

>

> We are also on a revised version of biofilm protocol. We do not

use NaEDTA,

> which my son reacts badly. Here are the things we use:

>

> - Enzymes: Lambrokinase, Virastop, Mucostop, and Candex.

> - Rotating anti-fungal at 4-day intervals to treat Candida:

Biocidin,

> Allimax (garlic), Goldenseal, Uva Ursi (in Organic Lavage), and

Oil of

> Oregano.

> - Rotating Lyme herbs: Banderol and Cumanda for 12 days on with

a 36-hour

> break.

> - Caprylic Acid with Psyllium stem/seed powder to treat

Klebsiella.

> - Rotating Quina and Samando to treat Strep bacteria. (Samando is

more

> effective than Quina in this regard, as Samando works on most

strains of

> Strep, whereas Quina works on some.)

> - PectaSol Chelation Complex to mop up toxins released by

fungal/bacterial

> die-off and metal toxins in the gut.

> - Chelate with low dose ALA/DMSA and NDF (Chlorrela) on Andy

Cutler's

> schedule.

>

> My son is also on a " fat cocktail " , as we call it in our

household. The

> cocktail contains PC, PS, vitamin A, vitamin D, vitamin K, Black

Currant

> Oil, DMAE, Grape Seed PCO Phytosome, L-Carnitine, Pentothenic

Acid, and

> Folic Acid. I have been chelating my son for two years. When

metal toxins

> come out, they tear apart the cell membranes to come out. And the

cells

> will need time to repair. I found supplementing with the lipid

cocktail we

> created help my son in repairing the cell membranes and

maintaining cell

> membrane fluidity. Dr. Amy Yakso once comments that if the cell

membranes

> are rigid, the transmission of intercellular signals will be poor.

> Maintaining a good level of cell membrance fluidity helps in cell-

to-cell

> communication.

>

> It is possible that, as you suggested, Burbur might have been

prophylactical

> for us. I read about Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol in the mid year

2007 and

> right away started supplementing my son with Burbur and Pinella

(detoxing

> MSG and glutamate) for about a half year, prior to taking my son

to see him

> in order to get an Asyra screening. My son has also been using

Methyl B12

> injections, reduced Glutathione in low dose, and homeopathic organ

drainage.

> Perhaps all these supplements have prepared his detox organs for

the

> powerful anti-microbial, anti-parasitic herbs. When starting

VRM4, I

> increased Burbur from twice a day to 4 times a day for the initial

7 days,

> and then dropped back to twice a day.

>

> However, it is also possible that my son's chronic lyme is mostly

in the

> form of cell-wall-deficient bacteria, which the herbs cannot

effectively

> attack, because they work most effecitvely in killing off

spirachetes. In

> the beginning of 2007, we did a live blood analysis on my son.

Observing

> from a dark field microscopy, we found that his blood exhibits an

unusually

> high level of plaque-like, unassimilated materials collectively

referred to

> as symplatsts. Many of these can be explained in terms of poor

nutrient

> utilization, gut dysbiosisi, chronic immune challenges and

inflammatory

> conditions. Furthermore, the researcher who did the analysis told

us that

> some of these symplasts strongly resemble markers for cell-wall-

deficient

> bacteria also known as stealth pathogens. My son had one tick

bite instance

> in early 2005. Not until we met with this researcher did we

realize the

> significance of that tick bite and its insult on his already

> vaccines/metals-weaken immune system. Unfortunately, he is a tick

charmer

> and got another two tick bite instances in 2007.

>

> I started sequential homeopathy right after the live blood

screening. The

> researcher was also a trainer who teaches sequential/isopahtic

homeopathy

> practitioners to use live blood screening as diagnostic tool. I

initially

> learned from him and took off to choose remedies on my own

according to my

> observation of my son's prognosis. My son had initial bacterial

die-off and

> had very bad diarrhea and lost of appetite for about 3 weeks.

Then his

> diarrhea cleared up, good appeitite bounced back, and he was

happy, alert,

> calm, and produced the best stools (in terms of color, texture,

and shape)

> we have even had during our close-to 3 years of biomed journey. I

did

> sequential homeopathy about 5, 6 months. Gradually choosing

appropriate

> remedies became more and more difficult for me. As I am not a

registered or

> licensed healthcare provider, valid information on products and

protocols

> and training materials are not readily accessible. At the same

time I

> learned more about Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol, so I set sequential

homeopathy

> aside and took my son to receive LED. I always think that

sequential

> homeopathy is worthy of revisit.

>

> I am now considering consulting with Coyle

> (http://www.childrensexcelcenter.com/doctors.html). She is a

> homotoxicologist, and she is all about detox. I want to collect

some

> parents' feedback on her first. I am also waiting for my son's

IgeneX test

> result and will take it from there.

>

> Appoligize for this long post. Thank you for reading.

>

> Limin

>

>

> Re:Any successes

with Cowden

> protocol?

>

>

> > Hi Limen,

> >

> > Yes I suspect my child is a viral kid too. (he is also no doubt

a

> > big bacterial kid as well), and has had protozoa in the past.

Thsu

> > why I am on this list! Here is why I think he is a viral kid:

> >

> > 1. He rarely gets sick, but..

> >

> > 2. When he does gets a fever which is rare, his ASD symptoms

> > improve quite a bit, better social connectivity, better eye

contact,

> > language, lower stims, lower aggitation, lower OCD, lower

anxiety.

> >

> > 3. He regressed terribly after the MMR/Varicella, and had

> > subsequent clinical bowel disease as a result. Scoped by

Krigsman

> > and found to have " marked colitis " at age 4.

> >

> > 4. He received 3 separate immunizations within a year and a half

> > period between ages 2 months and 18 months of a 5-in-one vaccine

> > called Pentocel containing ACT-HIB, DTaP, and Polio. (Haemophilus

> > influenzae type b (HIB), diptheria, Tetnus, Pertussis, and Polio)

> > all wrapped up into one lovely (not!!) shot.

> >

> > 5. He has been laregly a non or poor responder to DAN stuff

> > including chelation. Diets have however made a difference in

him,

> > especially allergy rotation diets, whole foods, high nutrient

> > density diets, eliminating allergenic foods.

> >

> > 6. Amy Derksen via ART determined his big remaining issues are

> > Strep, Lyme, and RUBELLA.

> >

> > 7. He broke out in an all over 4 day body rash that looked like

> > measles on LDM-100. He also got a fever on it and while

feverish,

> > ASD symptoms resolved. Yes, we went to see Dr Kampol and he put

him

> > on this. He stayed on it for 2 months, and then Dr Derksen said

it

> > wasn;t needed anymore (ART testing).

> >

> > 8. His pattern has been one of waxing and waning, 4 steps

forward

> > and 3 steps backward.

> >

> > Limen, do you think that your prophylactic use of Burbur has

> > prevented the herx reactions you were hoping to see as evidence

of

> > die off? Am I misunderstanding your post about Burbur -did you

only

> > use it with the VRM, or did you also use it prophylactically with

> > the Cowden herbs?

> >

> > When we start the Cowden herbs, we will definitely give the

Burbur.

> > This along wiht the other binder I have in place which is

Cholacol

> > II (bentonite clay, collisonia root, and purified bile salts. I

> > give it twice a day on an empty stomach about 2 hours after the

> > herbs. http://www.becomehealthynow.com/supps/cholacolii.shtml

> >

> > Other ideas. What about working on breaking down the biofilm

prior

> > to giving the herbs? We are using Virastop as the enzyme along

with

> > Chewable EDTA to help punch holes inthe biofilm and bind to

released

> > metals. Going to alternate this with Phospholipid exchange which

> > also contains EDTA. Maybe the biofilm is preventing the Cowden

> > herbs from reaching the pathogens?

> >

> > Alos, have you used any other natural antivirals? We have or

have

> > had in our arsenal: Virastop, Olive Leaf Extract, Lauricidin,

Cat's

> > Claw, and high dose A. I know you have used high dose A and

> > lysine, but what about the others? Again, with biofilm

breakdown.

> >

> > Have you ever considered classical homeopathy?

> >

> > Beth

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Beth,

During our almost 3-year journey of biomed, the only healthcare professional

who I have ever consulted once is Dr. Lee Cowden. He has an Asyra machine

with an extensive toxin database, which is generally believed to be a

diagnostic tool with high accuracy. I wanted my son to get an Asyra

screening - this is not something that I can download from the Internet. I

would love to have Dr. Lee Cowden's advice, but he is too expensive for us

to consult with at a continual base. Each family has its own situation and

financial planning/consideration. We most spend money on supplements,

therapies, and tests, not on doctor consultation. However, at the moment I

do feel that I need new inspiration in order to move forward.

Limin

Re:Any successes

> with Cowden

>> protocol?

>>

>>

>> > Hi Limen,

>> >

>> > Yes I suspect my child is a viral kid too. (he is also no doubt

> a

>> > big bacterial kid as well), and has had protozoa in the past.

> Thsu

>> > why I am on this list! Here is why I think he is a viral kid:

>> >

>> > 1. He rarely gets sick, but..

>> >

>> > 2. When he does gets a fever which is rare, his ASD symptoms

>> > improve quite a bit, better social connectivity, better eye

> contact,

>> > language, lower stims, lower aggitation, lower OCD, lower

> anxiety.

>> >

>> > 3. He regressed terribly after the MMR/Varicella, and had

>> > subsequent clinical bowel disease as a result. Scoped by

> Krigsman

>> > and found to have " marked colitis " at age 4.

>> >

>> > 4. He received 3 separate immunizations within a year and a half

>> > period between ages 2 months and 18 months of a 5-in-one vaccine

>> > called Pentocel containing ACT-HIB, DTaP, and Polio. (Haemophilus

>> > influenzae type b (HIB), diptheria, Tetnus, Pertussis, and Polio)

>> > all wrapped up into one lovely (not!!) shot.

>> >

>> > 5. He has been laregly a non or poor responder to DAN stuff

>> > including chelation. Diets have however made a difference in

> him,

>> > especially allergy rotation diets, whole foods, high nutrient

>> > density diets, eliminating allergenic foods.

>> >

>> > 6. Amy Derksen via ART determined his big remaining issues are

>> > Strep, Lyme, and RUBELLA.

>> >

>> > 7. He broke out in an all over 4 day body rash that looked like

>> > measles on LDM-100. He also got a fever on it and while

> feverish,

>> > ASD symptoms resolved. Yes, we went to see Dr Kampol and he put

> him

>> > on this. He stayed on it for 2 months, and then Dr Derksen said

> it

>> > wasn;t needed anymore (ART testing).

>> >

>> > 8. His pattern has been one of waxing and waning, 4 steps

> forward

>> > and 3 steps backward.

>> >

>> > Limen, do you think that your prophylactic use of Burbur has

>> > prevented the herx reactions you were hoping to see as evidence

> of

>> > die off? Am I misunderstanding your post about Burbur -did you

> only

>> > use it with the VRM, or did you also use it prophylactically with

>> > the Cowden herbs?

>> >

>> > When we start the Cowden herbs, we will definitely give the

> Burbur.

>> > This along wiht the other binder I have in place which is

> Cholacol

>> > II (bentonite clay, collisonia root, and purified bile salts. I

>> > give it twice a day on an empty stomach about 2 hours after the

>> > herbs. http://www.becomehealthynow.com/supps/cholacolii.shtml

>> >

>> > Other ideas. What about working on breaking down the biofilm

> prior

>> > to giving the herbs? We are using Virastop as the enzyme along

> with

>> > Chewable EDTA to help punch holes inthe biofilm and bind to

> released

>> > metals. Going to alternate this with Phospholipid exchange which

>> > also contains EDTA. Maybe the biofilm is preventing the Cowden

>> > herbs from reaching the pathogens?

>> >

>> > Alos, have you used any other natural antivirals? We have or

> have

>> > had in our arsenal: Virastop, Olive Leaf Extract, Lauricidin,

> Cat's

>> > Claw, and high dose A. I know you have used high dose A and

>> > lysine, but what about the others? Again, with biofilm

> breakdown.

>> >

>> > Have you ever considered classical homeopathy?

>> >

>> > Beth

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> > ------------------------------------

>> >

>> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Limen,

I do understand your situation. For the last 3+ years I have been

pretty much been doing it on my own too, actually since we started

with Yasko in 2005. We are no longer doign Yasko though. Last year

I got to a point where I really felt I could use some direction and

someone to bounce things off of, because my son was not doign well

and was on so many supplements I was not sure what was helping or

hurting anymore, what was detox and what was an imblanace or

supplement reaction, you know? Since last summer, we have been

under the care of Dr Derksen, and she does the energy testing thing;

the jury is still out on whether her recommendations are making much

of a difference for my son; that is the true litmus test isn't it?

We shall see with her latest set of recommendations. I am still

wanting to confirm her energy findings with bloodwork, etc. Though

we haven't seen a DAN doc since 2004, I am taking my son later this

month to see a different DAN who is an allergist by training to run

a battery of tests we have not run in a long while plus some new

ones. And to get his feedback. And my fall back will be a

classical homeopath hopefully later this summer. So, I too do a lot

on my own, but am getting to the point where I could use some

guidance. Choosing the right person can be tough. I spent a lot of

effort in choosing the pracitioners that I did - mainly the results

they were getting with older kids and tough nuts.

Beth

> >>

> >> Hi Beth,

> >>

> >> Thank you for the link to the product information of Cholacol

II.

> > I have

> >> not done any colon support for quite some time. It is about

time

> > for us to

> >> do a spring cleanse.

> >>

> >> We are also on a revised version of biofilm protocol. We do not

> > use NaEDTA,

> >> which my son reacts badly. Here are the things we use:

> >>

> >> - Enzymes: Lambrokinase, Virastop, Mucostop, and Candex.

> >> - Rotating anti-fungal at 4-day intervals to treat Candida:

> > Biocidin,

> >> Allimax (garlic), Goldenseal, Uva Ursi (in Organic Lavage), and

> > Oil of

> >> Oregano.

> >> - Rotating Lyme herbs: Banderol and Cumanda for 12 days on

with

> > a 36-hour

> >> break.

> >> - Caprylic Acid with Psyllium stem/seed powder to treat

> > Klebsiella.

> >> - Rotating Quina and Samando to treat Strep bacteria. (Samando

is

> > more

> >> effective than Quina in this regard, as Samando works on most

> > strains of

> >> Strep, whereas Quina works on some.)

> >> - PectaSol Chelation Complex to mop up toxins released by

> > fungal/bacterial

> >> die-off and metal toxins in the gut.

> >> - Chelate with low dose ALA/DMSA and NDF (Chlorrela) on Andy

> > Cutler's

> >> schedule.

> >>

> >> My son is also on a " fat cocktail " , as we call it in our

> > household. The

> >> cocktail contains PC, PS, vitamin A, vitamin D, vitamin K, Black

> > Currant

> >> Oil, DMAE, Grape Seed PCO Phytosome, L-Carnitine, Pentothenic

> > Acid, and

> >> Folic Acid. I have been chelating my son for two years. When

> > metal toxins

> >> come out, they tear apart the cell membranes to come out. And

the

> > cells

> >> will need time to repair. I found supplementing with the lipid

> > cocktail we

> >> created help my son in repairing the cell membranes and

> > maintaining cell

> >> membrane fluidity. Dr. Amy Yakso once comments that if the cell

> > membranes

> >> are rigid, the transmission of intercellular signals will be

poor.

> >> Maintaining a good level of cell membrance fluidity helps in

cell-

> > to-cell

> >> communication.

> >>

> >> It is possible that, as you suggested, Burbur might have been

> > prophylactical

> >> for us. I read about Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol in the mid year

> > 2007 and

> >> right away started supplementing my son with Burbur and Pinella

> > (detoxing

> >> MSG and glutamate) for about a half year, prior to taking my son

> > to see him

> >> in order to get an Asyra screening. My son has also been using

> > Methyl B12

> >> injections, reduced Glutathione in low dose, and homeopathic

organ

> > drainage.

> >> Perhaps all these supplements have prepared his detox organs for

> > the

> >> powerful anti-microbial, anti-parasitic herbs. When starting

> > VRM4, I

> >> increased Burbur from twice a day to 4 times a day for the

initial

> > 7 days,

> >> and then dropped back to twice a day.

> >>

> >> However, it is also possible that my son's chronic lyme is

mostly

> > in the

> >> form of cell-wall-deficient bacteria, which the herbs cannot

> > effectively

> >> attack, because they work most effecitvely in killing off

> > spirachetes. In

> >> the beginning of 2007, we did a live blood analysis on my son.

> > Observing

> >> from a dark field microscopy, we found that his blood exhibits

an

> > unusually

> >> high level of plaque-like, unassimilated materials collectively

> > referred to

> >> as symplatsts. Many of these can be explained in terms of poor

> > nutrient

> >> utilization, gut dysbiosisi, chronic immune challenges and

> > inflammatory

> >> conditions. Furthermore, the researcher who did the analysis

told

> > us that

> >> some of these symplasts strongly resemble markers for cell-wall-

> > deficient

> >> bacteria also known as stealth pathogens. My son had one tick

> > bite instance

> >> in early 2005. Not until we met with this researcher did we

> > realize the

> >> significance of that tick bite and its insult on his already

> >> vaccines/metals-weaken immune system. Unfortunately, he is a

tick

> > charmer

> >> and got another two tick bite instances in 2007.

> >>

> >> I started sequential homeopathy right after the live blood

> > screening. The

> >> researcher was also a trainer who teaches sequential/isopahtic

> > homeopathy

> >> practitioners to use live blood screening as diagnostic tool. I

> > initially

> >> learned from him and took off to choose remedies on my own

> > according to my

> >> observation of my son's prognosis. My son had initial bacterial

> > die-off and

> >> had very bad diarrhea and lost of appetite for about 3 weeks.

> > Then his

> >> diarrhea cleared up, good appeitite bounced back, and he was

> > happy, alert,

> >> calm, and produced the best stools (in terms of color, texture,

> > and shape)

> >> we have even had during our close-to 3 years of biomed

journey. I

> > did

> >> sequential homeopathy about 5, 6 months. Gradually choosing

> > appropriate

> >> remedies became more and more difficult for me. As I am not a

> > registered or

> >> licensed healthcare provider, valid information on products and

> > protocols

> >> and training materials are not readily accessible. At the same

> > time I

> >> learned more about Dr. Lee Cowden's protocol, so I set

sequential

> > homeopathy

> >> aside and took my son to receive LED. I always think that

> > sequential

> >> homeopathy is worthy of revisit.

> >>

> >> I am now considering consulting with Coyle

> >> (http://www.childrensexcelcenter.com/doctors.html). She is a

> >> homotoxicologist, and she is all about detox. I want to collect

> > some

> >> parents' feedback on her first. I am also waiting for my son's

> > IgeneX test

> >> result and will take it from there.

> >>

> >> Appoligize for this long post. Thank you for reading.

> >>

> >> Limin

> >>

> >>

> >> Re:Any successes

> > with Cowden

> >> protocol?

> >>

> >>

> >> > Hi Limen,

> >> >

> >> > Yes I suspect my child is a viral kid too. (he is also no

doubt

> > a

> >> > big bacterial kid as well), and has had protozoa in the past.

> > Thsu

> >> > why I am on this list! Here is why I think he is a viral kid:

> >> >

> >> > 1. He rarely gets sick, but..

> >> >

> >> > 2. When he does gets a fever which is rare, his ASD symptoms

> >> > improve quite a bit, better social connectivity, better eye

> > contact,

> >> > language, lower stims, lower aggitation, lower OCD, lower

> > anxiety.

> >> >

> >> > 3. He regressed terribly after the MMR/Varicella, and had

> >> > subsequent clinical bowel disease as a result. Scoped by

> > Krigsman

> >> > and found to have " marked colitis " at age 4.

> >> >

> >> > 4. He received 3 separate immunizations within a year and a

half

> >> > period between ages 2 months and 18 months of a 5-in-one

vaccine

> >> > called Pentocel containing ACT-HIB, DTaP, and Polio.

(Haemophilus

> >> > influenzae type b (HIB), diptheria, Tetnus, Pertussis, and

Polio)

> >> > all wrapped up into one lovely (not!!) shot.

> >> >

> >> > 5. He has been laregly a non or poor responder to DAN stuff

> >> > including chelation. Diets have however made a difference in

> > him,

> >> > especially allergy rotation diets, whole foods, high nutrient

> >> > density diets, eliminating allergenic foods.

> >> >

> >> > 6. Amy Derksen via ART determined his big remaining issues

are

> >> > Strep, Lyme, and RUBELLA.

> >> >

> >> > 7. He broke out in an all over 4 day body rash that looked

like

> >> > measles on LDM-100. He also got a fever on it and while

> > feverish,

> >> > ASD symptoms resolved. Yes, we went to see Dr Kampol and he

put

> > him

> >> > on this. He stayed on it for 2 months, and then Dr Derksen

said

> > it

> >> > wasn;t needed anymore (ART testing).

> >> >

> >> > 8. His pattern has been one of waxing and waning, 4 steps

> > forward

> >> > and 3 steps backward.

> >> >

> >> > Limen, do you think that your prophylactic use of Burbur has

> >> > prevented the herx reactions you were hoping to see as

evidence

> > of

> >> > die off? Am I misunderstanding your post about Burbur -did

you

> > only

> >> > use it with the VRM, or did you also use it prophylactically

with

> >> > the Cowden herbs?

> >> >

> >> > When we start the Cowden herbs, we will definitely give the

> > Burbur.

> >> > This along wiht the other binder I have in place which is

> > Cholacol

> >> > II (bentonite clay, collisonia root, and purified bile

salts. I

> >> > give it twice a day on an empty stomach about 2 hours after

the

> >> > herbs. http://www.becomehealthynow.com/supps/cholacolii.shtml

> >> >

> >> > Other ideas. What about working on breaking down the biofilm

> > prior

> >> > to giving the herbs? We are using Virastop as the enzyme

along

> > with

> >> > Chewable EDTA to help punch holes inthe biofilm and bind to

> > released

> >> > metals. Going to alternate this with Phospholipid exchange

which

> >> > also contains EDTA. Maybe the biofilm is preventing the

Cowden

> >> > herbs from reaching the pathogens?

> >> >

> >> > Alos, have you used any other natural antivirals? We have or

> > have

> >> > had in our arsenal: Virastop, Olive Leaf Extract, Lauricidin,

> > Cat's

> >> > Claw, and high dose A. I know you have used high dose A and

> >> > lysine, but what about the others? Again, with biofilm

> > breakdown.

> >> >

> >> > Have you ever considered classical homeopathy?

> >> >

> >> > Beth

> >> >

> >> >

> >> >

> >> >

> >> > ------------------------------------

> >> >

> >> >

[Guest guest]

Limin/Beth,

We have started our child with ASD on Cowden's protocol. We are

using Takuna (anti-viral), Samento, and Cumanda. We have gradually

worked our way up to a full dose of Samento (15 drops 2X/day), and

are currently working our way up to a full dose of Cumanda (about

half way there). We started out at 1 drop, 2X/day, and have

increased one drop per day. We have done some LED treatments. We

have seen some language/social gains, not sure if it is LED and/or

Samento/Cumanda/Takuna or combination of all the above. We are using

Bromelain, Fibroboost, and alternate Parsley (odd days) and Burbur

(even days) for helping with detox reactions by increasing lymph

flow. We didn't see major herx reactions to the Samento, but are

starting to see some reactions to the Cumanda. We were told by

another Naturopath (not associated with Cowden's organization) that

Samento works outside the cell wall, Cumanda works inside the cell

wall. I am very interested and hopeful that we will see some major

progress using this protocol. We will know our test results from Fry

Laboratories soon -- test for Lymes, Bartontella, co-infections,

autoimmuniity, etc. I'm excited that we're seeing some reaction to

Cumanda -- generally looks like detox and some rashes on the skin. I

say, " Keep the reactions and the language/social gains coming!!! " I

anticipate the test results showing some blood born infection agents,

intuitively I suspect Bartonella.

It's nice to read posts from people that are extremely committed to

recovering our children.

I have much more to say, but lack the time. I am also very

interested in some effective treatments for chronic viral issues like

measles. There's a lot of evidence that measles might be at the root

of a large percentage of our kids. Not sure if the natural anti-

virals like Takuna are effective.

I've heard Cowden say that reducing the toxic load is important to

effective treating the infections agents present in Lymes, etc. I've

also heard it say that Lymes cannot be effectively treated without

addressing the Bartonella. I'm curious if people have tried some of

the clay baths to address toxicity. Some people claim they are just

as effective and safer than IV chelation therapy...

Best wishes to you and your efforts!!

[Guest guest]

,

Thank you for sharing the interventions at your house.

We are rotating Banderol and Cumanda at 30 drops twice a day. I asked Dr.

Lee Cowden if he would recommend RIFE to a child who is less than 50 pounds.

He said yes and do it on days 1, 3, 5, 7, 9 and 11 of the Cumanda/Banderol

protocol and not during the 36 hours off. We are still exploring the pros

and cons of rifing a young child. I wonder if anyone in this list uses RIFE

as an adjunctive therapy to other Lyme treatments. Or, is there a Yahoo

group to provide support to parents who rife their children?

Limin

Re:Any successes with Cowden

protocol?

> Limin/Beth,

>

> We have started our child with ASD on Cowden's protocol. We are

> using Takuna (anti-viral), Samento, and Cumanda. We have gradually

> worked our way up to a full dose of Samento (15 drops 2X/day), and

> are currently working our way up to a full dose of Cumanda (about

> half way there). We started out at 1 drop, 2X/day, and have

> increased one drop per day. We have done some LED treatments. We

> have seen some language/social gains, not sure if it is LED and/or

> Samento/Cumanda/Takuna or combination of all the above. We are using

> Bromelain, Fibroboost, and alternate Parsley (odd days) and Burbur

> (even days) for helping with detox reactions by increasing lymph

> flow. We didn't see major herx reactions to the Samento, but are

> starting to see some reactions to the Cumanda. We were told by

> another Naturopath (not associated with Cowden's organization) that

> Samento works outside the cell wall, Cumanda works inside the cell

> wall. I am very interested and hopeful that we will see some major

> progress using this protocol. We will know our test results from Fry

> Laboratories soon -- test for Lymes, Bartontella, co-infections,

> autoimmuniity, etc. I'm excited that we're seeing some reaction to

> Cumanda -- generally looks like detox and some rashes on the skin. I

> say, " Keep the reactions and the language/social gains coming!!! " I

> anticipate the test results showing some blood born infection agents,

> intuitively I suspect Bartonella.

>

> It's nice to read posts from people that are extremely committed to

> recovering our children.

>

> I have much more to say, but lack the time. I am also very

> interested in some effective treatments for chronic viral issues like

> measles. There's a lot of evidence that measles might be at the root

> of a large percentage of our kids. Not sure if the natural anti-

> virals like Takuna are effective.

>

> I've heard Cowden say that reducing the toxic load is important to

> effective treating the infections agents present in Lymes, etc. I've

> also heard it say that Lymes cannot be effectively treated without

> addressing the Bartonella. I'm curious if people have tried some of

> the clay baths to address toxicity. Some people claim they are just

> as effective and safer than IV chelation therapy...

>

> Best wishes to you and your efforts!!

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Cumanda/Burbur was GREAT for my then 6 year old daughter. I didn't

see improvement with my son. I have used different homeopathic

approaches/remedies. I also use the rife machine with the help of

someone who knows much more than I do. It helps in emergencies and

when I need a quick fix instead of trying to find the right

homeopathic remedy.

Carol

>

> ,

>

> Thank you for sharing the interventions at your house.

>

> We are rotating Banderol and Cumanda at 30 drops twice a day. I

asked Dr.

> Lee Cowden if he would recommend RIFE to a child who is less than

50 pounds.

> He said yes and do it on days 1, 3, 5, 7, 9 and 11 of the

Cumanda/Banderol

> protocol and not during the 36 hours off. We are still exploring

the pros

> and cons of rifing a young child. I wonder if anyone in this list

uses RIFE

> as an adjunctive therapy to other Lyme treatments. Or, is there a

Yahoo

> group to provide support to parents who rife their children?

>

> Limin

>

>

> Re:Any successes

with Cowden

> protocol?

>

>

> > Limin/Beth,

> >

> > We have started our child with ASD on Cowden's protocol. We are

> > using Takuna (anti-viral), Samento, and Cumanda. We have

gradually

> > worked our way up to a full dose of Samento (15 drops 2X/day), and

> > are currently working our way up to a full dose of Cumanda (about

> > half way there). We started out at 1 drop, 2X/day, and have

> > increased one drop per day. We have done some LED treatments. We

> > have seen some language/social gains, not sure if it is LED and/or

> > Samento/Cumanda/Takuna or combination of all the above. We are

using

> > Bromelain, Fibroboost, and alternate Parsley (odd days) and Burbur

> > (even days) for helping with detox reactions by increasing lymph

> > flow. We didn't see major herx reactions to the Samento, but are

> > starting to see some reactions to the Cumanda. We were told by

> > another Naturopath (not associated with Cowden's organization)

that

> > Samento works outside the cell wall, Cumanda works inside the cell

> > wall. I am very interested and hopeful that we will see some

major

> > progress using this protocol. We will know our test results from

Fry

> > Laboratories soon -- test for Lymes, Bartontella, co-infections,

> > autoimmuniity, etc. I'm excited that we're seeing some reaction

to

> > Cumanda -- generally looks like detox and some rashes on the

skin. I

> > say, " Keep the reactions and the language/social gains

coming!!! " I

> > anticipate the test results showing some blood born infection

agents,

> > intuitively I suspect Bartonella.

> >

> > It's nice to read posts from people that are extremely committed

to

> > recovering our children.

> >

> > I have much more to say, but lack the time. I am also very

> > interested in some effective treatments for chronic viral issues

like

> > measles. There's a lot of evidence that measles might be at the

root

> > of a large percentage of our kids. Not sure if the natural anti-

> > virals like Takuna are effective.

> >

> > I've heard Cowden say that reducing the toxic load is important to

> > effective treating the infections agents present in Lymes, etc.

I've

> > also heard it say that Lymes cannot be effectively treated without

> > addressing the Bartonella. I'm curious if people have tried some

of

> > the clay baths to address toxicity. Some people claim they are

just

> > as effective and safer than IV chelation therapy...

> >

> > Best wishes to you and your efforts!!

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >