Re: Good photos of mold cleanup techniques..

January 24, 2008

N95 and n100 don't stop aiborne particles under 5 microns. I wore a N95 to the

Dr's office. He said quit wasting your money.

LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

Readers Digest has some good photos in this article

http://www.rd.com/17827/article.html

that show some good nuts and bolts mold cleanup techniques.

The mask one of the people in one of the photos is wearing is the

extremely cheap kind that are totally inadequate, but the rest look

like N-95 ones with the perch valve, which is commonly used - although

I think N-100 is what someone would want to be using if they were

sensitive - AND the fan in window, vacumn with hose going outside,

etc.

The shop vac with HEPA filter AND vacumn exhaust hose going outside of

window seems like a real winner..

We should all save that photo to show people as a reference as to how

to vacumn if even dust makes you sick..

Check out the above article and scroll down to the bottom..

---------------------------------

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

January 24, 2008

Some of the pictures are good, except.........We can clearly see the Bleach they

are using.........Darlene

LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

Readers Digest has some good photos in this article

http://www.rd.com/17827/article.html

that show some good nuts and bolts mold cleanup techniques.

The mask one of the people in one of the photos is wearing is the

extremely cheap kind that are totally inadequate, but the rest look

like N-95 ones with the perch valve, which is commonly used - although

I think N-100 is what someone would want to be using if they were

sensitive - AND the fan in window, vacumn with hose going outside,

etc.

The shop vac with HEPA filter AND vacumn exhaust hose going outside of

window seems like a real winner..

We should all save that photo to show people as a reference as to how

to vacumn if even dust makes you sick..

Check out the above article and scroll down to the bottom..

---------------------------------

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.

January 24, 2008

a,

Technically you are wrong, but speaking from a practical point of

view you are very likely correct. N95 is a NIOSH rating meaning it

stops 95% of particles 0.3 microns and larger. It is even more

effective for the larger 5 micron paricles. N100 is actually a HEPA

rated device meaning 99.97% at 0.3 microns. Professionally,

these require a medical exam prior to the workers using them,

plus a fit test to validate no leakage around the edges.

See http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/topics/respirators/disp_part/

HOWEVER, nothing is absolute. Two reasons, at least:

1. The APF (assigned protection factor) for N95 is far

100%. For a half-face it is only about 10, meaning it

reduces the particles to 1/10 of what is outside the mask.

A full-face is 50 meaning it reduces to 1/50. If there are 1

million spores outside the mask, which is very likely

during remediation or other disturbance, the spores inside

the mask will be about 100,000 and 20,000 respectively.

Even a full-face powered filter unit with an APF of 1000

would still present an exposure inside the mask near

1000!

2. How the respirator fits your face is critical. ANY gaps

from face movement, hair, eyeglasses etc will reduce the

effectiveness because the spores and particles take the

path of least resistance around the edges instead of

through the filter itself.

What has to be realized is the rating applies only to the filter

media under ideal conditons, not the whole device in actual use.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

> N95 and n100 don't stop aiborne particles under 5 microns. I wore a N95 to

the Dr's office. He said quit wasting your money.

>

> LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

Readers Digest has some good photos in this article

>

> http://www.rd.com/17827/article.html

>

> that show some good nuts and bolts mold cleanup techniques.

>

> The mask one of the people in one of the photos is wearing is the

> extremely cheap kind that are totally inadequate, but the rest look

> like N-95 ones with the perch valve, which is commonly used - although

> I think N-100 is what someone would want to be using if they were

> sensitive - AND the fan in window, vacumn with hose going outside,

> etc.

>

> The shop vac with HEPA filter AND vacumn exhaust hose going outside of

> window seems like a real winner..

>

> We should all save that photo to show people as a reference as to how

> to vacumn if even dust makes you sick..

>

> Check out the above article and scroll down to the bottom..

>

> ---------------------------------

> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

>

January 24, 2008

Thank you ,

I just didn't want people to have a false sence of security.

a

" Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...> wrote:

a,

Technically you are wrong, but speaking from a practical point of

view you are very likely correct. N95 is a NIOSH rating meaning it

stops 95% of particles 0.3 microns and larger. It is even more

effective for the larger 5 micron paricles. N100 is actually a HEPA

rated device meaning 99.97% at 0.3 microns. Professionally,

these require a medical exam prior to the workers using them,

plus a fit test to validate no leakage around the edges.

See http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/topics/respirators/disp_part/

HOWEVER, nothing is absolute. Two reasons, at least:

1. The APF (assigned protection factor) for N95 is far

100%. For a half-face it is only about 10, meaning it

reduces the particles to 1/10 of what is outside the mask.

A full-face is 50 meaning it reduces to 1/50. If there are 1

million spores outside the mask, which is very likely

during remediation or other disturbance, the spores inside

the mask will be about 100,000 and 20,000 respectively.

Even a full-face powered filter unit with an APF of 1000

would still present an exposure inside the mask near

1000!

2. How the respirator fits your face is critical. ANY gaps

from face movement, hair, eyeglasses etc will reduce the

effectiveness because the spores and particles take the

path of least resistance around the edges instead of

through the filter itself.

What has to be realized is the rating applies only to the filter

media under ideal conditons, not the whole device in actual use.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

> N95 and n100 don't stop aiborne particles under 5 microns. I wore a N95 to

the Dr's office. He said quit wasting your money.

>

> LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

Readers Digest has some good photos in this article

>

> http://www.rd.com/17827/article.html

>

> that show some good nuts and bolts mold cleanup techniques.

>

> The mask one of the people in one of the photos is wearing is the

> extremely cheap kind that are totally inadequate, but the rest look

> like N-95 ones with the perch valve, which is commonly used - although

> I think N-100 is what someone would want to be using if they were

> sensitive - AND the fan in window, vacumn with hose going outside,

> etc.

>

> The shop vac with HEPA filter AND vacumn exhaust hose going outside of

> window seems like a real winner..

>

> We should all save that photo to show people as a reference as to how

> to vacumn if even dust makes you sick..

>

> Check out the above article and scroll down to the bottom..

>

> ---------------------------------

> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

>

January 25, 2008

You are correct again, a.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

> Thank you ,

> I just didn't want people to have a false sence of security.

> a

>

> " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...> wrote:

a,

>

> Technically you are wrong, but speaking from a practical point of

> view you are very likely correct. N95 is a NIOSH rating meaning it

> stops 95% of particles 0.3 microns and larger. It is even more

> effective for the larger 5 micron paricles. N100 is actually a HEPA

> rated device meaning 99.97% at 0.3 microns. Professionally,

> these require a medical exam prior to the workers using them,

> plus a fit test to validate no leakage around the edges.

>

> See http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/npptl/topics/respirators/disp_part/

>

> HOWEVER, nothing is absolute. Two reasons, at least:

>

> 1. The APF (assigned protection factor) for N95 is far

> 100%. For a half-face it is only about 10, meaning it

> reduces the particles to 1/10 of what is outside the mask.

> A full-face is 50 meaning it reduces to 1/50. If there are 1

> million spores outside the mask, which is very likely

> during remediation or other disturbance, the spores inside

> the mask will be about 100,000 and 20,000 respectively.

> Even a full-face powered filter unit with an APF of 1000

> would still present an exposure inside the mask near

> 1000!

>

> 2. How the respirator fits your face is critical. ANY gaps

> from face movement, hair, eyeglasses etc will reduce the

> effectiveness because the spores and particles take the

> path of least resistance around the edges instead of

> through the filter itself.

>

> What has to be realized is the rating applies only to the filter

> media under ideal conditons, not the whole device in actual use.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

>

> -----

> > N95 and n100 don't stop aiborne particles under 5 microns. I wore a N95 to

the Dr's office. He said quit wasting your money.

> >

> > LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

Readers Digest has some good photos in this article

> >

> > http://www.rd.com/17827/article.html

> >

> > that show some good nuts and bolts mold cleanup techniques.

> >

> > The mask one of the people in one of the photos is wearing is the

> > extremely cheap kind that are totally inadequate, but the rest look

> > like N-95 ones with the perch valve, which is commonly used - although

> > I think N-100 is what someone would want to be using if they were

> > sensitive - AND the fan in window, vacumn with hose going outside,

> > etc.

> >

> > The shop vac with HEPA filter AND vacumn exhaust hose going outside of

> > window seems like a real winner..

> >

> > We should all save that photo to show people as a reference as to how

> > to vacumn if even dust makes you sick..

> >

> > Check out the above article and scroll down to the bottom..

> >

> > ---------------------------------

> > Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

> >

January 25, 2008

The bleach is a concern because people think bleach will solve or

kill the problem of mold; people like my mother who see articles like

this use bleach; but the pictures are very good... I'm going to

forward this to my mother so she can better understand the big job of

cleaning up my moldy apartment that she would love to rent out to

someone else but I won't let her until she fixes the mold

infestations and replaces the pipes that have caused all the water

damage and flooding... sorry, I'm rambling but my kitchen flooded

again, two weeks ago, so I'm back to square one trying to dry out the

floors, cabinets, etc. and get rid of the smell, again! And with all

the rain out here my living room wall is leaking, again, not to

mention the window seals in my daughter's room.... arrrrrgh!

And on top of all this my grandmother passed away of lung cancer a

week ago but the irony is she never smoked and was not around second

hand smoke but she knew she had cancer but the doctors did not

discover it until one week before she passed away even though she was

tested for everything under the sun but she hadn't had a chest x-ray

in two years. I'm only mentioning all this because this points to the

fact that I believe my grandmother actually died from toxic mold

exposure that got into her lungs and caused the cancer from living at

my mother's house breathing the air over there. But of course no one

would listen to me when she was still alive. It's just so frustrating

that there are still many people who are blinded or shielded from the

truth!

Dana

Readers Digest has some good photos in this article

>

> http://www.rd.com/17827/article.html

>

> that show some good nuts and bolts mold cleanup techniques.

>

> The mask one of the people in one of the photos is wearing is the

> extremely cheap kind that are totally inadequate, but the rest look

> like N-95 ones with the perch valve, which is commonly used -

although

> I think N-100 is what someone would want to be using if they were

> sensitive - AND the fan in window, vacumn with hose going outside,

> etc.

>

> The shop vac with HEPA filter AND vacumn exhaust hose going

outside of

> window seems like a real winner..

>

> We should all save that photo to show people as a reference as to

how

> to vacumn if even dust makes you sick..

>

> Check out the above article and scroll down to the bottom..

>

> ---------------------------------

> Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.

>

January 25, 2008

We need to gather all of the primary sources together and make it clear

where the info came from in each case.

Often its not as clear as people would like.. For example, here is one

primary source. How do people interpret what this one says?

Not " what do you think should be done "

How do you interpret what THEY are saying here?

I'm curious what people here think of the below, especiually what the

starred sentence means in the context that its in..

And also HOW DO YOU THINK THIS COULD EASILY END UP BEING MISUNDERSTOOD...

(thats what everyone is mad about!)

How could that misunderstanding hurt people? My personal opinion? I think

common sense when you see " soap and water " means soap and water AND SERIOUS

SCRUBBING AND REMOVAL OF WASTE WATER AND RINSING..

(It is also in a different, the CBW - context.. this is not instructions on

how to remediate stachybootrys - ts instruction on how to decontaminate

casuaties of trichothecene poisoning in WARFARE - )

This is from

USAMRIID'S Medical Management of Biological Casualties Handbook

Fifth Edition

August 2004

U.S. Army Medical Research Institute Of Infectious Diseases

Fort Detrick

Frederick, land

TOXIN CHARACTERISTICS

The trichothecene mycotoxins are low-molecular-mass (250-500 daltons)

nonvolatile compounds produced by filamentous fungi (molds) of the genera

Fusarium, Myrotecium, Trichoderma, Stachybotrys and others. The structures

of approximately 150 trichothecene derivatives have been described in the

literature. These substances are relatively insoluble in water but are

highly soluble in ethanol, methanol and propylene glycol. The trichothecenes

are extremely stable to heat

and ultraviolet light inactivation. They retain their bioactivity even when

autoclaved; heating to 1500o F for 30 minutes is required for inactivation.

Here is the part that I am talking about that can easily be misinterpreted:

****Hypochlorite solution alone does not effectively inactivate the toxins.

Rather, adding 0.1M NAOH to a 1% hypochlorite solution, with 1 hour contact

time is required. Soap and water effectively remove this oily toxin from

exposed skin or other surfaces.***

*

MECHANISM OF TOXICITY

The mycotoxins appear to have multiple mechanisms of action, many of which

are poorly understood. Their most notable effect stems from their ability to

rapidly inhibit protein and nucleic acid synthesis. Thus, they are markedly

cytotoxic to rapidly dividing cells such as in the bone marrow, GI tract

(mucosal epithelium), skin, and germ cells. Because this cytotoxic effect

imitates the hematopoietic and lymphoid effects of radiation sickness, the

mycotoxins are referred to as " radiomimetic agents. " The mycotoxins also

alter cell membrane structure and function, inhibit mitochondrial

respiration, and inactivate certain enzymes.

CLINICAL FEATURES

In a BW attack with trichothecenes, the toxin(s) can adhere to and penetrate

the skin, be inhaled, or be ingested. In the alleged yellow rain incidents,

symptoms of exposure from all three routes coexisted. Contaminated clothing

may serve as a reservoir for further toxin exposure. Early symptoms

beginning within minutes of exposure include burning skin pain, redness,

tenderness, blistering, and progression to skin necrosis with leathery

blackening and sloughing of large areas of skin. Upper respiratory exposure

may result in nasal itching, pain, sneezing, epistaxis, and rhinorrhea.

Pulmonary and tracheobronchial toxicity produces dyspnea, wheezing, and

cough. Mouth and throat exposure causes pain and blood-tinged saliva and

sputum. Anorexia, nausea, vomiting, and watery or bloody diarrhea with

crampy abdominal pain occur with gastrointestinal toxicity. Eye pain,

tearing, redness, foreign body sensation, and blurred vision may follow

ocular exposure. Skin symptoms occur in minutes to hours and eye symptoms in

minutes. Systemic toxicity can occur via any route of exposure, and results

in weakness, prostration, dizziness, ataxia, and loss of coordination.

Tachycardia, hypothermia, and hypotension follow in fatal cases. Death may

occur in minutes, hours, or days. The most common symptoms are vomiting,

diarrhea, skin involvement with burning pain, redness and pruritis, rash or

blisters, bleeding, and dyspnea. A late effect of systemic absorption is

pancytopenia, predisposing to bleeding and sepsis.

January 25, 2008

Dana, I'm sorry to hear that you are going through another cleanup. And, I'm

sorry about your grandmother. It's ridiculous that the insurance companies and

their experts are allowed to keep lying about the dangers of toxic mold----while

so many people are sick and dying!!

[] Re: Good photos of mold cleanup techniques..