OT - LYME TEST & QUESTIONS - NEED ADVICE PLEASE !!!

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Its Goran from Macedonia writting....

Im a very new in this group....

Im a father of 5 y old son with autism...

I really need your advice...... ....

This is the story....

----- My son get ill 15 days ago, compost in his throath - sore

throath, and get feve, high tmeperature. ..

We give supps for fever but they dont help...

We went to Dr and give us antibiotics, OSPEN (penicilin) and after 1

day my son get like herpes on his tounge and Dr change the

antibiotics. .., she start Claritomicin. ... and start injections

Gentamicin or Garamicin for 3 days....

After the 1st shot of injection my son get better and we continue

with this mix, oral with antibiotics for the next 7 days....

His fewer get better, sore throat get better and everything finished

just fine....

What was very strange to me is that using these antibiotics my son

get better, BUT NOT only with his illnes,..... his BEHAVIOR improve

very much too... He stop to mooo, to flap, very present, even start

and want to talk.....

----- At same time I was reading on mb12 valtrex group the dialog

named " Rapamycin Reverse Autism's Effects/Lyme Infection " , and I was

very interesting in all your replies and dialog about..... all

concernin the Lyme desease and Micoplasma and autism...... ......

----- and at same time I speak on phone with friends who have a

child positive for Lyme and treat him with antibiotics and see great

improvement. They participate at the Lyme-Autism Connections

Conference, organised by L.I.A. Foundation, performed 26-29 June 2008

in California.. ..

What I try to say that my son get improved from his last antibiotics

treatmant..

" He ussually regressed using antibiotics and I was always worried to

give him any " !!!!!

Except this time, he get progress, and after a week of stoping the

oral antibiotics and injections, his old behavior back again,

flaping, moo, walking on toes, hand shake in front of his mouth etc

etc.....

All these makes me to test my son for Lyme, Micoplasma, Chlamydia and

other viruses...

This is 1test who offer these testings.... .

Im not sure how much I can trust our laboratory but its all I can do

here...

Dr say that this machine and test ecquipment is from France and I

need to trust it...

I receive my son test results today, and it say:

- vidas Lyme IgG and IgM = 0.67 referent number - value > 1.0

- vidas Lyme IgM = negative

- Legionella pneumophila serogri = negative

- Mysoplasma pneumoniae = negative

- Adenovirus = negative

- Respiratory Syncytial Virus = Negative

- Influenzae A = Negative

- Influenzae B = Negative

- Parainfluenzae serotypes 1,2,3 = Negative

All is negative eccept the 1st one, Lyme IgG and IgM = 0.67 !!!

Dr say that is NORMAL !!!

I ask, all others are NEGATIVE and why the 1st one is not NEGATIVE

too, but say 0.67???

She reply that this machine give the right number-value, its very

correct she say..

I say, so there is LYME??? She say its normal value... 0.67 is

normal, over 0.75 is suspisious and over 1.0 we can talk about

Lyme......

I need your advice...

When you test is USA or Europe for Lyme, what your test show???

It show NEGATIVE if there is NO Lyme??

It show some amount of Lyme, but is NORMAL ???

Is it normal to have any value of Lyme, as my son 0.67, and to be OK-

NORMAL ????

or When you dont have any Lyme the test need to be negative and when

you tested positive for Lyme test show any value, even very smal???

What should I do??

Did my son have Lyme????

Sorry for long letter, but reg the place Im writting from, I need to

explain the whole situation...

Wait for your reply...

My best regards

Goran, Macedonia

[Guest guest]

That was me about the lyme. I said antibiotics work for children

with autism because often they have lyme. I was angry that the

researchers were saying that the antibiotic worked because it fixed

problems in the brain. I say it worked because it kills the germs

and then the brain fixes itself. I am glad you found us.

With lyme testing, its difficult to get it to show positive on the

test because it hides inside of cells and lowers the immune system.

Testing is very difficult. Many doctors say you have to kill the

lyme first for a month or two or three months and then test again for

lyme. Lyme can take months or years to kill.

With lyme, some antibiotics make children worse and some make them

better. This may be why you got improvement with this antibiotic.

What you now know for sure is that your son has some type of

infection causing his autism because the antibiotic makes him well.

Here are my thoughts on things you can do. You can ask the doctor to

keep giving you the same antibiotic because it was making him well.

See if your doctor agrees to that. Or you can use products that kill

lyme like herbs. We have other fancy things in the USA like Oxygen

chambers and Intravenous expensive treatments. But cheap herbs work,

and my children got well on cheap herbs. Also, homeopathy is a way

that some use. I do not know what you have in your country to kill

bacteria and lyme, but you can use something you have there or order

something from America or even fly here to see a doctor. Some people

don't use doctors because you don't have to have a doctor for herbs

and homeopathy.

Think about what you want to do and then find a good way to do it.

If you want to use herbs, then ask what herbs people use to kill

their lyme. If you want to use antibiotics, you can ask what

antibiotics people use. Let us know how you want to treat the

bacteria your son has, and we will show you reports and research

about it so you can learn more.

Heidi N

>

> Hi,

>

> Its Goran from Macedonia writting....

>

> Im a very new in this group....

> Im a father of 5 y old son with autism...

> I really need your advice...... ....

>

> This is the story....

>

> ----- My son get ill 15 days ago, compost in his throath - sore

> throath, and get feve, high tmeperature. ..

> We give supps for fever but they dont help...

> We went to Dr and give us antibiotics, OSPEN (penicilin) and after

1

> day my son get like herpes on his tounge and Dr change the

> antibiotics. .., she start Claritomicin. ... and start injections

> Gentamicin or Garamicin for 3 days....

> After the 1st shot of injection my son get better and we continue

> with this mix, oral with antibiotics for the next 7 days....

> His fewer get better, sore throat get better and everything

finished

> just fine....

> What was very strange to me is that using these antibiotics my son

> get better, BUT NOT only with his illnes,..... his BEHAVIOR improve

> very much too... He stop to mooo, to flap, very present, even start

> and want to talk.....

>

> ----- At same time I was reading on mb12 valtrex group the dialog

> named " Rapamycin Reverse Autism's Effects/Lyme Infection " , and I

was

> very interesting in all your replies and dialog about..... all

> concernin the Lyme desease and Micoplasma and autism...... ......

>

> ----- and at same time I speak on phone with friends who have a

> child positive for Lyme and treat him with antibiotics and see

great

> improvement. They participate at the Lyme-Autism Connections

> Conference, organised by L.I.A. Foundation, performed 26-29 June

2008

> in California.. ..

>

> What I try to say that my son get improved from his last

antibiotics

> treatmant..

> " He ussually regressed using antibiotics and I was always worried

to

> give him any " !!!!!

> Except this time, he get progress, and after a week of stoping the

> oral antibiotics and injections, his old behavior back again,

> flaping, moo, walking on toes, hand shake in front of his mouth etc

> etc.....

>

> All these makes me to test my son for Lyme, Micoplasma, Chlamydia

and

> other viruses...

> This is 1test who offer these testings.... .

>

> Im not sure how much I can trust our laboratory but its all I can

do

> here...

> Dr say that this machine and test ecquipment is from France and I

> need to trust it...

>

> I receive my son test results today, and it say:

>

> - vidas Lyme IgG and IgM = 0.67 referent number - value > 1.0

> - vidas Lyme IgM = negative

> - Legionella pneumophila serogri = negative

> - Mysoplasma pneumoniae = negative

> - Adenovirus = negative

> - Respiratory Syncytial Virus = Negative

> - Influenzae A = Negative

> - Influenzae B = Negative

> - Parainfluenzae serotypes 1,2,3 = Negative

>

> All is negative eccept the 1st one, Lyme IgG and IgM = 0.67 !!!

>

> Dr say that is NORMAL !!!

> I ask, all others are NEGATIVE and why the 1st one is not NEGATIVE

> too, but say 0.67???

> She reply that this machine give the right number-value, its very

> correct she say..

> I say, so there is LYME??? She say its normal value... 0.67 is

> normal, over 0.75 is suspisious and over 1.0 we can talk about

> Lyme......

>

> I need your advice...

> When you test is USA or Europe for Lyme, what your test show???

> It show NEGATIVE if there is NO Lyme??

> It show some amount of Lyme, but is NORMAL ???

> Is it normal to have any value of Lyme, as my son 0.67, and to be

OK-

> NORMAL ????

>

> or When you dont have any Lyme the test need to be negative and

when

> you tested positive for Lyme test show any value, even very smal???

>

> What should I do??

> Did my son have Lyme????

>

> Sorry for long letter, but reg the place Im writting from, I need

to

> explain the whole situation...

> Wait for your reply...

>

> My best regards

> Goran, Macedonia

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Thanks for your reply....

I need to say that when ever my son get ill, using antibiotics regress him soooo much...

We need a month to recover him and brnig back to the point before the antibiotics...

I notice that when ever my son have fewer, he get progress, his behavior become much much better...

I read many many children act in same way, progrewsssing during the fewer...

Im not sure, did fewer makes him better or antibiotics....

Thats why I make this test for Lyme...

Can you please reply me, did my son have Lyme???

Is this 0.67 a mark who say YES your son have Lyme or NOT????

Let me tell you few things...

Here in my country autism is a unknown illnesss.

We have no Drs who is aware fo autism...

Dont talk about DAN or any....

There a few of them but they are not informed well...

So, Im doing my own research..

In last 15 months I spend 10 and more hours a day reading reading and reading, informing and educate my self..

Minute by minute hour by hour I swim in this ocean of infromations,...., I was very confused in begining but happy at same time... THERE IS HOPE FOM MY SON !!!!

We dont have support groups here, no one aware of ABA, Son Rise etc etc....

Im on my own, we are on our own....

So buying any of herbs is imposible here, cose we dont have them, or any suplements...

God is great and I met so many friend, parents who help me with all is needed to treat my son...

So, we dont have any herbs here, no Drs, and to fly to USA for Dr is science fiction for me..

Im strugling every day, but Im on the way to help my son...

A friend of mine, with autistic child, who is treated by Dr Klinghardt, advice me the following:

To use a solution that cleanse all the pathogens in the body.t is called MMS.

Here is the website:

http://miraclemineralsolutions.com/

And there is also a homeopathic nosode for the lyme infections,it is called lyme disease nosode. Link: www.biopureus.com.

Any info about these 2 remedies???

Anyone use these 2 products for Lyme??

My best regards

Goran

Subject: Re: OT - LYME TEST & QUESTIONS - NEED ADVICE PLEASE !!!To: BorreliaMultipleInfectionsAndAutism Date: Saturday, August 2, 2008, 1:41 AM

That was me about the lyme. I said antibiotics work for children with autism because often they have lyme. I was angry that the researchers were saying that the antibiotic worked because it fixed problems in the brain. I say it worked because it kills the germs and then the brain fixes itself. I am glad you found us. With lyme testing, its difficult to get it to show positive on the test because it hides inside of cells and lowers the immune system. Testing is very difficult. Many doctors say you have to kill the lyme first for a month or two or three months and then test again for lyme. Lyme can take months or years to kill. With lyme, some antibiotics make children worse and some make them better. This may be why you got improvement with this antibiotic. What you now know for sure is that your son has some type of infection causing his autism because the antibiotic makes him well.

Here are my thoughts on things you can do. You can ask the doctor to keep giving you the same antibiotic because it was making him well. See if your doctor agrees to that. Or you can use products that kill lyme like herbs. We have other fancy things in the USA like Oxygen chambers and Intravenous expensive treatments. But cheap herbs work, and my children got well on cheap herbs. Also, homeopathy is a way that some use. I do not know what you have in your country to kill bacteria and lyme, but you can use something you have there or order something from America or even fly here to see a doctor. Some people don't use doctors because you don't have to have a doctor for herbs and homeopathy. Think about what you want to do and then find a good way to do it. If you want to use herbs, then ask what herbs people use to kill their lyme. If you want to use antibiotics, you can ask what

antibiotics people use. Let us know how you want to treat the bacteria your son has, and we will show you reports and research about it so you can learn more.Heidi N>> Hi,> > Its Goran from Macedonia writting....> > Im a very new in this group....> Im a father of 5 y old son with autism...> I really need your advice...... ....> > This is the story....> > ----- My son get ill 15 days ago, compost in his throath - sore > throath, and get feve, high tmeperature. ..> We give supps for fever but they dont help...> We went to Dr and give us antibiotics, OSPEN (penicilin) and after 1 > day my son get

like herpes on his tounge and Dr change the > antibiotics. .., she start Claritomicin. ... and start injections > Gentamicin or Garamicin for 3 days....> After the 1st shot of injection my son get better and we continue > with this mix, oral with antibiotics for the next 7 days....> His fewer get better, sore throat get better and everything finished > just fine....> What was very strange to me is that using these antibiotics my son > get better, BUT NOT only with his illnes,..... his BEHAVIOR improve > very much too... He stop to mooo, to flap, very present, even start > and want to talk.....> > ----- At same time I was reading on mb12 valtrex group the dialog > named "Rapamycin Reverse Autism's Effects/Lyme Infection", and I was > very interesting in all your replies and dialog about..... all > concernin the Lyme desease and Micoplasma and

autism...... ......> > ----- and at same time I speak on phone with friends who have a > child positive for Lyme and treat him with antibiotics and see great > improvement. They participate at the Lyme-Autism Connections > Conference, organised by L.I.A. Foundation, performed 26-29 June 2008 > in California.. .. > > What I try to say that my son get improved from his last antibiotics > treatmant..> "He ussually regressed using antibiotics and I was always worried to > give him any"!!!!!> Except this time, he get progress, and after a week of stoping the > oral antibiotics and injections, his old behavior back again, > flaping, moo, walking on toes, hand shake in front of his mouth etc > etc.....> > All these makes me to test my son for Lyme, Micoplasma, Chlamydia and > other viruses...> This is 1test

who offer these testings.... .> > Im not sure how much I can trust our laboratory but its all I can do > here...> Dr say that this machine and test ecquipment is from France and I > need to trust it...> > I receive my son test results today, and it say:> > - vidas Lyme IgG and IgM = 0.67 referent number - value > 1.0> - vidas Lyme IgM = negative> - Legionella pneumophila serogri = negative> - Mysoplasma pneumoniae = negative > - Adenovirus = negative> - Respiratory Syncytial Virus = Negative> - Influenzae A = Negative> - Influenzae B = Negative> - Parainfluenzae serotypes 1,2,3 = Negative> > All is negative eccept the 1st one, Lyme IgG and IgM = 0.67 !!!> > Dr say that is NORMAL !!!> I ask, all others are NEGATIVE and why the 1st one is not NEGATIVE > too, but say 0.67???> She

reply that this machine give the right number-value, its very > correct she say..> I say, so there is LYME??? She say its normal value... 0.67 is > normal, over 0.75 is suspisious and over 1.0 we can talk about > Lyme......> > I need your advice...> When you test is USA or Europe for Lyme, what your test show???> It show NEGATIVE if there is NO Lyme??> It show some amount of Lyme, but is NORMAL ???> Is it normal to have any value of Lyme, as my son 0.67, and to be OK-> NORMAL ????> > or When you dont have any Lyme the test need to be negative and when > you tested positive for Lyme test show any value, even very smal???> > What should I do??> Did my son have Lyme????> > Sorry for long letter, but reg the place Im writting from, I need to > explain the whole situation...> Wait for your

reply...> > My best regards> Goran, Macedonia>

[Guest guest]

Goran:

The test you show here looks like a screening test. The doctors I

choose to believe because they are successful, say that screening

tests are not good tests. The doctors who I choose to believe say to

kill the lyme for one, two or three months, then stop killing the

lyme for 3 days to 6 weeks, and test using this lab:

http://igenex.com/Website/

(select the Western Blot test)

Lyme lowers one's antibodies, so the antibodies do not show up in

tests. Often the doctors will test for lyme coinfections like

Babesia and Bartonella because many people with lyme will have these

infections which help the doctor know if the person has lyme.

Babesia and Bartonella are more likely to show up when tested.

Many parents report that their children with autism do lose their

autism symptoms upon a fever and also upon certain antibiotics. I

feel both do this because lyme does not like heat, and does not like

certain antibiotics because they can both kill lyme.

I choose to believe that most children with autism have lyme. My

children take herbs to kill lyme, and now they do not have any more

autism symptoms, except one that I adopted still has some

hyperactivity. But she has only been treated for about a year. This

is very good because she had really bad symptoms. People do use MMS

and also homeopathy to treat lyme. I can not tell you much about

these because I only like to talk about what I actually used. I

think you should know that many people use MMS, homeopathy and herbs

to treat children with autism, so sometimes people use many things.

My favorite treatment for lyme today is Samento which you can buy

over the internet at www.myherbs.net It is quite strong, so

everyone has to start with one drop a day and then increase as the

person is able without getting much sick. When lyme dies, often

people will get more sick at first. Burbur is what we use to keep us

from getting sick when the lyme is being killed. When the lyme is

being killed, we get more symptoms and less symptoms mixed

together.

At the website www.lymeinducedautism.com you will find much

information. On the right side of the page, click on more

information for lyme - autism. Then you will see two links. Both of

those links are power point presentations of doctors who are

successful at ridding lyme and autism. Also on the website

www.lymeinducedautism.com you can click on treatment options,

natural to learn of what some doctors and a herbalist do to treat

lyme. You can also click on treatment options, antibiotic to learn

of antibiotics used to treat lyme. When you look at all this and

decide what to do, then ask us more questions so we can tell you of

our experiences in using these things.

People from all over the world come to forums. Its good for us to

work together. I am happy to see all the love you have for your son.

Love and prayers,

Heidi N

>

>

> Hi,

>  

> Thanks for your reply....

>  

> I need to say that when ever my son get ill, using antibiotics

regress him soooo much...

> We need a month to recover him and brnig back to the point before

the antibiotics...

>  

> I notice that when ever my son have fewer, he get progress, his

behavior become much much better...

> I read many many children act in same way, progrewsssing during the

fewer....

> Im not sure, did fewer makes him better or antibiotics....

> Thats why I make this test for Lyme...

>  

> Can you please reply me, did my son have Lyme???

> Is this 0.67 a mark who say YES your son have Lyme or NOT????

>  

> Let me tell you few things...

>  

> Here in my country autism is a unknown illnesss.

> We have no Drs who is aware fo autism...

> Dont talk about DAN or any....

> There a few of them but they are not informed well...

> So, Im doing my own research..

> In last 15 months I spend 10 and more hours a day reading reading

and reading, informing and educate my self..

> Minute by minute hour by hour I swim in this ocean of

infromations,...., I was very confused in begining but happy at same

time... THERE IS HOPE FOM MY SON !!!!

>  

> We dont have support groups here, no one aware of ABA, Son Rise etc

etc....

> Im on my own, we are on our own....

>  

> So buying any of herbs is imposible here, cose we dont have them,

or any suplements...

> God is great and I met so many friend, parents who help me with all

is needed to treat my son...

> So, we dont have any herbs here, no Drs, and to fly to USA for Dr

is science fiction for me..

> Im strugling every day, but Im on the way to help my son...

>  

> A friend of mine, with autistic child, who is treated by Dr

Klinghardt, advice me the following:

>

> To use a solution that cleanse all the pathogens in the body.t is

called MMS.

> Here is the website:

> http://miraclemineralsolutions.com/

> And there is also a homeopathic nosode for the lyme infections,it

is called lyme disease nosode. Link:  www.biopureus.com.

>  

> Any info about these 2 remedies???

> Anyone use these 2 products for Lyme??

>  

> My best regards

> Goran

>  

>

>

[Guest guest]

What herbs, supplements have you all found to hit the cyst and cell

wall defiencient forms? I recently read through your notes, Heidi

(and thank you for sharing those), that grapeseed oil has been

proposed to hit cell wal defiencient and that andrographis hits cyst

forms. Then, someone passed on another list that garlic gets the cyst

form. Salt C claims to get cyst form and I thought I read soemwhere

that grapeseed oil does as well. Does anyone know how samento acts

and if it does address cyst and cell wall deficient form? I'm

concerned about (Rosner) creating more cyst forms with antimicrobial

use (such as samento, cumanda, banderol, etc) which from what I

understand multiply while in the dormant cyst form. Also, upon

reading the notes and looking into Klinghardt's power point

presentation, I am pretty much convinced that EMRs, the gut and

toxins are very much key for all of us and that gives me more

direction with my chlidren who are not autistic but I know exposed to

Bb. Heidi, has samento done most of the work for you Bb-ly speaking?

Thank you. Sal

>

> Goran:

>

> The test you show here looks like a screening test. The doctors I

> choose to believe because they are successful, say that screening

> tests are not good tests. The doctors who I choose to believe say

to

> kill the lyme for one, two or three months, then stop killing the

> lyme for 3 days to 6 weeks, and test using this lab:

>

> http://igenex.com/Website/

>

> (select the Western Blot test)

>

> Lyme lowers one's antibodies, so the antibodies do not show up in

> tests. Often the doctors will test for lyme coinfections like

> Babesia and Bartonella because many people with lyme will have

these

> infections which help the doctor know if the person has lyme.

> Babesia and Bartonella are more likely to show up when tested.

>

> Many parents report that their children with autism do lose their

> autism symptoms upon a fever and also upon certain antibiotics. I

> feel both do this because lyme does not like heat, and does not

like

> certain antibiotics because they can both kill lyme.

>

> I choose to believe that most children with autism have lyme. My

> children take herbs to kill lyme, and now they do not have any more

> autism symptoms, except one that I adopted still has some

> hyperactivity. But she has only been treated for about a year.

This

> is very good because she had really bad symptoms. People do use

MMS

> and also homeopathy to treat lyme. I can not tell you much about

> these because I only like to talk about what I actually used. I

> think you should know that many people use MMS, homeopathy and

herbs

> to treat children with autism, so sometimes people use many

things.

> My favorite treatment for lyme today is Samento which you can buy

> over the internet at www.myherbs.net It is quite strong, so

> everyone has to start with one drop a day and then increase as the

> person is able without getting much sick. When lyme dies, often

> people will get more sick at first. Burbur is what we use to keep

us

> from getting sick when the lyme is being killed. When the lyme is

> being killed, we get more symptoms and less symptoms mixed

> together.

>

> At the website www.lymeinducedautism.com you will find much

> information. On the right side of the page, click on more

> information for lyme - autism. Then you will see two links. Both

of

> those links are power point presentations of doctors who are

> successful at ridding lyme and autism. Also on the website

> www.lymeinducedautism.com you can click on treatment options,

> natural to learn of what some doctors and a herbalist do to treat

> lyme. You can also click on treatment options, antibiotic to

learn

> of antibiotics used to treat lyme. When you look at all this and

> decide what to do, then ask us more questions so we can tell you of

> our experiences in using these things.

>

> People from all over the world come to forums. Its good for us to

> work together. I am happy to see all the love you have for your

son.

>

[Guest guest]

Sal:

At this moment in time, I don't know all the nitty gritty stuff about

lyme. I have seen reports that lyme can change forms in less than a

minute. I have seen reports that success is obtained when treating

just one form and also when treating for all forms. Bacteria can

only live for so long no matter what stage they are in. I would have

to research a whole lot to learn all the details. Instead I choose

to go the easy route. What people say works is my route. If you

have lyme and you used Samento to make it go away, then I research

Samento, see if its safe, and jump in. I also make sure I use it

correctly, and learn of possible side effects, etc. If I see that

more people have success who also treat for coinfections, then I am

jumping onto that as well.

Thus, I am happy for the people who have the time and mental energy

to do all the details stuff, but I like to jump to the bottom line

because I feel like there are so many variables and pieces, and we

are not ever going to have all of them. Thus, I say what works is

what I go by. Therefore, as much as I am aware of all the forms, and

the different methods people talk about for the different forms, I

think the problem is much more grand than that, since lyme can change

forms in less than a minute.

We are recovered from doing supplements, diet, digestive aids, mild

immune boosters, anti-inflammatories, and detoxers. But we are all

still dependend upon such. Thus, we then moved on to ridding toxins

and pathogens. My children could do regular school basically without

killing the pathogens much, but since going after the pathogens,

their risidual symptoms are going away. Thus, I now have faith,

after lowing the pathogen and toxin load some more, they will be able

to not depend upon anything to be symptom-free other than a healthy

diet, because its possible to get lots of pathogens and toxins from

food.

Being said that, turmeric worked wonders but then a plateau, then we

did Samento and Resveratrol and now LDM-100. As each week goes by,

things just keep getting better and better. We plan on doing Enula

and Cumanda and some systemic enzymes. I need also to treat more for

worms, maybe, so I will be researching more in that area.

I have seen many doctor reports on the success of Samento as well as

from www.myherbs.net says that of all the products he sells,

Samento is the one that people say really helps them the most (in

general). We loved the results here. I had eczema for 26 years that

went away from the Samento. My children also stopped some of their

residual symptoms. I have one who stopped throwing fits and two that

started wrestling all day long, whereas before they had to be

enticed. They were a little hyper at church today, so we have some

more pathogens to rid, but I don't think even a professional would

diagnose my kids with anything now except maybe one for mild ADHD.

Thus, I am just saying, rid those germs.

At this point, I think many things work, just as long as you do

something. Probably best to do a few different things at some point

since each treatment you choose may not get all the pathogens you

need to rid. Just make sure the treatment you choose is safe, and do

it correctly. This reminds me, I need to ask Rita if LDM-100 makes

kids hyper. Unfortunately, I am tired, but my kids are hyper. It

would be nice to be the other way around, but then that wouldn't be

normal - shucks.

Heidi N

>

> What herbs, supplements have you all found to hit the cyst and cell

> wall defiencient forms? I recently read through your notes, Heidi

> (and thank you for sharing those), that grapeseed oil has been

> proposed to hit cell wal defiencient and that andrographis hits

cyst

> forms. Then, someone passed on another list that garlic gets the

cyst

> form. Salt C claims to get cyst form and I thought I read soemwhere

> that grapeseed oil does as well. Does anyone know how samento acts

> and if it does address cyst and cell wall deficient form? I'm

> concerned about (Rosner) creating more cyst forms with

antimicrobial

> use (such as samento, cumanda, banderol, etc) which from what I

> understand multiply while in the dormant cyst form. Also, upon

> reading the notes and looking into Klinghardt's power point

> presentation, I am pretty much convinced that EMRs, the gut and

> toxins are very much key for all of us and that gives me more

> direction with my chlidren who are not autistic but I know exposed

to

> Bb. Heidi, has samento done most of the work for you Bb-ly

speaking?

> Thank you. Sal

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Heidi,

It's great that you have been so successful with your children on

natural products.

I tried Cumanda a couple of years ago with my 2 kids, myself and

husband. It was a miracle for my daughter - the teacher had been

trying to get an aide for her in Oct., we did Cumanda in Nov., and in

Dec. she was the student of the month and no longer needed an aide.

However, it didn't do a thing for the rest of us. Definitely

worthwhile - helped 1 out of 4 of us.

My kids are a little hyper - I think it's time to revisist some of

the products before school starts up again--

Carol

> >

> > What herbs, supplements have you all found to hit the cyst and

cell

> > wall defiencient forms? I recently read through your notes, Heidi

> > (and thank you for sharing those), that grapeseed oil has been

> > proposed to hit cell wal defiencient and that andrographis hits

> cyst

> > forms. Then, someone passed on another list that garlic gets the

> cyst

> > form. Salt C claims to get cyst form and I thought I read

soemwhere

> > that grapeseed oil does as well. Does anyone know how samento

acts

> > and if it does address cyst and cell wall deficient form? I'm

> > concerned about (Rosner) creating more cyst forms with

> antimicrobial

> > use (such as samento, cumanda, banderol, etc) which from what I

> > understand multiply while in the dormant cyst form. Also, upon

> > reading the notes and looking into Klinghardt's power point

> > presentation, I am pretty much convinced that EMRs, the gut and

> > toxins are very much key for all of us and that gives me more

> > direction with my chlidren who are not autistic but I know

exposed

> to

> > Bb. Heidi, has samento done most of the work for you Bb-ly

> speaking?

> > Thank you. Sal

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Sal,NutriMedix Lyme herbs mainly hit on spirochetes and do not hit on cyst for CWD forms. This is why it is important to rotate herbs on a 12 days on and 2 days off schedule as recommended. So Borrelia can have a chance to be mobile and turns into spirochetes again during the off days, and then you hit on spirochetes with a different herb after the off days.LiminWhat herbs, supplements have you all found to hit the cyst and cell wall defiencient forms? I recently read through your notes, Heidi (and thank you for sharing those), that grapeseed oil has been proposed to hit cell wal defiencient and that andrographis hits cyst forms. Then, someone passed on another list that garlic gets the cyst form. Salt C claims to get cyst form and I thought I read soemwhere that grapeseed oil does as well. Does anyone know how samento acts and if it does address cyst and cell wall deficient form? I'm concerned about (Rosner) creating more cyst forms with antimicrobial use (such as samento, cumanda, banderol, etc) which from what I understand multiply while in the dormant cyst form. Also, upon reading the notes and looking into Klinghardt's power point presentation, I am pretty much convinced that EMRs, the gut and toxins are very much key for all of us and that gives me more direction with my chlidren who are not autistic but I know exposed to Bb. Heidi, has samento done most of the work for you Bb-ly speaking? Thank you. Sal>> Goran:> > The test you show here looks like a screening test. The doctors I > choose to believe because they are successful, say that screening > tests are not good tests. The doctors who I choose to believe say to > kill the lyme for one, two or three months, then stop killing the > lyme for 3 days to 6 weeks, and test using this lab:> > http://igenex.com/Website/> > (select the Western Blot test)> > Lyme lowers one's antibodies, so the antibodies do not show up in > tests. Often the doctors will test for lyme coinfections like > Babesia and Bartonella because many people with lyme will have these > infections which help the doctor know if the person has lyme. > Babesia and Bartonella are more likely to show up when tested.> > Many parents report that their children with autism do lose their > autism symptoms upon a fever and also upon certain antibiotics. I > feel both do this because lyme does not like heat, and does not like > certain antibiotics because they can both kill lyme. > > I choose to believe that most children with autism have lyme. My > children take herbs to kill lyme, and now they do not have any more > autism symptoms, except one that I adopted still has some > hyperactivity. But she has only been treated for about a year. This > is very good because she had really bad symptoms. People do use MMS > and also homeopathy to treat lyme. I can not tell you much about > these because I only like to talk about what I actually used. I > think you should know that many people use MMS, homeopathy and herbs > to treat children with autism, so sometimes people use many things. > My favorite treatment for lyme today is Samento which you can buy > over the internet at www.myherbs.net It is quite strong, so > everyone has to start with one drop a day and then increase as the > person is able without getting much sick. When lyme dies, often > people will get more sick at first. Burbur is what we use to keep us > from getting sick when the lyme is being killed. When the lyme is > being killed, we get more symptoms and less symptoms mixed > together. > > At the website www.lymeinducedautism.com you will find much > information. On the right side of the page, click on more > information for lyme - autism. Then you will see two links. Both of > those links are power point presentations of doctors who are > successful at ridding lyme and autism. Also on the website > www.lymeinducedautism.com you can click on treatment options, > natural to learn of what some doctors and a herbalist do to treat > lyme. You can also click on treatment options, antibiotic to learn > of antibiotics used to treat lyme. When you look at all this and > decide what to do, then ask us more questions so we can tell you of > our experiences in using these things. > > People from all over the world come to forums. Its good for us to > work together. I am happy to see all the love you have for your son.>

[Guest guest]

--- Thank you so much for sharing this, Heidi. You are helping me put

the pieces of our puzzle together. Sal

[Guest guest]

Hi Heidi,

Its Goran from Macedonia...

Sorry for delay, I was out of town for a while...

I talk with Dr about the test for Lyme and she say that this is not a screening test...

This is about the test:

VIDAS LYME IgG and IgM (LT)

is intendent for use with a VIDAS (VITEK IMMUNO DIAGNOSTIC) ASSAY SISTEM

Istrument ASAM automated qualitative enzyme linked flurescent immuno ASSAY (ELFA) for detection of total LYME IgG and IgM antibodies-BORELIA, BURGODORFERI in human serum.

About Pani and antibiotics..I need to mention something and look for your advice...

As Pani get some vrus and vomiting Dr give us antibiotic...This is second time as we see improvement with antibiotics..., but ....The progres of antibiotics we see after the 2 nd day or 3 day...and during the week he is better and better... but at the day 7, 8 or 9 specialy the last day I see bad behavior..I mean, more hiper, like he is not confortable, he start to itch him slef, and scratch him self, especially on stomsch - belly and legs.., mooo more, more finger play...more foggy today...These days his poo was great like never before and today I see that his poo is like not procesed...Interesting, yes, we see progress with antibiotics but it stay few days, more than 7 days we see regress again/....What is happening????? Advice...As he scratch him self on stomach we see like rash on his skeen on stomach...Probably the antibiotic kill the bacteria but kill other too and now some bad things happening in his

instenines, so probably I will have to increase some suplements!!!!Is it posible that I start rise and patatoes and give him little GF bread these days??

Regards

Goran

Subject: Re: OT - LYME TEST & QUESTIONS - NEED ADVICE PLEASE !!!To: BorreliaMultipleInfectionsAndAutism Date: Sunday, August 3, 2008, 4:03 AM

Goran:The test you show here looks like a screening test. The doctors I choose to believe because they are successful, say that screening tests are not good tests. The doctors who I choose to believe say to kill the lyme for one, two or three months, then stop killing the lyme for 3 days to 6 weeks, and test using this lab:http://igenex. com/Website/(select the Western Blot test)Lyme lowers one's antibodies, so the antibodies do not show up in tests. Often the doctors will test for lyme coinfections like Babesia and Bartonella because many people with lyme will have these infections which help the doctor know if the person has lyme. Babesia and Bartonella are more likely to show up when tested.Many parents report that their children with autism do lose their autism symptoms upon a fever and also upon certain

antibiotics. I feel both do this because lyme does not like heat, and does not like certain antibiotics because they can both kill lyme. I choose to believe that most children with autism have lyme. My children take herbs to kill lyme, and now they do not have any more autism symptoms, except one that I adopted still has some hyperactivity. But she has only been treated for about a year. This is very good because she had really bad symptoms. People do use MMS and also homeopathy to treat lyme. I can not tell you much about these because I only like to talk about what I actually used. I think you should know that many people use MMS, homeopathy and herbs to treat children with autism, so sometimes people use many things. My favorite treatment for lyme today is Samento which you can buy over the internet at www.myherbs. net It is quite strong, so everyone has to start with one drop a day and then

increase as the person is able without getting much sick. When lyme dies, often people will get more sick at first. Burbur is what we use to keep us from getting sick when the lyme is being killed. When the lyme is being killed, we get more symptoms and less symptoms mixed together. At the website www.lymeinducedauti sm.com you will find much information. On the right side of the page, click on more information for lyme - autism. Then you will see two links. Both of those links are power point presentations of doctors who are successful at ridding lyme and autism. Also on the website www.lymeinducedauti sm.com you can click on treatment options, natural to learn of what some doctors and a herbalist do to treat lyme. You can also click on treatment options, antibiotic to learn of antibiotics used to treat lyme. When you look at all this and decide what to do, then ask us more questions so we

can tell you of our experiences in using these things. People from all over the world come to forums. Its good for us to work together. I am happy to see all the love you have for your son.Love and prayers,Heidi N>> > Hi,> > Thanks for your reply....> > I need to say that when ever my son get ill, using antibiotics regress him soooo much...> We need a month to recover him and brnig back to the point before the antibiotics. ..> > I notice that when ever my son have fewer, he get progress, his behavior become much much better...> I read many many children act in same way, progrewsssing during the

fewer....> Im not sure, did fewer makes him better or antibiotics. ...> Thats why I make this test for Lyme...> > Can you please reply me, did my son have Lyme???> Is this 0.67 a mark who say YES your son have Lyme or NOT????> > Let me tell you few things...> > Here in my country autism is a unknown illnesss.> We have no Drs who is aware fo autism...> Dont talk about DAN or any....> There a few of them but they are not informed well...> So, Im doing my own research..> In last 15 months I spend 10 and more hours a day reading reading and reading, informing and educate my self..> Minute by minute hour by hour I swim in this ocean of infromations, ...., I was very confused in begining but happy at same time... THERE IS HOPE FOM MY SON !!!!> > We dont have support groups here, no one aware of ABA, Son

Rise etc etc....> Im on my own, we are on our own....> > So buying any of herbs is imposible here, cose we dont have them, or any suplements.. .> God is great and I met so many friend, parents who help me with all is needed to treat my son...> So, we dont have any herbs here, no Drs, and to fly to USA for Dr is science fiction for me..> Im strugling every day, but Im on the way to help my son...> > A friend of mine, with autistic child, who is treated by Dr Klinghardt, advice me the following:> > To use a solution that cleanse all the pathogens in the body.t is called MMS. > Here is the website: > http://miracleminer alsolutions. com/> And there is also a homeopathic nosode for the lyme infections,it is called lyme disease nosode. Link:

www.biopureus. com.> > Any info about these 2 remedies???> Anyone use these 2 products for Lyme??> > My best regards> Goran> > >

[Guest guest]

Goran:

From the reports I have seen, when you kill bad bacteria like lyme,

you get better the first few days. Then about a week you get worse

and stay worse for awhile, and then you get better again. Most

people will not test positive for lyme unless they go on antibiotics

or lyme-killing herbs for one to three months, and then go off of the

antibiotic for a few days to 6 weeks and then test for lyme. Lyme

does not like to live in the blood, so many times it may not be seen

in the blood. Yes, antibiotics do also kill good bacteria, and this

is also a problem because yeast grows and yeast is very bad. Many

use herbs to kill the bad bacteria, so they don't have to worry about

killing good bacteria and having yeast grow. My family is well using

herbs, and not using antibiotics. Some people like to use

antibiotics. I think people should decide for themself whether to

use antibiotics or to use herbs or to use both. I chose only herbs,

and we got well in only a few months. But, we still do herbs so we

can get fully well.

Most people do not eat wheat and milk when they are trying to fight

infections in children with autism. Other foods are ok, usually, but

each person has to decide what is best for them. Rice and potatoes

are good if they do not have gmo pesticides and if they are not full

of toxins, since some rice may have toxins from bad farming. GF

bread is considered good by some and not by some. Some feel that

bread needs to be from soaked grains.

Love and prayers,

Heidi N

> >

> >

> > Hi,

> >  

> > Thanks for your reply....

> >  

> > I need to say that when ever my son get ill, using antibiotics

> regress him soooo much...

> > We need a month to recover him and brnig back to the point before

> the antibiotics. ..

> >  

> > I notice that when ever my son have fewer, he get progress, his

> behavior become much much better...

> > I read many many children act in same way, progrewsssing during

the

> fewer....

> > Im not sure, did fewer makes him better or antibiotics. ...

> > Thats why I make this test for Lyme...

> >  

> > Can you please reply me, did my son have Lyme???

> > Is this 0.67 a mark who say YES your son have Lyme or NOT????

> >  

> > Let me tell you few things...

> >  

> > Here in my country autism is a unknown illnesss.

> > We have no Drs who is aware fo autism...

> > Dont talk about DAN or any....

> > There a few of them but they are not informed well...

> > So, Im doing my own research..

> > In last 15 months I spend 10 and more hours a day reading reading

> and reading, informing and educate my self..

> > Minute by minute hour by hour I swim in this ocean of

> infromations, ...., I was very confused in begining but happy at

same

> time... THERE IS HOPE FOM MY SON !!!!

> >  

> > We dont have support groups here, no one aware of ABA, Son Rise

etc

> etc....

> > Im on my own, we are on our own....

> >  

> > So buying any of herbs is imposible here, cose we dont have them,

> or any suplements.. .

> > God is great and I met so many friend, parents who help me with

all

> is needed to treat my son...

> > So, we dont have any herbs here, no Drs, and to fly to USA for Dr

> is science fiction for me..

> > Im strugling every day, but Im on the way to help my son...

> >  

> > A friend of mine, with autistic child, who is treated by Dr

> Klinghardt, advice me the following:

> >

> > To use a solution that cleanse all the pathogens in the body.t is

> called MMS.

> > Here is the website:

> > http://miracleminer alsolutions. com/

> > And there is also a homeopathic nosode for the lyme infections,it

> is called lyme disease nosode. Link:  www.biopureus. com.

> >  

> > Any info about these 2 remedies???

> > Anyone use these 2 products for Lyme??

> >  

> > My best regards

> > Goran

> >  

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I can say that this has been my experience as well so far. I felt

pretty good and was very hopeful for those first few days and then I

felt really bad and still feel bad for about 4 to 5 days now. I am

only just beginning my 2nd week, so can't say much beyond that.

I can say the same for my ASD son. He seemed pretty good for a few

days and then he went downhill. He is on Samento and anti-virals. He

is about 2 and 1/2 weeks in. I then plan to test him for Lyme at the

end of 6 weeks.

Just wanted to add to this.

Jane

>

> Goran:

>

> From the reports I have seen, when you kill bad bacteria like lyme,

> you get better the first few days. Then about a week you get worse

> and stay worse for awhile, and then you get better again. Most

> people will not test positive for lyme unless they go on antibiotics

> or lyme-killing herbs for one to three months, and then go off of the

> antibiotic for a few days to 6 weeks and then test for lyme.