Re: Intro and remediation question

[Guest guest]

Judith,

Firstly can you get someone else to get into the fan and wipe off the

blades/motor? A few times I had found that mold spores stuck to the

blades which caused my breathing problem. Have them use a washcloth

with sprayed on clorox and rinse; repeat.

Also, sometimes mold spores will get in the corners of cabinets or get

onto pipes which will cause decay. Maybe you can get someone

else to wipe out every nook and cranny of that kitchen cabinet with a

mild clorox spray. If there is mold, you're likely to see some black

stuff on the washcloth or even spores.

HI will cover it IF you can prove it was caused by a leak in the house.

llaci

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Judith, As mold remediators, we have discovered that one of the worst things

people can do with treating a mold problem, is to use bleach, chlorox, etc...

This article is posted on our website. BLEACH MYTH EXPOSED! WHY IT DOESN'T

WORK!Mold's hyphae (root structures) actually grow into wood and drywall like

roots. The hyphae are not killed by bleach because bleach's ion structure

prevents chlorine from penetrating into porous materials such as dry wall and

wood. It stays on the outside surface, whereas mold has protected enzyme roots

growing inside the porous construction materials. When you spray porous surface

molds with bleach, the water part of the solution soaks into the wood while the

bleach chemical sits atop the surface, gasses off, and thus only partially kills

the surface layer of mold while the water penetration of the building materials

fosters further mold growth. Chlorine bleach (sodium hypochlorite) causes

long term breakdown of wood products like

studs, sheathing plywood, OSB, and other building materials over time. Fungus

and mold through time developes a resistance to chlorine bleach.

Sincerely,Chrissy MannFrom: llaci2003 [mailto: jjaksic@...]To:

@...: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 18:13:00 -0000Subject:

[] Re: Intro and remediation question

Judith,Firstly can you get someone else to get into the fan and wipe off

theblades/motor? A few times I had found that mold spores stuck to theblades

which caused my breathing problem. Have them use a washclothwith sprayed on

clorox and rinse; repeat. Also, sometimes mold spores will get in the corners of

cabinets or getonto pipes which will cause decay. Maybe you can get someoneelse

to wipe out every nook and cranny of that kitchen cabinet with amild clorox

spray. If there is mold, you're likely to see some blackstuff on the washcloth

or even spores.HI will cover it IF you can prove it was caused by a leak in the

house.llaci & gt;

_______________________________________________

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Make My Way your home on the Web - http://www.myway.com

[Guest guest]

Chrissy,

There are many incorrect statements in this post and as a chemist, I

would like to respond.

Hyphae do not grow into drywall gypsum, only into the paper, which

contains about 1% starch, a far more readily digested nutrient than

the cellulose in paper. Hyphae grow where there are nutrients, and

there are none in the gypsum. Molds are microfungi and therefore only

grow on the surfaces of materials, unlike macrofungi that decay wood

and send hyphae through the wood structure.

There is nothing about the ion structure (hypochlorite) that prevents

bleach from soaking into gypsum, wood, or paper. Bleach penetrates

porous materials as readily as does water.

There is no such thing as a " protected enzyme root. " Hyphae are killed

by bleach.

Under typical conditions of spraying, it is impossible for the water

part of the solution to separate from the bleach part (except by

evaporation).

Bleach is very effective at killing microbes, but given their vast

numbers, a few microbes will survive, thus leading to the

misconception that bleach is not effective.

Fungi do not develop a resistance to bleach.

The only partially correct statement in the post is that bleach

(because it is alkaline) can weaken the stucture of wood. But since

most spraying only affects a superficial amount of wood, any weakening

is irrelevant.

Bleach may not be " green, " but as long as the smell isn't a problem

for you, and you take proper precautions during use, diluted it works

great on solid (non-porous) surfaces.

C. May

Author, " The Mold Survival Guide "

May Indoor Air Investigations LLC

www.mayindoorair.com

________________________________________________________________________

> 11a. Re: Intro and remediation question

> Posted by: " chrissy " microbes4u@... moldremedy

> Date: Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:56 pm ((PDT))

>

> Hi Judith, As mold remediators, we have discovered that one of the

> worst things people can do with treating a mold problem, is to use

> bleach, chlorox, etc... This article is posted on our website.

> BLEACH MYTH EXPOSED! WHY IT DOESN'T WORK!Mold's hyphae (root

> structures) actually grow into wood and drywall like roots. The

> hyphae are not killed by bleach because bleach's ion structure

> prevents chlorine from penetrating into porous materials such as dry

> wall and wood. It stays on the outside surface, whereas mold has

> protected enzyme roots growing inside the porous construction

> materials. When you spray porous surface molds with bleach, the

> water part of the solution soaks into the wood while the bleach

> chemical sits atop the surface, gasses off, and thus only partially

> kills the surface layer of mold while the water penetration of the

> building materials fosters further mold growth. Chlorine bleach

> (sodium hypochlorite) causes long term breakdown of wood products

> like

> studs, sheathing plywood, OSB, and other building materials over

> time. Fungus and mold through time developes a resistance to

> chlorine bleach. Sincerely,Chrissy MannFrom: llaci2003 [mailto:

> jjaksic@...]@...: Wed, 30

> Apr 2008 18:13:00 -0000Subject: [] Re: Intro and

> remediation question

>

>

>

> Judith,Firstly can you get someone else to get into the fan and wipe

> off theblades/motor? A few times I had found that mold spores stuck

> to theblades which caused my breathing problem. Have them use a

> washclothwith sprayed on clorox and rinse; repeat. Also, sometimes

> mold spores will get in the corners of cabinets or getonto pipes

> which will cause decay. Maybe you can get someoneelse to wipe out

> every nook and cranny of that kitchen cabinet with amild clorox

> spray. If there is mold, you're likely to see some blackstuff on the

> washcloth or even spores.HI will cover it IF you can prove it was

> caused by a leak in the house.llaci & gt;

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Chrissy. After reading Mold Warriors and another mold book

by Dr. Schaller, I suspected that bleach would not be a good idea,

and you have explained why. My feeling was that killing the surface

part of mold would probably dislodge millions of spores and disperse

them into the air, which would just make me sicker and contaminate

the house more.

How can I find a good local remediator? Where are you located?

What does everyone think of Concrobium? Is there anything a

homeowner can use to clean up and kill mold safely? I suspect that

an entire kitchen cabinet may be contaminated here. The cabinets are

old, so it would not be terrible to have them replaced.

Judith

From: llaci2003 [mailto: jjaksic@...]To:

@...: Wed, 30 Apr 2008 18:13:00 -0000Subject:

[] Re: Intro and remediation question

>

>

[Guest guest]

, thanks for clarifying this issue. Still, what can a

homeowner do when cleaning up a small amount of mold, to prevent

sending spores all over the house? Or should I find a remediator?

And if so, is there an organization website where I can find a good

one in NC?

Judith

[Guest guest]

Jeff is indeed the proffesional and I believe his comments but I do wonder why I

tried to save a letterman multitool by soaking it in a glass bowl of pure bleach

and mold continued to grow on them. I still have the sample sealed in a glass

jar but I dont know how to compute his information with what I saw. The house I

lived in was treated with a bleach and a chemical sold at home depot called

Jomax (I think) mixture and only made the situation worse. I would think there

would be some other recomendations other that bleach but I wont go there. I

don't have the knowledge to dispute anything our proffesinals on the board do

and would niot want to anyway. Good luck Judith

Judith <howdeeeyall@...> wrote: , thanks for clarifying this

issue. Still, what can a

homeowner do when cleaning up a small amount of mold, to prevent

sending spores all over the house? Or should I find a remediator?

And if so, is there an organization website where I can find a good

one in NC?

Judith

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[Guest guest]

Chrissy,

What is the recommended methods of removing mold in lew of bleach. We've been

worried about this ourselves as the remediators we've dealt with so far think

bleach is the best remedy.Also, could you please send me the link to the

article? Many thanks, Sam

chrissy <microbes4u@...> wrote:

This article is posted on our website. BLEACH MYTH EXPOSED! WHY IT DOESN'T

WORK!

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

Judith,

You need not worry about cleaning up a small amount of mold on a

non-porous surface. So long as no leaks are involved, mold spores are

primarily on the surface and generally can only be released when

disturbed and relatively dry, so wetting them first allows for easy

removal.

Since many spores are hydrophobic (they repel water), water alone is

not adequate to wet the spores, and droplets from a spray would simply

bead up like water on wax paper. You must use water with detergent,

which reduces the surface tension of the water and allows the water to

dampen all the spores.

Probably any laundry detergent you find acceptable, diluted in water,

and a spray bottle will do. Use the finest spray mist so that the

liquid stream does not dislodge spores before they get wet.

Once the mold layer is soaked, there is no longer any danger of spores

(or any other particulates) being released into the air, unless you go

crazy with wiping and aerosolize the liquid. The surfaces can be wiped

clean, rinsed and treated again if necessary. Throw out the sponge or

cloth. If there is discoloration, you can try a diluted bleach rinse.

I would consider surface mold on any intact painted surface as mold on

a non-porous surface, if the mold is only growing on the surface and

not through the material. For example, mold growing on the collected

dust on painted drywall or wood trim in a bathroom where the only

source of moisture is from the air, should be on the surface of the

paint and not growing on the paper or wood. On the other hand, mold

growing on drywall from a leak is another story, since both sides of

the material have been wet.

When cleaning mold, as a precaution, always cover or remove any nearby

fleecy- surfaced items and operate a window box fan on exhaust nearby,

to draw out any spores that may get aerosolized. Use personal

protection as well.

Being quite allergic to some molds, one of my big fears always was

that I would drop a petri dish full of mold in my lab. Of course, this

did happen once. I immediately shut the doors to the lab and grabbed a

face mask, but I was curious to know how bad the situation was, so I

took a spore-trap air sample. There were thousands of Penicillium

spores in the air sample. Since these are relatively small spores that

remain airborne for up to an hour, I put a box fan in the window on

exhaust for 15 minutes, then took another air sample. There were no

Penicillum spores left.

You may be able to get help finding a remediator on the IAQA web site:

www.iaqa.org

C. May

Author, " The Mold Survival Guide "

May Indoor Air Investigations LLC

________________________________________________________________________

> 5c. Re: Intro and remediation question

> Posted by: " Judith " howdeeeyall@... howdeeeyall

> Date: Thu May 1, 2008 11:41 am ((PDT))

>

> , thanks for clarifying this issue. Still, what can a

> homeowner do when cleaning up a small amount of mold, to prevent

> sending spores all over the house? Or should I find a remediator?

> And if so, is there an organization website where I can find a good

> one in NC?

>

> Judith

>

>

[Guest guest]

How can mold continue to grow on metal? You (me, layperson) would think that a

metal multi-tool would be the easiest thing to remediate; epsecially when you've

soaked it for a length of time in pure bleach? Are there any thoughts on that?

Thanks very much, Sam

United States Vet <unitedstatesvet@...> wrote: ...soaking it in a glass

bowl of pure bleach and mold continued to grow on them. I still have the sample

sealed in a glass jar

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