Re: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal to have any of these antibodies?

August 7, 2012

I, my husband, and my daughter-16 (diagnosed age 9) all have Hoshimoto's. I have a son who has been tested for TSH and antibodies three times in the last 7 years and his TPA is always 12 with a low normal TSH. I think the presence of a few antibodies does not make an active disease but should warrant monitoring every few years. (My daughter's two Endocrinologist, one a very close friend agree with this approach.) I have to overdramatize some symptoms like sleepiness for the Pediatrician to re-run everything, but I get my way. I like to bring up how they told me my daughter's thyroid was fine since she was so tall for her age and when tested her TSH was 32 and TPO, TPA antibodies maxed out the chart.How was your other daughter's test? My husband was having some gastric pain and went on a gluten free diet

and now when he has even a little gluten he has severe cramps and other things. The diet isn't really that bad at home, but is a pain when you go out. Hope this helps,MicheleSubject: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal to have any of these antibodies?To: Thyroiditis Date: Monday, August 6, 2012, 11:38 PM

Hi everyone,

Our 10-year old daughter is undergoing testing for Hashimoto's disease and gluten sensitivity so we had our 8-year old daughter tested as well.

Her thyroid peroxidase antibodies came back at 13.0 IU/mL and the doctor says that less than 20 is "normal". Although the doctor said that this is normal, I googled it and some sources say that a person should not have any antibodies against the thyroid and that any result other than zero is abnormal and should be rechecked.

Does anyone know if a level of 13 is normal?

Thanks,

August 7, 2012

Thanks. Our 10-year with Hashimoto's had a bunch of allergy tests yessterday.

Her blood tests showed a milk allergy while the skin tests were positive for

weeds, trees, dust, grass, and cats. Luckily we don't have cats but I have no

idea how we'll avoid the grass and trees.

>

> Subject: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal to have

any of these antibodies?

> To: Thyroiditis

> Date: Monday, August 6, 2012, 11:38 PM

>

> Â

>

> Hi everyone,

>

> Our 10-year old daughter is undergoing testing for Hashimoto's disease and

gluten sensitivity so we had our 8-year old daughter tested as well.

>

> Her thyroid peroxidase antibodies came back at 13.0 IU/mL and the doctor says

that less than 20 is " normal " . Although the doctor said that this is normal, I

googled it and some sources say that a person should not have any antibodies

against the thyroid and that any result other than zero is abnormal and should

be rechecked.

>

> Does anyone know if a level of 13 is normal?

>

> Thanks,

>

August 7, 2012

Hi Michele,

I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at friends

houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting Enzymes and I

buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other products available

at a local Health Food Store, however this one works best for me.

I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the chart.

I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount. As far as I

know there is no maxed-out chart.

Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or small

to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause TPOabs to

form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around 8,000 when he was

stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they went down to below

10.

It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily correlate

with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the " markers " of

inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.

Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost always

overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and symptoms are

important. There are a few studies that show patients with massive high TPOab

levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels caused much destruction. So

there is much more than TPOabs that must be considered.

The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical refined

world.

HTH,

~Bj

>

> Subject: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal to have

any of these antibodies?

> To: Thyroiditis

> Date: Monday, August 6, 2012, 11:38 PM

>

> Â

>

> Hi everyone,

>

> Our 10-year old daughter is undergoing testing for Hashimoto's disease and

gluten sensitivity so we had our 8-year old daughter tested as well.

>

> Her thyroid peroxidase antibodies came back at 13.0 IU/mL and the doctor says

that less than 20 is " normal " . Although the doctor said that this is normal, I

googled it and some sources say that a person should not have any antibodies

against the thyroid and that any result other than zero is abnormal and should

be rechecked.

>

> Does anyone know if a level of 13 is normal?

>

> Thanks,

>

August 7, 2012

Hi BJ,This is interesting - I've never heard it before now. What test shows how much damage is being done (if any) by the antibodies? It sounds like you're saying that the antibodies sometimes serve a positive role and can be helpful???

Hi Michele,

I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting Enzymes and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other products available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works best for me.

I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount. As far as I know there is no maxed-out chart.

Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause TPOabs to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around 8,000 when he was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they went down to below 10.

It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the " markers " of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.

Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and symptoms are important. There are a few studies that show patients with massive high TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels caused much destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be considered.

The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical refined world.

HTH,

~Bj

August 7, 2012

TPO antibody activity is not indicative of a "strong" immune system! It points to confused immune system cells (WBC's). These must be dealt with because if they are allowed to run high, you run a viable risk for the antibodies to attack other organs & tissues besides the thyroid gland, seething you up for secondary autoimmune disorders....because remember, TPO antibody activity is the result of an immune system gone haywire - not one that is "strong." I am a holistic nurse & I am aware of many issues that modern medicine overlooks but make no mistake....antibodies are only appropriate to see when when there is a true foreign substance (virus or bacteria) in the body. Recognizing "self" as something that is foreign & must be attacked is not a "strong" immune system.Sent from my iPad Garrett

Hi BJ,This is interesting - I've never heard it before now. What test shows how much damage is being done (if any) by the antibodies? It sounds like you're saying that the antibodies sometimes serve a positive role and can be helpful???

Hi Michele,

I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting Enzymes and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other products available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works best for me.

I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount. As far as I know there is no maxed-out chart.

Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause TPOabs to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around 8,000 when he was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they went down to below 10.

It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the "markers" of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.

Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and symptoms are important. There are a few studies that show patients with massive high TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels caused much destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be considered.

The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical refined world.

HTH,

~Bj

August 7, 2012

My understanding is that thyroid antibodies are never normal. However, lots of people have low levels of antibodies and do fine with no thyroid diseases. Others have low level antibodies for years and then thyroid inflammation kicks in later in life. Seems like antibody levels don't directly correlate with degree of damage but the higher the level the higher the chance for damage. Interested if others have a different understanding. Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone with SprintSpeedSender: Thyroiditis Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2012 07:00:19 +1000To: <Thyroiditis >ReplyTo: Thyroiditis Subject: Re: Re: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal tohave any of these antibodies? Hi BJ,This is interesting - I've never heard it before now. What test shows how much damage is being done (if any) by the antibodies? It sounds like you're saying that the antibodies sometimes serve a positive role and can be helpful??? Hi Michele,I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting Enzymes and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other products available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works best for me.I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount. As far as I know there is no maxed-out chart. Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause TPOabs to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around 8,000 when he was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they went down to below 10. It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the " markers " of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves. Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and symptoms are important. There are a few studies that show patients with massive high TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels caused much destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be considered.The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical refined world.HTH,~Bj

August 7, 2012

,

This is the story as I understand it - and I would be delighted to have any

inaccuracies corrected.

Hashimoto's is often defined as chronic lymphocytic thyroiditis. That is, a

disorder in which lymphocytes attack the thyroid tissue. A lymphocyte is a

specialised white blood cell.

The use of an antibody test to detect the results of this attack misleads untold

numbers of people into thinking that the antibodies do the attacking. They do

not. The only thing that any antibody could possibly do is stick to a thyroid

cell and identify it as a target for attack - but I know of NO evidence that

this occurs with TPO or TG antibodies. (Which is no proof of anything except

possibly my ignorance.)

Further, some tests have a lower cut-off below which they are simply unreliable.

E.g. an upper limit of 20 and a lower of 5. The 5 means that there were fewer

than 5 and they cannot confidently say there are none so it is likely to be

reported as < 5.

Rod

>

> Hi BJ,

>

> This is interesting - I've never heard it before now. What test shows how

> much damage is being done (if any) by the antibodies?

>

> It sounds like you're saying that the antibodies sometimes serve a

> positive role and can be helpful???

>

August 7, 2012

Hi ,

I think you may have misunderstood.

Some people think the TPO antibodies damage the thyroid, which is NOT so. What I

was trying to say is the TPO antibodies themselves do NOT cause any thyroid

destruction or damage, which, I guess could mean a positive or good thing

although I don't personally look at that way.

TPOabs are formed to clean up already damaged thyroid cells - after the cells

have already been injured or demised. (The TPOabs do NOT do this damage.) What

cause the damage are the Killer T cells, cytokines and macrophage (and even

sometimes eosinophils attack and damage the thyroid cells). The TPOabs are

formed to clean up the thyroid peroxidase after it has leaked out of the cell.

The level of TPOabs can be misleading in that a high count can mean little

damage and a lower amount may mean high destruction. The way to find this out is

by an ultra sound. An US will show the thyroid gland size. The blood tests for

TPOabs only show what amount of TPOab is in the blood. There could lots of

damaged cells in the gland that will never be picked-up on the lab test. So

falsely assumming a low count is good can backfire.

The tests to measure how the thyroid is functioning are the Free T3 and Free T4

tests. But in the early stages of bad symptoms the tests are usually not

all-telling - meaning symptoms and labs do NOT usually show the same thing

leaving patients ill.

Thyroid antibody tests are useful in the diagnosis of thyroid autoimmune

disorders and used to differentiate autoimmune thyroid disease from

non-autoimmune hypothyroidism or goiter; and can also be useful as a diagnostic

tool in deciding whether to treat a patient who has subclinical hypothyroidism.

**The magnitude of the antibody titer does NOT correlate with the clinical

activity of the disease. **

Although high anti-TPO titers are seen in over 98% of patients with chronic

Hashimoto's thyroiditis and over 80% of Graves' disease patients. Elevated

amounts of these antibodies are also present in other autoimmune disorders, too,

such as pernicious anemia, type I diabetes, rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, and

other diseases.

As a repeat, it is always best to go by symptoms and actual thyroid function not

the antibody count. Studies prove that thyroid meds, selinium, removing gluten

in the diet and healing the gut along with modulating the immune system do in

fact help lower these antibodies. My levels as of last year are at 87 down from

a whopping 20,893.

I hope this is helpul to you,

~Bj

>

> > **

> >

> > Hi Michele,

> >

> > I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at

> > friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting

> > Enzymes and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other

> > products available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works

> > best for me.

> >

> > I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the

> > chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount.

> > As far as I know there is no maxed-out chart.

> >

> > Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or

> > small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause

> > TPOabs to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around

> > 8,000 when he was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they

> > went down to below 10.

> >

> > It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily

> > correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the

> > " markers " of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.

> >

> > Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost

> > always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and

> > symptoms are important. There are a few studies that show patients with

> > massive high TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels

> > caused much destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be

> > considered.

> >

> > The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical

> > refined world.

> >

> > HTH,

> > ~Bj

> >

>

August 7, 2012

Hi ,

I think you may have misinterpreted as I was not referring to Hashi patients.

What I meant by a strong immune system is that having TPOabs in the high range

in a healthy person and without any thyroid destruction or other autoimmune

disease. I have seen this in studies with chocking victims; the antibodies

disappear or nearly disappears when the neck heals. And some people just have

these antibodies for unknown reasons and don't have Hashis.

Also it is interesting that many Graves' patients have high TPOabs levels but no

thyroid destruction.

I was afraid of getting another autoimmune disease with my mega high levels and

I was shocked to find that I still have about 70% of my gland left after all

this time - 12 years after Dx and 20 plus years of feeling hypO. So I personally

know that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily correlate with degree of

damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the " markers " of inflammation, but

do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.

Could you explain what antibodies you are talking about that attack other organs

& tissues besides the thyroid gland? And please tell us how do you deal with

the TPO antibodies in your practice? Thanks!

Best,

~Bj

> >

> > Hi Michele,

> >

> > I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at

friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting Enzymes

and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other products

available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works best for me.

> >

> > I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the

chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount. As

far as I know there is no maxed-out chart.

> >

> > Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or

small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause TPOabs

to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around 8,000 when he

was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they went down to below

10.

> >

> > It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily

correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the

" markers " of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.

> >

> > Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost

always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and symptoms

are important. There are a few studies that show patients with massive high

TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels caused much

destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be considered.

> >

> > The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical refined

world.

> >

> > HTH,

> > ~Bj

> >

>

August 7, 2012

Correction!!!

I should have wrote that many Graves' patients have high TPOabs levels but have

little or no thyroid destruction.

~BJ

> > >

> > > Hi Michele,

> > >

> > > I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at

friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting Enzymes

and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other products

available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works best for me.

> > >

> > > I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the

chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount. As

far as I know there is no maxed-out chart.

> > >

> > > Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or

small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause TPOabs

to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around 8,000 when he

was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they went down to below

10.

> > >

> > > It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily

correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the

" markers " of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.

> > >

> > > Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost

always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and symptoms

are important. There are a few studies that show patients with massive high

TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels caused much

destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be considered.

> > >

> > > The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical

refined world.

> > >

> > > HTH,

> > > ~Bj

> > >

> >

>

August 7, 2012

Hi Becky,

TPO antibodies may exist otherwise, that you are correct. For example, there are many foods, e.g. gluten & coffee for instance where their molecular structure looks just like that of thyroid cells & tissue to these antibodies that are "primed" to look out for this molecule - for whatever reason. TPO antibodies will always exist of course in either Hashi's OR Graves, which is very common & expected. The notion that they form when they see other molecules that aren't exactly thyroid tissue cells but are similar in molecular structure is known as cross-referencing. When they form due to cross-referencing, the danger is they mistakenly attack the thyroid gland/tissue/cells as well because antibodies cannot tell the difference in the molecular structure of a coffee bean, gluten, & many other substances than that of thyroid tissue. Does this make sense? Never is is appropriate or healthy to see TPO antibodies in the high range in a person with a healthy immune system, I'm sorry -

The antibodies that form to attack other body tissues/organs are the result of an immune system that has gone completely haywire & is confused, but it originated with TPO antibodies attacking the thyroid. There are thousands of antibody structures that can form, as in cases such as rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, multiple sclerosis to name a few & so on. It's just that in RA the joints are attacked, in MS the myelin sheath of cranial & spinal nerves are attacked, & lupus it is the liver that is attacked...but it is all the same premise in that the immune system was not reigned in & was allowed to continue with its "confused" state. (I'm saying all of this in as simple lay terms as I know how, hope I'm making sense, haha!).

In current practice, TPO antibodies as well as abnormal antibody activity in other disease/autoimmune processes is to approach the diet first....get patients tested via a gut analysis to check for food sensitivies & cross-referencing. We use Cyrex Labs (www.cyrexlabs.com). Gluten & dairy are strongly associated with ALL autoimmune disorders & are primary suspects. Keep in mind that the type of sensitivity we are talking about here is not the kind of sensitivity one can knowingly "sense or feel" that there is a problem when they consume these foods....it is happening molecularly, & we cannot feel those types of actions in the body. Second to correcting diet, we're using LDN to correct immune system function - I just went on it myself recently.

I don't know of anyone who believes TPO antibodies are the entire problem when it comes to Hashi's or Graves disease - but, what is true is that they are a sign of an immune system that is attacking its host, when antibodies of any kind should only be attacking foreign invaders, eg viruses or bacteria.

Hope this helps!

To: Thyroiditis Sent: Tuesday, August 7, 2012 6:15:11 PMSubject: Re: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal to have any of these antibodies?

Hi ,I think you may have misinterpreted as I was not referring to Hashi patients. What I meant by a strong immune system is that having TPOabs in the high range in a healthy person and without any thyroid destruction or other autoimmune disease. I have seen this in studies with chocking victims; the antibodies disappear or nearly disappears when the neck heals. And some people just have these antibodies for unknown reasons and don't have Hashis. Also it is interesting that many Graves' patients have high TPOabs levels but no thyroid destruction. I was afraid of getting another autoimmune disease with my mega high levels and I was shocked to find that I still have about 70% of my gland left after all this time - 12 years after Dx and 20 plus years of feeling hypO. So I personally know that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the "markers" of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.Could you explain what antibodies you are talking about that attack other organs & tissues besides the thyroid gland? And please tell us how do you deal with the TPO antibodies in your practice? Thanks!Best,~Bj> > > > Hi Michele,> > > > I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting Enzymes and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other products available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works best for me.> > > > I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount. As far as I know there is no maxed-out chart. > > > > Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause TPOabs to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around 8,000 when he was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they went down to below 10. > > > > It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the "markers" of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves. > > > > Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and symptoms are important. There are a few studies that show patients with massive high TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels caused much destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be considered.> > > > The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical refined world.> > > > HTH,> > ~Bj> > > > > >>

August 7, 2012

Interesting that mention the eosinophols. My daughter with Hashi has a high eosinophil count which we've been told is likely from a food or environmental allergy. Sent from my BlackBerry® smartphone with SprintSpeedSender: Thyroiditis Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2012 22:49:38 -0000To: <Thyroiditis >ReplyTo: Thyroiditis Subject: Re: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal to have any of these antibodies? Hi ,I think you may have misunderstood. Some people think the TPO antibodies damage the thyroid, which is NOT so. What I was trying to say is the TPO antibodies themselves do NOT cause any thyroid destruction or damage, which, I guess could mean a positive or good thing although I don't personally look at that way.TPOabs are formed to clean up already damaged thyroid cells - after the cells have already been injured or demised. (The TPOabs do NOT do this damage.) What cause the damage are the Killer T cells, cytokines and macrophage (and even sometimes eosinophils attack and damage the thyroid cells). The TPOabs are formed to clean up the thyroid peroxidase after it has leaked out of the cell.The level of TPOabs can be misleading in that a high count can mean little damage and a lower amount may mean high destruction. The way to find this out is by an ultra sound. An US will show the thyroid gland size. The blood tests for TPOabs only show what amount of TPOab is in the blood. There could lots of damaged cells in the gland that will never be picked-up on the lab test. So falsely assumming a low count is good can backfire.The tests to measure how the thyroid is functioning are the Free T3 and Free T4 tests. But in the early stages of bad symptoms the tests are usually not all-telling - meaning symptoms and labs do NOT usually show the same thing leaving patients ill.Thyroid antibody tests are useful in the diagnosis of thyroid autoimmune disorders and used to differentiate autoimmune thyroid disease from non-autoimmune hypothyroidism or goiter; and can also be useful as a diagnostic tool in deciding whether to treat a patient who has subclinical hypothyroidism.**The magnitude of the antibody titer does NOT correlate with the clinical activity of the disease. **Although high anti-TPO titers are seen in over 98% of patients with chronic Hashimoto's thyroiditis and over 80% of Graves' disease patients. Elevated amounts of these antibodies are also present in other autoimmune disorders, too, such as pernicious anemia, type I diabetes, rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, and other diseases.As a repeat, it is always best to go by symptoms and actual thyroid function not the antibody count. Studies prove that thyroid meds, selinium, removing gluten in the diet and healing the gut along with modulating the immune system do in fact help lower these antibodies. My levels as of last year are at 87 down from a whopping 20,893. I hope this is helpul to you,~Bj> > > **> >> >> > Hi Michele,> >> > I use a gluten prevention enzyme supplement when we eat out or eat at> > friends houses etc. It's called BioCore DPP IV Gluten Peptide Digesting> > Enzymes and I buy it at http://www.swansonvitamins.com/ . There are other> > products available at a local Health Food Store, however this one works> > best for me.> >> > I do not understand what you mean by your daughter's TPOabs maxed out the> > chart. I had TPOabs of close to 21,000 and the lab showed the exact amount.> > As far as I know there is no maxed-out chart.> >> > Also, healthy people can get TPOabs whenever there is any injury large or> > small to the neck region. Just a small bump to the neck region can cause> > TPOabs to form. One study showed that a man got a TPOab count of around> > 8,000 when he was stabbed and chocked in the neck area. After recovery they> > went down to below 10.> >> > It is worthy to remember that the amount of TPOabs do NOT necessarily> > correlate with degree of damage to the gland, since TPOabs are simply the> > " markers " of inflammation, but do NOT cause the damage and hypO themselves.> >> > Also, a high TPOab count can mean a strong immune system, which is almost> > always overlooked by modern medicine. This is where other lab tests and> > symptoms are important. There are a few studies that show patients with> > massive high TPOab levels and NO thyroid destruction while lower levels> > caused much destruction. So there is much more than TPOabs that must be> > considered.> >> > The key is to live a clean healthy life as possible in this chemical> > refined world.> >> > HTH,> > ~Bj> >> >>

August 8, 2012

BJYou asked about my daughter "maxing out the chart". The lab at the time just put >3000 and did not go any further. Same with the other, only it has >1200. Both of the Endocrinologist we have seen were surprised-mostly because she was nine. Although kids can get extreme numbers if they have an infection and then they will go back to normal. Unfortunately for her the TSH and goiter confirmed Hoshimotos. Which is bad, but now she has Chronic Autoimmune Urticaria (hives) and that is a whole lot worse. I will get the gluten pills and maybe my husband will not be quite so sensitive to cross-contamination issues when we go out. I actually caught a waiter taking the croutons off his salad after we asked for another one (we had ordered it without them and told them he

was 'allergic'). I spoke with the manager about food education because you can really mess someone up doing that. My husband's brother is Celiac so we assume he is to and take the gluten thing very serious. MicheleSubject: Re: Re: Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies - is it normal to have any of these antibodies?To: Thyroiditis Date: Tuesday, August 7, 2012, 9:53 PM

Interesting that mention the eosinophols. My daughter with Hashi has a high eosinophil count which we've been told is likely from a food or environmental allergy. Sent from my BlackBerryÂ® smartphone with SprintSpeed