RE: What's nudity got to do with religion?

[Guest guest]

Hi Janet,

You brought up a significant question, but

it is one that can be readily answered. And I’m not answering from

a partisan point of view, but rather from a factual one.

I apologize for dealing with a religious

topic, but I plead that I might be able to avert more queries and debate on the

topic, and we can just move on. I want to point out that I am

deliberately avoiding precise quotes of Biblical Chapter and Verse. This

would sound a bit too much like preaching, and I just want to explain these

things in general.

What has nudity got to do with

Christianity or Jesus? Well, personally, I’m not aligned

with those on the Church side, but I can give some guidelines to clarify the

matter, from a traditional and Biblical point of view. And these will be

pretty well applicable to all people ‘of the Book’, Judaism,

Christianity and Islam.

For a start, the story of Adam and Eve

indicates that our ‘first parents’ were embarrassed and ashamed

when they realized their nude condition. They promptly clothed themselves

in Fig leaves, we are told. Then on being expelled from the garden, were

clothed by God in ‘animal skins’. Since the Garden story of the

Fall is and has to be the very foundation of Christian doctrine about man,

therefore it can be stated that humanity is ‘meant’ to be clothed

in everyday life. The story expresses the idea that until a total

regeneration of the race through Salvation occurs, mankind may not attempt to

imitate the innocent state of A and E. It is generally suggested in

tradition and illustrated in many Art works that at the Last Judgement, mankind

will again be in the naked state as they face their Maker.

Then there is the demand or expectation

that the Christian will not act, eat, dress or whatever in any way that might

cause his brother or sister to ‘stumble’. Nudity removes some of

the barriers and tendencies to temptation, and will, it would be argued, make

it easier to sin. In the Jewish Bible, it is frequently

indicated that it is a heinous sin to ‘uncover the nakedness’ of

people. This represents a pretty general rule on the matter;

although some scholars would suggest that ‘uncovering one’s

nakedness’ is essentially a euphemism for sexual activity. The

surrounding Pagan peoples around the Jews and then the Christians, frequently

displayed a most libertarian approach to nudity (leading presumably to improper

actions), and especially within their religious context. Naturally these examples

just appalled the faithful, and inevitably brought about more and more rules to

control sexual behaviour and proper dressing back at home.

There may well be other concepts or ideas,

but the final set of guidelines and expectations would concern the principle of

faithfulness to one’s wife or husband, who alone may be permitted all

physical intimacies including contact and viewing in the undressed condition;

as well as the obvious principles of intimate caring for one’s children.

And it must be said that from both the earliest traditions of Catholicism, in

the writings of Augustine, Jerome and loads of others, through to the Puritan

views of Calvinism etc, the heaviest sanctions were enjoined on immodesty in

one’s dress. Friend Jerome was literally obsessed with

decency in women’s dress and wrote about it almost with a relish. Many

Biblical passages in Old and New do make direct rules about appropriate dress

and modesty. But few of us today would be too worried about women wearing

trousers or other male dress; or for that matter be concerned with the objections

about hair-styles jewelry and the covering of one’s hair in public.

These are all vital principles of

Religion, and especially within traditional Christianity. So right

or wrong, our religions would all take an official stand on the matter of

nudity, and the Christian

Churches of our Tradition

would certainly for the most part, agree on it. So when it

comes to persons with the Aspergers Syndrome, it can be said that if they

adhere rigidly to any of the Christian Churches, it is most likely that they

would stick closely in their classic Aspie fashion, to their rules and sanctions,

taking them in the most literal form. Obviously individuals in

every age turn up who either question the traditions and rules, and may take on

for themselves the job of protesting, or of just practicing such things as

nudity in private or with persons of their own conviction.

Ron.

Subject: Re:

Aspergers and Naturism/Nudism

I am jumping in here... perhaps inappropriately and my cat is tryin gto

lay on my ha =nds, so hang in there while I boot her away! I don't see what

nudity has to do with

Chrisitianity or Jesus. Religious beliefs, yes. but they are not one

and the same. I think that this is where the argumentative tone about religion

(Or whatever you want to call it) always comes up on this site... people

propose that their 'flavor' of Christianity is the only one and that is what is

offensive, not the actual exchange of ideas about the subject. So it is

forbidden. To bad I say.

[Guest guest]

Ron,

A good explanation of 'what's nudity got to do with religion'. :-) Good job.

Jennie AS

[Guest guest]

I appreciate your input on this Ron but I find it somewhat illogical to way the least.  And patriarchal as well.   But valid as an explanation in it's own way.  nuff said.  Janet ZEE Hi Janet,You brought up a significant question, but it is one that can be readily answered.  And I’m not answering from a partisan point of view, but rather from a factual one.I apologize for dealing with a religious topic, but I plead that I might be able to avert more queries and debate on the topic, and we can just move on.   I want to point out that I am deliberately avoiding precise quotes of Biblical Chapter and Verse.  This would sound a bit too much like preaching, and I just want to explain these things in general.  What has nudity got to do with Christianity or Jesus?    Well, personally, I’m not aligned with those on the Church side, but I can give some guidelines to clarify the matter, from a traditional and Biblical point of view.  And these will be pretty well applicable to all people ‘of the Book’, Judaism, Christianity and Islam. For a start, the story of Adam and Eve indicates that our ‘first parents’ were embarrassed and ashamed when they realized their nude condition.  They promptly clothed themselves in Fig leaves, we are told.  Then on being expelled from the garden, were clothed by God in ‘animal skins’.  Since the Garden story of the Fall is and has to be the very foundation of Christian doctrine about man, therefore it can be stated that humanity is ‘meant’ to be clothed in everyday life.  The story expresses the idea that until a total regeneration of the race through Salvation occurs, mankind may not attempt to imitate the innocent state of A and E.  It is generally suggested in tradition and illustrated in many Art works that at the Last Judgement, mankind will again be in the naked state as they face their Maker.  Then there is the demand or expectation that the Christian will not act, eat, dress or whatever in any way that might cause his brother or sister to ‘stumble’. Nudity removes some of the barriers and tendencies to temptation, and will, it would be argued, make it easier to sin.    In the Jewish Bible, it is frequently indicated that it is a heinous sin to ‘uncover the nakedness’ of people.   This represents a pretty general rule on the matter; although some scholars would suggest that ‘uncovering one’s nakedness’ is essentially a euphemism for sexual activity.   The surrounding Pagan peoples around the Jews and then the Christians, frequently displayed a most libertarian approach to nudity (leading presumably to improper actions), and especially within their religious context.  Naturally these examples just appalled the faithful, and inevitably brought about more and more rules to control sexual behaviour and proper dressing back at home. There may well be other concepts or ideas, but the final set of guidelines and expectations would concern the principle of faithfulness to one’s wife or husband, who alone may be permitted all physical intimacies including contact and viewing in the undressed condition; as well as the obvious principles of intimate caring for one’s children.  And it must be said that from both the earliest traditions of Catholicism, in the writings of Augustine, Jerome and loads of others, through to the Puritan views of Calvinism etc, the heaviest sanctions were enjoined on immodesty in one’s dress.   Friend Jerome was literally obsessed with decency in women’s dress and wrote about it almost with a relish.    Many Biblical passages in Old and New do make direct rules about appropriate dress and modesty.  But few of us today would be too worried about women wearing trousers or other male dress; or for that matter be concerned with the objections about hair-styles jewelry and the covering of one’s hair in public. These are all vital principles of Religion, and especially within traditional Christianity.   So right or wrong, our religions would all take an official stand on the matter of nudity, and the Christian Churches of our Tradition would certainly for the most part, agree on it.    So when it comes to persons with the Aspergers Syndrome, it can be said that if they adhere rigidly to any of the Christian Churches, it is most likely that they would stick closely in their classic Aspie fashion, to their rules and sanctions, taking them in the most literal form.   Obviously individuals in every age turn up who either question the traditions and rules, and may take on for themselves the job of protesting, or of just practicing such things as nudity in private or with persons of their own conviction. Ron.    Subject: Re: Aspergers and Naturism/NudismI am jumping in here... perhaps inappropriately and my cat is tryin gto lay on my ha =nds, so hang in there while I boot her away! I don't see what nudity has to do withChrisitianity or Jesus. Religious beliefs, yes. but they are not one and the same. I think that this is where the argumentative tone about religion (Or whatever you want to call it) always comes up on this site... people propose that their 'flavor' of Christianity is the only one and that is what is offensive, not the actual exchange of ideas about the subject. So it is forbidden. To bad I say.

[Guest guest]

The concept of religion, to me, seems too much man-made or woman-made.

>

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi Janet,

> >

> > You brought up a significant question, but it is one that can be

> > readily answered. And I'm not answering from a partisan point

of

> > view, but rather from a factual one.

> >

> > I apologize for dealing with a religious topic, but I plead that

I

> > might be able to avert more queries and debate on the topic, and

we

> > can just move on. I want to point out that I am deliberately

> > avoiding precise quotes of Biblical Chapter and Verse. This

would

> > sound a bit too much like preaching, and I just want to explain

> > these things in general.

> >

> >

> >

> > What has nudity got to do with Christianity or Jesus? Well,

> > personally, I'm not aligned with those on the Church side, but I

> > can give some guidelines to clarify the matter, from a

traditional

> > and Biblical point of view. And these will be pretty well

> > applicable to all people `of the Book', Judaism, Christianity

and

> > Islam.

> >

> >

> >

> > For a start, the story of Adam and Eve indicates that our `first

> > parents' were embarrassed and ashamed when they realized their

nude

> > condition. They promptly clothed themselves in Fig leaves, we

are

> > told. Then on being expelled from the garden, were clothed by

God

> > in `animal skins'. Since the Garden story of the Fall is and

has

> > to be the very foundation of Christian doctrine about man,

> > therefore it can be stated that humanity is `meant' to be

clothed

> > in everyday life. The story expresses the idea that until a

total

> > regeneration of the race through Salvation occurs, mankind may

not

> > attempt to imitate the innocent state of A and E. It is

generally

> > suggested in tradition and illustrated in many Art works that at

> > the Last Judgement, mankind will again be in the naked state as

> > they face their Maker.

> >

> >

> >

> > Then there is the demand or expectation that the Christian will

not

> > act, eat, dress or whatever in any way that might cause his

brother

> > or sister to `stumble'. Nudity removes some of the barriers and

> > tendencies to temptation, and will, it would be argued, make it

> > easier to sin. In the Jewish Bible, it is frequently

indicated

> > that it is a heinous sin to `uncover the nakedness' of people.

> > This represents a pretty general rule on the matter; although

some

> > scholars would suggest that `uncovering one's nakedness' is

> > essentially a euphemism for sexual activity. The surrounding

> > Pagan peoples around the Jews and then the Christians,

frequently

> > displayed a most libertarian approach to nudity (leading

presumably

> > to improper actions), and especially within their religious

> > context. Naturally these examples just appalled the faithful,

and

> > inevitably brought about more and more rules to control sexual

> > behaviour and proper dressing back at home.

> >

> >

> >

> > There may well be other concepts or ideas, but the final set of

> > guidelines and expectations would concern the principle of

> > faithfulness to one's wife or husband, who alone may be

permitted

> > all physical intimacies including contact and viewing in the

> > undressed condition; as well as the obvious principles of

intimate

> > caring for one's children. And it must be said that from both

the

> > earliest traditions of Catholicism, in the writings of

Augustine,

> > Jerome and loads of others, through to the Puritan views of

> > Calvinism etc, the heaviest sanctions were enjoined on immodesty

in

> > one's dress. Friend Jerome was literally obsessed with decency

in

> > women's dress and wrote about it almost with a relish. Many

> > Biblical passages in Old and New do make direct rules about

> > appropriate dress and modesty. But few of us today would be too

> > worried about women wearing trousers or other male dress; or for

> > that matter be concerned with the objections about hair-styles

> > jewelry and the covering of one's hair in public.

> >

> >

> >

> > These are all vital principles of Religion, and especially

within

> > traditional Christianity. So right or wrong, our religions

would

> > all take an official stand on the matter of nudity, and the

> > Christian Churches of our Tradition would certainly for the most

> > part, agree on it. So when it comes to persons with the

> > Aspergers Syndrome, it can be said that if they adhere rigidly

to

> > any of the Christian Churches, it is most likely that they would

> > stick closely in their classic Aspie fashion, to their rules and

> > sanctions, taking them in the most literal form. Obviously

> > individuals in every age turn up who either question the

traditions

> > and rules, and may take on for themselves the job of protesting,

or

> > of just practicing such things as nudity in private or with

persons

> > of their own conviction.

> >

> >

> >

> > Ron.

> >

> >

> >

> > Subject: Re: Aspergers and Naturism/Nudism

> >

> > I am jumping in here... perhaps inappropriately and my cat is

tryin

> > gto lay on my ha =nds, so hang in there while I boot her away! I

> > don't see what nudity has to do with

> >

> > Chrisitianity or Jesus. Religious beliefs, yes. but they are not

> > one and the same. I think that this is where the argumentative

tone

> > about religion (Or whatever you want to call it) always comes up

on

> > this site... people propose that their 'flavor' of Christianity

is

> > the only one and that is what is offensive, not the actual

exchange

> > of ideas about the subject. So it is forbidden. To bad I say.

> >

> >

> >

>