Opinion

June 12, 2006

yes, I believe so. My daughter has only 2-4mm of facial asymmetry (within "normal" range), but we just banded her for plagio/brachy. In fact most brachy babies have no facial asymmetry whatsoever. <heatherae_21@...> wrote: I was just wondering if anyone knows if a child does not have any facial asymmetry if they will do a helmet/band anyways. i have pics of my son but are unable to get them to post. thanks heather ethan nicholas left tort right tilt, mild plagio __________________________________________________

August 12, 2008

Scroll down to the post with the utube video and watch.

http://www.immunesupport.com/chat/forums/message.cfm?id=1302192 & B=FM

Do you wonder if these kids have black mold in their house?

February 26, 2009

My 2 aspies (9 & 4) are very alike yet very different. The little one has severe sensory issues, the older one mild. The little one has behavior issues and is wild and out of control, the older one is an introvert and would rather eat his gut out that share something. Both carry on long speeches for like forever. Hard to say but it presents differently in each kid.

February 27, 2009

>

> My 2 aspies (9 & 4) are very alike yet very different. The little one

has severe sensory issues, the older one mild. The little one has

behavior issues and is wild and out of control, the older one is an

introvert and would rather eat his gut out that share something. Both

carry on long speeches for like forever. Hard to say but it presents

differently in each kid.

>

Thank you for the info. Being that I am sure you are well-versed, do

you think this sounds like Asperger's? Obviously, we are going to see

the MD, but I think other moms of special needs kids are very good at

identifying characteristics. I told my younger son's teacher that the

screening clinic said it could be Asperger's and she looked at me like

I have 10 heads. I know you have never seen him so it is difficult to

say, but do the behaviors match up? From what I have read, it seems

that if you strictly follow the DSM-IV criteria hardly anyone would

have this.

February 27, 2009

My son did and does some of the things your son is doing and he does have Aspergers, there are different levels of Aspergers, some are mild and some have more of it. In either case I think early intervention is the key. pj

From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@...> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 7:40:51 PMSubject: ( ) Opinion

Hi,I have a 6 year old with PDD-NOS. He developmental ped is now leaning towards a diagnosis of Asperger's even though he doesn't meet the full criteria. We have also been concerned about our 4 year old son for a little while, and we recently took him for a developmental screening through a local children's hospital. He saw a nurse practitioner there and she said that she feels that he has a lot of "soft signs" for Asperger's. He reacts very strongly to things. He does not like changes in his routine. He has a lot of separation anxiety. He has some very mild sensory issues. They are not overly concerning, but we did have an OT eval anyway. He was very uncooperative, but the OT felt that it was not an OT issue as much as it is a behavioral issue. He is not very social and when he tries to be, he is often inappropriate. I think he feels more comfortable with adults but even so he will often either

say something unusual or he will do something unusual like trying to lick them or fake burping. Have any of you experienced anything like this? He doesn't have a speech delay nor does he speak like a "little professor". He is pretty fixated on Star Wars though. He basically has some unusual mannerisms. I am not sure what to make of it. I thought maybe he was mimicking my older son, but although they have some similiarities, they are also very different. I would appreciate any opinions. The NP sent up an appt with the dev ped for May so we are going to take him back at that time. I am just looking for some opinions and wondering if anyone else is in my same situation.Thank you.

February 28, 2009

Wow...those are all signs...like Patti said Asperger's is a spectrum and children can be very mild or very high on the spectrum. I sometimes wonder about my son....he is so social and that is the only thing he really cares about...but he doesn't have the social skills and does not always act appropriately or his age. When I spoke to the Psychiatrist...he said that the main criteria was the lack of Social Skills/Communication. And, early intervention is the best...

Jan

Janice Rushen

"I will try to be open to all avenues of wisdom and hope"

From: Patti Journey <pjpoo78363@...>Subject: Re: ( ) Opinion Date: Friday, February 27, 2009, 10:13 PM

My son did and does some of the things your son is doing and he does have Aspergers, there are different levels of Aspergers, some are mild and some have more of it. In either case I think early intervention is the key. pj

From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 7:40:51 PMSubject: ( ) Opinion

Hi,I have a 6 year old with PDD-NOS. He developmental ped is now leaning towards a diagnosis of Asperger's even though he doesn't meet the full criteria. We have also been concerned about our 4 year old son for a little while, and we recently took him for a developmental screening through a local children's hospital. He saw a nurse practitioner there and she said that she feels that he has a lot of "soft signs" for Asperger's. He reacts very strongly to things. He does not like changes in his routine. He has a lot of separation anxiety. He has some very mild sensory issues. They are not overly concerning, but we did have an OT eval anyway. He was very uncooperative, but the OT felt that it was not an OT issue as much as it is a behavioral issue. He is not very social and when he tries to be, he is often inappropriate. I think he feels more comfortable with adults but even so he will often

either say something unusual or he will do something unusual like trying to lick them or fake burping. Have any of you experienced anything like this? He doesn't have a speech delay nor does he speak like a "little professor". He is pretty fixated on Star Wars though. He basically has some unusual mannerisms. I am not sure what to make of it. I thought maybe he was mimicking my older son, but although they have some similiarities, they are also very different. I would appreciate any opinions. The NP sent up an appt with the dev ped for May so we are going to take him back at that time. I am just looking for some opinions and wondering if anyone else is in my same situation.Thank you.

February 28, 2009

In a message dated 2/28/2009 4:04:54 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, pjpoo78363@... writes:

thought the school had to do an evaluation if they parent asked, Roxane what do you think? Can the school get away with this? pj

The school can refuse but the parent needs to ask for their refusal and reasons why in writing. Pam

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February 28, 2009

Remember when the school district refuses to provide a service (evaluation) or support (therapy etc)...get their refusal and WHY in WRITING. That way you have the proof you need to challenge them further. Pam

In a message dated 2/28/2009 4:19:49 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, jimandjeanine@... writes:

I even presented the paper work from the doctor. They would not budge. Then, my husband and I met with the principal. They said that because the teacher feels that he is functioning in his pre-school class they do not have to test him. The town that we live in has an inclusion pre-school. I attempted to have him tested last year when he turned 3, but I was turned down then also. I then applied to the program, and they accepted him as a typically developing child. Basically, his class has 10 "typicals" and up to 6 children who are classified for one reason or another. I barely was able to get my older son in to this program. It was not an easy road. Then, they refused him summer services so I had to contact the county's child study team supervisor. After that, he was allowed to go. Last year, he finished the pre-school program, and we had to push to get him services for kindergarten. It wasn't until I asked for a behavioral analysis that they relented as far as him participating in a social skills class through the district.I feel like I am forever battling to get them help. It's frustrating and mentally tiring and they are only 4 and 6! I can only imagine what the future will bring in terms of getting them services. =(> > > > ________________________________> From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@...>> > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 2:59:25 PM> Subject: Re: ( ) Opinion> > > Thanks to all the moms that responded. We know something is "not > right", but I was just wondering what other parents thought about my > situation. I know there is a spectrum, but when I mentioned what the > nurse practitioner said to his pre-school teacher, she looked at me > like I had 10 heads. She clearly does not think this is his problem, > but from my experiences with my older son, I know the school is not > always "in tune" with what is going on. I am in the process of trying > to get my younger son tested by the school district, but they are > refusing. It's an upward battle, as I am sure you all know. Neither > of my sons truly meet the DSM-IV criteria for Asperger's, but from what > I have read, only a small percent of the population actually do. > > Thanks again!>

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February 28, 2009

Thanks to all the moms that responded. We know something is " not

right " , but I was just wondering what other parents thought about my

situation. I know there is a spectrum, but when I mentioned what the

nurse practitioner said to his pre-school teacher, she looked at me

like I had 10 heads. She clearly does not think this is his problem,

but from my experiences with my older son, I know the school is not

always " in tune " with what is going on. I am in the process of trying

to get my younger son tested by the school district, but they are

refusing. It's an upward battle, as I am sure you all know. Neither

of my sons truly meet the DSM-IV criteria for Asperger's, but from what

I have read, only a small percent of the population actually do.

Thanks again!

February 28, 2009

I thought the school had to do an evaluation if they parent asked, Roxane what do you think? Can the school get away with this? pj

From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@...> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 2:59:25 PMSubject: Re: ( ) Opinion

Thanks to all the moms that responded. We know something is "not right", but I was just wondering what other parents thought about my situation. I know there is a spectrum, but when I mentioned what the nurse practitioner said to his pre-school teacher, she looked at me like I had 10 heads. She clearly does not think this is his problem, but from my experiences with my older son, I know the school is not always "in tune" with what is going on. I am in the process of trying to get my younger son tested by the school district, but they are refusing. It's an upward battle, as I am sure you all know. Neither of my sons truly meet the DSM-IV criteria for Asperger's, but from what I have read, only a small percent of the population actually do. Thanks again!

February 28, 2009

I even presented the paper work from the doctor. They would not

budge. Then, my husband and I met with the principal. They said

that because the teacher feels that he is functioning in his pre-

school class they do not have to test him.

The town that we live in has an inclusion pre-school. I attempted to

have him tested last year when he turned 3, but I was turned down

then also. I then applied to the program, and they accepted him as a

typically developing child. Basically, his class has 10 " typicals "

and up to 6 children who are classified for one reason or another.

I barely was able to get my older son in to this program. It was not

an easy road. Then, they refused him summer services so I had to

contact the county's child study team supervisor. After that, he was

allowed to go. Last year, he finished the pre-school program, and we

had to push to get him services for kindergarten. It wasn't until I

asked for a behavioral analysis that they relented as far as him

participating in a social skills class through the district.

I feel like I am forever battling to get them help. It's frustrating

and mentally tiring and they are only 4 and 6! I can only imagine

what the future will bring in terms of getting them services. =(

>

> ________________________________

> From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@...>

>

> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 2:59:25 PM

> Subject: Re: ( ) Opinion

>

> Thanks to all the moms that responded. We know something is " not

> right " , but I was just wondering what other parents thought about

my

> situation. I know there is a spectrum, but when I mentioned what

the

> nurse practitioner said to his pre-school teacher, she looked at me

> like I had 10 heads. She clearly does not think this is his

problem,

> but from my experiences with my older son, I know the school is not

> always " in tune " with what is going on. I am in the process of

trying

> to get my younger son tested by the school district, but they are

> refusing. It's an upward battle, as I am sure you all know. Neither

> of my sons truly meet the DSM-IV criteria for Asperger's, but from

what

> I have read, only a small percent of the population actually do.

>

> Thanks again!

>

February 28, 2009

It will seem like an up hill battle for you, but if you don't fight for your kids, no one else will. It was like pulling teeth for me to get help for my child too, he is 18 now and going to graduate in May. I don't understand why the people who run the schools have to give us such a hard time, I guess because they can't relate to our children and some just don't want to. If you can find an advocate to go to the school with you when you have meetings it will help you, even if you just take a friend or family member so you don't feel so alone. Don't let them bully you. If they were in our shoes they would do the same thing. So never feel bad about standing up for your kids, you will feel very proud in later years for what you do for them now. And you will deserve to

feel proud.

From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@...> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 3:19:12 PMSubject: Re: ( ) Opinion

I even presented the paper work from the doctor. They would not budge. Then, my husband and I met with the principal. They said that because the teacher feels that he is functioning in his pre-school class they do not have to test him. The town that we live in has an inclusion pre-school. I attempted to have him tested last year when he turned 3, but I was turned down then also. I then applied to the program, and they accepted him as a typically developing child. Basically, his class has 10 "typicals" and up to 6 children who are classified for one reason or another. I barely was able to get my older son in to this program. It was not an easy road. Then, they refused him summer services so I had to contact the county's child study team supervisor. After that, he was allowed to go. Last year, he finished the pre-school program, and we had to push to get him services for kindergarten. It wasn't

until I asked for a behavioral analysis that they relented as far as him participating in a social skills class through the district.I feel like I am forever battling to get them help. It's frustrating and mentally tiring and they are only 4 and 6! I can only imagine what the future will bring in terms of getting them services. =(> > > > ____________ _________ _________ __> From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@ ...>> > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 2:59:25 PM> Subject: Re: ( ) Opinion> > > Thanks to all the moms that responded. We know something is "not > right", but I was just wondering what other parents thought about my > situation. I know

there is a spectrum, but when I mentioned what the > nurse practitioner said to his pre-school teacher, she looked at me > like I had 10 heads. She clearly does not think this is his problem, > but from my experiences with my older son, I know the school is not > always "in tune" with what is going on. I am in the process of trying > to get my younger son tested by the school district, but they are > refusing. It's an upward battle, as I am sure you all know. Neither > of my sons truly meet the DSM-IV criteria for Asperger's, but from what > I have read, only a small percent of the population actually do. > > Thanks again!>

February 28, 2009

Thank you. I know, and I will continue to fight for them.

Fortunately, I found a very good dev ped who really seems to " get " my

older son. I feel better that my younger son will be seeing him as

well. This doctor has also given us a lot of information about how to

deal with the school. I am in the process of trying to get an

advocate. I really appreciate your advice and support.

How is your son doing now?

February 28, 2009

My son has social problems, and lately trouble relating without a bad temper. We used to have him on Geodon for this problem, took him off it because he takes so much medication, but now realize he needs it so he can get a long with others. He has a giant heart, very caring and loving, always ready to help someone in need. Only has one good friend but doesn't get to see him much. So he is lonely. But we are hanging in there, and try to support him in anyway we can.

From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@...> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 3:30:51 PMSubject: Re: ( ) Opinion

Thank you. I know, and I will continue to fight for them. Fortunately, I found a very good dev ped who really seems to "get" my older son. I feel better that my younger son will be seeing him as well. This doctor has also given us a lot of information about how to deal with the school. I am in the process of trying to get an advocate. I really appreciate your advice and support.How is your son doing now?

February 28, 2009

I think I just clicked as to why I've never pushed for Dylan to get an official diagnosis outside of the school. It's because the school has never argued with me that anything was wrong with my kid (except for that dumb Spec Ed director who said he didn't need to be in Special Ed, but didn't suggest we change anything when everyone in the room looked at her like she was from planet Mars!) I really feel for you guys where the school isn't acknowledging there is a problem. My son more than publicly displayed all sorts of stuff from preschool to present (although it's much better now) so the fact that something is wrong has never been the topic of discussion! Now I understand why some of you feel like getting a medical diagnosis outside of school is important - so you have some validation of what's happening and something to show to school staff.

"Over-optimism is waiting for you ship to come in when you haven't sent one out."

From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@...> Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 3:19:12 PMSubject: Re: ( ) Opinion

I even presented the paper work from the doctor. They would not budge. Then, my husband and I met with the principal. They said that because the teacher feels that he is functioning in his pre-school class they do not have to test him. The town that we live in has an inclusion pre-school. I attempted to have him tested last year when he turned 3, but I was turned down then also. I then applied to the program, and they accepted him as a typically developing child. Basically, his class has 10 "typicals" and up to 6 children who are classified for one reason or another. I barely was able to get my older son in to this program. It was not an easy road. Then, they refused him summer services so I had to contact the county's child study team supervisor. After that, he was allowed to go. Last year, he finished the pre-school program, and we had to push to get him services for kindergarten. It wasn't

until I asked for a behavioral analysis that they relented as far as him participating in a social skills class through the district.I feel like I am forever battling to get them help. It's frustrating and mentally tiring and they are only 4 and 6! I can only imagine what the future will bring in terms of getting them services. =(> > > > ____________ _________ _________ __> From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine@ ...>> > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 2:59:25 PM> Subject: Re: ( ) Opinion> > > Thanks to all the moms that responded. We know something is "not > right", but I was just wondering what other parents thought about my > situation. I know

there is a spectrum, but when I mentioned what the > nurse practitioner said to his pre-school teacher, she looked at me > like I had 10 heads. She clearly does not think this is his problem, > but from my experiences with my older son, I know the school is not > always "in tune" with what is going on. I am in the process of trying > to get my younger son tested by the school district, but they are > refusing. It's an upward battle, as I am sure you all know. Neither > of my sons truly meet the DSM-IV criteria for Asperger's, but from what > I have read, only a small percent of the population actually do. > > Thanks again!>

February 28, 2009

You keep saying pre-school. In Milder cases, it starts showing by age 8-10 as it did by my son who is 9 now. If I wouldn't be so in tune with his issues, I would not notice it on my now 4 year old.

February 28, 2009

I adopted my son at age 10...he already had a diagnosis of ODD, ADHD,

Developmental Delay, PTSD...okay...he fit all of those; however, he

has behavior that fits AS which I feel is his primary diagnosis. I

feel this was missed due to his living in more than 8 foster homes

before his coming to live with us.

He had an IEP at school since he was in Kindergarten under the

category of Emotional Disturbance. I am having the most difficult

time having the category changed to Autism. I know he has AS and fits

the DSM IV criteria; however, the school did reevaluate him and will

not change his eligibility criteria...my thinking is because the

school district does not have to offer him certain services under the

ED category.

My son has calmed down quite a bit since his adoption. Where he was

always sent home or in some sort of trouble at school on a regular

basis, he is now able to attend school with regularity without getting

into any serious trouble and can even take the bus after school and

walk home from the bus stop...something that would never have taken

place a year ago.

My son is still " active but odd, " for he's socially awkward to say the

least and does not realize his not fitting in. I believe his major

problem dealing with stressful situations is his AS. When life has

predictability his symptoms diminish...if something is stressful to

him such as a large crowd or new situation...his actions become very

much autistic like.

I went to an IEP workshop and now can utilize an IEP advocate whom

wants to meet with him. I hope she can help me change the criteria

diagnosis which is important to me because emotional disturbance to me

is so broad I feel it can affect how he is dealt with as he ages or

even when he goes to college.

February 28, 2009

>

> You keep saying pre-school. In Milder cases, it starts showing by

age 8-10 as it did by my son who is 9 now. If I wouldn't be so in tune

with his issues, I would not notice it on my now 4 year old.

>

Most of the parents I know have said that they started seeing issues

very early on. To clarify, I have one son in kindergarten who

officially has a PDD-NOS diagnosis, but the MD said that as he matures

it appears that it is probably Asperger's. My younger son is in

pre-school and we are seeing some troubling signs with him as well,

but he does not presently have a diagnosis.

February 28, 2009

My son has social problems, and lately trouble relating without a bad temper. We used to have him on Geodon for this problem, took him off it because he takes so much medication, but now realize he needs it so he can get a long with others. He has a giant heart, very caring and loving, always ready to help someone in need. Only has one good friend but doesn't get to see him much. So he is lonely. But we are hanging in there, and try to support him in anyway we can.

From: jimandjeanine <jimandjeanine > Sent: Saturday, February 28, 2009 3:30:51 PMSubject: Re: ( ) Opinion

Thank you. I know, and I will continue to fight for them. Fortunately, I found a very good dev ped who really seems to "get" my older son. I feel better that my younger son will be seeing him as well. This doctor has also given us a lot of information about how to deal with the school. I am in the process of trying to get an advocate. I really appreciate your advice and support.How is your son doing now?

____________________________________________________________

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March 1, 2009

Actually, the catagory in which he qualifies for special ed (IEP)

does not make any difference in the services he is eligible for. The

criteria for eligiblity of services is based on whether or not he has

a need. What I mean is this: My son has an IEP under the catagory

of EBD (emotional/behavioral disturbance). He had a mild speech

problem. They tested him and found he met the criteria (mildly) for

speech therapy so he recieved speech services. His testing with the

doctors showed a mild motor skills problem. However, he does not

meet the criteria for OT through the school because his deficiency is

mild. He does however have some scripting accomodation in his IEP.

If there is an area in which your son is deficient and needs services

then you should push for the testing to be done and services to be

provided but there are no " automatic " services that come as a result

of a certain catagory.

Also, my son's special ed teacher told me a story recently that I

found interesting. She had a student that was receiving extra

services in Math. When he was initially tested he did not meet the

criteria for reading deficiency. So he was recieve extra help in the

main classroom for reading but going to special ed for math help.

Well the parents wanted him in special ed for reading also and

insisted that they retest him to see if he now qualified. Well it

turned out that he still did not qualify and also no longer met the

criteria for math deficency. So now he must do math in the

mainstream classroom also. Obviously this is a uncommon situation

but my point is simply that if your son is getting what he needs from

the school than be happy for that. If he isn't then fight for the

help he needs. But don't lose sight of the goal just because of a

different lable. Because anytime you require the school to re-test

there is always the chance (especially if your child is borderline)

that they could test out of special ed altogether.

I guess my only point in this long winded reply is that the catagory

isn't important the quality of his eduacation and the services is the

part to focus on.

Vickie

>

> I adopted my son at age 10...he already had a diagnosis of ODD,

ADHD,

> Developmental Delay, PTSD...okay...he fit all of those; however, he

> has behavior that fits AS which I feel is his primary diagnosis. I

> feel this was missed due to his living in more than 8 foster homes

> before his coming to live with us.

>

> He had an IEP at school since he was in Kindergarten under the

> category of Emotional Disturbance. I am having the most difficult

> time having the category changed to Autism. I know he has AS and

fits

> the DSM IV criteria; however, the school did reevaluate him and will

> not change his eligibility criteria...my thinking is because the

> school district does not have to offer him certain services under

the

> ED category.

>

> My son has calmed down quite a bit since his adoption. Where he was

> always sent home or in some sort of trouble at school on a regular

> basis, he is now able to attend school with regularity without

getting

> into any serious trouble and can even take the bus after school and

> walk home from the bus stop...something that would never have taken

> place a year ago.

>

> My son is still " active but odd, " for he's socially awkward to say

the

> least and does not realize his not fitting in. I believe his major

> problem dealing with stressful situations is his AS. When life has

> predictability his symptoms diminish...if something is stressful to

> him such as a large crowd or new situation...his actions become very

> much autistic like.

>

> I went to an IEP workshop and now can utilize an IEP advocate whom

> wants to meet with him. I hope she can help me change the criteria

> diagnosis which is important to me because emotional disturbance to

me

> is so broad I feel it can affect how he is dealt with as he ages or

> even when he goes to college.

>

March 1, 2009

>

> I guess my only point in this long winded reply is that the catagory

> isn't important the quality of his education and the services is the

> part to focus on.

The thing is, if they have the dx wrong and thus the category wrong,

they may misinterpret his needs. For example, if a student is

categorized as ED, his communication or sensory breakdowns may well be

interpreted as defiance. He may not ever get intervention for

communication or sensory overload strategies. Also, at least in my

state, being classified as autism opens up additional evaluations that

have to be done that are only done for autistic students since they

only apply to autism. So, if a student is classified as ED, he will

miss out on these extra evaluations. Yes, theoretically, he should

have them if the need is there, but if nobody from the autism team

ever sees him the need will never be realized.

Ruth

March 1, 2009

Yes...for certain things; however, I feel my son has learning disabilities and because of the category...the school does not have to do any tests...even though he is way behind in math...and his writing looks like chicken scratch...and he cannot take a test to save his life...among other things. This came from the school psychologist..quoting state law. Also...the category of Emotional Disturbance can be misleading--especially if there are other factors...as Aspergers. AS in and of itself leads to odd social behavior especially in situations that are uncomfortable or too stimulating. He was miscategorized as ED when he was a foster child--he never stayed in one home long enough to have a foster parent advocate for him...also his life was always turned upside down...not good for an Aspie.Also, I was told (special ed

expert) this category can lead to serious discipline if the child gets into trouble in school--especially when he reaches the higher grades, and it will follow him to college...There's a red flag for college police. I feel this is an unfair category for my son...It's like calling someone drunk when they have cerebral palsey. Without the correct diagnosis...intervention, resources, and teaching strategies are hindered...they my help but if the correct intervention matches his diagnosis...then it would be that much more beneficial. When taking the IEP workshop...those in the know agreed that if he meets criteria for Autism...then he should be in that category. Also, my son is mainstreamed 75% of the day. He is not unintelligent--just doesn't know how to test and regurgitate information in the traditional way...hence the need for testing.At my request, they did agree to provide my son with OT (due to his

deficit in his fine motor skills--something he never received before); however, the school district at this time does not have an OT due to budget cuts.From: Vickie Boehnlein <baneline1@...>Subject: Re: ( ) Opinion Date: Sunday, March 1, 2009, 7:51 PM