Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Oh dear April, it's all so typical here. I think your FIL slept until noon, because your MIL gave him the extra dosage of Sominex the night before, because he was threatening her for it. I am not sure if Sominex comes in pill form or liquid, but one of the tricks here when our LOs threaten to have an extra dosage of medication is to give them a Tic Tac or Vitamin Pill in place of it and they usually don't know the difference. If it's liquid, substitute it with honey or something liquidy. I'm not sure how a LO would react to Sominex, it could make them very confused, since they are highly sensitive to medications and your FIL was reacting to the first dosage and that is why he was threatening. There are only certain medications for sleeping that are compatible for LBD. It is a good thing that the guns are locked up. I sure hope that you have all made sure that they are and any other weapons he can use, such as cuttlery in the house or anything that can be used as a weapon. It is not a joke that they can use these things, because they are not in their right mind. It should be taken very seriously. Also, one of the symptoms of LBD besides visual hallucinations is smell and smelling smoke is one of the common hallucinations. Your mother needs to play along with it. My husband also smells smoke from time to time and I have dialed POPCORN that gives the time on the phone and pretended to talk with the fire dept. about it. That is all you need to do to make them feel something has been done. They can not reason about the fire truck showing up. My husband doesn't care after the call has been made. Others have other things that they do, I actually read where someone went on the roof with a hose to relieve the LO. Your mother will have to act some things out. I know it sounds weird, but sometimes to alleviate the urgency for them, you need to become a part of the hallucination to put an end to it. Also, there is taste, touch and hearing hallucinations too, besides the visual hallucinations. April, it is only going to get worse before it gets better, but your mother will have to play the game, tell little white lies, it's survival for the caregiver. I hope this helps you a little to realize it is only LBD doing it's thing and your MIL is not alone. Hugs, Jan --- aswest1021 wrote: > Hi Everyone, > > I just returned from having lunch with my husband. > He had spoken to > his mom earlier today. She informed him that she > had an awful night > with my FIL last night/early morning. He awakened > my MIL around 2 > a.m. saying he couldn't sleep. He wandered all > throughout the house > for awhile, then he started demanding that my MIL > give him some more > sleeping medication. He takes some sort of medicine > right before > bedtime that helps him relax so he'll sleep better. > She refused > because he'd already taken the prescribed dosage. > My MIL said my > FIL started screaming at her saying, " Give me my > medicine now! " He > went into the bathroom and tore through nearly every > drawer in there > looking for it. She said she got very nervous about > the way he was > acting and even told herself that if he had found a > gun, he probably > would have shot her. Now, how scary is that? My > MIL finally caved > in and gave him some Sominex and he, supposedly, > went to sleep > eventually. > > My MIL said he got up this morning and just wasn't > acting quite > right. She said she gave him some cereal because > she didn't have > time to make him anything. After awhile, she came > to the conclusion > that he was still asleep, so she took him and put > him back to bed. > At noon today, he was still asleep in bed and he > usually gets up > around 7 a.m. > > Yesterday, as they were getting ready to walk out > the door to go to > church, my FIL had a bout of diarrhea, so my MIL had > to clean him > up. She had to call my BIL down to stay with my > FIL, so my she > could go on to church. She also mentioned that my > FIL thought he > smelled smoke yesterday and made my BIL climb up > into the attic to > make sure something wasn't on fire; all was fine. > When my BIL told > my FIL that everything checked out, my FIL said, > " Are you calling me > a liar? " He's actually said that many times before. > It's as though > he feels that no one believes him. > > I definitely believe the time has come for my MIL to > either get > someone to come in and help her or to put my FIL in > an assisted > living facility. She simply cannot keep up at this > pace. My heart > just breaks for her each time I hear about what > she's having to > endure. My FIL will see a neurologist here in > Atlanta by the name > of Dr. Factor on April 25th for a second > opinion. I hope he > will be able to encourage my MIL to find some help. > If she keeps > going like this, she will not be around in the next > several years. > > Thanks for listening. > > April > > > > Jan Colello, wife of Jim, dx w/Parkinsons 1993 and LBD 2003San Francisco Bay Area, California __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Hello April, Since I just got off of the emotional roller coaster that Jan is talking about I feel qualified to respond to what you wrote: " Is there truly improvement on the horizon or are we just kidding ourselves? " If your FIL truly has LBD you ARE kidding yourselves if you think he will get better, because he won't. He will " plateau " and then get slightly worse each week/month and you won't notice it because he will fool your emotions into thinking all is well with the " SHOWTIME " that LBD LO's are master of. He wasn't " better " or " improved " when your husband " saw " his Dad. He " saw " SHOWTIME and I'm betting your FIL went right back to his LBD ways as soon as your husband got into his car. My Uncle is in the last, long stage of LBD (actually PDD) and he was in the stage your FIL is in now for TWO YEARS before he dipped silently into this current stage. It was grueling and emotionally frustrating (read past posts I wrote) because Mr. B thought nothing was wrong with him and when his friends would come over they thought I was fibbing to them about his condition. It was horrible and it almost put me into the hospital. Your FIL has a bit of a way to go if he has LBD/PDD and the best thing to do at this point is breathe and try not to get too dizzy from the ride. Much Peace sent to you and your family, Stevie Stevie in So. California LO - Mr. B (Uncle) 82 yrs. Lives in my home - 3 yrs. DX Parkinson's 1993 DX LBD 2003 - probably has PDD End stage meds: Hytrin, E.S Tylenol (Hallies have subsided) ...but have started up again. Was on: Sinemet, Seroguel, Elavil, Lasix, Hytrin, Roxinal, Aciphex, Amitriptyline Was given Ativan and Seroquel in NH for 5 days (Jan '06), hasn't been the same since Daily BP usually 68/52 Severe shoulder pain, hip pain, and shortness of breath. Now taking Trilisate Liquid for pain - seems to be working UTI since 4/7 not getting any better - took Bactrim Sleeping most of the day, breathing becoming an issue, asking for oxygen daily. Uncle got a Living Trust when he was still living on his own. * * * * * * --- aswest1021 wrote: > Jan, > > You wrote, " Things will get worse before they get > better. " > Is there truly improvement on the horizon or are we > just kidding > ourselves? > > By the way, my husband drove over and saw my in-laws > tonight on his > way to a meeting. He said my FIL got around > amazingly well. It's > astonishing how things can change day to day, moment > to moment. > > April > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Sorry, April, I meant for your MIL. If she doesn't play the game, she will burn out before your FIL. So things will get worse before they get better for her. She can not think of things realistically and give your FIL overdoses of medication, because he demands it. He does not know what he is doing when he is in a state of confusion like that. She needs to substitute a vitamin pill or a candy or honey or molasses or something syrupy for the liquid instead of giving him overdoses, because he is demanding. The smoke smell is a common hallucination smell. One of the caregivers here at one time had such a hard time with convincing her LO that there was no smoke, she took the hose and sparayed the roof. Sometimes you have to get into the hallucination to put an end to it and it will satisfy the LO. It is a very rocky road of ups and downs, you never know where you are at from day to day with your LO. And sometimes things do appear to get better with the LO and causes the caregiver to think that maybe things are getting better and then the dip comes again and more nightmares. No, the LO can not actually get better as in overcome the illness, but they can plateau where things seem to not get any worse for awhile. Your last paragraph explains what I am trying to tell you about the ups and down and emotional roller coaster of this disease. Unless you see the person constantly, what you see may not be what your MIL sees. The comparison from what you saw at your house recently to what your husband just saw explains that. I hope this answers some of your questions. I am sorry that I confused you. Jan --- aswest1021 wrote: > Jan, > > You wrote, " Things will get worse before they get > better. " > Is there truly improvement on the horizon or are we > just kidding > ourselves? > > By the way, my husband drove over and saw my in-laws > tonight on his > way to a meeting. He said my FIL got around > amazingly well. It's > astonishing how things can change day to day, moment > to moment. > > April > > > > > > > > Hi Everyone, > > > > > > I just returned from having lunch with my > husband. > > > He had spoken to > > > his mom earlier today. She informed him that > she > > > had an awful night > > > with my FIL last night/early morning. He > awakened > > > my MIL around 2 > > > a.m. saying he couldn't sleep. He wandered all > > > throughout the house > > > for awhile, then he started demanding that my > MIL > > > give him some more > > > sleeping medication. He takes some sort of > medicine > > > right before > > > bedtime that helps him relax so he'll sleep > better. > > > She refused > > > because he'd already taken the prescribed > dosage. > > > My MIL said my > > > FIL started screaming at her saying, " Give me my > > > medicine now! " He > > > went into the bathroom and tore through nearly > every > > > drawer in there > > > looking for it. She said she got very nervous > about > > > the way he was > > > acting and even told herself that if he had > found a > > > gun, he probably > > > would have shot her. Now, how scary is that? > My > > > MIL finally caved > > > in and gave him some Sominex and he, supposedly, > > > went to sleep > > > eventually. > > > > > > My MIL said he got up this morning and just > wasn't > > > acting quite > > > right. She said she gave him some cereal > because > > > she didn't have > > > time to make him anything. After awhile, she > came > > > to the conclusion > > > that he was still asleep, so she took him and > put > > > him back to bed. > > > At noon today, he was still asleep in bed and he > > > usually gets up > > > around 7 a.m. > > > > > > Yesterday, as they were getting ready to walk > out > > > the door to go to > > > church, my FIL had a bout of diarrhea, so my MIL > had > > > to clean him > > > up. She had to call my BIL down to stay with my > > > FIL, so my she > > > could go on to church. She also mentioned that > my > > > FIL thought he > > > smelled smoke yesterday and made my BIL climb up > > > into the attic to > > > make sure something wasn't on fire; all was > fine. > > > When my BIL told > > > my FIL that everything checked out, my FIL said, > > > " Are you calling me > > > a liar? " He's actually said that many times > before. > > > It's as though > > > he feels that no one believes him. > > > > > > I definitely believe the time has come for my > MIL to > > > either get > > > someone to come in and help her or to put my FIL > in > > > an assisted > > > living facility. She simply cannot keep up at > this > > > pace. My heart > > > just breaks for her each time I hear about what > > > she's having to > > > endure. My FIL will see a neurologist here in > > > Atlanta by the name > === message truncated === Jan Colello, wife of Jim, dx w/Parkinsons 1993 and LBD 2003San Francisco Bay Area, California __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 April, not all LOs are combative, but many are. My husband also is combative. There are some things that can cause combativeness even if the person typically is not combative and that is any kind of infection, such as a UTI (Urinary Tract Infection) Pneumonia, Also, Anesthetics and if the medications are wrong and not compatible with LBD. My husband is normally combative and the things that he usually is combative about is toileting, he does not recognize a toilet, but in the day when he is awake, he can tell me he needs to go to the bathroom, but when he gets there he does not want to go in the toilet and will hit at me, attempt to push me and kick at me to avoid the toilet and would rather pee on the floor. It is always an argument. I wouldn't mind if he would just pee in his diaper, but he pulls them down to pee on the floor and all over his clothes that are pulled down around his knees. When he is sleeping he is incontinent and pees in his diaper, which is so much easier for me. Other things are when he wants to be independent, but he is not safe in what he wants to do and I interfere for his safety, he gets very aggressive with me. He is obsessive with tearing things out of drawers and closets and redistributing them to other areas and forgets where he puts them, so I interfere with that, because I am tired of playing the witch hunt to find things and this makes him combative too. Also, if he forgets he already took his pills and wants more and insists I need to give him his pills, he is combative. First, you must deduct if the combativeness is due to a UTI, which is very common with our LOs, or other infections or if the LO just had surgery, it could be due to anesthetics or medications. If the LO is typically reacting to things that make them combative, such as my husband, to cope I have learned that when my husband is combative about the toilet, if I grab his diapers and pants and pull them up quickly, before he can hit me from behind him and get him in his transport chair. (A transport chair is like a wheel chair, but has 4 small wheels, instead of the two large wheels and the person can not manipulate it, they have to depend on someone to push it or they use their feet to push and get around . Also, it is very light to get it into a car) Anyway, once I get him out of the bathroom and into another room and try again in about 5 minutes, he forgets about he doesn't recognize a toilet and will then use the toilet. Things can turn around so fast, so I found if I give it a rest and return a few minutes later, it usually works. When he wants to be independent, but safety is involved I have put a dead bolt on the door, so he can not escape when no one is assisting him. He can not figure out how to open it. Or if it is other issues I try to distract him with something else to get him out of the situation and if he wants medication, because he forgot he already had his medication, I give him a vitamin pill in place of it and he doesn't know the difference. When he is in his tearing everything out of drawers and closet frenzy, I have a box for him to put the things in and tell him we will put them in a place where you want them after you get them all in the box and then he is willing to help me put them back to where they belong, because the box distracts him from putting the things in other areas. These are things I have found to help me cope, instead of the battles and the aggressiveness. It doesn't always work and there is still the stresses, but it mostly works and is helpful and that is a relief when it works. Your MIL will have to find coping skills that can help her distract the situation or play a game of strategy and be a step ahead of your FIL or even as has been said here many times little white lies, because it is for a safety issue and sometimes has to be done. Your MIL can not think realistically, she has to get into your FILs world or she will not survive. Your FIL can no longer reason and she has to do that for him and stop following what he says when it is not safe for him, but make the situation safe for him with strategy. It is very wearing, but there are ways to cope. I hope this has helped somewhat. With LBD, not everyone follows the same pattern, that is what is so frustrating. Your MIL has a long ways to go, so she has to start picking up coping skills that work for her. Generally, LBD is 5 - 7 years, of course not everyone is going to be right on those years, some may be earlier and some later. But that is the general amount of years for LBD. Take care April.........Jan --- aswest1021 wrote: > Thanks for clearing that up, Jan. Wonder why > smelling smoke is a > common hallucination? Evidently, my FIL has had > that before. Also, > is my FIL's combativeness a symptom of the disease > or is it a > reaction to something? I know it really scared my > MIL. Are there > ways to avoid it happening again in the future? > > April > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh dear April, it's all so typical here. I > think > > > your > > > > FIL slept until noon, because your MIL gave > him > > > the > > > > extra dosage of Sominex the night before, > because > > > he > > > > was threatening her for it. I am not sure if > > > Sominex > > > > comes in pill form or liquid, but one of the > > > tricks > > > > here when our LOs threaten to have an extra > dosage > > > of > > > > medication is to give them a Tic Tac or > Vitamin > > > Pill > > > > in place of it and they usually don't know the > > > > difference. If it's liquid, substitute it > with > > > honey > > > > or something liquidy. I'm not sure how a LO > would > > > > react to Sominex, it could make them very > > > confused, > > > > since they are highly sensitive to medications > and > > > > your FIL was reacting to the first dosage and > that > > > is > > > > why he was threatening. There are only certain > > > > medications for sleeping that are compatible > for > > > LBD. > > > > It is a good thing that the guns are locked > up. I > > > sure > > > > hope that you have all made sure that they are > and > > > any > > > > other weapons he can use, such as cuttlery in > the > > > > house or anything that can be used as a > weapon. It > > > is > > > > not a joke that they can use these things, > because > > > > they are not in their right mind. It should be > > > taken > > > > very seriously. > > > > Also, one of the symptoms of LBD besides > visual > > > > hallucinations is smell and smelling smoke is > one > > > of > > > > the common hallucinations. Your mother needs > to > > > play > > > > along with it. My husband also smells smoke > from > > > time > > > > to time and I have dialed POPCORN that gives > the > > > time > > > > on the phone and pretended to talk with the > fire > > > dept. > > > > about it. That is all you need to do to make > them > > > feel > > > > something has been done. They can not reason > about > > > the > > > > fire truck showing up. My husband doesn't care > > > after > > > > the call has been made. Others have other > things > > > that > > > > they do, I actually read where someone went on > the > > > > roof with a hose to relieve the LO. Your > mother > > > will > > > > have to act some things out. I know it sounds > > > weird, > > > > but sometimes to alleviate the urgency for > them, > > > you > > > > need to become a part of the hallucination to > put > > > an > > > > end to it. Also, there is taste, touch and > hearing > > > > hallucinations too, besides the visual > > > hallucinations. > > > > > > > > April, it is only going to get worse before it > === message truncated === Jan Colello, wife of Jim, dx w/Parkinsons 1993 and LBD 2003San Francisco Bay Area, California __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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