Re: Feelings curriculum???? and a bit of a therapy vent

[Guest guest]

Hi, Pattie.

When I have things I want to talk to our son't therapist about, he

schedules time for me alone. Or, I can call him and discuss it on the

phone.

It doesn't sound like to me that this therapist, you are seeing, knows

or understands what they are doing, with treating OCD. Therapy should

not consist of working in workbooks about your feelings. It should be

CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy) and ERP (exposure and response

prevention), the only proven therapy that works on OCD.

Our son tried the " sharing your feelings " therapy for years, and it

drove him crazy too. He hated it. We were uninformed and didn't know

any better, accepting that the therapist should know, . . After all,

they told us they knew how to treat OCD. But, they didn't know.

After the initial first couple appointments, where they evaluate

everything, they should get down to work. First they should make a

hierarchy list. That is a list where they come up with all the OCD

thoughts and rituals. They put them in order from least bothersome to

most bothersome and anxiety producing. Then they start applying the

ERP and CBT, working on the easiest thing on the list. As they

confront and overcome the ritual, the thought associated with it

should become less or even disappear. They work their way up the list

to the harder stuff, gaining confidence as they go, so they are

prepared to take the harder stuff on. If your therapist is not using

this method, you need to find someone who does.

Our son responded to this therapy immediately. There was an actual

plan that he could work on. And when he saw that it worked, he was

completely on board.

Check the ocfoundation.org website, they have people listed there, but

be willing to interview them, because being listed there doesn't

guarantee they know what they are doing either.

You can also try anxiety clinics. OCD is an anxiety disorder, and

most anxiety clincs have people there who understand how to treat it

correctly, using CBT/ERP.

You can also call support groups in your area, and ask for any

recommendations of therapists. They often know of good doctors

available.

Best of luck, Hon.

Hugs,

BJ

>

> Today was a bit weird at therapy. I need to write a letter to

explain a few

> things because there isn't enough time to get certain things across

and/or

> not really something to share in front of J. Do I write a letter (or

> email)? Advice? Do I just let it go or do I explain?????

Seriously.I

> think therapy makes everything worse for all of us.

>

>

>

> So.J is supposed to be doing the workbooks (had them before we started

> therapy) and we do try.he hates them (he verbalized this for the

therapist

> today). He used to like them, but now doesn't want to do them

because he

> doesn't like talking about this stuff. Therapist says we have to

make him

> do it-he doesn't have a choice. Easier said than done. Then when I

tell

> him, " Well, I tell him he has to do it. He has the books to read and he

> won't do it-this goes on for hours.so I sit with him and read some

of it and

> get him to do some of the pages. " The therapist them says that I

should not

> be sitting with him to get him to do it-that he needs to do it on

his own.

>

>

>

> He brought up feelings curriculum said we talked about getting it

started in

> school? I don't remember that one-we did talk about J doing the

workbooks.

> He said, " I know you have a lot going on in your life, but you have

to have

> him do this every day. " Said it should be like school work-he has

to do

> it. Again, easier said than done. He said that this is a bit of

defiance

> on J's part not doing it.. well, of course it is. I can

understand his

> not wanting to talk about everything.

>

>

>

> I wanted to say that we had a hard enough time getting J to re-start the

> medication that he HATES because it has nasty side-effects. I did

tell him

> that J was crying at the urologist's office-he did not ask why and

it moved

> to something else. I feel like therapy is a bit scattered..never on one

> topic long enough. I would liked to have explored his crying and

explained

> that he is upset because he leaks urine.. He asked J about tests

they did

> and J explained the u/s..and the doctor went into the u/s stuff. and

even

> asked J if it made him feel embarrassed--- the U/S is NOT what bothers

> him..it is the LEAKING.but we never got there.

>

>

>

> He moved on to how we/I need to make him do the writing about his

feelings

> and not sit with him while he does it-he has to do it on his own.

Part of

> me thought, " Well, I give him many hours and then after he has his

breakdown

> and all.I tell him I will read the workbook with him and go over the

> questions to get him started with writing.. Isn't that better than

him NOT

> doing it at all????????

>

>

>

> AND..I wanted to say that we are dealing with the medication trial and

> getting him back on, him crying about leaking and not wanting to do

> medication...and working on a plan to get him to try the mediation

to help

> him stop leaking and protect his kidneys.. if we are working on him

> dealing with that and talking about his feelings there.isn't that

enough for

> a week? Just getting that one freaking thing done was a nightmare

and to

> get it done where is ACCEPTED IT and is okay with it... I thought

that was

> a HUGE accomplishment!

>

>

>

> I came out of there feeling like a failure.like we weren't doing

ANYTHING we

> were supposed to.and when he said he knew we had a lot going on in our

> lives, it was as if NOTHING else we were doing mattered.. J had a

> procedure in Aug (under anesthesia) and had surgery in September

that was

> not successful and he knows we may have t have another.. The surgery was

> supposed to keep him from having to take the meds (they are not 100%

> effective for him anyway.. too long to go into)

>

>

>

> I am wiped... I am supposed to search (therapist's words) Amazon

and find

> some sort of feelings curriculum that a guidance counselor might use at

> school... I reminded him of the workbooks and he got back onto us

using

> those.

>

>

>

> Peace be with you,

>

> Pattie

>

> Look what God is doing with nothing. People must believe that it is

all his,

> all his. We must allow God to use us, without adding or subtracting

> anything. ~ Bl. Mother of Calcutta

>

> www.catholicmomof3.blogspot.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Oh, another thing, Pattie. There are a couple of workbooks that walk

you through CBT/ERP, that can give you idea of what successful therapy

should look like. If you don't want to buy them, you might be able to

get them from your local library.

They are. . . .

Talking Back to OCD by March

Helping Your Child With Ocd: A Workbook for Parents of Children With

Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder by Lee Fitzgibbons and Cherry Pedrick

We tried using them at home, without a therapist, but found for us, a

therapist worked better with our son. I think because the doctor had

no emotional attachment, our son responded to him better.

Hugs,

BJ

>

> Today was a bit weird at therapy. I need to write a letter to

explain a few

> things because there isn't enough time to get certain things across

and/or

> not really something to share in front of J. Do I write a letter (or

> email)? Advice? Do I just let it go or do I explain?????

Seriously.I

> think therapy makes everything worse for all of us.

>

>

>

> So.J is supposed to be doing the workbooks (had them before we started

> therapy) and we do try.he hates them (he verbalized this for the

therapist

> today). He used to like them, but now doesn't want to do them

because he

> doesn't like talking about this stuff. Therapist says we have to

make him

> do it-he doesn't have a choice. Easier said than done. Then when I

tell

> him, " Well, I tell him he has to do it. He has the books to read and he

> won't do it-this goes on for hours.so I sit with him and read some

of it and

> get him to do some of the pages. " The therapist them says that I

should not

> be sitting with him to get him to do it-that he needs to do it on

his own.

>

>

>

> He brought up feelings curriculum said we talked about getting it

started in

> school? I don't remember that one-we did talk about J doing the

workbooks.

> He said, " I know you have a lot going on in your life, but you have

to have

> him do this every day. " Said it should be like school work-he has

to do

> it. Again, easier said than done. He said that this is a bit of

defiance

> on J's part not doing it.. well, of course it is. I can

understand his

> not wanting to talk about everything.

>

>

>

> I wanted to say that we had a hard enough time getting J to re-start the

> medication that he HATES because it has nasty side-effects. I did

tell him

> that J was crying at the urologist's office-he did not ask why and

it moved

> to something else. I feel like therapy is a bit scattered..never on one

> topic long enough. I would liked to have explored his crying and

explained

> that he is upset because he leaks urine.. He asked J about tests

they did

> and J explained the u/s..and the doctor went into the u/s stuff. and

even

> asked J if it made him feel embarrassed--- the U/S is NOT what bothers

> him..it is the LEAKING.but we never got there.

>

>

>

> He moved on to how we/I need to make him do the writing about his

feelings

> and not sit with him while he does it-he has to do it on his own.

Part of

> me thought, " Well, I give him many hours and then after he has his

breakdown

> and all.I tell him I will read the workbook with him and go over the

> questions to get him started with writing.. Isn't that better than

him NOT

> doing it at all????????

>

>

>

> AND..I wanted to say that we are dealing with the medication trial and

> getting him back on, him crying about leaking and not wanting to do

> medication...and working on a plan to get him to try the mediation

to help

> him stop leaking and protect his kidneys.. if we are working on him

> dealing with that and talking about his feelings there.isn't that

enough for

> a week? Just getting that one freaking thing done was a nightmare

and to

> get it done where is ACCEPTED IT and is okay with it... I thought

that was

> a HUGE accomplishment!

>

>

>

> I came out of there feeling like a failure.like we weren't doing

ANYTHING we

> were supposed to.and when he said he knew we had a lot going on in our

> lives, it was as if NOTHING else we were doing mattered.. J had a

> procedure in Aug (under anesthesia) and had surgery in September

that was

> not successful and he knows we may have t have another.. The surgery was

> supposed to keep him from having to take the meds (they are not 100%

> effective for him anyway.. too long to go into)

>

>

>

> I am wiped... I am supposed to search (therapist's words) Amazon

and find

> some sort of feelings curriculum that a guidance counselor might use at

> school... I reminded him of the workbooks and he got back onto us

using

> those.

>

>

>

> Peace be with you,

>

> Pattie

>

> Look what God is doing with nothing. People must believe that it is

all his,

> all his. We must allow God to use us, without adding or subtracting

> anything. ~ Bl. Mother of Calcutta

>

> www.catholicmomof3.blogspot.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Oh, yes, those meltdowns are awful. Our son had them a lot when he

was young. His frustration would get so bad, then he would crack. I

had no idea he even had OCD, so had no clue what was going on even.

We found that once our son was able to take control of the OCD, that

was dictating that things had to be a certain way to either make it

feel right, or to alleviate the anxiety, the frustration stopped. So

the potential for the meltdowns, your son is experiencing, could most

likely stop too, if the frustration of dealing with what OCD is

demanding, is removed.

For instance, our son's OCD needed things to be at a 90 degree angle.

He would get so frustrated because it would take up HUGE amounts of

his time. Once he was able to use ERP to bring it to a halt, the

frustration went with it. He no longer straightens. )

Your little guy has situations that most children will never have to

deal with, and I can only imagine how much stress and anxiety that

causes for him. That on top of OCD, must be really tough on him. So

very sorry.

Our son had minor health situations, compared to your situation, when

he was young that his OCD would grab onto, that would exacerbate them.

For us, it became intermingled.

Hugs,

BJ

>

> Thank you BJ. I will check this out. I have to say that I am really

> confused. He did ask ph what bad thoughts or scary thoughts

he'd been

> having and ph said he had not been having them in the last few

days..

>

>

>

> ph has *peaks* when he has to deal with medical events-like Just

before

> the surgeries.or when he has to change medication.. He has OCD stuff

that he

> does (measures things to be exact, etc..that do not really get into

the way

> most of the time. We want to deal with anxiety related issues.

>

>

>

> ph doesn't want to talk to this guy. he is nice enough. but

today he

> asked ph about talking about feelings and ph said he didn't like

> it-and the guy asked what type of things-ph said he doesn't like

to talk

> about embarrassing things... and did not want to go into more details.

>

>

>

> ph has a neurogenic bladder and leaks urine all day long and all

night

> long.. the last surgery/procedure was our BIG hope to help stop the

> leaking.it was not successful. We may try a higher dose to see if it

> helps..but it does wear off.

>

>

>

> Anyway-- this triggers stress and anxiety for him and brings out

more of

> his OCD issues..

>

>

>

> I was looking for more of a , " Here is what we need to try when you

meltdown

> and can't cope, " type things... he meltsdown because of OCD

things-paper

> not perfect, pencils not perfect, math problem on the test (supposed to

> omit & he stresses out because it is on the printed test and he

can't go to

> the next problem unless he works this one.it doesn't matter if it is

to be

> omitted because it was mistakenly put on the test) ...how is

talking about

> feelings going to help this? He panics.and then the rest of the

boys (we

> homeschool) are distracted and upset , which the makes it worse.so I

try to

> get J to go sit quietly in his room where none of us are so he can

calm down

> (he calms down when left alone with out extra stimuli!) but he shuts

down

> and won't budge because he is freaked out about the math problem, or

paper

> or whatever at the moment set him off...

>

>

>

> Peace be with you,

>

> Pattie

>

> Preach the Gospel at all times and when necessary use words. ~St

Francis of

> Assisi

>

> Family website: www.shwachman.50megs.com

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Pattie, I think you've been doing a great job. And you need another

therapist. Just my opinion. Nothing wrong with you sitting with

him; the long-range goal can be for you to sit less with him, and

eventually not at all. He apparently needs some prompting and help

to do it. Is he getting anything at all (help, understanding, any

benefit) from the workbook(s)? Or maybe he hasn't done them long

enough for any benefit.

By the way, my son never liked to skip a question either. Now he

might would have skipped one easily that wasn't supposed to be on a

test. But to skip one because it's taking too long and go back to it

later -- did not want to skip it. Also at times it seemed, watching

him, that he did not want to have to go to a 2nd sheet/turn paper

over and would squeeze as much as he could on the first page. And he

definitely didn't want to write outside those " pink line margins " on

notebook paper. Oh and he got really upset with me once for tearing

a blank sheet of paper out of his composition book for me to use,

apparently wanted to use EVERY sheet in it for his class (or

something like that). You never know what OCD might affect.

Not sure what you mean about having his paper " perfect " but is this

something where he can use a computer more often (thus, skipping the

paper part)??

To work on some of his perfection, not skipping...other issues.

Maybe find some " OCD homework time " . Have him have to hold or use a

non-perfect pencil; even for 5 seconds, work over time towards

building up to 15 seconds. (or if he can do it for minutes to begin

with, that's great) Or have problems (not real work that counts)

where he has to work some, then skip.... Just some thoughts towards

working on OCD but it's stuff that can be thrown away later, nothing

that actually counts. He needs to try to have things " imperfect " for

seconds/minutes, wait out the anxiety a little before doing his

compulsions, etc. And just pick out one of the problems to work on

at first. Some families find a specific time to work on OCD helpful.

We didn't manage to work on OCD daily either, too much going on some

weeks or nights. Weekends seemed easier but then we didn't

have " homework time " just did it more as opportunities came during

the day; like since he repeated things, if he went in a room and had

to turn lightswitch on, try to hold out and not repeat.

If going to his room is a good way for him to calm down, then that's

a good plan. Maybe he can go there when he begins to feel anxious

and calm down, prevent a meltdown, tears....

Some quick thoughts. And, again, I think you're doing better than

the therapist!!

>

> Thank you BJ. I will check this out. I have to say that I am

really

> confused. He did ask ph what bad thoughts or scary thoughts

he'd been

> having and ph said he had not been having them in the last few