Re: Boy am I glad I found this group

February 22, 2008

I think your own body should be the test. Just make sure that you can move,

that you are not locked in to a situation that you can't fix. That " they "

WON'T fix.

Try to pick basically dry buildings, that is buildings that are not in

natural flood areas, along rivers or in gullies. Look at the building

closely to see that it has been well maintained. Look in every part of the

building, especially basements and attics. Ask neighbors, does this landlord

fix things when they are notified by them. Are the units market rate? In

general, landlords tend to fix units they are getting market rate for, but

when the units are significantly below market rate, then they sometimes

ignore repairs in the hope that the tenants will leave.

If there is any way you can, avoid those buildings. Many cities now have web

sites where you can check out buildings complaint history. Even though these

websites often dont provide most of the most important information, use

them. Sometimes you can get a shred of information about a buildings' past

that you can flesh out into something important, like flooding. If a

building has ever been flooded for any length of time, even years earlier, I

would say that your chances are much worse because thats a situation that

demands aggressive cleanup. Its not impossible, but it takes a landlord who

cares enough to hire specialized contractors they don't hire often. The

worst landlords are in court all the time. If they evict a lot of people,

that indicates that at least some of those people are possibly witholding

rent for a good reason.

Either that, or the building is a slum and many of the tenants are very poor

and transient. In my experience I have only had one landlord like that and

she was a piece of work. The building turned out to be condemmed,

and she was not allowed to collect or even ask for rent by law. But the

tenants didn't know, tried to withold rent, and she also sued them anyway.

(Their lawyers would have had to bring this tidbit up in court to have it

recognized)

February 22, 2008

-If the apartment is bad enough the county will condemn the place but I

would have a place ready to go to. That is how it is in my state.

Good luck and welcome to the group. -- In

, " Deb " <pookiebear_44144@...> wrote:

>

> Hello, newbie here and boy am I glad I found this group. I moved into

> an apartment in Sept. of 07 and have been ill ever since. Each month

> I got progressively sicker. Yet if I left the building even in the

> worse symptomatic stages of my illness, I could breath 100% better

> and felt much better. Here is my story:

February 22, 2008

Fat chance you'll get a public agency to condemn anything... you'd have to do

the testing, it would be expensive - too long a road. The city or county or

whatever is getting taxes from the property so they have a vested interest in

the building remaining standing. Fruitless avenue unless you have really,

really deep pockets.

I'm not saying don't attempt to have it documented, but don't expect for a

moment that will accomplish anything toward your immediate needs.

I'm no lawyer, but have had a bit of my own experience with this stuff, enough

to know that public agencies 1) don't have an ability to test for what's unsafe

about mold/mycotoxins, 2) they truly don't care - seriously, you'd need to have

a gaggle of infants die to get a public agency's attention. If you have lots of

visible mold, the best you could hope for would be to get them to document that

- don't hold your breath for anything else - you'd probably have to provide the

photographs for the file/report. Save your strength for doing what you have to

do to get out of there. If you do go to the trouble to work with them, you'll

need to follow up and make sure the person who did the inspection actually filed

his or her report. (We learned that the hard way.)

Here's what I'd try in your circumstances: If you have a doctor document that

your asthma is exacerbated by the conditions in your living situation that

should be enough to start with. I'd see if you can get any advice from Legal

Aid and then go to small claims court and file a claim to get your deposit and

the rent you have spent there returned because they are not upholding their end

of providing a safe place for you to live. You'll need to look up the public

laws that say they have that responsibility.

That's the best way I can imagine you could get leverage to get out. I'm

guessing they'll settle for letting you out of your contract at that point. You

won't be getting money out of this is my prediction, but it's possible you could

get them to stop going after you for any.

Getting a story in the local paper about what's happening to you is another

way to get leverage.

If you can't get leverage QUICKLY, do whatever you have to to out! It's not

worth what this can do to your health. If you've been hospitalized several

times, you are pretty darn reactive to whatever you are living with, and the

cummulative damage may take awhile to undo. GET OUT!

Honestly? My neighbor (36) died of his exposure to mycotoxins over a couple

years from a sewer pipe leak under the building I lived in a few years ago. I

could write all day about how many different ways public agencies have let his

mother down in her quest to have this situation brought to light. His decline

started with asthma attacks and seizures. His allergist told him it was because

of the damp building... when he got out, his asthma improved. Then he died

suddenly. Took us a long, long time to figure out what happened and to find a

way to document it.

The science on this stuff isn't yet definitive, but if you pick up a copy of

Mold Warriors (moldwarriors.com) you'll see the theory that some of us are

genetically pre-dispositioned to get sick from mold (because we lack certain

antibodies to remove biotoxins) while others in the same environment can be

unaffected, at least for much longer exposure periods... that it is only some of

us who get really, really sick has made it extremely difficult for those of us

who are more sensitive to get taken seriously. (Actually, enough mycotoxins

will make ANYONE sick - Google 'chapter 34 mycotoxins' and you can read about

how they are used for bioweapons production- but they aren't always present in

mold situations and it's extremely difficult and expensive to test for them.)

Mold Warriors also talks about a protocol for getting biotoxins out of the

body. Many of the members of this list swear by it.

First priortity? GET OUT of that place - it's making you sick. Take THAT

very, very seriously.

~Haley

February 22, 2008

Hi Sweety,

Glad that your looking for a new place to live. First i want to say go to

biotoxin.info where you can read up on the latest treatment for those who have

been exposed to toxic mold. Your body can not naturally fight against this mold

and can not naturally remove it from the body. The man who is behind the website

is considered to be the foremost expert in this new field of medicine. When i

considered traveling from california to maryland(his office is located) i heard

" im off to see the wizard " form wizard of oz in my head. Sorry had to point that

out.

And that part about you looking for a duplex bottom half doesnt mean you will be

safe on the bottom, that is where i got sick. My upstairs neighbor had a leaking

faucet and it just so happen to be right above my freakin bed. almost 4 years

later i still cringe about that.

As far as your 3 month lease buy out option; If you can see mold growing in your

home you can have it tested easily by swab samples sent into a lab for

identification. If it comes out to be toxic mold im sure your apartment owner

will be more apt to cover is a$$ and let you out of it. Im assuming you can see

mold. If not just another option for you.

Yeah i have panic attacks and anxiety as well. After i was exposed to toxic mold

wow!! So much more the intensity of the PA and anxiety.

As far as finding a safe (non toxic) home in the future its possible.

Hard.....yes. When i go into a new building I always check for any old water

leaks inbetween walls or dark spaces like basements and attics. If i see any

evidence of this i run like the wind!!!! Its like the cartoons where you can see

my silloiett on the wall after i crash through it running like a mad man with a

trail of smoke behind me. Water leaks are the obvious. But ofcourse this is just

the obvious opinion on finding a new home without toxic mold. Im sure you will

get some great advices from this group. Welcome!!!!!!!! Luv ya!!

God Bless

Elias

Deb <pookiebear_44144@...> wrote: Hello,

newbie here and boy am I glad I found this group. I moved into

an apartment in Sept. of 07 and have been ill ever since. Each month

I got progressively sicker. Yet if I left the building even in the

worse symptomatic stages of my illness, I could breath 100% better

and felt much better. Here is my story:

February 22, 2008

hi Deb-

my landlord tried to more or less do the same thing. and all

likelihood, your landlord's " bluffing " you. my landlord wanted the

remaining months' rent, AND went as far as saying that i should

contact a lawyer. phooey on her!

here's what i suggest:

1) take photos of any visible mold from the leaks

2) type up a chronology of events in bullet form (start with your

move-in date, then add all your hospitalization dates, dates you went

to doctor & diagnosis, date you found out about the past

flooding--don't mention the neighbor's names, etc etc). in the last

paragraph, state that you are more or less correlating your

illness(es) with the conditions of your apartment and that you are

requesting to be let out of your lease without any penalties of doing

so. also put on there that you would like to hear back within 5

business days (specify date) in writing. make sure both you & your

husband sign & date at bottom.

3) give a copy of the above " chronology of events " to your landlord...

if your landlord is on the premises, hand-deliver it and make note of

who you handed it to...or if landlord is elsewhere, send certified

mail with return receipt.

if that doesn't work, go to Plan B, which could entail going to the

media. i'm guessing it won't go that far. :-)

>

> How do you find a safe home to live in? In reading your entries, I

> have noted that there are tests to perform, questions to ask, and

> obviously many of you have been there, done that, so I am asking for

> as much help as I can get on this. I am in the process of looking to

> move out soon as I can locate another place to live.

February 22, 2008

The county was ready to condemn one of the places I was living in. The

landlord was forced to get roofer, etc. but we were getting ready to

move anyway and I didn't want to be there during any roofing work. But

they were going to condemn the place if the landlord didn't get the

work done.

Also an entire apartment complex was condemned several years ago. -

-- In , Haley <myhaze@...> wrote:

>

> Fat chance you'll get a public agency to condemn anything... you'd

have to do the testing, it would be expensive - too long a road. The

city or county or whatever is getting taxes from the property so they

have a vested interest in the building remaining standing. Fruitless

avenue unless you have really, really deep pockets.

>

February 23, 2008

>

> Hello, newbie here and boy am I glad I found this group. I moved into

> an apartment in Sept. of 07 and have been ill ever since. Each month

> I got progressively sicker. Yet if I left the building even in the

> worse symptomatic stages of my illness, I could breath 100% better

> and felt much better. Here is my story:

>

> I left a home of 30 years that had some dampness in the basement but

> never gave it much thought that it could be harmful. Yes, naive I

> was, but I am being honest and I was young at the time we bought the

> house. Fast forward to 18 months ago when my hubby and I thought

> about downsizing and moving out of house and into a apartment. First

> place was not damp, did not have a odor or seem like any thing was

> wrong. The unit where the furnace was located and hot water tank

> seemed dusty but it seemed dry.

> I did not suffer too much in this building thank GOD. The next

> apartment we moved into (due to job we had to relocate)there was an

> obvious flood problem that we were not told about until almost 3

> months into the movein. We were told by neighbors that the unit was

> flooded out and that the clean up efforts were done very hasty and

> very cheaply. We decided that we should move again. 3 times in one

> year was hard on my poor hubby and I and we felt we moved into a

> sound building with our apartment remodeled and overhauled with new

> walls, carpeting etc. Later we found out why. (Note: this is where

> you should ask questions to the leasing people, why was it remodeled?

> Wish I had asked before moving in)

> Apparently this building had a huge roof leak and our apartment, the

> one below ours and the one next door to ours got hit bad. The

> landlord refused to break our lease. In the meantime, I have been

> hospitalized 3 times this month alone for asthma attacks, panic

> attacks and anxiety attacks, bronchitis and a lung infection. I have

> never had any of these before and each doctor tells me it is being

> caused by some irritant in my environment.

>

> I know in my heart that the ventilation system must have mold spores

> in it. I know too that it does not properly circulate the air, as

> another issue I have is a sensitivity to second hand smoke. Combine

> the two and I am one sick lady here about to go crazy literally, if I

> do not find another place to live.

>

> How do you find a safe home to live in? In reading your entries, I

> have noted that there are tests to perform, questions to ask, and

> obviously many of you have been there, done that, so I am asking for

> as much help as I can get on this. I am in the process of looking to

> move out soon as I can locate another place to live. I am through

> with apartment living and am in search of either a duplex, bottom

> half of a double or a single family home. What should I be looking

> for in my search? I know I am naive in all of this, but I am

> teachable and I am desperate. Landlord is getting P.O'd that I

> brought up the subject of mold and smoke issues and told me that I

> could break lease if I choose to pay a 3 month buyout. His building

> is causing me my health, causing me to about to loose my job due to

> all the time off in hospital, medical bills out the wazoo and I still

> have to come up with 3 times my rent to get out. Is there any way I

> can get out of lease with medical conditions resulting from all of

> this illness due to mold and poor ventilation?

>

> Ok, enough said, I will wait for all of your professional and not so

> professional advice and opinions. Thanks for listening and thanks for

> having this group. Deperate in Ohio.

>

I can't help with the legal stuff but I can suggest some things for

finding an better place. Depending on how sick you are, if you are

like me then you start to react to bad stuff almost immediately. Get

in touch with that-I've learned to get out of bad places in under a

minute because I feel my body start reacting. This should help you

when you check out basements etc.

It is possible to find a safe house-I have a friend who did-it took

them a while but they knew beforehand what they needed. In other words

they asked about recent construction, materials used, etc. But my

friend told me that they went mostly by their noses. If the house felt

safe after an hour of looking maybe it was. They found a lovely old

house with NO new construction and a completely dry basement.

I'm glad you mentioned panic attacks because i started having them too

and they continued for months till we got rid of the mold. I would cry

for hours and I couldn't understand what was happening to me. Luckily

I was able to speak to others who confirmed that it was the mold.

Good Luck-Surella

February 23, 2008

Elias,

Thank you for the warm greeting and the information. The more I am reading

about all of this, the more I am convinced my health issues are stemming from

some kind of exposure. The apartment I am living in currently also has had

damage to it from a flood. Leak in the roof I was told. The apartment before

that one was the one I mentioned in my first letter. To sum it up if your all

confused.... I lived in a house for 30 years with some evidence of mold in the

basement. Though minor and we cleaned it well, or so we thought, I did have

symptoms develop as did my husband, but we chalked it up to many other things

than mold. Interesting though I was diagnoised with Fibro and arthritis and a

host of other things that perhaps were being caused from this " mold " that I did

not pay to much attention too.

After moving from our house, we moved to our 1st apartment. It was dusty, but

dry and as far as I could tell mold free. I actually did not have any complaints

living there other than a horriable man for a boss. We were rental agents that

got the apt with our jobs. We lucked out with this apartment but it did not last

too long. We had to accept another job and another move 12 months later and in

this new apartment we found out not from the leasing agent or our bosses, but

from the neighbors in the building what a horrendous leak that happened and the

shotty way they " cleaned " it up. Though we stayed there a mere 4 months, I was

feeling poorly as was my hubby most of the whole time there.

We just wanted out so we moved a third time into the apartment we currently

reside in. In this apartment we were told by a leasing agent who is no longer

employed with the company, that there was water damage and they " remodeled "

however, we were never told to the extent how much was replaced, or remodeled

about it.

I have been really really ill since we moved in here. Now with Winter here and

everything closed up, it is hard to breath in here, when the heat which is steam

heat is on, all bets are off. I panic, I pace, I am nervous. I get very antsy. I

itch, I get nervous. I too get rashes I can not heal. I have been in the

hospital 3 times with respitiory issues that doctors tell me are caused by

irritants. One doctor asked me if I smoked. When I told him no, he seemed

puzzled. I even have a heart doctor that wrote to our building manager insisting

I have a residence where no smoke is involved.

The current landlord is the one insisting we have this buyout. He " might "

consider a 2 month because I am showing them evidence that I was hospitalised

because of smoke. When I mentioned that other issues like possible mold were or

may be involved he got pissy with me.

What kind of testing do I need to do to prove my case to this landlord? Are

the tests expensive? Where do I go to locate agencies or people to do this

testing? Do I call the local health dept?

Your help is appreciated as is the advice. Thanks!

Debbie

E E <photoguys2003@...> wrote: