Re: Re: Epiphany of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships

January 14, 2008

Hi , I also a spouse of someone with AS. It is a very loney relationship most of the time. My husband has been daignosed with AS but is in denial and thinks he has a type four personality which has been reading up on. He doesn't want the stigmatism that something is "wrong" with him. Although he struggles such much socially,emotionally and has extremely poor self esteem he thinks its just his personality. I have been married almost ten years and I honestly don't know how its lasted this long. There have been numerous times I wanted to leave but since his diagnosis I am trying to have patience and change my behaviors towards his behaviors. I feel as though I am changing my self and personality to make my marriage work which makes me extremely sad. I was happy with myself but I feel I owe it to myself and my kids to help him. How do you know if your kids are AS or ADD/ADHD. My oldest son does exhibit some of the

same personality traits as my husband his frustration with things his lack of wanting to talk about situations etc....I do love my husband and would love to saty married but I also feel like I need another relationship where I can get the emotional support I need. My vows are very important to me and I would never be unfaithful but the thought has crossed my mind. Its hard to share situations with friends and family members because my family at least thinks he is rude, obnoxious and unfeeling which he is alot of the time but I now know he can't help it. I'm suring having AS is not what my husband would wish for and finds daily life very difficult. But being the spouse of someone with AS is definitely lonely and stressful I think. I know longer make my husband accompany me to any family functions because it is to stressful for me. If your not an strong independant person before than I think AS makes you that way or makes your life very

very stressful....I share you lonliness and just know that there are others going through the same so if you need to vent ....Please don't hestitate to get in touch. Sometimes its comforting to know someone else is struggling also. Where are you located. I'm in the Philadelphia area. Talk to you soon hopefully wrote: I'm responding as the wife of someone with Asperger's, and I don't know if I have distrust with my spouse, but then he has been able to

verbalize that he has no interest in changing himself to improve our marriage. We will have been married for 25 years this week. I would say that we have more of a "business arrangement" than a marriage, everything has always been geared to what he is comfortable with, and he is not very affectioanate, or romantic, and has been very verbal about not wanting to be, "too much pressure". We have a son who has been medically recognized as being AS, and that enabled him to receive services at the school. I don't believe that my husband believes he has AS, he has not been medically recognized, but he is exactly like our son, and we got to observe part of the testing, with our son, and my husband had a hard time relating what was going on and what the signifance of the testing ment. We have three boys total, all have add/adhd, one has AS and one has ODD (oppositional defiant disorder). Since my husband has been very vocal

about what works for him, (of course he wasn't at first!) I have always made a point of taking the time to do something special for occaisions that are important to me. It was hard in the beginning of our marriage, and I used to wonder what had I done, or didn't do? But once we got our son's diagnosis, and I started researching materials on spouses of AS, it was like a light bulb went on. I don't take it personally, intelluctually, but since this is a milestone year (25th) and the plans I made, had to be cancelled, emotionally it is really hard. I have a lot of interests, and my plate is usually full, with the kids, and now I am a major care provider for my mother. But there really isn't anyone who can understand the loneliness, that comes with an AS relationship.On a side note, if anyone knows of a group of people that are married to or have family relationships with AS, I would like to know, as I feel very

isolated most of the time, and I have just thought to reach out on the web, and came across this group. Angie >> I sent this note to see if anyone has been able to deal with the distrust > NT partners tend to have of their AS spouses when they say they are trying > to change.> > I have found one of the most negative responses we can make to an > individual iis withdrawal and sulking which is what I have done habitually > throughout our married life. Strange that what you should value becomes > more valuable when you have lost it.> > Perhaps I have had an epiphany but if that is so I will need a lot of > courage to take the necessary steps to make the most of it. I think the > penny

dropped when the counsellor helped me understand the consequences > words and lack of action have, and how damaging it can be to a > relationship. One of the things that helped me understand this was the > following:> > We may think that we have to do things or say things rather than realising > that we can choose to do so or not to do so. I told my wife that I had > chosen to behave in the way I did and that realising that is a choice I > made means that I am really responsible for it. So the counsellor helped > me understand that I can choose to withdraw or I can choose to engage with > my wife. That in itself is a very powerful message. So when I do not "get > it" or do or say something that upsets or hurts her, I have to choose how > I respond not fall back on old negative habits. > > I have just now set a goal of trying hard to make a

difference within 3 > months. I got home on Friday night and told my wife that I am going to > really try hard to fit in more and listen to her point of view and try not > to make it about me all the time. I have read a book called the seven > principles of making marriage work by Gottman. This has helped me > realise that there are tools I can use to make a better efforf. She > wanted to know when the lightning struck or who hit me on the head. To > quote the words she used > > "So after 30 years of not wanting me in your life you now decide you want > a relationship! What about when I wanted a relationship and you were > physically or emotionally unavailable to be involved in my life and the > kids lives? What ulteriror motive do you have that you find that this is > now necessary? What can you offer me other than what you have so

far? Why > should I take a risk of being let down again? Just because you want it > now it HAS to happen! What are you going to base a relationship on that > you have destroyed? You still have Aspergers so how can you change?> > So I kept telling her that I need to try and I asked for her help. I have > said this several times over the weekend. I even tried to initiate > conversations about what we can do to develop some shared experiences. I > want to see if we can be happy together rather than trying to be happy > alone. I even sat in the family room with her tonight to watch a movie > rather than do my own thing. Tried making suggestions about the garden > and what she may like to do with it. The response so far has been > ridicule and put downs with accusations about how I expect her to roll > over and cause more pain. > >

Now I understand the reaction may be her way of expressing her fears etc. > but basically she does not trust my motives. And to be fair to her the > questions are quite valid. I have lost count of the number of times I > have said sorry this weekend. I have also told her that I intend to spend > more time at home and not be so obsessive about work. The real challenge > for me I think will be being in the moment with her when I am home and not > problem solving something from work or at home. Also I need to connect > with my two daughters who both feel very protective of their mother and > are not inclined to make it easy for me. > > Needless to say I have felt quite discouraged. But I am going to clean up > my act, get fit and make sure that I do more to help if I can and if she > agrees. I have asked her also to tell me when anytthing I say hurts

her > so that I can understand what or how I say things causes hurt. She > believes I say things to deliberately hurt or twist the knife so to speak. > Explaining that I am often unaware when she feels hurt is the major > problem. It seems I have to be so careful about what I say and have to > second guess how she might take it. > > Oh well. Lets see if I can stick to my goal and see what comes of it. I > do feel that 2008 will be a better year where my wife and I will finally > either make it together or make it apart. Even gaining her respect back > may be enough. It would definitely be progress. > > BTW the psychologist advised me that I have emotional dyspraxia. This > translates I think to lack of awareness of feelings or emotions and thus > inhibiting normal responses to emotional behaviour from > others. Do all AS on the list

suffer this?> > Greg> dx AS at 53>

January 14, 2008

Hi ,

Wow! It's incredible for me to comunicate with someone who understands what is

going on in my world! Thank you for responding.

My son was reviewed at the Autism Spectrum Center, at Kaiser, in Santa Clara,

California. It is a multi dimensional testing center and it took months. You start by

filling out all kinds of family history, and the teachers all fill something out based on

the relationship they have with your child, and then you schedule a date where you

bring your child to the clinic and they have different types of tests. Then, because they

have so many different people doing the testing, they have a round table and get back

to you as to the findings. It was pretty exact. I actually had figured it out when he was

about 6-7 years old, but we didn't get a diagnosis until he was in 4th grade. We did

confirm he was add/adhd when he was in 2nd grade, and his brother was in kindergarten.

That was done through the regular Kaiser Hospital, having the family history and the

teacher info, since they just had one teacher then. I went and got tested for adhd and they

said I was "mildly" adhd. I am sure I am not, but as an adult I have acquired life skills

to adapt to my surroundings.

We struggled in our relationship for the first eleven years, it was really hard. I have a

hard time getting past the fact that I love him. I almost wonder if I would be able to be in

a "normal" relationship, whatever that is. My Mother also has ODD, and she tends to be

very emotionally unavailable. I often wonder if that is why I was so attracted to my husband,

you marry what you've come to know. I know that based on the circumstances in our home

it would be very disruptive to the boys, I'm sure you know how change can be so threatening,

if I were to leave. They are actually doing very well, in school, and getting better socially, trying things. So

I certainly don't want to upset the apple cart. My Mother fell 12/10, while I was taking her

out to lunch. She severed her tendon from her left knee, and had emergency surgery to

re-attach it. She had 34 staples from the middle of her left thigh down below her knee. She is

75 years old, and was six days away from being retired. I am her only daughter, and live

closest to her. I moved in with her after she came home from the hospital, for a short time,

and then have been going over, pretty much daily to help take care of her. It has been hard,

as she was very active, and working and now she can't go anywhere. She really doesn't have

any close friends, so I am the whole of her universe now. I haven't been able to work, and

am just juggling alot. I am slipping into depression, and just trying not to beat myself up too

much about life right now. Because she fell, over a carpet, at a public place this is also going

into litigation. It's just become a mess all around.

I am trying to focus on just primary things that are important, eat, drink lots of water, breath

deep and sleep. I keep thinking, she will walk again, and hopefully it won't last forever. Thank

you, again, for responding. I am trying to see what others are doing, in a relationship such as mine,

who want to stay in said relationship. Maybe I would be able to learn and grow from some of their

experiences.

Angie

Re: Re: Epiphany of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships

Hi ,

I also a spouse of someone with AS. It is a very loney relationship most of the time. My husband has been daignosed with AS but is in denial and thinks he has a type four personality which has been reading up on. He doesn't want the stigmatism that something is "wrong" with him. Although he struggles such much socially,emotionally and has extremely poor self esteem he thinks its just his personality. I have been married almost ten years and I honestly don't know how its lasted this long. There have been numerous times I wanted to leave but since his diagnosis I am trying to have patience and change my behaviors towards his behaviors. I feel as though I am changing my self and personality to make my marriage work which makes me extremely sad. I was happy with myself but I feel I owe it to myself and my kids to help him. How do you know if your kids are AS or ADD/ADHD. My oldest son does ! exhibit some of the same personality traits as my husband his frustration with things his lack of wanting to talk about situations etc....I do love my husband and would love to saty married but I also feel like I need another relationship where I can get the emotional support I need. My vows are very important to me and I would never be unfaithful but the thought has crossed my mind. Its hard to share situations with friends and family members because my family at least thinks he is rude, obnoxious and unfeeling which he is alot of the time but I now know he can't help it. I'm suring having AS is not what my husband would wish for and finds daily life very difficult. But being the spouse of someone with AS is definitely lonely and stressful I think. I know longer make my husband accompany me to any family functions because it is to stressful for me. If your not an strong independant person before than I think AS makes you that way or makes your life very very stressful....I share you lonliness and just know that there are others going through the same so if you need to vent ....Please don't hestitate to get in touch. Sometimes its comforting to know someone else is struggling also. Where are you located. I'm in the Philadelphia area.

Talk to you soon hopefully

<amwill2pacbell (DOT) net> wrote:

I'm responding as the wife of someone with Asperger's, and I don't know if I have distrust with my spouse, but then he has been able to verbalize that he has no interest in changing himself to improve our marriage. We will have been married for 25 years this week. I would say that we have more of a "business arrangement" than a marriage, everything has always been geared to what he is comfortable with, and he is not very affectioanate, or romantic, and has been very verbal about not wanting to be, "too much pressure". We have a son who has been medically recognized as being AS, and that enabled him to receive services at the school. I don't believe that my husband believes he has AS, he has not been medically recognized, but he is exactly like our son, and we got to observe part of the testing, with our son, and my husband had a hard time relating what was going on and what the signifance of the testing ment. We have three boys total, all have add/adhd, one has AS and one has ODD (oppositional defiant disorder). Since my husband has been very vocal about what works for him, (of course he wasn't at first!) I have always made a point of taking the time to do something special for occaisions that are important to me. It was hard in the beginning of our marriage, and I used to wonder what had I done, or didn't do? But once we got our son's diagnosis, and I started researching materials on spouses of AS, it was like a light bulb went on. I don't take it personally, intelluctually, but since this is a milestone year (25th) and the plans I made, had to be cancelled, emotionally it is really hard. I have a lot of interests, and my plate is usually full, with the kids, and now I am a major care provider for my mother. But there really isn't anyone who can understand the loneliness, that comes with an AS relationship.On a side note, if anyone knows of a group of people that are married to or have family relationships with AS, I would like to know, as I feel very isolated most of the time, and I have just thought to reach out on the web, and came across this group. Angie >> I sent this note to see if anyone has been able to deal with the distrust > NT partners tend to have of their AS spouses when they say they are trying > to change.> > I have found one of the most negative responses we can make to an > individual iis withdrawal and sulking which is what I have done habitually > throughout our married life. Strange that what you should value becomes > more valuable when you have lost it.> > Perhaps I have had an epiphany but if that is so I will need a lot of > courage to take the necessary steps to make the most of it. I think the > penny dropped when the counsellor helped me understand the consequences > words and lack of action have, and how damaging it can be to a > relationship. One of the things that helped me understand this was the > following:> > We may think that we have to do things or say things rather than realising > that we can choose to do so or not to do so. I told my wife that I had > chosen to behave in the way I did and that realising that is a choice I > made means that I am really responsible for it. So the counsellor helped > me understand that I can choose to withdraw or I can choose to engage with > my wife. That in itself is a very powerful message. So when I do not "get > it" or do or say something that upsets or hurts her, I have to choose how > I respond not fall back on old negative habits. > > I have just now set a goal of trying hard to make a difference within 3 > months. I got home on Friday night and told my wife that I am going to > really try hard to fit in more and listen to her point of view and try not > to make it about me all the time. I have read a book called the seven > principles of making marriage work by Gottman. This has helped me > realise that there are tools I can use to make a better efforf. She > wanted to know when the lightning struck or who hit me on the head. To > quote the words she used > > "So after 30 years of not wanting me in your life you now decide you want > a relationship! What about when I wanted a relationship and you were > physically or emotionally unavailable to be involved in my life and the > kids lives? What ulteriror motive do you have that you find that this is > now necessary? What can you offer me other than what you have so far? Why > should I take a risk of being let down again? Just because you want it > now it HAS to happen! What are you going to base a relationship on that > you have destroyed? You still have Aspergers so how can you change?> > So I kept telling her that I need to try and I asked for her help. I have > said this several times over the weekend. I even tried to initiate > conversations about what we can do to develop some shared experiences. I > want to see if we can be happy together rather than trying to be happy > alone. I even sat in the family room with her tonight to watch a movie > rather than do my own thing. Tried making suggestions about the garden > and what she may like to do with it. The response so far has been > ridicule and put downs with accusations about how I expect her to roll > over and cause more pain. > > Now I understand the reaction may be her way of expressing her fears etc. > but basically she does not trust my motives. And to be fair to her the > questions are quite valid. I have lost count of the number of times I > have said sorry this weekend. I have also told her that I intend to spend > more time at home and not be so obsessive about work. The real challenge > for me I think will be being in the moment with her when I am home and not > problem solving something from work or at home. Also I need to connect > with my two daughters who both feel very protective of their mother and > are not inclined to make it easy for me. > > Needless to say I have felt quite discouraged. But I am going to clean up > my act, get fit and make sure that I do more to help if I can and if she > agrees. I have asked her also to tell me when anytthing I say hurts her > so that I can understand what or how I say things causes hurt. She > believes I say things to deliberately hurt or twist the knife so to speak. > Explaining that I am often unaware when she feels hurt is the major > problem. It seems I have to be so careful about what I say and have to > second guess how she might take it. > > Oh well. Lets see if I can stick to my goal and see what comes of it. I > do feel that 2008 will be a better year where my wife and I will finally > either make it together or make it apart. Even gaining her respect back > may be enough. It would definitely be progress. > > BTW the psychologist advised me that I have emotional dyspraxia. This > translates I think to lack of awareness of feelings or emotions and thus > inhibiting normal responses to emotional behaviour from > others. Do all AS on the list suffer this?> > Greg> dx AS at 53>

January 14, 2008

Welcome to the club , . You will see you are no longer alone in your struggles! Janet zEEI'm responding as the wife of someone with Asperger's, and I don't know if I have distrust with my spouse, but then he has been able to verbalize that he has no interest in changing himself to improve our marriage. We will have been married for 25 years this week. I would say that we have more of a "business arrangement" than a marriage, everything has always been geared to what he is comfortable with, and he is not very affectioanate, or romantic, and has been very verbal about not wanting to be, "too much pressure". We have a son who has been medically recognized as being AS, and that enabled him to receive services at the school. I don't believe that my husband believes he has AS, he has not been medically recognized, but he is exactly like our son, and we got to observe part of the testing, with our son, and my husband had a hard time relating what was going on and what the signifance of the testing ment. We have three boys total, all have add/adhd, one has AS and one has ODD (oppositional defiant disorder). Since my husband has been very vocal about what works for him, (of course he wasn't at first!) I have always made a point of taking the time to do something special for occaisions that are important to me. It was hard in the beginning of our marriage, and I used to wonder what had I done, or didn't do? But once we got our son's diagnosis, and I started researching materials on spouses of AS, it was like a light bulb went on. I don't take it personally, intelluctually, but since this is a milestone year (25th) and the plans I made, had to be cancelled, emotionally it is really hard. I have a lot of interests, and my plate is usually full, with the kids, and now I am a major care provider for my mother. But there really isn't anyone who can understand the loneliness, that comes with an AS relationship.On a side note, if anyone knows of a group of people that are married to or have family relationships with AS, I would like to know, as I feel very isolated most of the time, and I have just thought to reach out on the web, and came across this group. Angie >> I sent this note to see if anyone has been able to deal with the distrust > NT partners tend to have of their AS spouses when they say they are trying > to change.> > I have found one of the most negative responses we can make to an > individual iis withdrawal and sulking which is what I have done habitually > throughout our married life. Strange that what you should value becomes > more valuable when you have lost it.> > Perhaps I have had an epiphany but if that is so I will need a lot of > courage to take the necessary steps to make the most of it. I think the > penny dropped when the counsellor helped me understand the consequences > words and lack of action have, and how damaging it can be to a > relationship. One of the things that helped me understand this was the > following:> > We may think that we have to do things or say things rather than realising > that we can choose to do so or not to do so. I told my wife that I had > chosen to behave in the way I did and that realising that is a choice I > made means that I am really responsible for it. So the counsellor helped > me understand that I can choose to withdraw or I can choose to engage with > my wife. That in itself is a very powerful message. So when I do not "get > it" or do or say something that upsets or hurts her, I have to choose how > I respond not fall back on old negative habits. > > I have just now set a goal of trying hard to make a difference within 3 > months. I got home on Friday night and told my wife that I am going to > really try hard to fit in more and listen to her point of view and try not > to make it about me all the time. I have read a book called the seven > principles of making marriage work by Gottman. This has helped me > realise that there are tools I can use to make a better efforf. She > wanted to know when the lightning struck or who hit me on the head. To > quote the words she used > > "So after 30 years of not wanting me in your life you now decide you want > a relationship! What about when I wanted a relationship and you were > physically or emotionally unavailable to be involved in my life and the > kids lives? What ulteriror motive do you have that you find that this is > now necessary? What can you offer me other than what you have so far? Why > should I take a risk of being let down again? Just because you want it > now it HAS to happen! What are you going to base a relationship on that > you have destroyed? You still have Aspergers so how can you change?> > So I kept telling her that I need to try and I asked for her help. I have > said this several times over the weekend. I even tried to initiate > conversations about what we can do to develop some shared experiences. I > want to see if we can be happy together rather than trying to be happy > alone. I even sat in the family room with her tonight to watch a movie > rather than do my own thing. Tried making suggestions about the garden > and what she may like to do with it. The response so far has been > ridicule and put downs with accusations about how I expect her to roll > over and cause more pain. > > Now I understand the reaction may be her way of expressing her fears etc. > but basically she does not trust my motives. And to be fair to her the > questions are quite valid. I have lost count of the number of times I > have said sorry this weekend. I have also told her that I intend to spend > more time at home and not be so obsessive about work. The real challenge > for me I think will be being in the moment with her when I am home and not > problem solving something from work or at home. Also I need to connect > with my two daughters who both feel very protective of their mother and > are not inclined to make it easy for me. > > Needless to say I have felt quite discouraged. But I am going to clean up > my act, get fit and make sure that I do more to help if I can and if she > agrees. I have asked her also to tell me when anytthing I say hurts her > so that I can understand what or how I say things causes hurt. She > believes I say things to deliberately hurt or twist the knife so to speak. > Explaining that I am often unaware when she feels hurt is the major > problem. It seems I have to be so careful about what I say and have to > second guess how she might take it. > > Oh well. Lets see if I can stick to my goal and see what comes of it. I > do feel that 2008 will be a better year where my wife and I will finally > either make it together or make it apart. Even gaining her respect back > may be enough. It would definitely be progress. > > BTW the psychologist advised me that I have emotional dyspraxia. This > translates I think to lack of awareness of feelings or emotions and thus > inhibiting normal responses to emotional behaviour from > others. Do all AS on the list suffer this?> > Greg> dx AS at 53>

January 15, 2008

,

It has been stated a few times by NT

spouses that the AS spouse can often say they are going to change but they

see no difference in behaviour. I am in this category when my spouse

demands that I have to change and I always say yes with every intention

of doing so but then it can go one of two ways:

a) nothing happens and she gets more

disenchanted feeling that I have lied to her

I try to do something without consulting

her which leads to more aggravation or I go over the top in doing something

that has consequences I did not consider for her and the family.

Either way it seems to make things worse.

There seems to be a gap in common sense or executive function perhaps.

From an AS perspective the family members

often can get together and talk and enjoy each others company but we feel

like the lampshade in the corner. We by habit have not been involved

in their lives so can often get ignored. But then we do that to our

spouses when we withdraw.

Another frequent statement my spouse

makes is that I seem to be controlling and manipulative always wanting

things done my way. My view on this is that our inflexibility is what convinces

them that this is so. Maybe other NTs on the list could consider if this

is their experience too.

Greg

dx AS at 53

" "

Sent by: aspires-relationships

14/01/2008 07:16 PM

Please respond to

aspires-relationships

To

aspires-relationships

cc

Subject

Re: Epiphany

of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships

I'm responding as the wife of someone with Asperger's, and I don't

know if I have distrust with my spouse, but then he has been able to

verbalize that he has no interest in changing himself to improve our

marriage. We will have been married for 25 years this week. I would

say that we have more of a " business arrangement " than a marriage,

everything has always been geared to what he is comfortable with,

and he is not very affectioanate, or romantic, and has been very

verbal about not wanting to be, " too much pressure " . We have

a son

who has been medically recognized as being AS, and that enabled him

to receive services at the school. I don't believe that my husband

believes he has AS, he has not been medically recognized, but he is

exactly like our son, and we got to observe part of the testing,

with our son, and my husband had a hard time relating what was going

on and what the signifance of the testing ment. We have three boys

total, all have add/adhd, one has AS and one has ODD (oppositional

defiant disorder). Since my husband has been very vocal about what

works for him, (of course he wasn't at first!) I have always made a

point of taking the time to do something special for occaisions that

are important to me. It was hard in the beginning of our marriage,

and I used to wonder what had I done, or didn't do? But once we got

our son's diagnosis, and I started researching materials on spouses

of AS, it was like a light bulb went on. I don't take it personally,

intelluctually, but since this is a milestone year (25th) and the

plans I made, had to be cancelled, emotionally it is really hard. I

have a lot of interests, and my plate is usually full, with the

kids, and now I am a major care provider for my mother. But there

really isn't anyone who can understand the loneliness, that comes

with an AS relationship.

On a side note, if anyone knows of a group of people that are

married to or have family relationships with AS, I would like to

know, as I feel very isolated most of the

time, and I have just thought to reach out on the web, and came

across this group.

Angie

>

> I sent this note to see if anyone has been able to deal with the

distrust

> NT partners tend to have of their AS spouses when they say they

are trying

> to change.

>

> I have found one of the most negative responses we can make to an

> individual iis withdrawal and sulking which is what I have done

habitually

> throughout our married life. Strange that what you should value

becomes

> more valuable when you have lost it.

>

> Perhaps I have had an epiphany but if that is so I will need a lot

of

> courage to take the necessary steps to make the most of it. I

think the

> penny dropped when the counsellor helped me understand the

consequences

> words and lack of action have, and how damaging it can be to a

> relationship. One of the things that helped me understand this

was the

> following:

>

> We may think that we have to do things or say things rather than

realising

> that we can choose to do so or not to do so. I told my wife that I

had

> chosen to behave in the way I did and that realising that is a

choice I

> made means that I am really responsible for it. So the counsellor

helped

> me understand that I can choose to withdraw or I can choose to

engage with

> my wife. That in itself is a very powerful message. So when I do

not " get

> it " or do or say something that upsets or hurts her, I have to

choose how

> I respond not fall back on old negative habits.

>

> I have just now set a goal of trying hard to make a difference

within 3

> months. I got home on Friday night and told my wife that I am

going to

> really try hard to fit in more and listen to her point of view and

try not

> to make it about me all the time. I have read a book called the

seven

> principles of making marriage work by Gottman. This has

helped me

> realise that there are tools I can use to make a better efforf.

She

> wanted to know when the lightning struck or who hit me on the

head. To

> quote the words she used

>

> " So after 30 years of not wanting me in your life you now decide

you want

> a relationship! What about when I wanted a relationship and you

were

> physically or emotionally unavailable to be involved in my life

and the

> kids lives? What ulteriror motive do you have that you find that

this is

> now necessary? What can you offer me other than what you have so

far? Why

> should I take a risk of being let down again? Just because you

want it

> now it HAS to happen! What are you going to base a relationship

on that

> you have destroyed? You still have Aspergers so how can you

change?

>

> So I kept telling her that I need to try and I asked for her

help. I have

> said this several times over the weekend. I even tried to

initiate

> conversations about what we can do to develop some shared

experiences. I

> want to see if we can be happy together rather than trying to be

happy

> alone. I even sat in the family room with her tonight to watch a

movie

> rather than do my own thing. Tried making suggestions about the

garden

> and what she may like to do with it. The response so far has been

> ridicule and put downs with accusations about how I expect her to

roll

> over and cause more pain.

>

> Now I understand the reaction may be her way of expressing her

fears etc.

> but basically she does not trust my motives. And to be fair to

her the

> questions are quite valid. I have lost count of the number of

times I

> have said sorry this weekend. I have also told her that I intend

to spend

> more time at home and not be so obsessive about work. The real

challenge

> for me I think will be being in the moment with her when I am home

and not

> problem solving something from work or at home. Also I need to

connect

> with my two daughters who both feel very protective of their

mother and

> are not inclined to make it easy for me.

>

> Needless to say I have felt quite discouraged. But I am going to

clean up

> my act, get fit and make sure that I do more to help if I can and

if she

> agrees. I have asked her also to tell me when anytthing I say

hurts her

> so that I can understand what or how I say things causes hurt.

She

> believes I say things to deliberately hurt or twist the knife so

to speak.

> Explaining that I am often unaware when she feels hurt is the

major

> problem. It seems I have to be so careful about what I say and

have to

> second guess how she might take it.

>

> Oh well. Lets see if I can stick to my goal and see what comes of

it. I

> do feel that 2008 will be a better year where my wife and I will

finally

> either make it together or make it apart. Even gaining her

respect back

> may be enough. It would definitely be progress.

>

> BTW the psychologist advised me that I have emotional dyspraxia.

This

> translates I think to lack of awareness of feelings or emotions

and thus

> inhibiting normal responses to emotional behaviour from

> others. Do all AS on the list suffer this?

>

> Greg

> dx AS at 53

>

January 15, 2008

Greg,

I appreciate your comments and your viewpoint. My husband is an engineer. I have observed

over the years that he does seem to be lacking in basic commom sense, he has made the

same observation, himself. He is a project manager, and is very controlling and subtly manipulative

in his work environment (which I attributed to his being an engineer), which he sometimes brings home.

I feel I am also a controlling person, first child, type A, very detail oriented, and organized.

I actually find this a strength, having to deal with the family we have.

As much as I know intellectually from reading and surfing the web, and just through my personal

observations on living with my husband and my son, I still have periods of mourning, what I am missing

in having an intepersonal relationship with them, such as I have with a friend. My son gets social

skills classes at school, he sees a counselor, and I do have hope for him, as he asks questions and

queries his behaviour in situations, sometimes. When my husband and I were both in counseling, he

never really seemed to connect that someone else might have a different view on something. Everything

is either black or white, and I consider myself to live in a 'gray' environment. If he thought something was

black, then I better think that way too. Some of the decisions he has made during our marriage, reflect

his lack of being able to comprehend how, whatever the decision or circumstance might be, affects the

family as a 'whole'. He sees how it will affect him, and just seems to be oblivious to how the same decision

is going to affect anyone else. I didn't continue with him in counseling, because it was just so non-progressive

and I felt like I was talking to a brick wall. The counselor was fascinated by his observations, and genuflections

and he continues to see her to this day, which is working for him.

One of the coping mechanisms I have is to "find what works, and do that" knowing that it is subject to

change based on the situation, the person or persons involved in the situations, etc. I just feel that I am the

one consistently having to change, or compromise. At what point do I devalue myself, and not voice my

opinions, just because it is easier to go along with what works for him? Can I continue to do this? Sometimes

I feel like I am in a prison, as weird as that sounds. The overwhelming effort it takes , to make a connection

with him is just more energy than I have most of the time. His status quo, is all I can muster most days. If

I am responding to him the way he wants me to, he appears genuinely happy, or maybe content would be a

better phrase. For as much drama as we have in our lives, there is a basic framework, of a structured regimen,

that if he isn't getting that, things don't go well.

I'm sure he loves me, I would just like to feel more like his spouse and not his mother. Pryor to joining this

group and not being able to connect with a group in my area, I have focused on the person I have control over

changing, me. But it is very difficult, as other friends really can't relate to what it's like, and it's hard for me to

explain. I am thankful for coming across this forum to be able to grow and learn, being able to build up my strength

to continue to change, and compromise in love. I feel I am a 'work in progress', and that we were meant to be

together, it is sometimes I feel that maybe I am not getting whatever the message is that I am supposed to get

from the experience.

Blessings,

Angie

Re: Re: Epiphany of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships

, It has been stated a few times by NT spouses that the AS spouse can often say they are going to change but they see no difference in behaviour. I am in this category when my spouse demands that I have to change and I always say yes with every intention of doing so but then it can go one of two ways: a) nothing happens and she gets more disenchanted feeling that I have lied to her I try to do something without consulting her which leads to more aggravation or I go over the top in doing something that has consequences I did not consider for her and the family. Either way it seems to make things worse. There seems to be a gap in common sense or executive function perhaps. From an AS perspective the family members often can get together and talk and enjoy each others company but we feel like the lampshade in the corner. We by habit have not been involved in their lives so can often get ignored. But then we do that to our spouses when we withdraw. Another frequent statement my spouse makes is that I seem to be controlling and manipulative always wanting things done my way. My view on this is that our inflexibility is what convinces them that this is so. Maybe other NTs on the list could consider if this is their experience too. Greg dx AS at 53

" " <amwill2pacbell (DOT) net> Sent by: aspires-relationships 14/01/2008 07:16 PM

Please respond toaspires-relationships

To

aspires-relationships

cc

Subject

Re: Epiphany of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships

I'm responding as the wife of someone with Asperger's, and I don't know if I have distrust with my spouse, but then he has been able to verbalize that he has no interest in changing himself to improve our marriage. We will have been married for 25 years this week. I would say that we have more of a "business arrangement" than a marriage, everything has always been geared to what he is comfortable with, and he is not very affectioanate, or romantic, and has been very verbal about not wanting to be, "too much pressure". We have a son who has been medically recognized as being AS, and that enabled him to receive services at the school. I don't believe that my husband believes he has AS, he has not been medically recognized, but he is exactly like our son, and we got to observe part of the testing, with our son, and my husband had a hard time relating what was going on and what the signifance of the testing ment. We have three boys total, all have add/adhd, one has AS and one has ODD (oppositional defiant disorder). Since my husband has been very vocal about what works for him, (of course he wasn't at first!) I have always made a point of taking the time to do something special for occaisions that are important to me. It was hard in the beginning of our marriage, and I used to wonder what had I done, or didn't do? But once we got our son's diagnosis, and I started researching materials on spouses of AS, it was like a light bulb went on. I don't take it personally, intelluctually, but since this is a milestone year (25th) and the plans I made, had to be cancelled, emotionally it is really hard. I have a lot of interests, and my plate is usually full, with the kids, and now I am a major care provider for my mother. But there really isn't anyone who can understand the loneliness, that comes with an AS relationship.On a side note, if anyone knows of a group of people that are married to or have family relationships with AS, I would like to know, as I feel very isolated most of the time, and I have just thought to reach out on the web, and came across this group. Angie >> I sent this note to see if anyone has been able to deal with the distrust > NT partners tend to have of their AS spouses when they say they are trying > to change.> > I have found one of the most negative responses we can make to an > individual iis withdrawal and sulking which is what I have done habitually > throughout our married life. Strange that what you should value becomes > more valuable when you have lost it.> > Perhaps I have had an epiphany but if that is so I will need a lot of > courage to take the necessary steps to make the most of it. I think the > penny dropped when the counsellor helped me understand the consequences > words and lack of action have, and how damaging it can be to a > relationship. One of the things that helped me understand this was the > following:> > We may think that we have to do things or say things rather than realising > that we can choose to do so or not to do so. I told my wife that I had > chosen to behave in the way I did and that realising that is a choice I > made means that I am really responsible for it. So the counsellor helped > me understand that I can choose to withdraw or I can choose to engage with > my wife. That in itself is a very powerful message. So when I do not "get > it" or do or say something that upsets or hurts her, I have to choose how > I respond not fall back on old negative habits. > > I have just now set a goal of trying hard to make a difference within 3 > months. I got home on Friday night and told my wife that I am going to > really try hard to fit in more and listen to her point of view and try not > to make it about me all the time. I have read a book called the seven > principles of making marriage work by Gottman. This has helped me > realise that there are tools I can use to make a better efforf. She > wanted to know when the lightning struck or who hit me on the head. To > quote the words she used > > "So after 30 years of not wanting me in your life you now decide you want > a relationship! What about when I wanted a relationship and you were > physically or emotionally unavailable to be involved in my life and the > kids lives? What ulteriror motive do you have that you find that this is > now necessary? What can you offer me other than what you have so far? Why > should I take a risk of being let down again? Just because you want it > now it HAS to happen! What are you going to base a relationship on that > you have destroyed? You still have Aspergers so how can you change?> > So I kept telling her that I need to try and I asked for her help. I have > said this several times over the weekend. I even tried to initiate > conversations about what we can do to develop some shared experiences. I > want to see if we can be happy together rather than trying to be happy > alone. I even sat in the family room with her tonight to watch a movie > rather than do my own thing. Tried making suggestions about the garden > and what she may like to do with it. The response so far has been > ridicule and put downs with accusations about how I expect her to roll > over and cause more pain. > > Now I understand the reaction may be her way of expressing her fears etc. > but basically she does not trust my motives. And to be fair to her the > questions are quite valid. I have lost count of the number of times I > have said sorry this weekend. I have also told her that I intend to spend > more time at home and not be so obsessive about work. The real challenge > for me I think will be being in the moment with her when I am home and not > problem solving something from work or at home. Also I need to connect > with my two daughters who both feel very protective of their mother and > are not inclined to make it easy for me. > > Needless to say I have felt quite discouraged. But I am going to clean up > my act, get fit and make sure that I do more to help if I can and if she > agrees. I have asked her also to tell me when anytthing I say hurts her > so that I can understand what or how I say things causes hurt. She > believes I say things to deliberately hurt or twist the knife so to speak. > Explaining that I am often unaware when she feels hurt is the major > problem. It seems I have to be so careful about what I say and have to > second guess how she might take it. > > Oh well. Lets see if I can stick to my goal and see what comes of it. I > do feel that 2008 will be a better year where my wife and I will finally > either make it together or make it apart. Even gaining her respect back > may be enough. It would definitely be progress. > > BTW the psychologist advised me that I have emotional dyspraxia. This > translates I think to lack of awareness of feelings or emotions and thus > inhibiting normal responses to emotional behaviour from > others. Do all AS on the list suffer this?> > Greg> dx AS at 53>

January 15, 2008

I agree. I do see a change in my husband when HE feels good about himself. That changes almost daily though. The statement about controlling and manipulative is pretty acuarate for me also. He thinks his way is the right way and he has had problems at work because of this he's a commercial plumber. Greg Greer wrote: , It has been stated a few times by NT spouses that the AS spouse can often say they are going to change but they see no

difference in behaviour. I am in this category when my spouse demands that I have to change and I always say yes with every intention of doing so but then it can go one of two ways: a) nothing happens and she gets more disenchanted feeling that I have lied to her I try to do something without consulting her which leads to more aggravation or I go over the top in doing something that has consequences I did not consider for her and the family. Either way it seems to make things worse. There seems to be a gap in common sense or executive function perhaps. From an AS perspective the family members often can get together and talk and enjoy each others company but we feel like the lampshade in the corner. We by habit have not been involved in their lives so can often get ignored. But

then we do that to our spouses when we withdraw. Another frequent statement my spouse makes is that I seem to be controlling and manipulative always wanting things done my way. My view on this is that our inflexibility is what convinces them that this is so. Maybe other NTs on the list could consider if this is their experience too. Greg dx AS at 53 " " <amwill2pacbell (DOT) net> Sent by: aspires-relationships 14/01/2008 07:16 PM Please respond toaspires-relationships To aspires-relationships cc Subject Re: Epiphany of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships I'm responding as the wife of someone with Asperger's, and I don't know if I have distrust with my

spouse, but then he has been able to verbalize that he has no interest in changing himself to improve our marriage. We will have been married for 25 years this week. I would say that we have more of a "business arrangement" than a marriage, everything has always been geared to what he is comfortable with, and he is not very affectioanate, or romantic, and has been very verbal about not wanting to be, "too much pressure". We have a son who has been medically recognized as being AS, and that enabled him to receive services at the school. I don't believe that my husband believes he has AS, he has not been medically recognized, but he is exactly like our son, and we got to observe part of the testing, with our son, and my husband had a hard time relating what was going on and what the signifance of the testing ment. We have three boys total, all have add/adhd, one has AS and one has ODD (oppositional defiant disorder).

Since my husband has been very vocal about what works for him, (of course he wasn't at first!) I have always made a point of taking the time to do something special for occaisions that are important to me. It was hard in the beginning of our marriage, and I used to wonder what had I done, or didn't do? But once we got our son's diagnosis, and I started researching materials on spouses of AS, it was like a light bulb went on. I don't take it personally, intelluctually, but since this is a milestone year (25th) and the plans I made, had to be cancelled, emotionally it is really hard. I have a lot of interests, and my plate is usually full, with the kids, and now I am a major care provider for my mother. But there really isn't anyone who can understand the loneliness, that comes with an AS relationship.On a side note, if anyone knows of a group of people that are married to or have family relationships with AS, I would

like to know, as I feel very isolated most of the time, and I have just thought to reach out on the web, and came across this group. Angie >> I sent this note to see if anyone has been able to deal with the distrust > NT partners tend to have of their AS spouses when they say they are trying > to change.> > I have found one of the most negative responses we can make to an > individual iis withdrawal and sulking which is what I have done habitually > throughout our married life. Strange that what you should value becomes > more valuable when you have lost it.> > Perhaps I have had an epiphany but if that is so I will need a lot of >

courage to take the necessary steps to make the most of it. I think the > penny dropped when the counsellor helped me understand the consequences > words and lack of action have, and how damaging it can be to a > relationship. One of the things that helped me understand this was the > following:> > We may think that we have to do things or say things rather than realising > that we can choose to do so or not to do so. I told my wife that I had > chosen to behave in the way I did and that realising that is a choice I > made means that I am really responsible for it. So the counsellor helped > me understand that I can choose to withdraw or I can choose to engage with > my wife. That in itself is a very powerful message. So when I do not "get > it" or do or say something that upsets or hurts her, I have to choose how > I respond not fall back on

old negative habits. > > I have just now set a goal of trying hard to make a difference within 3 > months. I got home on Friday night and told my wife that I am going to > really try hard to fit in more and listen to her point of view and try not > to make it about me all the time. I have read a book called the seven > principles of making marriage work by Gottman. This has helped me > realise that there are tools I can use to make a better efforf. She > wanted to know when the lightning struck or who hit me on the head. To > quote the words she used > > "So after 30 years of not wanting me in your life you now decide you want > a relationship! What about when I wanted a relationship and you were > physically or emotionally unavailable to be involved in my life and the > kids lives? What ulteriror motive do you have that you find

that this is > now necessary? What can you offer me other than what you have so far? Why > should I take a risk of being let down again? Just because you want it > now it HAS to happen! What are you going to base a relationship on that > you have destroyed? You still have Aspergers so how can you change?> > So I kept telling her that I need to try and I asked for her help. I have > said this several times over the weekend. I even tried to initiate > conversations about what we can do to develop some shared experiences. I > want to see if we can be happy together rather than trying to be happy > alone. I even sat in the family room with her tonight to watch a movie > rather than do my own thing. Tried making suggestions about the garden > and what she may like to do with it. The response so far has been > ridicule and put downs with

accusations about how I expect her to roll > over and cause more pain. > > Now I understand the reaction may be her way of expressing her fears etc. > but basically she does not trust my motives. And to be fair to her the > questions are quite valid. I have lost count of the number of times I > have said sorry this weekend. I have also told her that I intend to spend > more time at home and not be so obsessive about work. The real challenge > for me I think will be being in the moment with her when I am home and not > problem solving something from work or at home. Also I need to connect > with my two daughters who both feel very protective of their mother and > are not inclined to make it easy for me. > > Needless to say I have felt quite discouraged. But I am going to clean up > my act, get fit and make sure that I do more to help if I

can and if she > agrees. I have asked her also to tell me when anytthing I say hurts her > so that I can understand what or how I say things causes hurt. She > believes I say things to deliberately hurt or twist the knife so to speak. > Explaining that I am often unaware when she feels hurt is the major > problem. It seems I have to be so careful about what I say and have to > second guess how she might take it. > > Oh well. Lets see if I can stick to my goal and see what comes of it. I > do feel that 2008 will be a better year where my wife and I will finally > either make it together or make it apart. Even gaining her respect back > may be enough. It would definitely be progress. > > BTW the psychologist advised me that I have emotional dyspraxia. This > translates I think to lack of awareness of feelings or emotions and thus

> inhibiting normal responses to emotional behaviour from > others. Do all AS on the list suffer this?> > Greg> dx AS at 53>

January 15, 2008

Angie, I connected with your story so much. I too am Type A, first child and I too feel I need to change to make life easier. A friend told me that I should not change who I am. But I believe understanding what others go through and how they deal will help me in my relationship with my husband. I am eternally gtateful... 's Family wrote: Greg, I appreciate your comments and your viewpoint. My husband is an engineer. I have observed over the years that he does seem to be lacking in basic commom sense, he has made the same observation, himself. He is a project manager, and is very controlling and subtly manipulative in his work environment (which I attributed to his being an engineer), which he sometimes brings home. I feel I am also a controlling person, first child, type A, very detail oriented, and organized. I actually find this a strength, having to deal with the family we have. As much as I know intellectually from reading and surfing the web, and just through my personal observations on living with my husband and my son, I still have periods of mourning, what I am missing in having an intepersonal relationship with them, such as I have with a friend. My son gets social skills classes at school, he sees a counselor, and I do have hope for him, as he asks questions and queries his behaviour in situations, sometimes. When my husband and I were both in counseling, he never really seemed to connect that someone else might have a different view on something. Everything is either black or white, and I consider myself to live in a 'gray' environment. If he thought something was black, then I better think that way too. Some of the decisions he has made during our marriage, reflect his lack of being able to comprehend how, whatever the decision or circumstance might be, affects the family as a 'whole'. He sees how it will affect him, and just seems to be oblivious to how the same decision is going to affect anyone else. I didn't continue with him in counseling, because it was just so non-progressive and I felt like I was talking to a brick wall. The counselor was fascinated by his observations, and

genuflections and he continues to see her to this day, which is working for him. One of the coping mechanisms I have is to "find what works, and do that" knowing that it is subject to change based on the situation, the person or persons involved in the situations, etc. I just feel that I am the one consistently having to change, or compromise. At what point do I devalue myself, and not voice my opinions, just because it is easier to go along with what works for him? Can I continue to do this? Sometimes I feel like I am in a prison, as weird as that sounds. The overwhelming effort it takes , to make a connection with him is just more energy than I have most of the time. His status quo, is all I can muster most days. If I am responding to him the way he wants me to, he appears genuinely happy, or maybe content would be a better phrase. For as much drama as we have in our lives, there is a basic framework, of a structured regimen, that if he isn't getting that, things don't go well. I'm sure he loves me, I would just like to feel more like

his spouse and not his mother. Pryor to joining this group and not being able to connect with a group in my area, I have focused on the person I have control over changing, me. But it is very difficult, as other friends really can't relate to what it's like, and it's hard for me to explain. I am thankful for coming across this forum to be able to grow and learn, being able to build up my strength to continue to change, and compromise in love. I feel I am a 'work in progress', and that we were meant to be together, it is sometimes I feel that maybe I am not getting whatever the message is that I am supposed to get from the

experience. Blessings, Angie Re: Re: Epiphany of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships , It has been stated a few times by NT spouses that the AS spouse can often say they are going to change but they see no difference in behaviour. I am in this category when my spouse demands that I have to change and I always say yes with every intention of doing so but then it can go one of two ways: a) nothing happens and she gets more disenchanted feeling that I have lied to her I try to do something without consulting her which leads to more aggravation or I go over the top in doing something that has consequences I did not consider for her and the family. Either way it seems to make things worse. There seems to be a gap in common sense or executive function perhaps. From an AS perspective the family members often can get together and talk and enjoy each others company but we feel like the lampshade in the corner. We by habit have not been involved in their lives so can often get ignored. But then we do that to our spouses when we withdraw. Another frequent statement my spouse makes is that I seem to be controlling and manipulative always wanting things done my way. My view on this is that our inflexibility is what convinces them that this is so. Maybe other NTs on the list could consider if this is their experience too. Greg dx AS at 53 " " <amwill2pacbell (DOT) net> Sent by: aspires-relationships 14/01/2008 07:16 PM Please respond toaspires-relationships To aspires-relationships cc Subject Re: Epiphany of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships I'm responding as the wife of someone with Asperger's, and I don't know if I have distrust with my spouse, but then he has been able to verbalize that he has no interest in changing himself to improve our marriage. We will have been married for 25 years this week. I would say that we have more of a "business arrangement" than a marriage, everything has always been geared to what he is comfortable with, and he is not very affectioanate, or romantic, and has been very verbal about not wanting to be, "too much pressure". We have a son who has been medically recognized as being AS, and that enabled him to receive services

at the school. I don't believe that my husband believes he has AS, he has not been medically recognized, but he is exactly like our son, and we got to observe part of the testing, with our son, and my husband had a hard time relating what was going on and what the signifance of the testing ment. We have three boys total, all have add/adhd, one has AS and one has ODD (oppositional defiant disorder). Since my husband has been very vocal about what works for him, (of course he wasn't at first!) I have always made a point of taking the time to do something special for occaisions that are important to me. It was hard in the beginning of our marriage, and I used to wonder what had I done, or didn't do? But once we got our son's diagnosis, and I started researching materials on spouses of AS, it was like a light bulb went on. I don't take it personally, intelluctually, but since this is a milestone year (25th) and the plans

I made, had to be cancelled, emotionally it is really hard. I have a lot of interests, and my plate is usually full, with the kids, and now I am a major care provider for my mother. But there really isn't anyone who can understand the loneliness, that comes with an AS relationship.On a side note, if anyone knows of a group of people that are married to or have family relationships with AS, I would like to know, as I feel very isolated most of the time, and I have just thought to reach out on the web, and came across this group. Angie >> I sent this note to see if anyone has been able to deal with the distrust > NT partners tend to have of their AS spouses when they say they are

trying > to change.> > I have found one of the most negative responses we can make to an > individual iis withdrawal and sulking which is what I have done habitually > throughout our married life. Strange that what you should value becomes > more valuable when you have lost it.> > Perhaps I have had an epiphany but if that is so I will need a lot of > courage to take the necessary steps to make the most of it. I think the > penny dropped when the counsellor helped me understand the consequences > words and lack of action have, and how damaging it can be to a > relationship. One of the things that helped me understand this was the > following:> > We may think that we have to do things or say things rather than realising > that we can choose to do so or not to do so. I told my wife that I had > chosen to behave in the way I

did and that realising that is a choice I > made means that I am really responsible for it. So the counsellor helped > me understand that I can choose to withdraw or I can choose to engage with > my wife. That in itself is a very powerful message. So when I do not "get > it" or do or say something that upsets or hurts her, I have to choose how > I respond not fall back on old negative habits. > > I have just now set a goal of trying hard to make a difference within 3 > months. I got home on Friday night and told my wife that I am going to > really try hard to fit in more and listen to her point of view and try not > to make it about me all the time. I have read a book called the seven > principles of making marriage work by Gottman. This has helped me > realise that there are tools I can use to make a better efforf. She > wanted to

know when the lightning struck or who hit me on the head. To > quote the words she used > > "So after 30 years of not wanting me in your life you now decide you want > a relationship! What about when I wanted a relationship and you were > physically or emotionally unavailable to be involved in my life and the > kids lives? What ulteriror motive do you have that you find that this is > now necessary? What can you offer me other than what you have so far? Why > should I take a risk of being let down again? Just because you want it > now it HAS to happen! What are you going to base a relationship on that > you have destroyed? You still have Aspergers so how can you change?> > So I kept telling her that I need to try and I asked for her help. I have > said this several times over the weekend. I even tried to initiate > conversations

about what we can do to develop some shared experiences. I > want to see if we can be happy together rather than trying to be happy > alone. I even sat in the family room with her tonight to watch a movie > rather than do my own thing. Tried making suggestions about the garden > and what she may like to do with it. The response so far has been > ridicule and put downs with accusations about how I expect her to roll > over and cause more pain. > > Now I understand the reaction may be her way of expressing her fears etc. > but basically she does not trust my motives. And to be fair to her the > questions are quite valid. I have lost count of the number of times I > have said sorry this weekend. I have also told her that I intend to spend > more time at home and not be so obsessive about work. The real challenge > for me I think will be being in

the moment with her when I am home and not > problem solving something from work or at home. Also I need to connect > with my two daughters who both feel very protective of their mother and > are not inclined to make it easy for me. > > Needless to say I have felt quite discouraged. But I am going to clean up > my act, get fit and make sure that I do more to help if I can and if she > agrees. I have asked her also to tell me when anytthing I say hurts her > so that I can understand what or how I say things causes hurt. She > believes I say things to deliberately hurt or twist the knife so to speak. > Explaining that I am often unaware when she feels hurt is the major > problem. It seems I have to be so careful about what I say and have to > second guess how she might take it. > > Oh well. Lets see if I can stick to my goal and see what

comes of it. I > do feel that 2008 will be a better year where my wife and I will finally > either make it together or make it apart. Even gaining her respect back > may be enough. It would definitely be progress. > > BTW the psychologist advised me that I have emotional dyspraxia. This > translates I think to lack of awareness of feelings or emotions and thus > inhibiting normal responses to emotional behaviour from > others. Do all AS on the list suffer this?> > Greg> dx AS at 53>

January 15, 2008

Angie,

From my own AS perspective there is

no doubt that I love my wife but the communication styles being so different

and mine being so inflexible has created many problems. I keep thinking

that if I did not love my family then why would I still be here providing

for them? The answer is that it is comfortable but the relationship

is not.

My wife needs to feel that she is the

number one thing in my life.

Let me try to describe what love is

for me as a diagnosed AS.

It means that when your partner wants

help then they should ask for it. If they want to go to the movies

then they should say so.

If I want to have time to myself then

I should be able to without recriminations.

Love is having the strength to declare

what boundaries you need.

Love is having the capacity to say that

is alright to have your own space in a relationship.

Love is not having to be expected to

think of someone else all the time.

But that is egocentric. I may

never get to understand love from an NT perspective. It seems like

fuzzy logic. Here is what I have learned love is not.

Love is not withdrawing because you

are oversensitive and sulking. That I have learned form counselling.

Love is not being secretive and refusing

to take responsibility. That I have learned from my wife.

Love is not having to have continual

reassurance of your partners affection. That is dependence.

I have become aware of how my wife and

I have morphed over the years. I was the strong one and slowly became

dependent on her. She was the dependent one who has had to become

strong for the kids and to keep a marriage afloat.

To all you NT women out there. What

you are doing is heroic. Even more so when you need a hero and he

is not there. It took me a long time to see that.

In some ways AS people learn how to

make themselves feel good by doing their own thing. This can lead

to maladaptive behaviour. It also builds walls.

I am trying to dismantle the wall brick

by brick. Each brick has a word on it. My wife cannot do it.

She did not build it. I have to do it.

Greg

dx AS at 53

" 's Family "

Sent by: aspires-relationships

15/01/2008 06:01 PM

Please respond to

aspires-relationships

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Subject

Re: Re: Epiphany

of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships

Greg,

I appreciate your comments

and your viewpoint. My husband is an engineer. I have observed

over the years that he does seem to be lacking

in basic commom sense, he has made the

same observation, himself. He is a project

manager, and is very controlling and subtly manipulative

in his work environment (which I attributed

to his being an engineer), which he sometimes brings home.

I feel I am also a controlling person,

first child, type A, very detail oriented, and organized.

I actually find this a strength, having to

deal with the family we have.

As much as I know intellectually

from reading and surfing the web, and just through my personal

observations on living with my husband and

my son, I still have periods of mourning, what I am missing

in having an intepersonal relationship with

them, such as I have with a friend. My son gets social

skills classes at school, he sees a counselor,

and I do have hope for him, as he asks questions and

queries his behaviour in situations, sometimes.

When my husband and I were both in counseling, he

never really seemed to connect that someone

else might have a different view on something. Everything

is either black or white, and I consider

myself to live in a 'gray' environment. If he thought something was

black, then I better think that way too.

Some of the decisions he has made during our marriage, reflect

his lack of being able to comprehend how,

whatever the decision or circumstance might be, affects the

family as a 'whole'. He sees how it will

affect him, and just seems to be oblivious to how the same decision

is going to affect anyone else. I didn't

continue with him in counseling, because it was just so non-progressive

and I felt like I was talking to a brick

wall. The counselor was fascinated by his observations, and genuflections

and he continues to see her to this day,

which is working for him.

One of the coping mechanisms

I have is to " find what works, and do that " knowing that it is

subject to

change based on the situation, the person

or persons involved in the situations, etc. I just feel that I am the

one consistently having to change, or compromise.

At what point do I devalue myself, and not voice my

opinions, just because it is easier to go

along with what works for him? Can I continue to do this? Sometimes

I feel like I am in a prison, as weird as

that sounds. The overwhelming effort it takes , to make a connection

with him is just more energy than I have

most of the time. His status quo, is all I can muster most days. If

I am responding to him the way he wants me

to, he appears genuinely happy, or maybe content would be a

better phrase. For as much drama as we have

in our lives, there is a basic framework, of a structured regimen,

that if he isn't getting that, things don't

go well.

I'm sure he loves me,

I would just like to feel more like his spouse and not his mother. Pryor

to joining this

group and not being able to connect with

a group in my area, I have focused on the person I have control over

changing, me. But it is very difficult, as

other friends really can't relate to what it's like, and it's hard for

me to

explain. I am thankful for coming across

this forum to be able to grow and learn, being able to build up my strength

to continue to change, and compromise in

love. I feel I am a 'work in progress', and that we were meant to be

together, it is sometimes I feel that maybe

I am not getting whatever the message is that I am supposed to get

from the experience.

Blessings,

Angie

Re: Re: Epiphany

of sorts - Making a difference in AS/NT relationships

,

It has been stated a few times by NT spouses that the AS spouse can often

say they are going to change but they see no difference in behaviour. I

am in this category when my spouse demands that I have to change and I

always say yes with every intention of doing so but then it can go one

of two ways:

a) nothing happens and she gets more disenchanted feeling that I have lied

to her

I try to do something without consulting her which leads to more aggravation

or I go over the top in doing something that has consequences I did not

consider for her and the family.

Either way it seems to make things worse. There seems to be a gap

in common sense or executive function perhaps.

From an AS perspective the family members often can get together and talk

and enjoy each others company but we feel like the lampshade in the corner.

We by habit have not been involved in their lives so can often get

ignored. But then we do that to our spouses when we withdraw.

Another frequent statement my spouse makes is that I seem to be controlling

and manipulative always wanting things done my way. My view on this is

that our inflexibility is what convinces them that this is so. Maybe other

NTs on the list could consider if this is their experience too.

Greg

dx AS at 53

"