Re: Question for NT homesteaders

[Guest guest]

Have you thought about selling locally (or shipping some of your bounty to me,

lol!)...I " d 'love' so find some kind souls around me that would be willing to

sell me their fermented, cultured, or otherwise traditional foods. I'd be

willing to pay prettily too )

So, other than buying yet another fridge, I'm no help. I've never grown

anything in my life, including flowers and household plants. Ugh.

cindy

Question for NT homesteaders

Hello,

We have a small farm...a few goats, chickens, and a veggie garden and

I'm trying to figure out how to manage it all. One area that is

getting out of control is food storage. I make alot of fermented

foods, sauerkraut and pickles by the gallon. We get grassfed beef

that we put in a chest freezer each fall. The milk/yogurt/cheese

takes up more precious refrigerator space. Basically, I have 1 large

refrigerator, and 1 smaller refrigerator, and one chest freezer

pretty much maxed out and have started harvesting lots of garden

veggies, but am at a loss of how to store them. I want to freeze

some, but don't have room to freeze alot. Fermenting doesn't work

for all veggies (like okra!) and my fridge is already full of pickles

anyway! I'll try drying some more things, but I'm really wondering

how I can live like folks in the past did. I know that canning would

solve alot of my dilemmas....but I hate to can and it's cooked to

death anyway. We are in GA and I don't think root cellars work very

well down here....but we may try it out one of these days. I know I

can make more jerky and pemmican for the pantry, but I need more

ideas. I'm gonna try feta in olive oil in the pantry too. But I

can't just get another fridge! I don't want anything to go to waste

and am wondering how I can store everything.....I want to rely on old

methods of food preservation if at all possible...

Any pointers from fellow farmers or homesteaders are welcome!!

Becky

[Guest guest]

>can't just get another fridge! I don't want anything to go to waste

>and am wondering how I can store everything.....I want to rely on old

>methods of food preservation if at all possible...

>

>Any pointers from fellow farmers or homesteaders are welcome!!

>

>Becky

ya know, if you go back and read your little house on the prairie, you

learn a ton!

a root cellar will definitely work even in georgia. the best root cellaring

resource is root cellaring by mike and nancy bubel. they have plans and

explanations even for city dwellers - everything from the traditional huge

root cellar to how to transform an extra closet into a " root cellar " .

they're great. then you can get the pickles and kimchi and stuff out of the

fridge - it doesn't need to be there anyway. your cheese will go in the

cellar too, and your yogurt can too if you don't mind it sour.

okra might just be straight out though. ew.

[Guest guest]

Yes, I do have a small group of friends that like to partake of the

bounty! And I do store a bit extra for them, but still, I'd like to

store a few gallons of pickles for my own family to last through the

winter...

--- In , " Harvey " <cindy@t...>

wrote:

> Have you thought about selling locally (or shipping some of your

bounty to me, lol!)...I " d 'love' so find some kind souls around me

that would be willing to sell me their fermented, cultured, or

otherwise traditional foods. I'd be willing to pay prettily too )

>

> So, other than buying yet another fridge, I'm no help. I've never

grown anything in my life, including flowers and household plants.

Ugh.

>

> cindy

> Question for NT homesteaders

>

>

> Hello,

>

> We have a small farm...a few goats, chickens, and a veggie garden

and

> I'm trying to figure out how to manage it all. One area that is

> getting out of control is food storage. I make alot of fermented

> foods, sauerkraut and pickles by the gallon. We get grassfed beef

> that we put in a chest freezer each fall. The milk/yogurt/cheese

> takes up more precious refrigerator space. Basically, I have 1

large

> refrigerator, and 1 smaller refrigerator, and one chest freezer

> pretty much maxed out and have started harvesting lots of garden

> veggies, but am at a loss of how to store them. I want to freeze

> some, but don't have room to freeze alot. Fermenting doesn't

work

> for all veggies (like okra!) and my fridge is already full of

pickles

> anyway! I'll try drying some more things, but I'm really

wondering

> how I can live like folks in the past did. I know that canning

would

> solve alot of my dilemmas....but I hate to can and it's cooked to

> death anyway. We are in GA and I don't think root cellars work

very

> well down here....but we may try it out one of these days. I

know I

> can make more jerky and pemmican for the pantry, but I need more

> ideas. I'm gonna try feta in olive oil in the pantry too. But I

> can't just get another fridge! I don't want anything to go to

waste

> and am wondering how I can store everything.....I want to rely on

old

> methods of food preservation if at all possible...

>

> Any pointers from fellow farmers or homesteaders are welcome!!

>

> Becky

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> ya know, if you go back and read your little house on the prairie,

you

> learn a ton!

Yeah, I do enjoy those books and will have to reread them to learn

now...

> a root cellar will definitely work even in georgia.

So, pickles and kraut will keep this time of year in a root cellar?

How can I find out what the temp would be and how far underground I

would need to go to get away from this heat. And how do you know it

will " definately " work?? Hmmm??? Our house is on piers, no basement

even....Have you used a root cellar? What temp is best to aim

for....I've read between 40-50 degrees.

the best root cellaring

> resource is root cellaring by mike and nancy bubel. they have plans

and

> explanations even for city dwellers - everything from the

traditional huge

> root cellar to how to transform an extra closet into a " root

cellar " .

> they're great. then you can get the pickles and kimchi and stuff

out of the

> fridge - it doesn't need to be there anyway. your cheese will go in

the

> cellar too, and your yogurt can too if you don't mind it sour.

>

> okra might just be straight out though. ew.

Yeah, ew is right. It may be bad dried too, but we will experiment!

Thanks for the help,

Becky

[Guest guest]

At 02:04 PM 8/4/2004, you wrote:

>So, pickles and kraut will keep this time of year in a root cellar?

>How can I find out what the temp would be and how far underground I

>would need to go to get away from this heat. And how do you know it

>will " definately " work?? Hmmm??? Our house is on piers, no basement

>even....Have you used a root cellar? What temp is best to aim

>for....I've read between 40-50 degrees.

all these answers, and more, are yours in the bubels' book! they explain it

all.

of course, if you are convinced it won't work, then don't bother!

-katja

[Guest guest]

Becky,

I understand your frustration. Every time I ask about preserving fresh

veggies I get answers about how to keep them from freezing. We've been thinking

of

building a thing called a spring house. The spring runs through the root

cellar, keeping it cool in the summer.

Yankees just don't understand that freezing is not always the problem! :-)

Belinda in TN

Hello,

We have a small farm...a few goats, chickens, and a veggie garden and

I'm trying to figure out how to manage it all. One area that is

getting out of control is food storage. I make alot of fermented

foods, sauerkraut and pickles by the gallon. We get grassfed beef

that we put in a chest freezer each fall. The milk/yogurt/cheese

takes up more precious refrigerator space. Basically, I have 1 large

refrigerator, and 1 smaller refrigerator, and one chest freezer

pretty much maxed out and have started harvesting lots of garden

veggies, but am at a loss of how to store them. I want to freeze

some, but don't have room to freeze alot. Fermenting doesn't work

for all veggies (like okra!) and my fridge is already full of pickles

anyway! I'll try drying some more things, but I'm really wondering

how I can live like folks in the past did. I know that canning would

solve alot of my dilemmas....but I hate to can and it's cooked to

death anyway. We are in GA and I don't think root cellars work very

well down here....but we may try it out one of these days. I know I

can make more jerky and pemmican for the pantry, but I need more

ideas. I'm gonna try feta in olive oil in the pantry too. But I

can't just get another fridge! I don't want anything to go to waste

and am wondering how I can store everything.....I want to rely on old

methods of food preservation if at all possible...

Any pointers from fellow farmers or homesteaders are welcome!!

Becky

[Guest guest]

>We are in GA and I don't think root cellars work very

>well down here....but we may try it out one of these days. I know I

>can make more jerky and pemmican for the pantry, but I need more

>ideas. I'm gonna try feta in olive oil in the pantry too. But I

>can't just get another fridge! I don't want anything to go to waste

>and am wondering how I can store everything.....I want to rely on old

>methods of food preservation if at all possible...

From my reading, root cellars really are the way to go! I'm lobbying

for one. Fermented vegies keep just fine in a root cellar, as do

cheese, oils, and a lot of other things. Including roots ... if you pack

potatoes and other vegies in sand or sawdust that last a long time.

The thing is, the temp of the soil is 50 degrees all year round,

in winter and summer, all over the world (except the poles, I think).

You just have to dig down, I think 8 feet or so. So you can have

what is essentially a BIG fridge for free. 50 degrees is too warm

to keep a lot of things, but it's perfect for fermented products

(which were designed for exactly that temp!).

The book " Keeping food fresh " talks about storing stuff

over the winter, including fresh vegies. So does the Country

Encyclopedia.

However, if you want something quick and dirty ... get a big

trash can. Bury it in the ground, except for the top. Stack your

fermented jars of stuff in the trash can, and put the lid on. Cover

with straw, and takes stuff out as needed. The Koreans would

store their kimchi this way ... they just buried the jars in their yards

(ceramic jars, some of them very big) and piled straw on top. I basically

prefer fermented greens to any other type, they are FAR better than

just plain boiled greens!

You can store turnips and potatoes this way too, in trenches,

with straw on top. But you have to line the trench with wire or

something to keep the critters out, I'd think a trash can would

be easier.

I like 's hay bale idea too ... you can build a shed out

of hay bales with a plywood roof to store stuff in, the haybales

keep the temp pretty constant. Kimchi doesn't freeze easily

anyway, and if it does freeze, it just gets a little mushy.

-- Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

> I make alot of fermented foods, sauerkraut and pickles

> by the gallon.

> Fermenting doesn't work for all veggies (like okra!)

> and my fridge is already full of pickles anyway!  I'll

> try drying some more things, but I'm really wondering

> how I can live like folks in the past did.  I know that

> canning would solve alot of my dilemmas....but I hate

> to can and it's cooked to death anyway. 

> and am wondering how I can store everything.....I want

> to rely on old methods of food preservation if at all

> possible

You've already mentioned drying. It's a good method but it has its

limitations. Just to modify it and, perhaps, increase the nutrient

availability, you might try a short (or even a long) ferment followed

by drying. Perhaps a whey/lactobacillis ferment a la Sally Fallon or

an acetic acid/pickling ferment. There is even the rather strange

gundra (sp?) ferment from Tibet which is for leafy vegetables. Either

way, I'll best you'd find the dried product a nice change of pace. At

the very least you'll have reduced the volume of the food you need to

store.

You might also be able to extend your lactobacillis ferments to

vegetables like okra by changing the soak water every day for several

days before allowing the souring to go to completion. This method has

even been known to work without salt. I tried a cabbage/nopales

(prickly pear) sour the other week that had its problems (I'm still

new to souring) but rinsing got rid of much of the mucus in the final

product and it was fairly tasty.

There are a number of techniques for storing fruits and

vegetables in sawdust, newspaper, and the like for extended periods of

time but they generally need a cool environment.

Clean, dry, unblemished fruits, vegetables, and eggs sometimes

stay good for an extended time if they are sealed against oxygen.

Physically wash and inspect the item. Make sure that the skins are

intact. Dip in a dilute solution of hydrogen peroxide to kill surface

microbes and place in a clean area till dry. Then dip in melted

parafin or the like so that it is completely covered. They barrier

doesn't need to be thick, just complete. Set aside in a cool location,

probably in newspaper or sand. Peel to eat. Decay should be visible in

most cases. I think that I've heard of a method involving glycerine

and eggs and another involving mud and vegetables. I know that I can

look up the egg method if you need it. Note the hydrogen peroxide,

paraffin (or equivalent), and mud are bio-integratable.

I know that Georgia can be very humid so this may not help but

evaporation of water is sometimes used to keep food and even room

cooler. This generally involves a porous stoney material (such as

fired clay or brick) soaked in water. As hot dry air circulates across

one side of it, the water evaporates and the other side cools. On a

small scale, this is the principle that the old lemonade and juice

coolers worked on (actually people and sweat, for full disclosure). On

a larger scale, this has been used for, say the outside wall of a

room. This might be a way to cool down an area with minimal energy

input.

Oh, you might also try a nuka pickle box which is a dynamic

pickling system developed in Japan (and, I think, China/Korea) wherein

a box of bran is made into a pickling medium with miso and vegetables

are pickled in it for about a week before being taken out and

replaced. I have read reports of these being maintained for years but

it requires daily attention.

Thanks about all that I can think of at the moment. If you need

any help tracking down information on some of these ideas, I'll do

what I can for you.

Geoffrey Tolle