Re: Re:Scientific paper about cross-contamination?

[Guest guest]

Laurie,

Sorry to hear the bad news. Where do you live? I have not heard of that product.

I use a product called MDF-500.

http://www.deconsolutions.com/pdf_Files/MDF-500%20Information%20Brochure.pdf

[] Re:Scientific paper about cross-contamination?

-My fiance and I just recentely moved and have cross contaminated

our new condo. Our recovery company says the will you and anti

fungal product called line one. have you heard of this and if it is

effective? Our cars have been contaminated also. thanks-- In

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

oneSearch: Finally, mobile search

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[Guest guest]

Many of those " Biocides " out there are in and of themselves toxic. So watch

out!

Branislav, if you do a Google search for " mold contaminated home contents "

you should find Dr. Straus's papers on decontaminatio strategies. There are

also a lot of papers out there on UV detection of aflatoxins that might be

useful.. (although they are written with food in mind, the same methods

should work elsewhere if the mold is visible)

Other that that, the detection side is a new science, but there are a lot of

people working on it. As we all know, however, the anecdotal experiences of

many of us is that contents of a mold contaminated dwelling taken elsewhere

often carry the ability to aggravate illness of people who come into contact

with them.

Cleaning them is very difficult, but not impossible.

[Guest guest]

Does anyone know of a company on the west coast who does this type of clean-up?

[Guest guest]

Branislav,

Maybe we can get one of the real experts to put in an appearance here

and explain it..

A lot comes to mind. Increasingly, the science is out there to back up

the anecdotal experiences.

Also, keep in mind that when you say 'cross contamination' its simply

a matter of dilution.

Some bulk samples of toxic mold are very toxic indeed.. live or work

around them a few hours, or god forbid, most of the day, even if you

make every possible effort to get fresh air, is going to effect you

physically. Its pretty clear that MANY of the assumptions made by the

ACOEM, AAAAI and lawyers are flawed on a numer of levels.. also.

There are also endotoxins and VOCS and synergistic effects of multiple

toxins in the same environment. There are inhalational as well as

dermal routes of ingress.. there are flawed assumptions about the

toxin load in particles in the air, as well as exterpolations derived

from LD50 type data that don't take into the account chronic exposure

and the nonlinear effect of toxins on things like protein synthesis..

and the incredible inflammatory casade of even tiny amounts of some

mycotoxins.. the load on the body of continually having to marshall

immune system reactions like alevolar macrophages (is that the right

spelling) and tumor necrosis factor a.. bla bla bla..

You know, I read last year that some aspergillus molds, when they grow

on latex paint, produce a chemical that is a lot like LSD, in fairly

high amounts, too..

Many, many of those myco-chemicals are so bioactive that they are very

difficult to test for unless you know specifically what you want to be

testing for.. which in a typical damp building scenario which probably

has literally millions of distinct different mold colonies with many

many thousands, perhaps also even millions of strains of those molds..

many producing different profiles of chemicals..

You know how for a long time some (lawyers?) have classed strains of

stachybotrys for example, as toxic and nontoxic? Well, the more I read

about stachy, the more I realize that the strains that produce

atarones and simple trichothecenes (the 'nontoxic' as some would say,

strains) instead of the macrocyclic trichothecenes (which are more

cytotoxic) are far more INFLAMMATORY and so they produce more

permanent lung damage.

I haven't spoken to Dr. Straus many times but the first time I did he

told me that we would be very mistaken to ever underestimate the

toxicity of molds because scientists are discovering new mycochemicals

- toxins - often - and new ways those toxins effect other living

things all the time and they have barely scratched the surface of what

is there to learn.

Id also say that its quite probable that often we overlook some effect

of a toxin for a very long time..

We need to trust and listen to the alarms raised by the many people

who have been made sick by them and work our society's response around

that reality rather than the other way around.

The more we know, the more you realize you don't know. And the

indications are that its serious danger.. Going back to the Bible.

On 8/8/07, Branislav <arealis@...> wrote:

> > Branislav, if you do a Google search for " mold contaminated

> > home contents " you should find Dr. Straus's papers on decontaminatio

> > strategies.

>

> Yes, I know about that paper. I think I even posted it in the files

> section here a while ago. It examines three methods for

> decontamination of clothes, paper and wood.

>

> But this is not exactly what I am looking for. I need a scientific

> study that clearly shows how mycotoxins can spread to clean buildings

> from contaminated buildings just by cross-contamination.

>

> We know it happens and is one of the biggest problems. However, we

> need the scientific proof to convince the unbelievers.

>

> > Cleaning them is very difficult, but not impossible.

>

> It depends on the type of contaminated material, the cleaning method

> you're using and on the type of the mycotoxin. I found that some

> objects are practically impossible to decontaminate (certain types of

> laminate plastic, for example)

>