Re: increased Ca causing Fe deficiency - Suze

[Guest guest]

=> Hmmmm...how long have you been consuming this much dairy and bone

meal

> capsules? I didn't notice any difference in my nails until I'd

been on the

> bone meal for about 5 months or so.

-----> Not that long..maybe 2 months so that's good to know. Before

that i assumed I was getting enough Ca for about 2 cups raw diary

and bone broths I consume almost daily. Evidently not. Dr. Ron told

me to start the bone meal sup. in late June and I had the blood test

done in late July so 1 month of supplementing isn't much. The

results of the test showed low Ca even though for the last 2 years

I've been on raw dairy and bone broths. When i talked to him last

week he said up the dairy to 4 cups and the bone meal to 6 caps.

I'll test again in 6 months. So the fact it took you 5 months to see

a difference makes sense.

On digestion ....possible but i really don't seem to have too many

stomach problems with food so I'm kinda doubting that. I'm on an

Thorne enzyme though just in case. I'm really wondering if the

amount of Ca many of us need is really way higher than say around

1500mg /cay. I think weston prices populations often had much higher

than that.

Anyhow on the Fe binding Ca question. I'll have to ask the person

where she's heard milk can do this. Given the Masai and swiss

poplulation didn't seem to have this problem it doesn't make sense.

I'm wondering if it's the form the Ca is in that causes it to bind

with Fe??? And the research simply hasn't been done with raw milk

just regular Ca supplements

Lynn

>>

[Guest guest]

> Re: increased Ca causing Fe deficiency - Suze

>

>

>=> Hmmmm...how long have you been consuming this much dairy and bone

>meal

>> capsules? I didn't notice any difference in my nails until I'd

>been on the

>> bone meal for about 5 months or so.

>

>-----> Not that long..maybe 2 months so that's good to know. Before

>that i assumed I was getting enough Ca for about 2 cups raw diary

>and bone broths I consume almost daily.

Well, I was consuming quite a bit of kefir daily - over two cups I think -

AND taking CA supplements and my blood CA was still coming up slightly low.

For all I know it's still low, but I do know that my nails started getting

much stronger about 5 months into Ron's protocol with his bone meal supp.

But my nails are weak now again. I've cut back on CLO because it's summer

and I don't want to consume too many PUFAs with the extra summer sun

exposure, so that could be why my nails have weakened again. Or it could be

a food allergy like gluten or casein which I've recently added back to my

diet.

>Anyhow on the Fe binding Ca question. I'll have to ask the person

>where she's heard milk can do this. Given the Masai and swiss

>poplulation didn't seem to have this problem it doesn't make sense.

>I'm wondering if it's the form the Ca is in that causes it to bind

>with Fe???

I have no idea. I still think there could be some other imbalance causing

you to excrete CA or not absorb it, such as a possible CA antagonist...these

things are hard to figure out! So many possibilities...

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

“The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times.” --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------

[Guest guest]

I am one of those people who excrete a lot of calcium. I am limited

to 400 mg a day from food only. Under this amount of CA I an

regaining the bone I lost.My nails have never been fragile, but my

bones where getting thinner despite 1500 mg of supplemental calcuium

a day.

You might want to ask you doctor about the calcium urine excretion

test. It's an easy urine collection test you do at home. I did it

twice, once on supplements of calcium and a few weeks later at 400 mg

of calcium from food. The condition I have is called hypercaliuria.

It's easy to treat.

Sheila

--- In , " Suze Fisher "

<s.fisher22@v...> wrote:

>

> > Re: increased Ca causing Fe deficiency - Suze

> >

> >

> >=> Hmmmm...how long have you been consuming this much dairy and

bone

> >meal

> >> capsules? I didn't notice any difference in my nails until I'd

> >been on the

> >> bone meal for about 5 months or so.

> >

> >-----> Not that long..maybe 2 months so that's good to know. Before

> >that i assumed I was getting enough Ca for about 2 cups raw diary

> >and bone broths I consume almost daily.

>

> Well, I was consuming quite a bit of kefir daily - over two cups I

think -

> AND taking CA supplements and my blood CA was still coming up

slightly low.

> For all I know it's still low, but I do know that my nails started

getting

> much stronger about 5 months into Ron's protocol with his bone meal

supp.

>

> But my nails are weak now again. I've cut back on CLO because it's

summer

> and I don't want to consume too many PUFAs with the extra summer sun

> exposure, so that could be why my nails have weakened again. Or it

could be

> a food allergy like gluten or casein which I've recently added back

to my

> diet.

>

>

>

>

> >Anyhow on the Fe binding Ca question. I'll have to ask the person

> >where she's heard milk can do this. Given the Masai and swiss

> >poplulation didn't seem to have this problem it doesn't make sense.

> >I'm wondering if it's the form the Ca is in that causes it to bind

> >with Fe???

>

> I have no idea. I still think there could be some other imbalance

causing

> you to excrete CA or not absorb it, such as a possible CA

antagonist...these

> things are hard to figure out! So many possibilities...

>

>

>

> Suze Fisher

> Lapdog Design, Inc.

> Web Design & Development

> http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

> Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

> http://www.westonaprice.org

>

> ----------------------------

> " The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol

cause

> heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times. " -

-

> Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at

Vanderbilt

> University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

>

> The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

> <http://www.thincs.org>

> ----------------------------

[Guest guest]

> For all I know it's still low, but I do know that my nails started

getting

> much stronger about 5 months into Ron's protocol with his bone

meal supp.

----> Interesting I didn't realize that Ca would take so long to

build up. So you're still on the same amount of dairy and bone meal

supplements and the only thing that changed is CLO?

I guess the only real solution to the PUFA problem and CLO is organ

meat. Guess I need to get back to liver tonics. Wonder what

Enig has to say about the PUFAs and large doses CLO????

Lynn

[Guest guest]

> I have no idea. I still think there could be some other imbalance

causing

> you to excrete CA or not absorb it, such as a possible CA

antagonist...these

> things are hard to figure out! So many possibilities...

----> I wonder how much of this also has to do with faulty Ca

mechanisms due to parents SAD that left along with bone and teeth

problems lots of less observable internal underdevolped organs?

I'm the child of two wonderful parents but they did exactly what the

doctors of the day told them......and it wasn't breastfeeding and

raw dairy!

If so some of this may simply be a matter of having to

oversupplement in order to supply enough to override poor bady

mechanisms. As you said....many possibilities and who knows......

Lynn

[Guest guest]

At 08:18 PM 8/17/2004, you wrote:

>I guess the only real solution to the PUFA problem and CLO is organ

>meat. Guess I need to get back to liver tonics. Wonder what

>Enig has to say about the PUFAs and large doses CLO????

>

>Lynn

hey, lynn, aren't you on chapterleaders? can you post this over there? i'm

interested!!

-katja

[Guest guest]

> hey, lynn, aren't you on chapterleaders? can you post this over

there? i'm

> interested!!

---> Well duh on me! Good idea...and repost the answers over here!

Lynn

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 8/17/04 2:52:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time, lyn122@...

writes:

I'm wondering if it's the form the Ca is in that causes it to bind

with Fe???

No, calcium cannot bind with iron. Iron comes in several forms, calcium

comes in one. Whatever base the calcium is associated with might bind with

iron,

but the calcium itself couldn't.

However, calcium could conceivably compete with iron for absorption into

cells, especially if calcium has more affinity to the proteins in the cell that

adsorb it than does iron. I don't know if this is the case, and it might be the

case under certain conditions or in certain cells, or not.

Chris

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 8/17/04 7:17:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

s.fisher22@... writes:

Given the Masai and swiss

>poplulation didn't seem to have this problem it doesn't make sense.

>I'm wondering if it's the form the Ca is in that causes it to bind

>with Fe???

On the other hand, the Masai ate practically nothing but red meat, besides

the milk, so perhaps they just had tons of iron to compensate. The Swiss, I

don't know, but I thought they consumed much less dairy than the Masai.

Chris

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 8/18/04 10:44:08 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

dezinegal@... writes:

I believe, as far as what i remember of the documentary I saw, they

rarely eat their cattle. Mainly they drink their milk and blood (using

a special technique to drain the blood and then to plug the hole in the

animals neck). The blood would be the iron source. Maybe they also eat

insects, cant remember.

From the little I've read, their meat consumption is infrequent, but

enormous. So, they may eat 10 lbs of meat in a day, but not nearly every day.

But

you are right: the blood is regular I think, and would also be rich in iron.

(Richer?)

Chris