Re: Irony of Chemicals: Friend and Foe Alike

[Guest guest]

Yes, I completely agree.

This remnds me of something I was just reading about. I was wondering

about the miraculous properties mold has in protecting people from the

vastly magnfied effects of toxins coating inhaled particulates.

Did you know, in the US at least, for the last eight years at least,

mold conveys scientific immunity!?

In the pharmaceutical industry, nanoparticles are being heralded as a

miraculous was to get drugs through the blood brain barrier, where

they become hundreds or even thousands of times more powerful. A

PubMed search on inhalation and the blood brain barrier brings up

literally hundreds of papers on how lipid-soluable drugs can be

nanoparticulated and inhaled and sent directly to the brain.

Very few on mold. BUT-Papers exist on everything else, includng the

best vehicle, carbon nanoparticles. This is the subject of a big buzz

in the drugmaking field. Lots of patents are being granted. Drugs can

be mixed with a liquid carrer and sprayed into the nose.. where they

effect the brain VERY rapidly. Without effects elsewhere n the body.

*It seems that mold partcles, by virtue of the absence of similar

papers, must convey some immunity! *

Except for a few papers that say things like " If you attach

macrocyclic trichothecene mycotoxins to submicron particles, they must

go directly into the brain if inhaled. " (Sort of like the

mycotoxin-laden polysaccharide matrix produced by stachybotrys to

protect the spores.)

On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 1:52 AM, Carl E. Grimes <grimes@...> wrote:

> As many of you know I have opinions...

[Guest guest]

Aside from major organ damage and chronic fatigue, I never had a cold

for at least 8 years after my mold exposure. I'll take the colds.

Barth

www.presenting.net/sbs/sbs.html

SUBMIT YOUR DOCTOR: www.presenting.net/sbs/molddoctors.html

---

Live wrote:

L> Yes, I completely agree.

L> This remnds me of something I was just reading about. I was wondering

L> about the miraculous properties mold has in protecting people from the

[Guest guest]

Ill have to go back and read the original post but I have not either. That is

because your immune system is in turbo drive if I am not mistaken...

    

 

 

 

 

 

 

   

       

From: Patilla DaHun <glypella@...>

Subject: Re: [] Re: Irony of Chemicals: Friend and Foe Alike

" LiveSimply " < >

Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 9:20 PM

Aside from major organ damage and chronic fatigue, I never had a cold

for at least 8 years after my mold exposure. I'll take the colds.

Barth

[Guest guest]

& Particia,

That was my experience also. When I was at my worst I never

had a cold or the flu. I remember years later after I was slowly

improving when I got the flu and celebrated it! The flu or a bad

cold is worse but short-lived, lasting days not months and years

like the other.

I wonder if others have also experienced this?

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitatis LLC

-----

>

> Ill have to go back and read the original post but I have not either. That is

because your immune system is in

> turbo drive if I am not mistaken...

>

>

>

>

>

> From: Patilla DaHun <glypella@...>

> Subject: Re: [] Re: Irony of Chemicals: Friend and Foe Alike

> " LiveSimply " <groups (DOT) com>

> Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 9:20 PM

>

> Aside from major organ damage and chronic fatigue, I never had a cold

> for at least 8 years after my mold exposure. I'll take the colds.

>

> Barth

>

>

[Guest guest]

I'm sorry. Actually, I was trying to make a joke. Maybe I didn't make

it clear enough. I meant that if everything else is stronger

intranasally applied, mold is too... but it seems as if precious

little research is being done on this important part of the picture on

indoor mold.

I was looking at papers on PubMed on something completely different,

eye diseases, and I started seeing papers on pharmacokinetics (Google

it) of xenobiotics (anything that isn't naturally found in the body,

like drugs, also toxins) that are inhaled - ( " intranasal application " )

There must be literally hundreds of papers there exploring various

commercial applications of the " intranasal " pathway across the blood

brain barrier into the brain.. They paint a distressing picture

because much of this research must also apply to mold, but it isn't

being considered..

The nose seems to have the ability to absorb microparticles and carry

them directly into the brain, bypassing the blood brain barrier.

Thats what I was getting at..

On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 9:20 PM, Patilla DaHun <glypella@...> wrote:

> Aside from major organ damage and chronic fatigue, I never had a cold

> for at least 8 years after my mold exposure. I'll take the colds.

>

> Barth

>

> www.presenting.net/sbs/sbs.html

>

[Guest guest]

I think I had my first cold about 3 weeks ago, it was amazeing to

blow my nose and have snot. lol's, seriously, I never would have

thought I'd be happy about getting a cold. I took it as a good sign.

--- In , " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...>

wrote:

>

> & Particia,

>

> That was my experience also. When I was at my worst I never

> had a cold or the flu. I remember years later after I was slowly

> improving when I got the flu and celebrated it! The flu or a bad

> cold is worse but short-lived, lasting days not months and years

> like the other.

>

> I wonder if others have also experienced this?

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitatis LLC

[Guest guest]

I'd like to see this as a research question, figuring out why this

happens. We are used to thinking that we have a compromised

immune system. But if that were true I think we would have colds

and flu all the time, perhaps at life threatening levels. Instead, we

(at least some of us) don't get them at all. So maybe we have a

sporadic immune system, or one that's " confused? "

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

> I think I had my first cold about 3 weeks ago, it was amazeing to

> blow my nose and have snot. lol's, seriously, I never would have

> thought I'd be happy about getting a cold. I took it as a good sign.

>

>

> >

> > & Particia,

> >

> > That was my experience also. When I was at my worst I never

> > had a cold or the flu. I remember years later after I was slowly

> > improving when I got the flu and celebrated it! The flu or a bad

> > cold is worse but short-lived, lasting days not months and years

> > like the other.

> >

> > I wonder if others have also experienced this?

> >

> > Carl Grimes

> > Healthy Habitatis LLC

>

>

[Guest guest]

Carl and others, This has been my experience also. I felt terrible,

exhausted all the time, but I never had a cold or the flu. Stopped

taking the flu vaccine. I figured my adrenaline system was ramped

up, because I had trouble sleeping also. My somnologist agreed, that

since I did not do well on antidepressants, but did well on anxiety

medicine, that it must be anxiety. He said I was " too up " , not

down. It seemed unlikely, with lack of rest, I would be resistent to

the flu though but I finally tied them together, and figured the high

adrenaline that was keeping me up at night, must be keeping my immune

system ramped up also. Then my somnologist retired and a new doctor

took over for him, and he would not write me an rx for benzos for me,

and put me an antidepressants, despite previous doctors notes and

excellent repuation, and I couldn't sleep again and also the

antidepressant he put me on had the side affect of depressing my

immune system, then I **REALLY** got sick!!!!

Lack of rest plus a medicine that was suppressing my immune system,

in a house with visible mold in basement, basement that was air leaky

to rest of house. (I didn't know of spores that flew or floated

around in the air back then, just thought it was on wall - I had so

much to learn). I tested positive to Epstein Bar Virus on the same

day imaging done at same hospital showed a small mass in my pelvic

area that turned out to be early stage cancer. That was 2004.

And now, me also, I got the flu this fall for first time in maybe 7-8

years, then larnygititis for Christmas. I told someone it reminded

me of when I was a kid. I always had a cold for Christmas when I was

a kid, with all the running around and out in the snow, etc. I

hadn't quite thought of it as a good sign though until I saw this

discussion. Maybe it is good sign for me too. I hope so!! Thanks

to whoever brought this up.

--- In , " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...>

wrote:

>

> & Particia,

>

> That was my experience also. When I was at my worst I never

> had a cold or the flu.

[Guest guest]

Maybe the immune system is charged up due to the threat of mold or

mold toxins or bacteria toxin, what have you, but not enough to

protect against the mold or resolve the mold/fungus issue, if it is

present all the time; but the flu and cold bug since it is not

present all the time, is easy to throw off with the immune system so

charged up. Maybe hard for doctor or scientist to detect what immune system is

fighting since it has been said that fungus and it's infection is so similar to

our own cells, so doctors think our immune system is charged up for " nothing " ,

no reason because they don't see or don't investigate molds and fungal illness,

so they say immune system is fighting with " healthy tissue " , i.e. autoimmune,

etc, when in fact there is a pathogen there, just not identified one. For a

long time ulcers were believed to be stress related, until someone discovered H

Pylori bacteria there and killed that and ulcers disappeared. Now they have

discovered cervical cancer is caused by a virus and have a vaccination for that

virus to protect women from cervical cancer. If they don't know what it is,

they make up stuff..you know, they always have to have an answer, even if it is

the wrong one. One popular answer though, is it is all in your head.

The flu germ, you come in contact with it and then it is in your body

but not usually in your environment, so your body is just working on

it internally, to get rid of it; but with mold/fungus, it gets

internal but different in that it will always also be in environment,

in some quantity so harder to fight internally, if constantly in

contact with fresh pathogens from outside also, so immune system is

always on 'high'. I'm not sure I explained what I was thinking well,

but if I am in as mold-free environment as possible, my immune

system starts to act more normal. At least, I notice I am much more

relaxed and even sleep better as I have improved my environment, so

I've made the connection myself to sleeping better, with cleaner

environment. It makes a huge difference. I would have never thought

before cleaner air, sleep better. I used to think, darker room, more

comfortable mattress, less noise, etc, but I've noticed good sleepers

can sleep in the middle of alot of noise and in uncomfortable

positions so there are other things at play.

I think another reason fungal issues are hard to notice is that bacterial

infections usually very visual, red, swollen, freq fever; but fungal I get

impression freq, except for most advanced cases, no fever and not obvious

swelling or inflamation. Person may 'feel' inflamation as pain, etc, but not

seen I believe on imaging or with eye, at least earlier stages where it affects

you but nobody can see what is bothering you on tests or imaging, etc. IF they

bother to do tests rather than blow you off totally.

--- In , " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...>

wrote:

>

> I'd like to see this as a research question, figuring out why this

> happens. We are used to thinking that we have a compromised

> immune system.

[Guest guest]

It is kind of strange, my family passed around this cold and I didn't

think I would get it but I think thats what it was, but mine wasn't

near as bad or lasted as long as everone else who had it. I can see

how while exposed our immune systems would just be going haywire.

and after exposire with the chemical sensitivity. maybe it causes our

immune system to either be over active or not active enough and never

just norma; mode like it should be. like Barb, I am either in a can't

sleep easily aggervated state or in a state of compleatly felling so

tired and drained I just want to sleep and have a lack of reaction

when I should have. it's like my brain has no control over how I

should react to things but something else does, like my environment

and it's not just chemicals but also electrical frequencies. I think

some people dont realize how much the damage to our cells and loss of

our bodies own natural resistance may be affecting us.

--- In , " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...>

wrote:

>

> I'd like to see this as a research question, figuring out why this

> happens.

[Guest guest]

Carl, Not havein the best of days today but I will go back through my paperwork.

Shoemaker told me exactly why. Its got to do with our MSH, C4a and other

cytokine..... See I have to look it up. But he did explain it to me and it makes

complete sence. Ill get back..

 

Chris...

    

 

 

 

 

 

 

   

       

From: Carl E. Grimes <grimes@...>

Subject: Re: [] Re: Irony of Chemicals: Friend and Foe Alike

Date: Wednesday, January 7, 2009, 3:11 PM

I'd like to see this as a research question, figuring out why this

happens. We are used to thinking that we have a compromised

immune system. But if that were true I think we would have colds

and flu all the time, perhaps at life threatening levels. Instead, we

(at least some of us) don't get them at all. So maybe we have a

sporadic immune system, or one that's " confused? "

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

> I think I had my first cold about 3 weeks ago, it was amazeing to

> blow my nose and have snot. lol's, seriously, I never would have

> thought I'd be happy about getting a cold. I took it as a good sign.

>

>

> >

> > & Particia,

> >

> > That was my experience also. When I was at my worst I never

> > had a cold or the flu. I remember years later after I was slowly

> > improving when I got the flu and celebrated it! The flu or a bad

> > cold is worse but short-lived, lasting days not months and years

> > like the other.

> >

> > I wonder if others have also experienced this?

> >

> > Carl Grimes

> > Healthy Habitatis LLC

>

>

[Guest guest]

I remembering last summer, I celebrated having a " normal " allergy

attack (you know itchy, watery eyes, sneezing)... Since my exposure I

hadn't had any allergies like that for about five or six years, I

guess but still haven't had a cold or flu but I never got the flu

much before being exposed.

I like that " sporadic immune system " instead of commpromised immune

system.... sounds better to me too.

Dana

--- In , Patilla DaHun <glypella@...>

wrote:

>

> I like " spore-addict " immune system better. LOL.

>

> Barth

>

[Guest guest]

I am amazed at this conversation, I too have no " snot " !

(Sorry) In the year before I got really ill I could not catch a flu

or cold. Since I have been ill this last year I have had two minor

colds lasting maybe 3 days whilst everyone else in the household is

down in out for over a week with quite a serious cold.

[Guest guest]

Barb do you feel that your pre-cancerous mass has anything to do

with your moldy environment? I ask because in 2003 I was dx with

stage 2b cervical cancer, treated with radiation/chemotherapy. Have

been successful in staying cancer-free-although shingles, allergies,

b12 deficient,graves disease, latent celiac since then. If our

immune system is hyper-active against colds and flues is this

overactivity causing me to be ill?

[Guest guest]

Count me in too. No colds or flu until I got better. Herpes of any

kind (I think) gets worse when exposed too.

>

> & Particia,

>

> That was my experience also.

[Guest guest]

--- In , LiveSimply <quackadillian@...>

wrote:

>

> There must be literally hundreds of papers there exploring various

> commercial applications of the " intranasal " pathway across the blood

> brain barrier into the brain.. They paint a distressing picture

> because much of this research must also apply to mold, but it isn't

> being considered..

>

> The nose seems to have the ability to absorb microparticles and

carry them directly into the brain, bypassing the blood brain barrier.

>

This is exactly what I am experimenting with using ionic silver water

as a nasal rinse. It ought to help heal up the bad pathways. It

certainly helps with the fungal infection thing.

[Guest guest]

Carl,

If you have a compromised immune system, you don't get the

inflammatory response to many pathogens.

They just infect you.. Often very badly. This applies to fungi very

substantially.

OFTEN the tests that in normal people accurately measures the immune

response doesn't register an infection..

Not because someone is not infected, its because after years of

fighting sometimes four or five infections on top of one another,

(Someone on a CFS site that I read said a new comorbid infection every

two or three years)

They each make it easier for the next ones, and a person's immune

response is too weak to show the response.

This is a political issue because they CAN be cured.. It takes

testing, time and money

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 3:11 PM, Carl E. Grimes <grimes@...> wrote:

> I'd like to see this as a research question, figuring out why this

> happens. We are used to thinking that we have a compromised

> immune system. But if that were true I think we would have colds

> and flu all the time, perhaps at life threatening levels. Instead,

[Guest guest]

Definately I believe the cancer could have been caused by the mold

exposure. I sent a sample of tissue to Dr Croft of WI to look at and

he said the cell structure very definately consistent with tricothecene

toxins, also found in my urine at the time, whereas last urine test

there was none (4 years later). I had shingles also. I test allergic

to almost everything tested in regular allergy clinic, standard allergy

tests. I had 'wheels' all over my arms. Doctor said " wow, I can't

believe you didn't realize you had all these allergies " . I just

experienced fatigue. I didn't sneeze. I don't think the overactivity

would cause you to be ill, but I think it could cause you to be

TIRED!!

>

> Barb do you feel that your pre-cancerous mass has anything to do

> with your moldy environment? I ask because in 2003 I was dx with

> stage 2b cervical cancer, treated with radiation/chemotherapy. Have

> been successful in staying cancer-free-although shingles, allergies,

> b12 deficient,graves disease, latent celiac since then. If our

> immune system is hyper-active against colds and flues is this

> overactivity causing me to be ill?

>

[Guest guest]

That would be consistent with my history. I tested positive to Epstein

Bar Virus, at that time, which is the herpes family - chronic form of

mono, later had another version of the herpes virus, Shingles.

--- In , " kl_clayton " <kl_clayton@...>

wrote:

>

> Count me in too. No colds or flu until I got better. Herpes of any

> kind (I think) gets worse when exposed too.

[Guest guest]

I get those painful white tiny tongue pimples and had a very bad case this

year. Take Lysine daily for that. Also...colloidal silver does help

avert viral attacks.

Barth

---

k> Count me in too. No colds or flu until I got better. Herpes of any

k> kind (I think) gets worse when exposed too.

k>

>>

>> & Particia,

>>

>> That was my experience also.

[Guest guest]

I swear by colloidal silver nasal spray.

Barth

---

k> This is exactly what I am experimenting with using ionic silver water

k> as a nasal rinse. It ought to help heal up the bad pathways. It

k> certainly helps with the fungal infection thing.

[Guest guest]

my grandson had sores while they were lining in my first moldy home,

the doctors couldn't figure out what they were and ended up calling

them herpies. they went away after they moned out. when he came to

visit one day at my second moldy home they quickly came back. so I

agree that mold exposure causes these sores, but I dont know if they

are really herpies, but it was pretty obvious to me that his exposure

to molds was causeing this.

> >

> > Count me in too. No colds or flu until I got better. Herpes of any

> > kind (I think) gets worse when exposed too.

>

[Guest guest]

KL, please be careful with that, sometimes to much of a good thing

can be bad. I had several cysy type things in my sinuses, they got

aggervated very easy and made me ill, I washed my sinus everytime I

felt them getting aggervated and several times a day to keep them

from getting aggervated. now I have been able to finally cut back on

wshing my sinuses, I think I lept them clean enough that they

somewhat held or something. they aren't gone because they still can

act up but I think keeping my sinuses very clean for a period of time

has helped with some level of healing in my sinuses. knock on wood, I

haven't felt that raw intence, hurt to breath felling for awhile now.

> >

> > There must be literally hundreds of papers there exploring various

> > commercial applications of the " intranasal " pathway across the

blood

> > brain barrier into the brain.. They paint a distressing picture

> > because much of this research must also apply to mold, but it

isn't

> > being considered..

> >

> > The nose seems to have the ability to absorb microparticles and

> carry them directly into the brain, bypassing the blood brain

barrier.

> >

>

>

> This is exactly what I am experimenting with using ionic silver

water

> as a nasal rinse. It ought to help heal up the bad pathways. It

> certainly helps with the fungal infection thing.

>

[Guest guest]

The sores are NOT herpes. These sores are fungal. (Herpes sores are caused by

a virus not a fungus.) Two of my family members also had these sores after our

exposure to toxic mold in our house. The sores were cultured (more than once)

and each time the lab just said " fungal in nature " but they couldn't identify

which fungus. I think they knew which fungus but they didn't want to admit it

because of the pressure from the insurance industry to hide the truth about the

effects of toxic mold.

________________________________

From: who <jeaninem660@...>

Sent: Friday, January 9, 2009 6:47:58 AM

Subject: [] Re: Irony of Chemicals: Friend and Foe Alike

my grandson had sores while they were lining in my first moldy home,

the doctors couldn't figure out what they were and ended up calling

them herpies. they went away after they moned out. when he came to

visit one day at my second moldy home they quickly came back. so I

agree that mold exposure causes these sores, but I dont know if they

are really herpies, but it was pretty obvious to me that his exposure

to molds was causeing this.

> >

> > Count me in too. No colds or flu until I got better. Herpes of any

> > kind (I think) gets worse when exposed too.

>

[Guest guest]

I was told I had herpes too after my exposure and was given valtrex

(didn't work and only made me sick). All this time I thought it was

herpes! I thought something was strange because I never had these

sores until I got exposed but never put 2 & 2 together but it makes

perfect since!

--- In , <brianc8452@...>

wrote:

>

> The sores are NOT herpes. These sores are fungal. (Herpes sores

are caused by a virus not a fungus.) Two of my family members also

had these sores after our exposure to toxic mold in our house. The

sores were cultured (more than once) and each time the lab just

said " fungal in nature " but they couldn't identify which fungus. I

think they knew which fungus but they didn't want to admit it