Re: further exploration of high vit D cautions

[Guest guest]

thanks Lynn definitely food for thought. At least for

those who have signs of chronic fatigue, fibromyalgia

or autoimmune diseases.

Madeleen

--- Lynn wrote:

>

> This is a much easier explanation of the article

> Madeleen posted the

> link to for anyone

> interested in further exploration.

> Can't comment on what I think of this as I'm also

> doing well on higher

> doses of vit D

> but this is fuel for thought/

> Lynn

>

>

>

> ImmuneSupport.com Treatment & Research Information

>

> A Journey Towards Complete Recovery from Chronic

> Fatigue Syndrome: The

> Story of My Progress on the Marshall Protocol

> ImmuneSupport.com

>

> 07-25-2005 By Amy Proal

> Amy Proal is a recent graduate of town

> University with a B.A.

> degree in Biology. She wrote her Senior Thesis on

> Chronic Fatigue

> Syndrome. Also a columnist for Fibromyalgia AWARE

> Magazine, she writes

> often about her battle with CFS and FMS.

>

> Last year during the Christmas holidays my body did

> not cooperate with

> my festive state of mind. Instead of decorating the

> tree or taking a

> walk in the snow, I found myself lying listlessly on

> the couch,

> suffering yet another relapse of my worst CFS

> symptoms. A series of

> extensive blood tests confirmed the fact that my

> body was far from

> functioning properly. At only age 23, I had hormone

> levels lower than

> post-menopausal women. Despite the fact that I was

> on four strong

> antifungal drugs, my digestive system was overtaken

> by Candida. My

> stomach was barely able to tolerate any food besides

> chicken and rice.

>

> Since I've suffered from severe CFS for at least

> three years, I

> wasn't surprised to find myself nearly bedridden yet

> again. Luckily,

> my doctor is one of the top CFS specialists in the

> country. I contacted

> him about my negative circumstances, expecting him

> to adjust my

> supplements or pain medicines. Instead, he wrote

> back a single sentence

> that has since drastically altered my health and

> most likely my entire

> life. He urged me to " try the Marshall Protocol. "

>

> Attached to the e-mail was a list of instructions

> with the title

> " Phase 1 guidelines. " I read them slowly, realizing

> with growing

> excitement that a treatment called the Marshall

> Protocol (MP) had been

> developed with the potential to actually CURE my

> illness, not just mask

> my symptoms.

>

> The MP, created by researcher Trevor Marshall,

> Ph.D., is based on the

> idea that CFS and many other chronic diseases

> (termed Th1 illnesses,

> including fibromyalgia, lupus, and rheumatoid

> arthritis), are caused

> when certain individuals accumulate large amounts of

> bacteria that have

> mutated and lost their cell walls. Because of this

> mutation, antibiotics

> are unable to kill them directly. Unlike other forms

> of bacteria, cell

> wall deficient (CWD) bacteria have also developed

> the ability to remain

> alive and proliferate undetected inside the very

> cells of the immune

> system that the body uses to kill invading

> pathogens, allowing them to

> generate a wide array of painful symptoms.

>

> The MP was first created to treat sarcoidosis, an

> illness from which Dr.

> Marshall himself suffered. After making several key

> discoveries about

> CWD bacteria, Marshall developed and fine-tuned a

> treatment plan aimed

> at slowly killing these pathogens. In 2002 a group

> of sarcoidosis

> patients began this novel course of therapy.

> Eventually, all of these

> first patients on the Protocol obtained complete

> symptomatic remission

> and remain healthy to this day. This marked the

> first time a group of

> patients has ever recovered from sarcoidosis.

>

> Once news spread that the MP had successfully killed

> the strains of CWD

> bacteria involved in causing sarcoidosis, several

> people with other Th1

> illnesses believed to be caused by different species

> of CWD bacteria

> decided to begin the Protocol as well. Since the MP

> slowly kills CWD

> bacteria, patients start to heal gradually over an

> extended period of

> time. The Protocol takes from 1 year to 18 months to

> induce symptomatic

> remission. However, once on the MP, patients begin

> to notice

> improvements little by little.

>

> As Dr. Marshall's research team likes to say,

> " Healing creeps up

> on you, just like the disease did. " Due to the long

> recovery period,

> no patient with CFS or any other Th1 illness besides

> sarcoidosis has

> been on the Protocol long enough to fully recover.

> However, patients

> with other Th1 illnesses are showing identical

> responses to the

> medicines used by the MP as the original sarcoidosis

> patients who were

> cured, a very positive sign they too will end up as

> healthy as the first

> group who finished the Protocol.

>

> The science behind the MP is complex, but before I

> continue telling you

> my own story please bear with me while I quickly

> describe a few basic

> concepts which help explain how the medicines used

> by the MP are able to

> target CWD bacteria. First, it is critical to

> realize that CWD bacteria

> are strongly influenced by Vitamin D. The body

> obtains forms of this

> vitamin from three sources: sunlight, artificial

> light that enters the

> eye, and foods that contain Vitamin D. One of the

> most exciting aspects

> of the MP is the fact that people who suspect they

> suffer from a Th1

> illness can actually take a simple blood test which

> may suggest the

> presence of CWD bacteria.

>

> Marshall discovered that once inside a cell, CWD

> bacteria activate an

> inflammatory pathway that is responsible for

> generating many of the

> painful symptoms of Th1 diseases. One of the major

> molecules involved in

> this pathway is 1,25D, an activated form of Vitamin

> D that functions as

> a hormone. Once inside a cell, CWD bacteria convert

> the regular form of

> Vitamin D (termed 25D) into 1,25D at a much higher

> rate than in healthy

> cells. Thus blood tests reveal that patients with

> Th1 diseases tend to

> display much higher levels of 1,25D than their

> healthy counterparts.

>

> Marshall also came across a drug called Benicar.

> Originally created to

> lower blood pressure, it also has the ability to

> lower levels of 1,25D.

> Thus, when patients take Benicar and also strive to

> lower Vitamin D

> levels by avoiding sunlight and bright lights, they

> are able to

> effectively disrupt the inflammatory pathway

> responsible for many of

> their painful symptoms.

>

> Once the inflammation around a cell has been

> reduced, antibiotics are

> finally able to penetrate the cellular environment

> and come in direct

> contact with CWD bacteria inside. Although

> antibiotics are not able to

> kill the pathogens directly, they are able to

> greatly weaken the

> bacteria by blocking the production of bacterial

> proteins. This allows

> the body's own immune system to recognize the

> weakened pathogens and

>

=== message truncated ===

________________________________________________________________________________\

____

Be a better friend, newshound, and

know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.

http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ

[Guest guest]

This article makes me wonder about a few things:

How does this fit together with the morphing theory about bacteria, viruses

and fungus infections and how they are all the same thing, but change from

one to the other with pH changes in the host — too acid or too alkaline.

Alternative orthodoxy says there is only one problem, too acid, and so all

humans need to eat a vegetarian alkalizing diet.

The protocol is entirely focused on the disease and not the condition of the

host. It may be a life saving intervention, but research should be done on

what makes the host, a good host.

I have been working to better understand autonomic nervous system dominance,

pH and metabolic diversity. It sounds like the people on this protocol are

the ones who may be parasympathetic dominant (I am). From what I have

studied, this group is susceptible to CFS, autoimmune problems because the

‘rest and digest’ side of the nervous system (includes immune system) is

stronger then the ‘fight and Flight’ side of the autonomic nervous system.

According to the theory, people who are para dominant typically have

ancestors who come from more northern latitudes than people who are more

balanced or who’s dominance is reversed. MS and many other autoimmune

diseases are more prevalent in northern latitudes with less sun.

This leads to chicken and egg problems. Does the low sun (lack of vit D)

lead to the diseases, or do the host’s genetic adaptations to low sun

conditions lead to the diseases?

Personal experiences:

My ancestors are from above the artic circle and didn’t get a lot of

sunlight in the winter, and also would have gotten their vit D mainly from

fish. I get rashes from the sun each spring for about 3 weeks until I adjust

(a friend calls me a ghoul). I take small amounts of topical Vit D, and fish

oils to keep the flu at bay over the winter (it works).

I have a history of mild chemical sensitivity that I was lucky enough to

catch early before going into full blown CSD. When a friend of mind did go

into full blown CSD, I recognized many of her symptoms, and realized that

not being able to stay in shopping malls long because of nausea was NOT a

psychological problem.

Since then I have made friends with a variety of people who have various

auto immune diseases. Many of them have tried to survive on a ‘healthy’ diet

low in fat, protein and high in carbs (7-10 fruits and veggies per day, no

red meat) or even vegan diets. Haven’t seen any of these people I suspect

share a parasympathetic dominance, do well on those diets, whereas some

others do very well.

I think it must be more complex than just a type of vitamin D = bad.

However if the multi-year antibiotic intervention creates significant

improvements, who would argue. Bet it is not a real cure though. I

haven’t read anything about what makes a ‘good host’ for the treated

diseases to begin with, in order to avoid going back to the same state once

treatment is complete.

These people may need the antibiotic intervention for the rest of their

lives. Sounds like they don’t have enough long term data to know.

Karima

thanks Lynn definitely food for thought. At least for those who have signs

of chronic fatigue, fibromyalgia or autoimmune diseases.

Madeleen

--- Lynn <lyn122@... <mailto:lyn122%40yahoo.com> > wrote:

[Guest guest]

> I think it must be more complex than just a type of vitamin D = bad.

>

>

Karima...Exactly! Now to put all the pieces together for what works

well for each person individual biochemistry.

Thanks for the part about the condition of the host....I do think

that's a key.

Lynn