Re: Re: Rat studies - Germ warfare

[Guest guest]

WHY is it that veterinary (animal) doctors know much more about fungal illness

than human docs? I for one think that's horrible & ridiculous, but as one

physician and I were having a discussion lately, we said " We can't blame docs

for not knowing what they weren't taught. " As far as I know, " normal " family

practitioners & other docs are only taught about fungal ringworm, jock itch, &

toenail fungus in med school. They can't know it, if it was never addressed, or

even discussed.

Awhile back, I saw my neurologist, & showed him an article about how when

rabbits ingest moldy feed, they become lame, paralyzed, & develop rectal

prolapse. His response? But WE aren't rabbits. But get this: after my

inhalation of toxigenic fungi (in my former workplace), I also became " lame,

paralyzed, & developed rectal prolapse. " I've had 3 surgeries in recent years,

due to what my former " employer " did to me.

Criminal? I think so.....what about you? They have admitted NO

wrongdoing....although I was far from the only one, suddenly unable to walk!!

What a nightmare.

V.

[] Re: Rat studies - Germ warfare

KC, I read something awhile back that basically said the same thing.

just the other day I came across a article where they use dogs and

raise special breeds for testing because they more closely match

humans systems. didn't post it for obvious reasons,but in the name of

science and to help people it may be what needs to be done. still

bothered me though.

>

> The other night on PBS was a story of the beginning of germ

warfare.

> One statement really made me sit up and take notice as it still

> applies to the " studies " done today.

>

> At Ft.Detrick in 1945 they were doing testing on mice, monkeys and

> rats to see which one was closest to humans as far as reactivity.

The

> mice and monkeys had similiar reactions, now here is the statment

from

> one of the scientists, " no matter how much toxins we administered to

> those damn rats, nothing would kill them. They do not have the same

> makeup as humans as far as reactions. "

>

> Does this sound familiar to the " Rat " study that is still being

toted

> today concerning our particular situation???

>

> KC

>

[Guest guest]

KC,

That is good to know. But what is occurring with the deceit in medicine

over the mold issue does not even have to go into whether rats resemble humans,

how many mycotoxins can dance on the head of a pin, etc, to understand the

JUNK SCIENCE of the matter.

This is all the deeper one has to go to understand it is junk: They took

data from a single rodent study regarding mold. Wiz bam, they hypothesized

based on nothing scientific, the mycotoxins that one would be exposed to over a

period of time from this one mold. From that they concluded humans could

never experience symptoms indicative of toxicity from exposure within water

damaged buildings.

Besides the flaws in the calculations themselves, the entire premise used

does not support the conclusions made.

When attempting to understand whether symptoms indicative of toxicity occur

from exposure within water damaged buildings, to look at ONLY one toxin

produced by one mold. It is shear folly to conclude anything of relevance

regarding human illness based only on this myopic hypothesis. It does not

even

come close to simulating human exposure that occurs within WDB's. In WDB's,

people are exposed to multiple molds, mycotoxins, endotoxins, glucan toxins all

at the same time.

That's why the calculations and results concluded by ACOEM and Veritox have

never been duplicated. EVERYONE KNOWS IT " S JUNK. Everyone except the

physicians and the courts, that is. In my opinion, I think it is criminal that

ACOEM

would continue to feign innocence and promote this concept as science while

so many are unable to obtain viable medical treatment and while so many are

being allowed to become ill from the continued misinformation of the matter.

I find it to be intentional reckless endangerment on a massive scale.

Sharon K

In a message dated 5/27/2007 3:52:33 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,

jeaninem660@... writes:

> The other night on PBS was a story of the beginning of germ

warfare.

> One statement really made me sit up and take notice as it still

> applies to the " studies " done today.

>

> At Ft.Detrick in 1945 they were doing testing on mice, monkeys and

> rats to see which one was closest to humans as far as reactivity.

The

> mice and monkeys had similiar reactions, now here is the statment

from

> one of the scientists, " one of the scientists, " <WBR>no matter how mu

> those damn rats, nothing would kill them. They do not have the same

> makeup as humans as far as reactions. "

>

> Does this sound familiar to the " Rat " study that is still being

toted

> today concerning our particular situation???

>

> KC

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

[Guest guest]

There are so many holes in their logic that it would be laughable if they

weren't actually promoting it seriously.

What they are doing is picking the desired outcome, which is zero liability

for their benefactors in industry and then citing lies and half truths that

support their goal, and leaving everything

They really deserve to be addressed one by one but some of the big ones are

Their CONSISTANT avoidance of mentioning that many (all that I've seen)

mycotoxins are at least 5-10 times MORE powerful inhaled than ingested. They

ALWAYS avoid mentioning this.

They also avoid mentioning the lipopolycaccharide (LPS) /endotoxin STRONG

potentiation of mycotoxins liks trichothecenes. Damp buildings often have

massive bacterial contaminations as well as mold.

Also many mycotoxins can absorb through the skin.

Also people respire a huge amount of air each and every day and that air

goes through moist

caverns in the lungs with many turns that can and do intercept particles,

especially the smallest ones.

So called mold testing that is based on air pumps that pull just twenty or

thirty liters of air through a filter with large holes in it and then having

that filter analyzed for spores only with a microscope only will not only

miss a large amount of what is in the air, including the smaller asp/pen

species that just sail through, they will also not be able to distinguish

what species it is of that they DO catch and they will not be able to detect

mycotoxins because they don't sample enough and they also don't catch the

small particles OR properly analyze them. (they would need an impingement

sampler like SpinCon and buffered solution and then ELISA testing or some

other ultrasensitive testing method like thin film chromatography.)

It goes on and on...

The stachbotrys mycotoxins in particular destroy the lungs natural

surfactecant which protects them. It is not just spores which carry

mycotoxins, tiny particles much smaller than spores actually carry more

toxin, go through much filtration, and they can last for years. Certain

situations, such as putting shampoo with sodium laurel sulfate on the skin,

can increase the penetration of trichothecene toxins into the bloodstream.

(and hair attracts mold just like carpet it has been shown because of the

ionic charges of particles in the air make particles in the air stick to

points of other dissimilarly charged - i.e. grounded, objects)

stuff like that...

On 5/28/07, snk1955@... <snk1955@...> wrote:

>

>

> KC,

>

> That is good to know. But what is occurring with the deceit in medicine

> over the mold issue does not even have to go into whether rats resemble

> humans,

> how many mycotoxins can dance on the head of a pin, etc, to understand the

>

> JUNK SCIENCE of the matter.

>

>

> This is all the deeper one has to go to understand it is junk: They took

> data from a single rodent study regarding mold. Wiz bam, they hypothesized

>

> based on nothing scientific, the mycotoxins that one would be exposed to

> over a

> period of time from this one mold. From that they concluded humans could

> never experience symptoms indicative of toxicity from exposure within

> water

> damaged buildings.

>

> Besides the flaws in the calculations themselves, the entire premise used

> does not support the conclusions made.

>

> When attempting to understand whether symptoms indicative of toxicity

> occur

> from exposure within water damaged buildings, to look at ONLY one toxin

> produced by one mold. It is shear folly to conclude anything of relevance

> regarding human illness based only on this myopic hypothesis. It does not

> even

> come close to simulating human exposure that occurs within WDB's. In

> WDB's,

> people are exposed to multiple molds, mycotoxins, endotoxins, glucan

> toxins all

> at the same time.

>

> That's why the calculations and results concluded by ACOEM and Veritox

> have

> never been duplicated. EVERYONE KNOWS IT " S JUNK. Everyone except the

> physicians and the courts, that is. In my opinion, I think it is criminal

> that ACOEM

> would continue to feign innocence and promote this concept as science

> while

> so many are unable to obtain viable medical treatment and while so many

> are

> being allowed to become ill from the continued misinformation of the

> matter.

> I find it to be intentional reckless endangerment on a massive scale.

>

> Sharon K

>

>

>

>

>

> In a message dated 5/27/2007 3:52:33 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,

> jeaninem660@... <jeaninem660%40sbcglobal.net> writes:

>

> > The other night on PBS was a story of the beginning of germ

> warfare.

> > One statement really made me sit up and take notice as it still

> > applies to the " studies " done today.

> >

> > At Ft.Detrick in 1945 they were doing testing on mice, monkeys and

> > rats to see which one was closest to humans as far as reactivity.

> The

> > mice and monkeys had similiar reactions, now here is the statment

> from

> > one of the scientists, " one of the scientists, " <WBR>no matter how mu

> > those damn rats, nothing would kill them. They do not have the same

> > makeup as humans as far as reactions. "

> >

> > Does this sound familiar to the " Rat " study that is still being

> toted

> > today concerning our particular situation???

> >

> > KC

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sharon,

I'm no expert either but it sounds criminal to me. Thanks to all who help

us understand the whole picture, one piece at a time. Special thanks to KC and

Sharon for all they do.

In a message dated 5/28/2007 11:27:00 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

snk1955@... writes:

KC,

That is good to know. But what is occurring with the deceit in medicine

over the mold issue does not even have to go into whether rats resemble

humans,

how many mycotoxins can dance on the head of a pin, etc, to understand the

JUNK SCIENCE of the matter.