OCD

[Guest guest]

I've read somewhere that use of inositol has to be consistently done

and results take time...somewhere up to 3 weeks or more. Just an FYI.

Mindy

> >

> > OCD tends to be linked to low serotonin

> >

> > For OCD, try inositol and tryptophan/5HTP. B6/P5P can also help

a

> > little. But inositol has a real track record in this area and

> helps

> > most people. andy put me onto it and we got almost instant

results

> >

> > look at giving tryptophan-rich foods with carbs (eg dairy with

> grains,

> > yogurt with mashed banana, chicken/turkey with vegetables.)

turkey

> > breast is esp. hihg in tryptophan

> >

> > also look at cleaning up gut problems, esp. constipation, as

> serotonin

> > also acts in the gut. Butyrate, a short-cahin fatty acid, can

help

> > with this

> >

> > Steve

[Guest guest]

Well this didnt work out too well at all. After 3 days of GABA and one

day of Rhodiola had a meltdown of sorts last night and started

thrusting his tongue and could not control his finger stimming. He was

sweating profusely. Finally calmed him down and kept a cool towel on

his head. Cant tell you how scary that was. I stopped and today have

not seen this behavior. Eileen

> Hi All: Just heard from Nurse at Pfeiffer re s OCD increase. I

> was advised to give hime GABA 500mg once or twice a day for 6 to 7

days

> and also a bottle worth of Rhodiola Extract to see how it goes.

Anyone

> ever use Rhodiola? Thanks Eileen

[Guest guest]

My daughter and ex-husband have OCD and it goes away with regular

meals that are not fast carb heavy. That is, it does come back if

meals are skipped, or skimpy on protein, or if there are

sweets/carbs alone on an empty stomach. Even fruit alone could do

it. So the deal was, regular meals with protein and things leveled

out. Never had to go to the next level (allergies or additives)

because we just used plain whole foods. Oh - lack of sleep brings it

back too.

Connie

> Has anyone ever dealt with obsessive-compulsive tendencies in a

child who

> shows no signs of autism or ADD? My husband is mild OCD (his

favorite

> television show is Monk :->), and my toddler who will be 3 in

October is

> showing some of the same tendencies. Because I've never been

around

> toddlers before, I'm not sure how much of this is being a normal

toddler,

> and how much isn't. I'm wondering if there's anything

nutritionally I can

> do to help her.

>

> Thanks,

> KerryAnn , owner of NTOAMC

> Batch and freezer cooking the NT way!

> NTOAMC/

> http://cookingnt.blogspot.com/

[Guest guest]

KerryAnn wrote:

>Has anyone ever dealt with obsessive-compulsive tendencies in a child who

>shows no signs of autism or ADD? My husband is mild OCD (his favorite

>television show is Monk :->), and my toddler who will be 3 in October is

>showing some of the same tendencies. Because I've never been around

>toddlers before, I'm not sure how much of this is being a normal toddler,

>and how much isn't. I'm wondering if there's anything nutritionally I can

>do to help her.

>

>

>

On another food issues list I'm on, fish oil seems to be a great broad

spectrum superfood that solves quite a few brain-based challenges.

(Funny how things go in groups, since this is coming up for discussion

again there....LOL!) I'm trying to remember if McCandless addresses OCD

in her book _Children With Starving Brains_, which is largely about ASD

stuff, but you might want to check it out. She's very convinced about

the role of Omega-3's in healthy neurological brain function, so it

makes sense to me that it could potentially solve any number of

neurological difficulties. The upside to fish oil and O-3's is that it

is a low risk intervention. I haven't seen studies about the

subject--perhaps others here might have--but McCandless mentions that

there hasn't been a ceiling established for a safe upper range dosage of

fish oil the way there has been for CLO, so fish oil can be dosed more

heavily IOT up the O-3 intake until symptoms improve.

Based on what I've read, it would be a relatively safe thing to trial.....

--s

[Guest guest]

>-----Original Message-----

>From:

>[mailto: ]On Behalf Of KerryAnn

>

>

>Has anyone ever dealt with obsessive-compulsive tendencies in a child who

>shows no signs of autism or ADD? My husband is mild OCD (his favorite

>television show is Monk :->), and my toddler who will be 3 in October is

>showing some of the same tendencies. Because I've never been around

>toddlers before, I'm not sure how much of this is being a normal toddler,

>and how much isn't. I'm wondering if there's anything nutritionally I can

>do to help her.

You might want to pick up a copy of Ross' " The Mood Cure " . She

discusses OCD and dietary and supplement treatments for it. It basically is

a result of low serotonin. The precursor to serotonin is tryptophan, which

is very low in the typical American diet. She recommends 5HTP (a more active

form of tryptophan) and protein at every meal. Preferably grass-fed meat

which is higher in tryptophan than grain-fed. If the 5HTP doesn't work, she

recommends other things. Could be a thyroid issue too, as I think one of the

thyroid hormones are required to convert tryptophan or 5HTP to serotonin.

She discusses this and ways to trouble shoot if the initial recommendations

don't work.

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

“The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times.” --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

[Guest guest]

The Potatoes not Prozac program also raises serotonin, with whole

foods. The problem with throwing fractionated supplements like 5HTP

and tryptophan is that there are 4 different kinds of serotonin and

people have wildly varying amounts of disregulation, so that some

people have a bad reaction to 5HTP, but few people can screw up with a

potato. Just my opinion and experience.

Connie

> She discusses this and ways to trouble shoot if the initial

recommendations

> don't work.

>

>

>

> Suze Fisher

[Guest guest]

>-----Original Message-----

>From:

>[mailto: ]On Behalf Of cbrown2008

>

>

>The Potatoes not Prozac program also raises serotonin, with whole

>foods. The problem with throwing fractionated supplements like 5HTP

>and tryptophan is that there are 4 different kinds of serotonin and

>people have wildly varying amounts of disregulation, so that some

>people have a bad reaction to 5HTP, but few people can screw up with a

>potato. Just my opinion and experience.

Right, that's why I suggested she get the book. She can read more of the

complexities of the recommendations as opposed to a brief and incomplete

summary that I can give on the list. It may not have the answer to her

child's problem, but so many of us NT'ers seem to have had good success

witih Ross' program that I definitely think it's worth looking into.

I've not heard of anyone having bad reactions to 5HTP. From what I

understand it's very well tolerated. But of course biochemical differences

means that won't be uniform. I've had pretty good results using 5HTP for my

OCD, FWIW.

But then I eat potatoes too. <g>

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

“The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times.” --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

[Guest guest]

<<You might want to pick up a copy of Ross' " The Mood Cure " . She

discusses OCD and dietary and supplement treatments for it. It basically is

a result of low serotonin. The precursor to serotonin is tryptophan, which

is very low in the typical American diet. She recommends 5HTP (a more active>>

I'll 2nd that. I bought it a month or so ago and it seems to be helping me with

some problems. However i don't have OCD.

Kathy A.

[Guest guest]

KerryAnn,

Does she exhibit the exact same tendencies as your hubby? Its just a

thought, but she might just be learning the behavior from him.

Sincerely,

Lana M. Gibbons

On 9/9/05, KerryAnn <krankedyann@...> wrote:

> Has anyone ever dealt with obsessive-compulsive tendencies in a child who

> shows no signs of autism or ADD? My husband is mild OCD (his favorite

> television show is Monk :->), and my toddler who will be 3 in October is

> showing some of the same tendencies. Because I've never been around

> toddlers before, I'm not sure how much of this is being a normal toddler,

> and how much isn't. I'm wondering if there's anything nutritionally I can

> do to help her.

[Guest guest]

I have not fully read " The Mood Cure " but I have flipped through it. I have

bought the companion book " The Diet Cure " because so much of it made sense

to me and mirrored what I already believed. One thing I noted is that she

repeatedly mentions that the supplements are temporary. Just to get your

body back on track, cut food cravings and othe symptoms. Each individual is

unique and requires an appropriate diagnosis to know what supplements (

there are quizzes in the book to help determine what you may need). The big

one is the amino acids, which oddly enough, right after I read about this, I

found a brochure at my ND's office about amino acid testing and how it can

help.

Carli

>

> >You might want to pick up a copy of Ross' " The Mood Cure " . She

> discusses OCD and dietary and supplement treatments for it.

>

> Suze Fisher

>

> >The Potatoes not Prozac program also raises serotonin, with whole

> foods. The problem with throwing fractionated supplements like 5HTP

> and tryptophan is that there are 4 different kinds of serotonin and

> people have wildly varying amounts of disregulation, so that some

> people have a bad reaction to 5HTP, but few people can screw up with a

> potato. Just my opinion and experience.

>

> Connie

>

> > She discusses this and ways to trouble shoot if the initial

> recommendations

> > don't work.

> >

> >

> >

> > Suze Fisher

>

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________________________________________________

> ________________________________________________________________________

>

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[Guest guest]

On 9/10/05, Suzanne Noakes <snoakes@...> wrote:

> On another food issues list I'm on, fish oil seems to be a great broad

> spectrum superfood that solves quite a few brain-based challenges.

> (Funny how things go in groups, since this is coming up for discussion

> again there....LOL!) I'm trying to remember if McCandless addresses OCD

> in her book _Children With Starving Brains_, which is largely about ASD

> stuff, but you might want to check it out. She's very convinced about

> the role of Omega-3's in healthy neurological brain function, so it

> makes sense to me that it could potentially solve any number of

> neurological difficulties. The upside to fish oil and O-3's is that it

> is a low risk intervention. I haven't seen studies about the

> subject--perhaps others here might have--but McCandless mentions that

> there hasn't been a ceiling established for a safe upper range dosage of

> fish oil the way there has been for CLO, so fish oil can be dosed more

> heavily IOT up the O-3 intake until symptoms improve.

>

> Based on what I've read, it would be a relatively safe thing to trial.....

The safe upper limit on CLO is bogus and not evidence-based, so I

disagree. Additionally, it is very, very, very established that

omega-3 PUFAs raise lipid peroxides significantly, which contributes

to cancer and a wide range of diseases, and causes the accumulation of

lipfuscin, the aging pigment.

However, the studies I've seen show that *CLO* actually *depresses*

lipid peroxidation. Yet DHA and EPA isolates, which are comparable to

fish oil, raise lipid peroxidation.

So, I would say that taking high doses of CLO is safer than taking

high doses of fish oil. You would have to take a pretty enormous dose

for there to be any true safety risk for vitamins A or D.

By the way, the proper abbreviation for " omega-3 " if you do not have

easy access to Greek alphabet characters is " n-3, " not " O-3. "

Chris

--

Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

On 9/10/05, Suze Fisher <s.fisher22@...> quoted someone else:

> >The Potatoes not Prozac program also raises serotonin, with whole

> >foods. The problem with throwing fractionated supplements like 5HTP

> >and tryptophan is that there are 4 different kinds of serotonin and

> >people have wildly varying amounts of disregulation, so that some

> >people have a bad reaction to 5HTP, but few people can screw up with a

> >potato. Just my opinion and experience.

Oh, *I* can screw up with a potato. Trust me. ;-)

I don't really see how they are comparable. Aren't the two treatments

approaching it from a different angle? I thought the potatoes were

for the starch, because insulin is involved in the conversion, or

something like that (although I admit I haven't read the book.) If

the potato is actually to derive tryptophan from then I imagine a lot

of people would have trouble absorbing it. If the potato is not for

the tryptophan specifically, then it wouldn't work for people who are

deficient in tryptophan-- but might enhance the effect of the

trytophan.

Chris

--

Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

Then what is CLO? I assumed it is an omega 3 oil,

being that it is from fish.

Does CLO, also balance out lipid chemistry, the way

omega 3 fish oil does?

jafa

--- Masterjohn <chrismasterjohn@...>

wrote:

> On 9/10/05, Suzanne Noakes <snoakes@...>

> wrote:

>

> > On another food issues list I'm on, fish oil seems

> to be a great broad

> > spectrum superfood that solves quite a few

> brain-based challenges.

> > (Funny how things go in groups, since this is

> coming up for discussion

> > again there....LOL!) I'm trying to remember if

> McCandless addresses OCD

> > in her book _Children With Starving Brains_, which

> is largely about ASD

> > stuff, but you might want to check it out. She's

> very convinced about

> > the role of Omega-3's in healthy neurological

> brain function, so it

> > makes sense to me that it could potentially solve

> any number of

> > neurological difficulties. The upside to fish oil

> and O-3's is that it

> > is a low risk intervention. I haven't seen

> studies about the

> > subject--perhaps others here might have--but

> McCandless mentions that

> > there hasn't been a ceiling established for a safe

> upper range dosage of

> > fish oil the way there has been for CLO, so fish

> oil can be dosed more

> > heavily IOT up the O-3 intake until symptoms

> improve.

> >

> > Based on what I've read, it would be a relatively

> safe thing to trial.....

>

> The safe upper limit on CLO is bogus and not

> evidence-based, so I

> disagree. Additionally, it is very, very, very

> established that

> omega-3 PUFAs raise lipid peroxides significantly,

> which contributes

> to cancer and a wide range of diseases, and causes

> the accumulation of

> lipfuscin, the aging pigment.

>

> However, the studies I've seen show that *CLO*

> actually *depresses*

> lipid peroxidation. Yet DHA and EPA isolates, which

> are comparable to

> fish oil, raise lipid peroxidation.

>

> So, I would say that taking high doses of CLO is

> safer than taking

> high doses of fish oil. You would have to take a

> pretty enormous dose

> for there to be any true safety risk for vitamins A

> or D.

>

> By the way, the proper abbreviation for " omega-3 " if

> you do not have

> easy access to Greek alphabet characters is " n-3, "

> not " O-3. "

>

> Chris

>

> --

> Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

> Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

> http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

On 9/10/05, jafa <jafasum@...> wrote:

>

>

> Then what is CLO? I assumed it is an omega 3 oil,

> being that it is from fish.

It is. The difference is primarily that CLO is high in vitamins A and

D. Both are very high in EPA and DHA, the important n-3 fatty acids.

Chris

--

Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

You know that was true for me. I only needed to do things just for

serotonin support until my level was raised, and now I can keep it

topped off with food, exercise, and sleep. Hmm the same old boring

healthy things. No more Seasonal Affective Disorder and what a

relief that is.

although I do still take fish oil.

Connie

> repeatedly mentions that the supplements are temporary. Just to

get your

> body back on track, cut food cravings and othe symptoms. Each

individual is

> unique and requires an appropriate diagnosis to know what

supplements (

> there are quizzes in the book to help determine what you may

need). The big

> one is the amino acids, which oddly enough, right after I read

about this, I

> found a brochure at my ND's office about amino acid testing and

how it can

> help.

> Carli

have been removed]

[Guest guest]

Then why isn't CLO a problem in raising PUFA in the

body?

jafa

--- Masterjohn <chrismasterjohn@...>

wrote:

> On 9/10/05, jafa <jafasum@...> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Then what is CLO? I assumed it is an omega 3 oil,

> > being that it is from fish.

>

> It is. The difference is primarily that CLO is high

> in vitamins A and

> D. Both are very high in EPA and DHA, the important

> n-3 fatty acids.

>

> Chris

>

> --

> Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

> Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

> http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

>

______________________________________________________

Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

http://store./redcross-donate3/

[Guest guest]

Masterjohn wrote:

>On 9/10/05, Suzanne Noakes <snoakes@...> wrote:

>

>

>

>>On another food issues list I'm on, fish oil seems to be a great broad

>>spectrum superfood that solves quite a few brain-based challenges.

>>(Funny how things go in groups, since this is coming up for discussion

>>again there....LOL!) I'm trying to remember if McCandless addresses OCD

>>in her book _Children With Starving Brains_, which is largely about ASD

>>stuff, but you might want to check it out. She's very convinced about

>>the role of Omega-3's in healthy neurological brain function, so it

>>makes sense to me that it could potentially solve any number of

>>neurological difficulties. The upside to fish oil and O-3's is that it

>>is a low risk intervention. I haven't seen studies about the

>>subject--perhaps others here might have--but McCandless mentions that

>>there hasn't been a ceiling established for a safe upper range dosage of

>>fish oil the way there has been for CLO, so fish oil can be dosed more

>>heavily IOT up the O-3 intake until symptoms improve.

>>

>>Based on what I've read, it would be a relatively safe thing to trial.....

>>

>>

>

>The safe upper limit on CLO is bogus and not evidence-based, so I

>disagree.

>

And I knew you would. This is just what McCandless offers, no more,

no less.

>So, I would say that taking high doses of CLO is safer than taking

>high doses of fish oil. You would have to take a pretty enormous dose

>for there to be any true safety risk for vitamins A or D.

>

>

>

Krispin Sullivan would probably disagree with you. (I'd love to see a

discussion of _Naked at Noon_ around here. ) Unless someone is

getting regular testing of their vitamin D levels, I'm going to feel

mighty uncomfortable recommending dosages above 800 IU daily and not

even that much on more Southern latitudes. But that's me. <shrug>

>By the way, the proper abbreviation for " omega-3 " if you do not have

>easy access to Greek alphabet characters is " n-3, " not " O-3. "

>

>Chris

>

>

>

So.....does that mean you *haven't* taken you CLO today.....?

--s, who pieced this email together two letters at a time between A

Bug's Life updates and rotating interruptions (wondering why they aren't

still asleep!), so apologizes for any incoherencies.

[Guest guest]

On 9/11/05, jafa <jafasum@...> wrote:

>

>

> Then why isn't CLO a problem in raising PUFA in the

> body?

The whole point of taking it is for the PUFA (n-3s are PUFAs), but it

apparently seems to depress lipid peroxide levels (byproducts of

oxidation) instead of raise them, according to some research. I

suspect it is because of the vitamins A and D.

Chris

--

Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

On 9/11/05, Suzanne Noakes <snoakes@...> wrote:

> Krispin Sullivan would probably disagree with you. (I'd love to see a

> discussion of _Naked at Noon_ around here. ) Unless someone is

> getting regular testing of their vitamin D levels, I'm going to feel

> mighty uncomfortable recommending dosages above 800 IU daily and not

> even that much on more Southern latitudes. But that's me. <shrug>

It would probably be a wise idea to get them tested, but I don't see

how taking it is any more dangerous than not taking it. I didn't read

her book, but her article on the subject, I think for WAPF a while

back, based her concern on a few anecdotes in her practice, and this

is, as far as I know, the only evidence of this concern. On the other

hand, most people need to consume far more than this to avoid vitamin

D deficiency. So yes, it's a good idea to get a vitamin D test, but

simply avoiding vitamin D is not necessarily the safe option! And you

know CLO isn't the only vitamin-D-rich food. You'd have to avoid

quite a few *foods* and not just supplements-- lard, some types of

shellfish, etc.

> >By the way, the proper abbreviation for " omega-3 " if you do not have

> >easy access to Greek alphabet characters is " n-3, " not " O-3. "

> So.....does that mean you *haven't* taken you CLO today.....?

>

> --s, who pieced this email together two letters at a time between A

> Bug's Life updates and rotating interruptions (wondering why they aren't

> still asleep!), so apologizes for any incoherencies.

What?

Chris

--

Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

Chris-

>However, the studies I've seen show that *CLO* actually *depresses*

>lipid peroxidation. Yet DHA and EPA isolates, which are comparable to

>fish oil, raise lipid peroxidation.

Presumably taking an EPA isolate with A and D would prevent that, right?

-

[Guest guest]

Chris-

>I thought the potatoes were

>for the starch, because insulin is involved in the conversion, or

>something like that (although I admit I haven't read the book.) If

>the potato is actually to derive tryptophan from then I imagine a lot

>of people would have trouble absorbing it.

I haven't read the book either, but I have read some articles which I

believe are similar, and the general idea (which I dispute!) seems to be

that in cases of seratonin deficiency protein must be strictly limited and

carbs must be boosted in order to (a) reduce the presence of amino acids

which compete with tryptophan and ( boost insulin.

-

[Guest guest]

> >I thought the potatoes were

> >for the starch, because insulin is involved in the conversion, or

> >something like that (although I admit I haven't read the book.)

If

> >the potato is actually to derive tryptophan from then I imagine a

lot

> >of people would have trouble absorbing it.

I've read it and follow it. in an earlier post I mentioned

how the potato works in the context of that program to help with

serotonin. The context is important. If a person just starts brand

new with very low serotonin and has a massive potato, it's just

weird. Did you know that LSD sits in serotonin receptors? Firing a

lot of upregulated serotonin receptors can give psychedelic dreams.

>

> I haven't read the book either, but I have read some articles

which I

> believe are similar, and the general idea (which I dispute!) seems

to be

> that in cases of seratonin deficiency protein must be strictly

limited and

> carbs must be boosted in order to (a) reduce the presence of amino

acids

> which compete with tryptophan and ( boost insulin.

The Potatoes not Prozac plan is not like this at all. It advocates

a little more than the RDA of animal protein to have adequate amino

acids. Carbs are not boosted, ick! Fibrous greens and whole carbs in

moderate amounts. Then the potato is used medicinally in a

controlled way to help the conversion of tryptophan to insulin.

Connie

[Guest guest]

On 9/11/05, Idol <Idol@...> wrote:

> Chris-

>

> >However, the studies I've seen show that *CLO* actually *depresses*

> >lipid peroxidation. Yet DHA and EPA isolates, which are comparable to

> >fish oil, raise lipid peroxidation.

>

> Presumably taking an EPA isolate with A and D would prevent that, right?

I presume so-- but in that case what's the point of isolating the EPA?

Chris

--

Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

On 9/11/05, cbrown2008 <cbrown2008@...> wrote:

> I've read it and follow it. in an earlier post I mentioned

> how the potato works in the context of that program to help with

> serotonin. The context is important.

Right, you said it did exactly what I said it did:

" After all that's in place, then the evening potato 3 hours after

dinner serves as a " controlled insulin rise " that helps convert

tryptophan to serotonin. "

You also noted that the presence of trytophan was an independent variable:

" If people don't get enough protein so there's tryptophan floating

around at the end of the day, it doesn't work. "

Your assumption that merely having adequate dietary protein will

ensure there is sufficient trytophan present is not necessarily

correct. Some people may have absorption or other issues that warrant

supplementing. Someone who does not digest protein well, will not get

adequate trytophan from eating protein.

The need for insulin and the need for tryptophan are two different

needs, so the same thing will not work for everyone.

> If a person just starts brand

> new with very low serotonin and has a massive potato, it's just

> weird.

I'm not sure what you mean.

> Did you know that LSD sits in serotonin receptors? Firing a

> lot of upregulated serotonin receptors can give psychedelic dreams.

I don't know the details about LSD, but I do know that LSD induces an

extremely complex chain reaction and is not even circulating in the

system by the time the psychoactive effects take hold. I'm not sure

what a psychedelic dream is-- aren't all dreams psychedelic in some

sense? After all, dreams happen when one is unconcscious.

Chris

--

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[Guest guest]

> I don't know the details about LSD, but I do know that LSD induces an

> extremely complex chain reaction and is not even circulating in the

> system by the time the psychoactive effects take hold. I'm not sure

> what a psychedelic dream is-- aren't all dreams psychedelic in some

> sense? After all, dreams happen when one is unconcscious.

It's just a colloquial description for a dream of a certain quality.

Haven't you ever had one of those wild colorful ones that are so vivid

they almost wake you up? Not quite a nightmare but almost?

Connie