beet kvass & liquid acidophilus

[Guest guest]

Hello all,

Can someone please tell me if it would work to make beet kvass with liquid

acidophilus instead of whey? If so, how much do you suppose I should use

for a two-quart batch? I read that liquid acidophilus can be used to ferment

vegetables, so I'm assuming it would do the same for drinks.

Thanks for any help,

Serene

[Guest guest]

>Hello all,

>

>Can someone please tell me if it would work to make beet kvass with liquid

>acidophilus instead of whey? If so, how much do you suppose I should use

>for a two-quart batch? I read that liquid acidophilus can be used to ferment

>vegetables, so I'm assuming it would do the same for drinks.

>

>Thanks for any help,

>

>Serene

Personally I'd stay away from liquid acidophilus ... it is a single

bacterial strain which can take over if you eat a lot of it (esp.

if you've had antibiotics) which throws the bacterial balance out

of sync. What you want in the gut is a MIX of bacteria. The easiest

way to get a good bacterial mix is with kefir whey ... it has 50 or

so micro-organisms, which is closer to the " natural " kind of fermenting

that has been practiced forever. Acidophilus produces d-lactate (not usable),

but

some of the other bacterial produce l-lactate (usable). And in kefir you ALSO

get a mess of other byproducts, including polysaccharides that may

be anti-carcinogenic, and some aldyhydes that give great flavor.

Some people have actually gotten acidosis from acidophilus (tho they

were pretty sick people to start with). It creates a form of lactic

acid that isn't very usable by the body. I don't think it's really

a danger for most folks, but it does show that it is healthier to

have a better mix of microbes. Plus, if you start growing kefir

grains, you don't have to buy anything else ever again (unless you

accidentally kill them, or the dog eats them). And the grains make

great fermentation products. I haven't made kvass with them, but

I do make " kefir beer " using fruit juice.

BTW the second link talks about acidosis induced by eating too

many carbs. THAT is interesting ... I wonder if some of the

really " carb sensitive " individuals in the world may have

a lot of d-lactate producing bacteria which give symptoms (rather

than or in addition to candida as is usually supposed). In that

case, taking acidophilus to fight candida would not be very

effective.

-- Heidi Jean

http://www.dairyscience.info/probiotics.htm

LAB can produce two stereoisomers or lactic acid, D and L lactic acid. Since

some LAB also have racemases, some strains will produce D/L lactate.

L-lactate is readily metabolised whereas the D-isomer is not. There have been

concerns about infants, in particular, ingesting high levels of D-lactic acid

and there is a maximum recommended intake level for D-lactate. Because Lb.

acidophilus <http://www.dairyscience.info/#top>produces D-lactic acid there is

some interest in using other probiotic lactobacilli or bifidobacteria with

babies and young children.

Several cases of D-lactic acid acidosis have been described in patients that

have had intestinal bypass surgery. This condition is associated with transient

neurological symptoms including headaches, weakness and visual disturbances. The

D-lactic acid acidosis has been shown to be due to the

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/839?maxtoshow= & HITS=10 & hits=10 & RE\

SULTFORMAT= & fulltext=Antibiotic-Induced%2BD-Lactic%2BAcidosis & searchid=106927382\

3371_9029 & stored_search= & FIRSTINDEX=0 & journalcode=annintmed>overgrowth of Lb.

acidophilus

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/839?maxtoshow= & HITS=10 & hits=10 & RE\

SULTFORMAT= & fulltext=Antibiotic-Induced%2BD-Lactic%2BAcidosis & searchid=106927382\

3371_9029 & stored_search= & FIRSTINDEX=0 & journalcode=annintmed>in the small

intestine, generally due to its selection by antibiotic therapy. As with babies

and young children, people who have had jejunoileal bypass surgery should seek

medical advice before taking probiotic products particularly those containing

D-lactate producing bacteria

http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/839

Since the initial report by DeWind and Payne

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R1-5>[1] in 1976 on intestinal

bypass surgery for the treatment of obesity, several cases of d-lactic acidosis

have been described <http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R2-5>[2-14].

This syndrome is characterized by episodic increases in levels of plasma

d-lactate (an isomer of l-lactate produced from bacterial carbohydrate

metabolism) identified by Oh and colleagues

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R2-5>[2] as the anion

responsible for the associated metabolic acidosis. Surgical procedures that

cause anatomical or functional short bowel facilitate the overgrowth of

d-lactate-producing gram-positive organisms (such as Lactobacillus species,

Streptococcus bovis, Bifidobacterium species, and Eubacterium species) at the

expense of the gram-negative flora

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R3-5>[3].

Most cases occur after the ingestion of carbohydrates and eventual absorption of

d-lactate from the affected intestinal segment, but others occur after the

consumption of dairy products or lactobacillus tablets

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R2-5>[2,4]. Dahlquist and

colleagues <http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R5-5>[5] reproduced

the syndrome by overfeeding carbohydrates to humans with previous

jejunoileostomy.

Transient neurologic symptoms are the hallmark of d-lactic acidosis: Headache,

weakness, delirium, visual disturbances, dysarthria, ataxia, cranial nerve

palsies, changes in affect, and even transient hypothalamic dysfunction have

been reported <http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R2-5>[2-14], but

the mechanism explaining these manifestations remains unknown.

Treatment has been successful with carbohydrate restriction and oral

antibiotics, such as vancomycin, metronidazole, clindamycin, tetracycline,

neomycin, and kanamycin

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R2-5>[2-6,10-13]. In some

patients, however, d-lactic acidosis recurred despite the use of antimicrobial

agents; in other instances, their potentially causative role was not addressed

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R6-5>[6,13]. The d-lactic

acidosis syndrome developed in a patient who had received tetracycline

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R3-5>[3], in another who had

received metronidazole

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R13-5>[13], and in a patient who

had received both agents

<http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/122/11/#R5-5>[5].