Re: Re: Dairy Produces Milk at its Purest

[Guest guest]

:Message: 54660 From: Idol Received: Mon Sep 13, 2004 12:55 PM

:Subject: Re: Dairy Produces Milk at its Purest

:

:Gene-

:

:>More typical is for dairy cattle to get access to some pasture for a short

:>period of time during the natural growing season (winter and spring here)

:>and to be fed mostly hay, grain and other produce during the rest of the

:>year.

replied:

:Sounds like Claravale isn't very good.

If the bulk of the rest of the year's food is hay that might not be so bad. In

temperate areas of the world herds forage the dried grasses under the snow

during the winter months. I suppose your point depends on how much total grain

Claravale's herd is eating. If you want your cows in totally natural conditions

why not toss a a few hungry wolves into the cows' enclosure for authentic wild

conditions . j/k

Darrell

[Guest guest]

>> If you want your cows in totally natural conditions why not toss a a few

hungry wolves into the cows' enclosure for authentic wild conditions . j/k

<<

My dogs think that's a DAMN good idea....

Christie

[Guest guest]

Darrell-

>If the bulk of the rest of the year's food is hay that might not be so

>bad. In temperate areas of the world herds forage the dried grasses under

>the snow during the winter months. I suppose your point depends on how

>much total grain Claravale's herd is eating.

True, but the sense I got was that grain is a pretty significant component

of their feed.

>If you want your cows in totally natural conditions why not toss a a few

>hungry wolves into the cows' enclosure for authentic wild conditions . j/k

<g> Natural, per se, is definitely not my standard. Nutrition is -- and

my lungs tell me when the dairy I consume is supplemented with grains.

-

[Guest guest]

Well I'm feeling responsible for posting about Claravale's Dairy. I only

thought it was an interesting article on a rather unique dairy. As a dairy

producer myself, I would like to toss out a few ideas, which may be contrary

to some lines of thinking... but it will give another perspective non the

less.

I read where Claravale apparently grows their own feed for the cows, which

is a great advantage for them, as they have strict control over all the

facets of the feed operation (whatever it encompasses). He really didn't say

if he was feeding a grain or if he was just growing hay or another legume

for them to consume. Many times specific types of crops will be sown on

alternating pastures and the cows rotated amongst them. (Crops sown? most

seeds have been processed....in some way..) Milk is very delicate and cows

which eat pasture which has not been removed of weeds etc can produce off

flavored milk. hmmmm weeds removed? How does that happen.? Organic doesn't

mean you can use things to kill off undesirable weeds, it just means you can

only use certain ones. ( I'm not an organic expert, but I was having this

same conversation with my milk inspector, who is certifying his farm organic

and he was telling me what it really means to him and what he has had to

jump through.

Ok so as a dairy farmer you have to decide... am I going to pasture my

cows/goats on pasture that may contain growth that may help to produce off

flavored milk OR am I going to kill off the undesirables, sow good grass

/legumes in order to produce quality milk or am I going to put my cows/goats

in an area where I can control what they eat so that they produce quality

milk? There are weeds out there that can turn the milk very bitter.. not a

good thing for a dairy!

In order to produce milk, the cow/goats have to have a higher protein

percentage feed. Most of the time the diets are supplemented so that the

milk production increases and yields a sweeter milk. Believe it or not,

simple things like having an animal producing milk that needs to be dewormed

can also produce off-flavored milk and decrease the milk yields. Depending

on what part of the country you are in, it becomes necessary at certain

times of the year to supplement their daily intake because there simply is

not enough forage out there to eat. I'm thinking about winter when there is

no growth and dry hot summers after the grasses have burned out.

well, i could go on, but I won't. I'm not trying to start an arguement, but

trying to shed some answers as to why some things are done they way they are

when it comes to feeding dairy animals.

BTW, I didn't know that you could buy raw milk off the shelf in California.

In Texas you can only buy raw milk at the farm. Thanks for listening.

charlene

-- Re: Re: Dairy Produces Milk at its Purest

Darrell-

>If the bulk of the rest of the year's food is hay that might not be so

>bad. In temperate areas of the world herds forage the dried grasses under

>the snow during the winter months. I suppose your point depends on how

>much total grain Claravale's herd is eating.

True, but the sense I got was that grain is a pretty significant component

of their feed.

>If you want your cows in totally natural conditions why not toss a a few

>hungry wolves into the cows' enclosure for authentic wild conditions . j/k

<g> Natural, per se, is definitely not my standard. Nutrition is -- and

my lungs tell me when the dairy I consume is supplemented with grains.

-

[Guest guest]

>> BTW, I didn't know that you could buy raw milk off the shelf in

California. <<

You can only buy it from specially certified dairies. It is widely available

in health food stores, at least in Northern CA.

I do find that Claravale is sweeter, but I want milk with a better nutrient

profile, especially EFAs, and taste is not my primary criterion. I don't

drink milk as a beverage, I really only buy butter and cream and use them in

cooking (and cream in my coffee and tea), so the taste issue isn't that

important to me.

That said, I don't think Organic Pastures tastes BAD, just that Claravale

does taste sweeter. I think OP is a better product, overall.

Christie

[Guest guest]

Actually it is better for the cow to have either no grain or lots of

grain. Grain requires different bacteria in the rumen to digest than

grasses, so having just a bit of grain really messes up the poor

cow. There are many alternatives to grain that one can feed a cow, such as

alfalfa, beet pulp, turnips, hay, silage, and on and on. Grain is not

required and if people as far north as Canada can do the grain free thing

with their cattle, there is no excuse but laziness for feeding grain.

Bright Blessings,

Kim

At 06:32 PM 9/13/2004, you wrote:

>Darrell-

>

> >If the bulk of the rest of the year's food is hay that might not be so

> >bad. In temperate areas of the world herds forage the dried grasses under

> >the snow during the winter months. I suppose your point depends on how

> >much total grain Claravale's herd is eating.

>

>True, but the sense I got was that grain is a pretty significant component

>of their feed.

>

> >If you want your cows in totally natural conditions why not toss a a few

> >hungry wolves into the cows' enclosure for authentic wild conditions . j/k

>

><g> Natural, per se, is definitely not my standard. Nutrition is -- and

>my lungs tell me when the dairy I consume is supplemented with grains.

>

>

>-

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

As far as I know it is the same for all ruminants.

Bright Blessings,

Kim

At 05:36 PM 9/21/2004, you wrote:

> >>>Actually it is better for the cow to have either no grain or lots of

> grain. Grain requires different bacteria in the rumen to digest than

> grasses, so having just a bit of grain really messes up the poor

> cow. There are many alternatives to grain that one can feed a cow, such

> as alfalfa, beet pulp, turnips, hay, silage, and on and on. Grain is not

> required and if people as far north as Canada can do the grain free thing

> with their cattle, there is no excuse but laziness for feeding grain.<<<

>

>

>Is it the same for goats?

>

>Cheers,

>Tas'.

>

>

[Guest guest]

compressed pellets are just that....mushed up alfalfa , oils, grains (the

ingredients are labeled) much like the stated alternatives, just in pelleted

form, so that one doesn't have to grow everything for feed. I assure you,

there is nothing lazy about feeding grain, and if you think there is a

laziness to it, then I welcome you to come by and help during feeding.

Most lactating goats need extras to increase milk production and butterfat

and to maintain their own body weight.

charlene

Grain requires different bacteria in the rumen to digest than grasses, so

having just a bit of grain really messes up the poor cow. I don't understand

where this is coming from

-- Re: Re: Dairy Produces Milk at its Purest

>>>Actually it is better for the cow to have either no grain or lots of

grain. Grain requires different bacteria in the rumen to digest than

grasses, so having just a bit of grain really messes up the poor cow. There

are many alternatives to grain that one can feed a cow, such as alfalfa,

beet pulp, turnips, hay, silage, and on and on. Grain is not required and

if people as far north as Canada can do the grain free thing with their

cattle, there is no excuse but laziness for feeding grain.<<<

Is it the same for goats?

Cheers,

Tas'.

[Guest guest]

>>>Actually it is better for the cow to have either no grain or lots of grain.

Grain requires different bacteria in the rumen to digest than grasses, so having

just a bit of grain really messes up the poor cow. There are many alternatives

to grain that one can feed a cow, such as alfalfa, beet pulp, turnips, hay,

silage, and on and on. Grain is not required and if people as far north as

Canada can do the grain free thing with their cattle, there is no excuse but

laziness for feeding grain.<<<

Is it the same for goats?

Cheers,

Tas'.