Re: New Student Seminar class for someone on AS

[Guest guest]

Great post, . You raise some very good points.

I hesitate to say more about this particular situation, as the details

were not included in the original post.

Best,

~CJ

rogernmeyer@... wrote:

>

>

> Sandy,

>

> It " may not be your place " to intervene on behalf of a student at a

> community college. Unless he's still in a public school transition

> program but enrolled in the community college, he's expected, as a

> student who has attained the legal age of 18, to carry his own issues

> with the students with disabilities office. In view of what you've

> said, I certainly hope that he's already started to establish his

> status as a disabled student. Doing so will assist him with

> accommodations to make it through regular coursework as well as

> preparatory coursework. Community colleges have become increasingly

> more familiar with autism in their students, but it's important not to

> assume that they're that well-informed so as to make his job, in

> requesting course substitution, easier. Every student encounters

> different challenge, but the one thing he'll learn right away is that

> if a course is required -- even if it's an orientation course such as

> the one you describe -- there should be an equivalent that

> accomplishes the same purpose. If there isn't, " creating " a new course

> just for him is very likely to be considered an undue burden on the

> college, and hence an accommodation requested that will not be

> accomplishable by the community college under current understandings

> of how the Americans with Disabilities Act works.

>

> I hate to say this so it doesn't appear crass or insensitive, but

> there may be a chance he isn't ready for community college, and the

> one tip-off to that is that what you may be requesting surpasses the

> level of individual attention or customization possible for a

> community college to offer. If managing his time, completing his

> assignments, familiarizing himself with services supportive of special

> needs students, or any of the other routine introductory material

> found in such an orientation " class " is something he can't benefit

> from, then there is a very good chance he will encounter frustration

> and difficulty from the word " go " in his attendance at community

> college. A community college will not " do " these things for its

> students on their own. Every student's needs are different, and with

> such orientation courses, they've probably done the best they can,

> short of asking the student to be accompanied by an " interpreter " for

> each of these functions they've already identified as contributing to

> the success of a matriculating student.

>

> Community colleges have served as substitutes for much more expensive

> advanced education in many instances, but please note that the

> community college's administration decisions about the difficulty of

> coursework, the number of classes in given subject matter a student

> must master, and the size and complexity of those courses may not suit

> this particular student's needs or differential stages of

> intellectual, emotional, or social development.

>

> There are an increasing number of community colleges known to be AS

> friendly. This may not be one of them. Also, it's up to the student to

> disclose and to work out arrangements that would be helpful, and this

> is one area of decision-making community college administrators expect

> the student to make, not others to make.

>

> That's the difference between adult education and K-12 special

> education, and if this student's transition plan in K-12 didn't

> prepare him for the realities of what he may have chosen as " the next

> step, " it may take the family's private resources to get him ready for

> the degree of independence expected of all adult students in community

> college. If you look at the workshops and course offerings of

> organizations such as the Asperger Association of New England, you'll

> see that such offerings are provided privately, and not at public

> expense. Also, they are group offerings, not opportunities for

> individual, one-on-one coaching or counseling, which might be

> necessary in this student's case. Again, such coaching or mentoring

> might be available at the community college, but I sincerely doubt

> that persons who do such work and are paid for their work would have

> either the sensitivity or special training required to work with him,

> even if they're on the community college's payroll -- which many such

> private mentors and tutors are not.

>

> Most community and four year colleges that offer such seminars

> deliberately hold the size of such classes down, but even those size

> restrictions have suffered as more and more students attend community

> colleges rather than more expensive " away " colleges. It is very likely

> that a disabled student counselor might be able to work with the

> student on a one-to-one basis, but that counselor ordinarily has many

> students to work with, and can only schedule so much individual time

> to work with any given student one-on-one. Again, expecting the

> college to do more may be considered an " undue burden " and not

> supportable as a request for reasonable accommodation given the

> mission of the community college and its financial needs and staff

> complement.

>

> If class size is an impediment to the student's learning, it may well

> be that more expensive, private, smaller colleges may be able to

> provide a smaller class experience. This is not likely to happen in

> publicly supported community and four year colleges.

>

> I do hope this student has a " plan B " for what might be a turn-down of

> your request. Having the capacity to make up back up plans and being

> able to resolve challenges when faced with disappointment from a

> " first shot out of the box " is an essential component of what a

> community college adult student is expected to have. I hope this

> student is up to these expectations.

>

> It may well be that he isn't ready. It might be better to consider

> lengthening the period of transition and preparation for community

> college rather than having him fail to accomplish even the

> " preliminary easing of the course way " that such orientation seminars

> are designed for.

>

> If his expectations are unreal, it also might be good for him to fail

> on his own, rather than have someone else to hold accountable for his

> lack of preparation or relative lack of maturity. In other words, I'm

> advising that among the first things one learns to " let go " " for an

> independence-seeking adult are things that could throttle that young

> adult's capacity to learn from his mistakes.

>

> N. Meyer

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sandy,

It "may not be your place" to intervene on behalf of a student at a community college. Unless he's still in a public school transition program but enrolled in the community college, he's expected, as a student who has attained the legal age of 18, to carry his own issues with the students with disabilities office. In view of what you've said, I certainly hope that he's already started to establish his status as a disabled student. Doing so will assist him with accommodations to make it through regular coursework as well as preparatory coursework. Community colleges have become increasingly more familiar with autism in their students, but it's important not to assume that they're that well-informed so as to make his job, in requesting course substitution, easier. Every student encounters different challenge, but the one thing he'll learn right away is that if a course is required -- even if it's an orientation course such as the one you describe -- there should be an equivalent that accomplishes the same purpose. If there isn't, "creating" a new course just for him is very likely to be considered an undue burden on the college, and hence an accommodation requested that will not be accomplishable by the community college under current understandings of how the Americans with Disabilities Act works.

I hate to say this so it doesn't appear crass or insensitive, but there may be a chance he isn't ready for community college, and the one tip-off to that is that what you may be requesting surpasses the level of individual attention or customization possible for a community college to offer. If managing his time, completing his assignments, familiarizing himself with services supportive of special needs students, or any of the other routine introductory material found in such an orientation "class" is something he can't benefit from, then there is a very good chance he will encounter frustration and difficulty from the word "go" in his attendance at community college. A community college will not "do" these things for its students on their own. Every student's needs are different, and with such orientation courses, they've probably done the best they can, short of asking the student to be accompanied by an "interpreter" for each of these functions they've already identified as contributing to the success of a matriculating student.

Community colleges have served as substitutes for much more expensive advanced education in many instances, but please note that the community college's administration decisions about the difficulty of coursework, the number of classes in given subject matter a student must master, and the size and complexity of those courses may not suit this particular student's needs or differential stages of intellectual, emotional, or social development.

There are an increasing number of community colleges known to be AS friendly. This may not be one of them. Also, it's up to the student to disclose and to work out arrangements that would be helpful, and this is one area of decision-making community college administrators expect the student to make, not others to make.

That's the difference between adult education and K-12 special education, and if this student's transition plan in K-12 didn't prepare him for the realities of what he may have chosen as "the next step," it may take the family's private resources to get him ready for the degree of independence expected of all adult students in community college. If you look at the workshops and course offerings of organizations such as the Asperger Association of New England, you'll see that such offerings are provided privately, and not at public expense. Also, they are group offerings, not opportunities for individual, one-on-one coaching or counseling, which might be necessary in this student's case. Again, such coaching or mentoring might be available at the community college, but I sincerely doubt that persons who do such work and are paid for their work would have either the sensitivity or special training required to work with him, even if they're on the community college's payroll -- which many such private mentors and tutors are not.

Most community and four year colleges that offer such seminars deliberately hold the size of such classes down, but even those size restrictions have suffered as more and more students attend community colleges rather than more expensive "away" colleges. It is very likely that a disabled student counselor might be able to work with the student on a one-to-one basis, but that counselor ordinarily has many students to work with, and can only schedule so much individual time to work with any given student one-on-one. Again, expecting the college to do more may be considered an "undue burden" and not supportable as a request for reasonable accommodation given the mission of the community college and its financial needs and staff complement.

If class size is an impediment to the student's learning, it may well be that more expensive, private, smaller colleges may be able to provide a smaller class experience. This is not likely to happen in publicly supported community and four year colleges.

I do hope this student has a "plan B" for what might be a turn-down of your request. Having the capacity to make up back up plans and being able to resolve challenges when faced with disappointment from a "first shot out of the box" is an essential component of what a community college adult student is expected to have. I hope this student is up to these expectations.

It may well be that he isn't ready. It might be better to consider lengthening the period of transition and preparation for community college rather than having him fail to accomplish even the "preliminary easing of the course way" that such orientation seminars are designed for.

If his expectations are unreal, it also might be good for him to fail on his own, rather than have someone else to hold accountable for his lack of preparation or relative lack of maturity. In other words, I'm advising that among the first things one learns to "let go"" for an independence-seeking adult are things that could throttle that young adult's capacity to learn from his mistakes.

N. Meyer

New Student Seminar class for someone on AS

Hi Everyone: I have to write a letter to a community college requesting a course substitution for a young man on the Autism Spectrum. He cannot relate to their required New Student Seminar in which students must do many assignments to learn how to study and write for college, explore a career, etc. The person to whom I must write may or may not be familiar with autism. I am trying to write a letter that does not give a wrong impression of this man's abilities but conveys his inability to relate to such assignments. Any suggestions? Thanks!

[Guest guest]

,

I'm fully aware of the generational change in status of adult children, transition issues, and the devastation families have experienced during financial hard times that has partially led to greater amounts of time spent on "the home ground" by young adults. That being said, however, this very unanticipated status of adult children doesn't exuse parents or the remaining parent from coming up with a developmentally appropriate scheme to plan for the adult child's eventual independence. In fact, parents are now more open than ever to making realistic plans rather than holding on to pie-in-the-sky dreams about their adult children's success. Over the past three years, I've developed a specialty in working with parents of young adults now at home or whose life away from the family nest is heavily feathered by manna not from heaven but from home. While that degree of physical separation offers the parents some modicum of privacy and the opportunity to get on with their lives together as a couple, the strength of the economic ties to a dependent adult child nevertheless acts as a brake to full exploration of opportunities for the young adult to explore life and the real world "out there" on his or her own. That's even harder to do without having "pushy parents" involved in the constant nudge of a home-bound young adult to make it, at least, to the edge of the nest and "observe" the world in which they'll eventually take flight. The fact remain that fledglings do, in fact, leave the nest. If they don't, then you have the outline for a very dysfunctional at home situation that goes far and beyond ordinary "partnership recovery issues following the successful launching of a young adult."

This is a particularly difficult condition to deal with, both on an individual consulting level, and also in avoiding coming up with resolutions that work in the abstract but fall flat in the reality of a particular adult child, and a particular set of parents, a single parent, or an extended family. And I say this with all due respect to the degree of care and concern shown by siblings and second and third removed relatives in extended families concerned about a relative on the spectrum. I've dealt with distant relatives who appear to be taking an interest in a mature or late-diagnosed adult not even indirectly under their charge because of an unusual degree of compassion, or concern not only for the adult on the spectrum, but the others affected by the "stay at home adult."

We all know the aging process doesn't stop, nor does it wait for the current economic and job-factor clouds to clear. We get older every day, and we change every day, whether we want to or not. At one point it was fashionable to flash the fact that our children outlast us for an additional 35 years. While the number of years may have become somewhat smaller (present demographic studies and projections suggest that we've begun to die earlier, not later, in this country), the fact remains that our children generally outlast us. Furthermore, with fewer resources and less actual room to maneuver and come up with alternatives due to our own limited assets and likely failing health -- even if both factors are "in the future--it still behooves us to set an example we hope our children can follow. Not doing so, or "faking it day by day" isn't an option, mainly because time doesn't hold still, even if we really believe we can fly in a perpetual holding pattern.

Parents don't stop worrying about their children just because their children reach a certain age, but they also shouldn't lose sight of their responsibilities to themselves and their partners and to others who may figure in their declining years. That's the only point I'm confronted with time after time as maturing parents approach me for some advice about how to plan for their dependent adult children. I'm not into pat answers. I try to listen to and explore as many facets about where the partnership relationship "is" at the same time I'm listening for verbal or behavioral signals that the parent(s) have begun to tote up the calculus of what it takes to just stay even, let alone avoid sinking. That's a hard, difficult process, and far be it from me to come up with solutions. At most, I refer the parents out for their own reality checks with truly disinterested professionals who have specialized in issues faced by families affected by disability. While it's difficult to completely detach concern for one's adult child(ren), it's still necessary in order to come up with one's own plans, priorities, and boundaries. Hence I generally recommend parent consultation with professionals who aren't "treating" their adult child at the same time, or referrals to professionals who don't have a history with the family. This assures at least some kind of a fresh look, and a distinterested one as well.

Yup. I often come across as self-satisfied and a bit smug. I don't mean to, but sometimes getting right down to the make-or-break issues clearly then provides problem-solvers a clearer view of not only the choices they may need to make, but also the order and priority they assign to such choices. I don't do that weighing. They do. It isn't up to me, and I don't have a dog in whatever fight is currently going on at the moment, It's just enough to acknowledge that standing by isn't an option, because "just waiting" isn't a choice without consequences.

N. Meyer

New Student Seminar class for someone on AS

:

The best and brightest among us collaborate and use others to bounce ideas off of and gain new perspectives and direction. Folks with AS are no different. We all need help or assurance we are on the right path or guidance on where the resources are to make the choice on what path to take in life.

I have always been at odds with the “sink or swim†method often touted for folks with autism when they become of legal age. I see the merits and logic, but if it is a parent’s job to prepare their children for adulthood and some with autism are developmentally delayed, it just seems that some parents need to extend or modify the boundaries. We do this for kids without autism. Social norms have shifted. When you and I were growing up they pushed us out of the nest at 18. Not true anymore as that age has been extended out. Not legally, but more and more kids are staying at home longer or forced back into the nest due to economics or other factors.

Just me.

Let's put a slightly different twist on this discussion.

Yes, I emphasized the personal responsibility and legal separations involved when adults act as their own advocates rather than having others chase after them (and perhaps even coddle). But wait...there's more. <g> ….