Re: My 'Philosophical Thought': Anguish at Cover-up is nothing compared to impact of illness.

[Guest guest]

LiveSimply, well said!! 

[] My 'Philosophical Thought': Anguish at Cover-up is

nothing compared to impact of illness.

I disagree. The thing that makes mold illness bad is being sick and

not feeling well.

Which in my case means a lot of pain. Also, its a killer not

being able to support yourself normally. How can people survive without a job?

[Guest guest]

Live, or anybody, do you know if when your on disability and you mive

to another state that might have higher liveing cosys, do they change

the amount of disability to adjust for that? I was told that the hud

program that helps pay some on rent can be tranfered like if I needed

to move somewhere in order to be closer to someplace like for medical

reasons but I dont know if the disability amount would change with

higher costs of liveing. just wondering

--- In , <brianc8452@...>

wrote:

>

> LiveSimply, well said!! 

>

>

>

> [] My 'Philosophical Thought': Anguish at

Cover-up is nothing compared to impact of illness.

>

>

> I disagree. The thing that makes mold illness bad is being sick and

> not feeling well.

> Which in my case means a lot of pain. Also, its a killer not

> being able to support yourself normally. How can people survive

without a job?

>

[Guest guest]

You misunderstood my post. I'm not saying that upset over the coverup

is worse than being ill. I mean if it were not for the coverup, there

wouldn't be so much illness and if one did get ill, you would be able

to get help. That the coverup, in a very real sense causes the illness

to be so prevalent.

--- In , LiveSimply <quackadillian@...>

wrote:

>

> I disagree. The thing that makes mold illness bad is being sick and

> not feeling well.

>

[Guest guest]

I have no idea. I have never applied for anything like that.

I would be terrified of approaching the government in such a way.

I am focusing on getting better, if at all possible. Somehow finding ways to

get better.

I don't like being sick. I hate it.

Stem cells may offer some possibilities.

I think what I have is related to chemo brain.

I think that people who have been poisoned by mold deserve much better than

being

labeled as 'disabled'. Its not as if it just happened by chance, you know.

My advice to you is to try to stop spending money on any and all

nonessentials and

do your best to get better. If you do need to apply for public assistance,

get help

from some activist public agencies and make it clear to them that you

were made ill by mold and that that needs to be part of the public record

because mold

is destroying a lot of lives.

That you are not alone.

Then, try to get better.

It may not be possible to continue to live in the urban parts of the US and

get decent medical care too if you are sick and trying to live on

disability.

Do you have any family you can live with to save money?

Maybe you could live off of the money they give you in Mexico and afford

medical treatment there?

Are there any mold savvy doctors there? The US is increasingly a very

unfriendly place for the ill.

On Sat, Aug 9, 2008 at 5:41 PM, who <jeaninem660@...> wrote:

> Live, or anybody, do you know if when your on disability and you mive

> to another state that might have higher liveing cosys, do they change

> the amount of disability to adjust for that? I was told that the hud

> program that helps pay some on rent can be tranfered like if I needed

> to move somewhere in order to be closer to someplace like for medical

> reasons but I dont know if the disability amount would change with

> higher costs of liveing. just wondering

>

>

>

> >

> > LiveSimply, well said!!

> >

> >

> >

> > [] My 'Philosophical Thought': Anguish at

> Cover-up is nothing compared to impact of illness.

> >

> >

> > I disagree. The thing that makes mold illness bad is being sick and

> > not feeling well.

> > Which in my case means a lot of pain. Also, its a killer not

> > being able to support yourself normally. How can people survive

> without a job?

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Jeanine, I recall that one of the Sickbuildings members moved to Arizona with

their child so they could get treatment from Dr. Gray.  Maybe that would be a

good option for you.

[] My 'Philosophical Thought': Anguish at

> Cover-up is nothing compared to impact of illness.

> >

> >

> > I disagree. The thing that makes mold illness bad is being sick and

> > not feeling well.

> > Which in my case means a lot of pain. Also, its a killer not

> > being able to support yourself normally. How can people survive

> without a job?

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

yes, thats been a thought Brain, just would have to drag my daughters

and grandkids with me,lol's

--- In , <brianc8452@...>

wrote:

>

> Jeanine, I recall that one of the Sickbuildings members moved to

Arizona with their child so they could get treatment from Dr. Gray. 

Maybe that would be a good option for you.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Live,?? ???

what are you tring to say Lve, that I should stuff myself with herbs,

med's this thing than that thing and spend all my money on grap that

doesn't work? to each his own, maybe I happen to think that less is

better and have found my own way at a very cheap price I may add and

do I need to remind you that I'm not into the herb thing because of

past exanple. maybe I sey here and keep my mouth shut about how maybe

trying all kinds of things, many that could be possable aggervaters

is not good. do you understand that adviceing people on takeing herbs

could cause them a reaction with some med they may be takeing or some

allergy they may have or it may cause irritation in other ways like

with stomach problems? and whats wrong with getting disability when

you are disabled? pride doesn't pay the bills. and believe it or not

I've came along way health wize sence my exposure and it wasn't by

spending all my money on trying this and trying that. it was

practiceing avoidence and learning how to slow down and even stop

some reactions. it's called listening to your body talk. did you know

that 60 percent of medical articles on the web are wrong? I really

dont care to base what I think around that. luv ya, so please dont

assume anything with me or how I live. sometimes a simple I dont know

well do.

[Guest guest]

I just want to put out there that I feel very passionately about not judging

people who are on disability, welfare, food stamps..doing what they need to do

to survive. It was the Reagan 80's that started all this shaming about being

broke, about reaching out for help, and I think it has been one of the most

damaging things to our society. I don't know what happened between the two of

you, but as far as I'm concerned, everyone on this site has enough reason to be

on disability. It is this attitude of judgement that is why we are here

suffering and trying to figure this out among ourselves instead of this being a

known quantity, with informed and adequate prevention and treatment. As far as

I'm concerned, they should have emergency medical funds specifically for this

illness, as one result is many of us have had to get rid of all our stuff, and

have had financial wipe-out. All this shaming for the people who need it, when

in the 80's, there was so

much white collar crime and corporate stealing of funds, and now we see

billionaire oil CEOs wringing people who just can barely afford enough gas to

get to the doctor, or their kids, or their job. THAT is shameful.

There should be no judging here.

I receive disability. And proud of it. I reached out for help and fought for

my life, and because of that, I was able to start seeing doctors. That's what

it's there for. We need MORE assistance, not less!

OOOOOh, don't get me started!!!!

[Guest guest]

We had to move away from all of our friends because we could no longer

afford to live

in the place we were living. We had to give away everything because we could

not sell it.

We lost access to our entire circle of friends, many, many thousands of

dollars worth of stuff.

Write a letter to your Congressman.

[Guest guest]

I wasn't judging anybody, just saying that I didn't know anything

about it and didn't want to know.

Whenever there is civil unrest, the disabled are always blamed for

things. What if it turns out that climate change is responsible for

mold illness and that in 20 or 30 years everybody will have it? Then

we could expect some kind of program to weed out those with " bad

genes " ..

That is why getting the government in my life scares me. Also the

money isn't enough to live on.

[Guest guest]

People should fight for a CURE..

On Mon, Aug 11, 2008 at 11:15 AM, LiveSimply <quackadillian@...> wrote:

> I wasn't judging anybody, just saying that I didn't know anything

> about it and didn't want to know.

>

[Guest guest]

Oh, so it's a government thing. I can relate to that.

Thing is, when you're broke and out of options, some money is better than none.

And some health coverage is also better than none.

> From: LiveSimply <quackadillian@...>

> Subject: Re: [] Re: My 'Philosophical Thought': Anguish at

Cover-up is nothing compared to impact of illness.

>

> Date: Monday, August 11, 2008, 8:15 AM

> I wasn't judging anybody, just saying that I didn't

> know anything

> about it and didn't want to know.

>

> Whenever there is civil unrest, the disabled are always

> blamed for

> things. What if it turns out that climate change is

> responsible for

> mold illness and that in 20 or 30 years everybody will have

> it? Then

> we could expect some kind of program to weed out those with

> " bad

> genes " ..

>

> That is why getting the government in my life scares me.

> Also the

> money isn't enough to live on.

[Guest guest]

Yes. But, as in my case, when you are too weak and sick to fight, that is

precisely why you need to do what you can so you can get even iota of strength

to do so. Disability helped me feed, house myself (though inadequately, it's a

bit less stressful than being homeless), enabled me to afford some care and

medicine.

It is exactly because I knew I would need to be in the fight that I had no

qualms about getting on disability.

Before I became seriously ill, I was an environmental activist-working

politically, going door to door, the works. I am also a performance artist.

Because I got on disability, I may have a chance of sharing my particular light,

what I was given to offer, again.

I feel very strongly about us fighting to shine our light. Whatever it takes,

as long as you are not hurting anyone, it is all of our birthright.

> > I wasn't judging anybody, just saying that I

> didn't know anything

> > about it and didn't want to know.

> >

[Guest guest]

This is an extremely complicated issue economically, and I think that

the only people who are being served well by it remaining this way are

the irresponsible people who put often poor and powerless other people

in the position of being made ill.

A number of questions bother me about the situation as it exists now..

1.) People who have been injured by very bad mold situations need

immediate medical help so that the injury doesn't get worse and worse.

2.) Proven therapies like cholestyramine exist, but the knowledge of

them is being covered up, and sometimes even the doctors who recommend

them are attacked professionally.

3.) Instead of concentrating on getting better, people are buried in

struggles to get medical care, to find safe housing, to support

themselves. There is no way they can afford those things without a job

or their health, so they must claim that they are totally isabled even

if they might be able to get work as a part-time greeter at WalMart or

something like that.

To get 'diasbility' they must be totally disabled, so they often,

tragically, avoid trying to do the things they need to do to get

better.

(This is why I think any SOLUTION needs to get those peope money, and

care, fast, and it needs to get them into SAFE housing, *fast*.)

4.) The people who are doing this to them are not being punished at

all, and they continue to poison other people.

5.) The taxpayers end up paying some of the bill in many cases and not

only is that amount WOEFULLY inadequate to the point of being

insulting, its also treated as some kind of gift, and the recipients

are forced to humilate themselves and claim total disability forever

in order to get it. So, most people opt out and take their chances.

6.) The lack of true accountability on the part of the poisoners and

the cover-uppers means that SOCIETY is giving a huge subsidy to the

POISONERS in the form of higher profits. Also, society is sending the

message that the rich and powerful are somehow 'entitled' to hurt

people in their quest for easy money.

7.) The true cost to society is even higher because of the GRIDLOCK

that comes from fear of liability and that gridlock prevents people

from fixing conditions that hurt people because they are afraid of the

impact that their irresponsibility has had in the past makes them

highly liable for monetary damages. So, nothing gets done and people

put wagns in circles and deny, deny deny.

[Guest guest]

I agree with most of your points, however, less than 1 percent of tax money

actually goes to welfare, and same with disability. I researched this when I

had to get on welfare and a friend (ex-friend) said she didn't want to " pay for

me " . This is one of the fallacies put out by the government in the 80's, that

lead to the shame and judgement of those on public assistance-that out tax money

is " paying for them " . In fact, about 25 percent or over of your tax money is

going to the corporations. It was a red herring.

Don't fall for it. It led to the " discompassion revolution " that started at

that time and carries on still today.

If you are talking about what has blocked the things you are talking about from

happening, it is this accepted lack of compassion.

> From: LiveSimply <quackadillian@...>

> Subject: Re: [] Re: My 'Philosophical Thought': Anguish at

Cover-up is nothing compared to impact of illness.

>

> Date: Monday, August 11, 2008, 4:04 PM

> This is an extremely complicated issue economically, and I

> think that

> the only people who are being served well by it remaining

> this way are

> the irresponsible people who put often poor and powerless

> other people

> in the position of being made ill.

>

[Guest guest]

There are some good articles on economic gridlock as it applies to

intellectual property.

I think a similar " mold gridlock " has seized America over the mold

issue, and that fear of

liability and acknowledgement of guilt is what is

preventing injured people from receiving care or compensation.

Here are two links that talk about economic gridlock in the IP world.

http://www.newyorker.com/talk/financial/2008/08/11/080811ta_talk_surowiecki

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=592166

Understand that the concept is basically different but similar

mechanisms of fear of liability are preventing accountability from

being attributed.

BTW, I think all medical care should be free. That is not what I am

talking about so much here. I am talking about the whole package.

Basically, I think we need no-fault insurance which is paid for by a

5-10% tax on all rentals. Fines would be assessed whenever a mold

problem is found, regardless of how people were effected.

[Guest guest]

I risked my life everyday working fir my state and to make roads safe

for drivers, I also worked for my city. I really dont care what

people think, I was injured while working to protact the public.

what needs to be foxed os the problem of people getting it that dont

need it, I watched a guy that got it supposedly for back injuries who

jumped on his motorcycle everyfsy to go for a spin. thats the state

problem not mine.

[Guest guest]

Really, everybody who is injured because of a job deserves to be

compensated - greatly. I don't think that people resent that. What IS

happening is that the government keeps trying to weasel out of their

responsibilities and so is industry and what results is basically a

subsidy to the injurers and the poisoners.. out of people's lives,

paid in blood and tears..

A HUGE subsidy, because the worth of what people typically lose FAR

exceeds the tiny amounts of money that 'disability' pays.

BTW, most people who are injured on the job never collect anything..

Only the extremely injured manage to collect.. and then they often

have to fight for every penny. Which sometimes drives them to suicide.

On Tue, Aug 12, 2008 at 1:26 PM, who <jeaninem660@...> wrote:

> I risked my life everyday working fir my state and to make roads safe

> for drivers, I also worked for my city. I really dont care what

> people think, I was injured while working to protact the public.

> what needs to be foxed os the problem of people getting it that dont

> need it, I watched a guy that got it supposedly for back injuries who

> jumped on his motorcycle everyfsy to go for a spin. thats the state

> problem not mine.

>

[Guest guest]

Yes, I know a woman who got it because she had alot of children and no

Father. I think she told them she had back trouble but perhaps on it

too much instead.

>

> the problem of people getting it that dont

> need it