Re: Shoemaker and immune system-my RA from last Apt

[Guest guest]

Yes, I would say from experience that mold stimulates rather than

supresses the immune system. Others have had my experience of having

no colds or flu for 10 years while living in a moldy house. I always

think of getting a herpes outbreak a sign that I finally have mold

imflmation under control. Once I moved unknowingly into a

contaminated place when I was getting a herpes outbreak-In 12 hrrs, I

could feel the outbreak disapper-then I noticed my ankles swelling-my

wrists also-then a throbing behind the eye-should have run-but stuck

it out trying to find a new place-by that time I was so sick and

nuerologically screwed that it took 12 people to take care of me. Of

course if you go long enough , your immune system finally crashes-

then try recovering!!! The latest for me is Rhumetoid Arthritis-an

auto-immune disease-I had been tested befor for it-none-but this last

house did it to me-strangly enough-I found out that the last tenent

there had RA also-proof to me that certain molds cause specific

illnesses.

> damaging the immume system. In my case, I ended up with diabetes

until I moved and

> that alone has compromised my immune system.

>

[Guest guest]

I think so too, I know the innate immune system is over stimulared

during exposure, how that in turn affects the aquired immune system?

I'm not sure. but theres something that keeps some of us from haveing

a infection, is it those who still have mycotoxins in their system?

candida A.(strange how some of us or diagnosed with " allergies " and

some not)maybe this is where the IgE,IgG,IgM,IgA comes in.I also

recall that the immune system also play a role in liver

function,humm. I too have not had a cold or flu sence exposed. humm,

that's one of the questions Dr. Shoemaker asked me. if I had had a

cold sence my exposure. there's been times that I thought I was

starting to get one from what I remember how that fells like, but

than it would go away.

--- In , " " <kdeanstudios@...>

wrote:

>

> Yes, I would say from experience that mold stimulates rather than

> supresses the immune system. Others have had my experience of

having

> no colds or flu for 10 years while living in a moldy house. I

always

> think of getting a herpes outbreak a sign that I finally have mold

> imflmation under control. Once I moved unknowingly into a

> contaminated place when I was getting a herpes outbreak-In 12 hrrs,

I

> could feel the outbreak disapper-then I noticed my ankles swelling-

my

> wrists also-then a throbing behind the eye-should have run-but

stuck

> it out trying to find a new place-by that time I was so sick and

> nuerologically screwed that it took 12 people to take care of me.

Of

> course if you go long enough , your immune system finally crashes-

> then try recovering!!! The latest for me is Rhumetoid Arthritis-an

> auto-immune disease-I had been tested befor for it-none-but this

last

> house did it to me-strangly enough-I found out that the last tenent

> there had RA also-proof to me that certain molds cause specific

> illnesses.

>

>

> > damaging the immume system. In my case, I ended up with

diabetes

> until I moved and

> > that alone has compromised my immune system.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

...that has been me also, no colds or flu. Oddly I don't even have

allergy symptoms, except some in fall and spring, even though I test

highly allergic to almost everything. I went to the local allergy

clinic to see if I was allergic to cats since someone had one I was

thinking of taking. The clinic is a teaching clinic for the local

university here. I thought I might have developed some seasonal

allergies, but they were mild. However to my surprise I

developed 'wheels, or whatever they are called', to just about

everything he put on my skin. I had so many wheels, he asked someone

to come in and take notes while he measured all of them. He said " I

can't believe you didn't know you had all these allergies " . I

said " I hardly ever sneeze " . He said they can manifest in many other

ways. How do you know if manifestation is, say, fatigue, headaches,

etc. Those could be anything. Anyway, so I test positive to all

these allergies but don't have much reaction such as sneezing, just

fatigue and headaches; and also haven't gotten a cold or flu for many

years, but yet feel sick almost all the time. I don't sleep well, so

you would think I would get sick easily from that also. Only thing I

can think of is that my adrenaline system is affected. I feel like I

lack 'energy' but am going on 'adrenaline', since I have difficulty

relaxing. If my response to mold is to hype up my adrenal system,

that might keep other infections away. At least that is something I

think could cause this.

>

>I know the innate immune system is over stimulared during exposure

[Guest guest]

Barb, its probably " masking/unmasking "

You know what that is, right?

Some of what you think is mold illness may be other things..

The dust in your home could contain a lot of those other allergens..too.

Pollen, pet dander, etc.

[Guest guest]

headackes sounds more like sinus problems which many irritants can

aggervate, allergens too weather your allergic to them or not.

>

> ..that has been me also, no colds or flu. Oddly I don't even have

> allergy symptoms, except some in fall and spring, even though I

test

> highly allergic to almost everything. I went to the local allergy

> clinic to see if I was allergic to cats since someone had one I was

> thinking of taking. The clinic is a teaching clinic for the local

> university here. I thought I might have developed some seasonal

> allergies, but they were mild. However to my surprise I

> developed 'wheels, or whatever they are called', to just about

> everything he put on my skin.

[Guest guest]

Barb,

Allergic reactions can also be delayed. Which means that you might eat something

that you might not have a reaction to for hours or days later. Kind of like when

you wake up in the morning with a stiff neck and can't figure out what you did

that caused it. May have been two days earlier when you lifted something heavy.

There are other allergy tests that can go a little deeper to search out and

confirm these reactions like Alcat or Eliza/Act. But you can also try by

eliminating certain things and reintroducing them one at a time. Skin Rast tests

are effective to a point, from what I've learned as a layperson, but can also be

false positives as just the fact that you're injecting substances under the skin

might not be fully accurate to an allergic reaction as much as to an irritant.

An environmental doc I see said that they are 60-65% accurate as opposed to

other blood tests, which she relies more on.

As per the mold ramping up the adrenals, the other side is when they have

exhasuted themselves and you face even worse health issues related to adrenal

fatigue, which I am now.

Jac

[Guest guest]

Hi Jackie (?), I did investigate further, a couple of years ago. I'm

not sure if I had tests you mention but I got blood testing for

allergies by Dr Marinkovich and also went down to Dallas and got skin

testing by Dr Rey which is done differently. I went both places for

other reasons also but both of them wanted to do allergy tests over

again. I'm not too concerned about the allergies, since I think

allergies are a symptom or something, especially when you have so

many. If I had one thing I was allergic to, I'd just avoid that, but

when you test allergic to almost everything, then there is something

else, bigger, wrong I'm assuming. They gave me a clue that something

was wrong or where to start looking since all other traditional blood

tests were fine and I was feeling so bad. I'll look up the terms you

used to see if I have had those tests. Thanks

>

> Barb,

>

> Allergic reactions can also be delayed.

[Guest guest]

Allergic reactions can be caused by massive exposures to things. That is

called allergic hypersensitization.

Here is a 1996 WHO letter on this important issue:

There is a need to try to encourage the US government to understand the

importance of this issue.

(The US is increasingly becoming a dumping ground for chemicals banned in

other countries.)

Toxicol Lett. <javascript:AL_get(this, 'jour', 'Toxicol Lett.');> 1996

Aug;86(2-3):61-3.

Related

Articles<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed & DbFrom=pubmed & Cmd=Li\

nk & LinkName=pubmed_pubmed & LinkReadableName=Related%20Articles & IdsFromResult=8711\

777 & ordinalpos=3 & itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_R\

VAbstract>,

Links <javascript:PopUpMenu2_Set(Menu8711777);>

*Environmental chemicals, respiratory hypersensitization and international

chemical safety.*

*

E*<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed & Cmd=Search & Term=%22%2\

0E%22%5BAuthor%5D & itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_\

RVAbstract>

..

International Programme on Chemical Safety, World Health Organization,

Geneva, Switzerland.

Allergic hypersensitization to a variety of chemicals, natural and

synthetic, is a worldwide health problem. Respiratory tract

hypersensitization is responsible for significant morbidity and, in some

cases, mortality. An important step in managing and controlling health

risks, such as allergic hypersensitization, is to identify the chemical

hazard, define dose-effect and dose-response relationships, evaluate

exposure, and characterize risk. In practical terms, the risk and safety

assessment processes lead to the designation of control limits for exposure

to chemicals in air, food, water, and consumer products. The objective of

exposure limits is to protect the whole human population, including the most

susceptible individuals and 'at risk' groups. The existence of susceptible

individuals is a factor that must be taken into account when quantitative

chemical risk assessments are being made, and should be covered in the risk

characterization. Within a population, individual susceptibility is

influenced by genetic and environmental factors and these have regional and

national differences. There may be cases where hypersusceptible individuals

and groups, such as asthmatic children, are not fully protected by

regulatory exposure limits. The International Programme on Chemical Safety,

as the global programme on identifying and assessing chemical risks to human

health and the environment in order to assist countries in effective

management, is striving to elucidate the toxicological basis for

chemically-associated disease and advance the basic science and methodology

of chemical risk and safety assessment.

PMID: 8711777 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

[Guest guest]

what I see wrong with this is that it says allergic but only refers

to chemical exposure. RAD comes to mind. and the sensirive

poplulation they refer to is people with previous asthma or possable

other health problems. if this was based on a true allergy we'd all

be diagnosed with allergies, so what really is a true allergy, some

kind of immune function that goes haywire with exosure to high doses

of what? chemicals? other than a massive exposure to chemicals that

makes people hypersensitive, what is a allergy?

[Guest guest]

Molds produce chemicals of a variety of different kinds. Ask a chemist.

Everything is a chemical.

On Sun, Aug 10, 2008 at 11:41 PM, who <jeaninem660@...> wrote:

> what I see wrong with this is that it says allergic but only refers

> to chemical exposure. RAD comes to mind. and the sensirive

> poplulation they refer to is people with previous asthma or possable

> other health problems. if this was based on a true allergy we'd all

> be diagnosed with allergies, so what really is a true allergy, some

> kind of immune function that goes haywire with exosure to high doses

> of what? chemicals? other than a massive exposure to chemicals that

> makes people hypersensitive, what is a allergy?

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Live-read carefully and don't waste you time-I have never tested

positive for allergies-mold is known to trigger auto immune illness-I

fail to see the relavence of the paper you mention to what I posted---

In , LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

>

> Allergic reactions can be caused by massive exposures to things. That

is

> called allergic hypersensitization.

>

>

[Guest guest]

--- :

Very tired of hearing the allergy thing brought op time and time again>

> Barb,

>

> Allergic reactions can also be delayed. Which means that you might

eat something that you might not have a reaction to for hours or days

[Guest guest]

No Live, my main problem would not be pet dander and pollen since I

noticed I felt better when away from my home. I do dust it and

vaccum.

What is masking and unmasking?

--- In , LiveSimply <quackadillian@...>

wrote:

>

> Barb, its probably " masking/unmasking "

>

>> Some of what you think is mold illness may be other things..

>

> The dust in your home could contain a lot of those other

allergens..too.

>

> Pollen, pet dander, etc.

>

[Guest guest]

Barb,

I can't tell you to do things..

You know that old saying about horses and water..

But..

Since you're a homeowner, why don't you invest in a vent fan for your

bathroom? And seal off your crawlspace with some heavy-duty vapor

barrier.. so you can exhaust that sump-pumpy air outside?

[Guest guest]

The thing about this illness is we all experience many of the same

problems-- but then many are not always the same, so that is the part

that is so hard for people or doctors to understand.

I think a lot of us can detect when it is a chemical bothering us,

mold, car exhaust, cooking. Unfortunately with the chemical

sensitivities or reactive airways disease or whatever you want to call

it we can smell every little thing. I once asked my doctor in the

beginning if he couldn't do something about me smelling every thing so

much. I forget what he said, but he understood. I guess it helps in a

way cuz when I get a headache or chest pain I look around to see what

is around me if I don't already know. I think diabetes (spell) and

yeast both are connected to sugar plus many of us have the elevated

white blood count which is in overdrive a lot of the time which then

causes the inflammation (spell)and all the other stuff. I don't get

many colds either, but if I do it is a bad one, but I probably have

only had maybe 4 in ten years. I am also allergic to mold, dust,

candida albicans but I don't feel like the allergies bother me. Like my

husband also has trouble with fragrance and mold but his nose is always

either stuffed up or running, but mine is usually never stuffed up or

running since I had sinus surgery in the beginning. I guess my mucus

doesn't drain properly and when I do blow my nose it come out very

thick and all at once. Sorry for the detail. I hope to have insurance

soon cuz my husband finally got a good job with insurance so maybe I

can see a doctor in the future. I have not been to a doctor for some

time. At least my doctor understood the yeast thing the last we talked

but it was very expensive for all the tests, etc. so I said I would

wait a while. He wad kind enough to barely charge me the last few

visits.

t , " barb1283 " <barb1283@...> wrote:

>

> No Live, my main problem would not be pet dander and pollen since I

> noticed I felt better when away from my home. I do dust it and

> vaccum.

> What is masking and unmasking?

[Guest guest]

If what you suggested would be good for me, I'd do it. However if I

tried to vent my sump pumpy air through bathroom vent, it would drag

it through house. I have basement, not crawl space. If I vented

anywhere in house in summertime, I'd creat negative air pressure and

most likely would get attic air down into house, not basement air,

but I could get both. I think I'm in a good spot with ventilation

right now. I ventilate by opening windows when dewpoint is low like

now it is 49 dewpoint and 74 out, and I open windows. Sometimes I

put fan like you do, one in and one out. Otherwise they are closed

all July and August. Too much mold in outdoor air for me until

winter now. In winter I have small fresh air intake. Thanks though.

--- In , LiveSimply <quackadillian@...>

wrote:

>

> Since you're a homeowner, why don't you invest in a vent fan for

your

> bathroom? And seal off your crawlspace with some heavy-duty vapor

> barrier.. so you can exhaust that sump-pumpy air outside?

>

[Guest guest]

Very sorry if I upset you or anyone on the list. That is always the farthest

intention from my mind. My two-cents is indeed quite flawed and my energy weak,

but the times I do share anything it is only meant to help, if possible.

If I can recall this correctly; and my short term memory is quite bad... I only

brought it up in response to a prior comment about the Rast testing. And it was

I believe food specific. I wasn't referring to the mold issue at all which I

know first-hand is quite a different issue. I too am suffering with toxic

exposure to mold and more.

Best,

Jac

> From: <kdeanstudios@...>

> Subject: [] Re: Shoemaker and immune system-my RA from last Apt

>

> Date: Monday, August 11, 2008, 2:07 PM

> --- :

> Very tired of hearing the allergy thing brought op time and

> time again>

>

> > Barb,

> >

> > Allergic reactions can also be delayed. Which means

> that you might

> eat something that you might not have a reaction to for

> hours or days

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

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>

>