Re: What was your breaking point?

[Guest guest]

Thanks all for your posts and the ones i didnt get to answer

individually. I feel a *bit* more like a whole person now. The broken

foot thing was not all the horrible really it wasnt. Because it was

such a revelation. And made me a better stronger person because of

it. Otherwise i might even still be enmeshed in her sick world

somehow.

C

I allways knew she was sick. Just never ever remember ever having

the desire to be held by her, nor did i miss her presense. age six or

so during aone of her severest of beatings I realized she was a three

year old trapped in an adults body. Age ten or so I KNEW I was being

abused - but didn't think i had a right to complain as relatives and

family members " looked the other way " whenever problems were so

obvious. I ran away several times. Once i was on the phone calling

cops but she droved up out of nowhere. She was then nice and rational

for two days. When she held a knife under my throat at age sixteen.

It pretty much made me detach from her in my mind. Course it was

several years more before i could phycically detach and even longer

before the broken foot incident.

I did start to talk about age twenty or so. Big mistake. Relatives

and even COUNSELORS, deny, minimize, etc. I just sank ever deeper

into despair and lonliness. Words cannot describe the sinking feeling

of going to " loving " relatives who brush it off and laugh at you for

ever bringing it up. Or they pretend to " care " then stab you in the

back.

Final breaking point: I woke up one day with a broken foot.

Something about it made me really see PB for what she really was.

just in it for the control and selfish interests of filling her own

emptiness,etc. No love, no " best intentions " etc. at all. I realized

nothing was inherently " wrong " with me. SO i cut off all ties. That

was the last breaking point.

Relatives still had the gall to try and get us to " reunite and work

it out, learn to get along, shes your mother, find it in your heart,

she loves you. blah blah blah. " The minimizing, denial and complete

blatant IGNORING what went on in front of thier eyes, things i

tearfully told THEM. But they just would NOT take me seriously. I

finally had to decide for myself. this is not good - they are WRONG.

I can get over the abuse i really can. what give me such anguish is

how other people close to her and relatives just dont believe me, nor

take it seriously. They think i am still in the WRONG somehow. I fell

alien and invisible, no validation as a human being.

Cristie

[Guest guest]

Its like they are not living in reality and we are having to deal with

it ... alone. Oh if they only knew. but hing is i eally think alot of

them really dont WANT to know they just believe what they want to as

the other possibility is just to overwhelming. I read an article

fomcanada that the main reason why teahers fail to report suspected

child abuse is becasue they dont want to " damage " the

parent/child/teacher relationship. grrrrrr

Hell- I ALLWAYS report any and all animal abuse cases. P ** on the

neighbor/sherriff/landlord realtionship. (actually my landlords wife

was on my side and put in a report herself)

I'm so sorry, Christie :-( I know how rough that is. My relatives

always say " but she's still your mother " like it's OK that she's so

abusive and I should put up with it because she birthed me...that's

just wrong. One of many reasons I love animals so much...they love

unconditionally.

Jackie

>

---

I can get over the abuse i really can. what give me such anguish is how

other people close to her and relatives just dont believe me, nor take

it seriously. They think i am still in the WRONG somehow. I fell alien

and invisible, no validation as a human being.

[Guest guest]

Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

Those are the selfish reasons its easier but I feel for her that her

life was so miserable that she is finally at peace.

Like you, I thought my mom would outlive everyone, even with her 1,00

made up illnesses. I've posted before about all the ones she made up-

some are funny- elephantitis of the ankles, walking around with full

frontal brain atrophy, obsession with bowels and laxatives, I could

go on and on about all of her illnesses.

She was also bipolar (I'm still not sure of all the differences

between bipolar and BPD) and would go into deep depressions, usually

in the winter. She was manic in summer- this was when she would rage-

and depressed in winter. It was this way for years, but the last

year and a half she was alive she was in a deep depression she

couldn't get out of. She didn't rage, didn't leave her apartment

much, and her self injury became more severe. Her suicide attempts

became more serious instead of just attention grabbers.

When she died, I knew instinctively she committed suicide, but my ex

husband insisted her body gave out- she had stopped eating entirely

and was wasting away. I knew better and when cause of death was

confirmed, I was right.

I felt guilty over her death for a long time, but she was in so much

pain, and caused so much pain, that her being gone seems better for

everyone in my family and for her.

There are times I really miss her, when she first died I actually

missed the phone calls and the 10 minute long messages she would

leave me saying absolutely nothing.

My life is much more peaceful now, but I realized recently I was

still living with so much pain over my upbringing and " survival "

skills from childhood that no longer work as an adult. Until I

started reading " Surviving Borderline Parent " I had no clue about all

of my guilt and all of the negative messages I still believed.

She has been dead for a while and I'm still reeling from things, but

this group and the book have been a Godsend to me.

This group was the first time I ever felt I could express things and

have people actually believe me and to know there are others like me.

I hate there are so many of us, but we are all here to share our pain

and feel some validation for all the hell we've been through.

Sorry this is so long, I don't mean to go on and on, but sometimes it

happens...

Love to everyone!

>

> so, it is easier now that she's gone ? I don't mean to

sound " cold " or

> anything, but deep inside me, I can't wait for that day to

come...but she

> goen on and on...like the energizer bunny...she'll probably outlive

all of

> us !!

>

> Jackie

>

>

> I never got a chance to answer this when it first came up, so sorry

> I'm late!

> I feel like my whole life before my mom died was a breaking point!!!

> Her attempts at attention became much much severe as she got older.

> There were so many breaking points, but I never went NC with her. I

> was in limited contact, but she had no respect for boudaries and

> would wait for hours at my home for me to arrive. Usually when I

> came home she would have cut herself and be bleeding all over the

> porch. Her self injury got really bad the last few years of her

life.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

Those are the selfish reasons its easier but I feel for her that her

life was so miserable that she is finally at peace.

Like you, I thought my mom would outlive everyone, even with her 1,00

made up illnesses. I've posted before about all the ones she made up-

some are funny- elephantitis of the ankles, walking around with full

frontal brain atrophy, obsession with bowels and laxatives, I could

go on and on about all of her illnesses.

She was also bipolar (I'm still not sure of all the differences

between bipolar and BPD) and would go into deep depressions, usually

in the winter. She was manic in summer- this was when she would rage-

and depressed in winter. It was this way for years, but the last

year and a half she was alive she was in a deep depression she

couldn't get out of. She didn't rage, didn't leave her apartment

much, and her self injury became more severe. Her suicide attempts

became more serious instead of just attention grabbers.

When she died, I knew instinctively she committed suicide, but my ex

husband insisted her body gave out- she had stopped eating entirely

and was wasting away. I knew better and when cause of death was

confirmed, I was right.

I felt guilty over her death for a long time, but she was in so much

pain, and caused so much pain, that her being gone seems better for

everyone in my family and for her.

There are times I really miss her, when she first died I actually

missed the phone calls and the 10 minute long messages she would

leave me saying absolutely nothing.

My life is much more peaceful now, but I realized recently I was

still living with so much pain over my upbringing and " survival "

skills from childhood that no longer work as an adult. Until I

started reading " Surviving Borderline Parent " I had no clue about all

of my guilt and all of the negative messages I still believed.

She has been dead for a while and I'm still reeling from things, but

this group and the book have been a Godsend to me.

This group was the first time I ever felt I could express things and

have people actually believe me and to know there are others like me.

I hate there are so many of us, but we are all here to share our pain

and feel some validation for all the hell we've been through.

Sorry this is so long, I don't mean to go on and on, but sometimes it

happens...

Love to everyone!

>

> so, it is easier now that she's gone ? I don't mean to

sound " cold " or

> anything, but deep inside me, I can't wait for that day to

come...but she

> goen on and on...like the energizer bunny...she'll probably outlive

all of

> us !!

>

> Jackie

>

>

> I never got a chance to answer this when it first came up, so sorry

> I'm late!

> I feel like my whole life before my mom died was a breaking point!!!

> Her attempts at attention became much much severe as she got older.

> There were so many breaking points, but I never went NC with her. I

> was in limited contact, but she had no respect for boudaries and

> would wait for hours at my home for me to arrive. Usually when I

> came home she would have cut herself and be bleeding all over the

> porch. Her self injury got really bad the last few years of her

life.

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

I'm not offended at all; I was the exact same way when my mom was

alive. There is a sense of freedom for me now, I just answered

Jackie's question about that in an accidentally very long post.

> >

> > so, it is easier now that she's gone ? I don't mean to

sound " cold " or

> > anything, but deep inside me, I can't wait for that day to

> come...but she

> > goen on and on...like the energizer bunny...she'll probably

outlive

> all of

> > us !!

> >

> > Jackie

> >

> >

> > I never got a chance to answer this when it first came up, so

sorry

> > I'm late!

> > I feel like my whole life before my mom died was a breaking

point!!!

> > Her attempts at attention became much much severe as she got

older.

> > There were so many breaking points, but I never went NC with

her. I

> > was in limited contact, but she had no respect for boudaries and

> > would wait for hours at my home for me to arrive. Usually when I

> > came home she would have cut herself and be bleeding all over the

> > porch. Her self injury got really bad the last few years of her

life.

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

I'm not offended at all; I was the exact same way when my mom was

alive. There is a sense of freedom for me now, I just answered

Jackie's question about that in an accidentally very long post.

> >

> > so, it is easier now that she's gone ? I don't mean to

sound " cold " or

> > anything, but deep inside me, I can't wait for that day to

> come...but she

> > goen on and on...like the energizer bunny...she'll probably

outlive

> all of

> > us !!

> >

> > Jackie

> >

> >

> > I never got a chance to answer this when it first came up, so

sorry

> > I'm late!

> > I feel like my whole life before my mom died was a breaking

point!!!

> > Her attempts at attention became much much severe as she got

older.

> > There were so many breaking points, but I never went NC with

her. I

> > was in limited contact, but she had no respect for boudaries and

> > would wait for hours at my home for me to arrive. Usually when I

> > came home she would have cut herself and be bleeding all over the

> > porch. Her self injury got really bad the last few years of her

life.

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

thank you so much for your insightful post, !! It makes total sense

to me...my nada is nasty and has gotten nastier towards me in the past 5

years, that I'm looking forward to her death..to free me from her constant

attacks. I am tired of having to keep my defenses up , and I'm tired of

never enjoying myself around my family, she always ruins it. I understand a

lot of this is me also, that I need to learn that my attitude needs to

change, but after 48 years, this is not an easy task, and sometimes I still

think I shouldn't have to...I'm new at this healing, having only started a

year ago going to a therapist..so I know I'll get better...life will be so

much easier once my nada is gone...no one will tell me I'm a stupid

worthless excuse for a human being that she should have killed when she had

the chance...which is why I've gone about 99% NC...

Jackie

Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

[Guest guest]

Ok...it seems like every single day here, something hits really close to

home...so I had to share this.

The very first time I ever went to therapy I told the doctor that I had tried

everything...but i had gotten to the point where i felt like i would not get any

relief until one of us was dead. I now realize that even if that were the case

i still need to fight my demons regarding her, and i need to not interalize what

she did. Her actions and the things she said was the mental illness

talking...and really had nothing to do with me.

Anyway....i've written that over and over and over in my journal...no peace

until she dies...and then my brother said it to me a couple of days ago...that

he felt that way. I just said " OH MY GOD! I feel that way too!! I've been

saying that for YEARS! " Well wouldn't you just know it, the very next day I get

this " urgent " message from nada. She said that my brother made the comment to

her that " he would not get any peace from them until they died " ...well she took

that as a " death threat " and called the police! Do you know how many times I

have stopped short of saying that? Lately my policy has been to not get

invoved, but I did call and talk to the arresting officer to tell them that

yeah...nada was nuts.

sleddog wrote:

thank you so much for your insightful post, !! It makes total

sense

to me...my nada is nasty and has gotten nastier towards me in the past 5

years, that I'm looking forward to her death..to free me from her constant

attacks. I am tired of having to keep my defenses up , and I'm tired of

never enjoying myself around my family, she always ruins it. I understand a

lot of this is me also, that I need to learn that my attitude needs to

change, but after 48 years, this is not an easy task, and sometimes I still

think I shouldn't have to...I'm new at this healing, having only started a

year ago going to a therapist..so I know I'll get better...life will be so

much easier once my nada is gone...no one will tell me I'm a stupid

worthless excuse for a human being that she should have killed when she had

the chance...which is why I've gone about 99% NC...

Jackie

Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

Kisses and Nibbles,

Bunny

[Guest guest]

Ok...it seems like every single day here, something hits really close to

home...so I had to share this.

The very first time I ever went to therapy I told the doctor that I had tried

everything...but i had gotten to the point where i felt like i would not get any

relief until one of us was dead. I now realize that even if that were the case

i still need to fight my demons regarding her, and i need to not interalize what

she did. Her actions and the things she said was the mental illness

talking...and really had nothing to do with me.

Anyway....i've written that over and over and over in my journal...no peace

until she dies...and then my brother said it to me a couple of days ago...that

he felt that way. I just said " OH MY GOD! I feel that way too!! I've been

saying that for YEARS! " Well wouldn't you just know it, the very next day I get

this " urgent " message from nada. She said that my brother made the comment to

her that " he would not get any peace from them until they died " ...well she took

that as a " death threat " and called the police! Do you know how many times I

have stopped short of saying that? Lately my policy has been to not get

invoved, but I did call and talk to the arresting officer to tell them that

yeah...nada was nuts.

sleddog wrote:

thank you so much for your insightful post, !! It makes total

sense

to me...my nada is nasty and has gotten nastier towards me in the past 5

years, that I'm looking forward to her death..to free me from her constant

attacks. I am tired of having to keep my defenses up , and I'm tired of

never enjoying myself around my family, she always ruins it. I understand a

lot of this is me also, that I need to learn that my attitude needs to

change, but after 48 years, this is not an easy task, and sometimes I still

think I shouldn't have to...I'm new at this healing, having only started a

year ago going to a therapist..so I know I'll get better...life will be so

much easier once my nada is gone...no one will tell me I'm a stupid

worthless excuse for a human being that she should have killed when she had

the chance...which is why I've gone about 99% NC...

Jackie

Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

Kisses and Nibbles,

Bunny

[Guest guest]

Ok...it seems like every single day here, something hits really close to

home...so I had to share this.

The very first time I ever went to therapy I told the doctor that I had tried

everything...but i had gotten to the point where i felt like i would not get any

relief until one of us was dead. I now realize that even if that were the case

i still need to fight my demons regarding her, and i need to not interalize what

she did. Her actions and the things she said was the mental illness

talking...and really had nothing to do with me.

Anyway....i've written that over and over and over in my journal...no peace

until she dies...and then my brother said it to me a couple of days ago...that

he felt that way. I just said " OH MY GOD! I feel that way too!! I've been

saying that for YEARS! " Well wouldn't you just know it, the very next day I get

this " urgent " message from nada. She said that my brother made the comment to

her that " he would not get any peace from them until they died " ...well she took

that as a " death threat " and called the police! Do you know how many times I

have stopped short of saying that? Lately my policy has been to not get

invoved, but I did call and talk to the arresting officer to tell them that

yeah...nada was nuts.

sleddog wrote:

thank you so much for your insightful post, !! It makes total

sense

to me...my nada is nasty and has gotten nastier towards me in the past 5

years, that I'm looking forward to her death..to free me from her constant

attacks. I am tired of having to keep my defenses up , and I'm tired of

never enjoying myself around my family, she always ruins it. I understand a

lot of this is me also, that I need to learn that my attitude needs to

change, but after 48 years, this is not an easy task, and sometimes I still

think I shouldn't have to...I'm new at this healing, having only started a

year ago going to a therapist..so I know I'll get better...life will be so

much easier once my nada is gone...no one will tell me I'm a stupid

worthless excuse for a human being that she should have killed when she had

the chance...which is why I've gone about 99% NC...

Jackie

Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

Kisses and Nibbles,

Bunny

[Guest guest]

> Anyway....i've written that over and over and over in my journal...no

> peace until she dies...and then my brother said it to me a couple of days

> ago...that he felt that way. I just said " OH MY GOD! I feel that way

> too!! I've been saying that for YEARS! " Well wouldn't you just know it,

> the very next day I get this " urgent " >message from nada. She said that

> my brother made the comment to her that " he would not get any peace from

> them until they died " ...well she took that as a " death threat " and called

> the police! Do you know how many times I have stopped short of >saying

> that? Lately my policy has been to not get invoved, but I did call and

> talk to the arresting officer to tell them that yeah...nada was nuts.

OMG !! I bet my nada would do this too...it's OK that she THREATENS us and

says many times throughout my life that she wishes she had killed me/us when

she was able..but heaven forbid if we ever suggest we'd be better off when

she's dead...and this is not even saying we'd kill her like she does to us..

unlike your brother..I would never have the nerve to actually SAY we'd be

better off when she's gone...

Jackie

[Guest guest]

> Anyway....i've written that over and over and over in my journal...no

> peace until she dies...and then my brother said it to me a couple of days

> ago...that he felt that way. I just said " OH MY GOD! I feel that way

> too!! I've been saying that for YEARS! " Well wouldn't you just know it,

> the very next day I get this " urgent " >message from nada. She said that

> my brother made the comment to her that " he would not get any peace from

> them until they died " ...well she took that as a " death threat " and called

> the police! Do you know how many times I have stopped short of >saying

> that? Lately my policy has been to not get invoved, but I did call and

> talk to the arresting officer to tell them that yeah...nada was nuts.

OMG !! I bet my nada would do this too...it's OK that she THREATENS us and

says many times throughout my life that she wishes she had killed me/us when

she was able..but heaven forbid if we ever suggest we'd be better off when

she's dead...and this is not even saying we'd kill her like she does to us..

unlike your brother..I would never have the nerve to actually SAY we'd be

better off when she's gone...

Jackie

[Guest guest]

I can really relate to your brother, because I said that I would stand over my

mother's casket and say " Praise God, I am free at last " and I said it to her

face. She didn't call the police, but she acted so wounded. It was almost

laughable, because just a few minutes before, she had the meanest, cruelest,

vilest things coming out of her mouth in reference to me.

Janie

sleddog wrote:

> Anyway....i've written that over and over and over in my

journal...no

> peace until she dies...and then my brother said it to me a couple of days

> ago...that he felt that way. I just said " OH MY GOD! I feel that way

> too!! I've been saying that for YEARS! " Well wouldn't you just know it,

> the very next day I get this " urgent " >message from nada. She said that

> my brother made the comment to her that " he would not get any peace from

> them until they died " ...well she took that as a " death threat " and called

> the police! Do you know how many times I have stopped short of >saying

> that? Lately my policy has been to not get invoved, but I did call and

> talk to the arresting officer to tell them that yeah...nada was nuts.

OMG !! I bet my nada would do this too...it's OK that she THREATENS us and

says many times throughout my life that she wishes she had killed me/us when

she was able..but heaven forbid if we ever suggest we'd be better off when

she's dead...and this is not even saying we'd kill her like she does to us..

unlike your brother..I would never have the nerve to actually SAY we'd be

better off when she's gone...

Jackie

[Guest guest]

I can really relate to your brother, because I said that I would stand over my

mother's casket and say " Praise God, I am free at last " and I said it to her

face. She didn't call the police, but she acted so wounded. It was almost

laughable, because just a few minutes before, she had the meanest, cruelest,

vilest things coming out of her mouth in reference to me.

Janie

sleddog wrote:

> Anyway....i've written that over and over and over in my

journal...no

> peace until she dies...and then my brother said it to me a couple of days

> ago...that he felt that way. I just said " OH MY GOD! I feel that way

> too!! I've been saying that for YEARS! " Well wouldn't you just know it,

> the very next day I get this " urgent " >message from nada. She said that

> my brother made the comment to her that " he would not get any peace from

> them until they died " ...well she took that as a " death threat " and called

> the police! Do you know how many times I have stopped short of >saying

> that? Lately my policy has been to not get invoved, but I did call and

> talk to the arresting officer to tell them that yeah...nada was nuts.

OMG !! I bet my nada would do this too...it's OK that she THREATENS us and

says many times throughout my life that she wishes she had killed me/us when

she was able..but heaven forbid if we ever suggest we'd be better off when

she's dead...and this is not even saying we'd kill her like she does to us..

unlike your brother..I would never have the nerve to actually SAY we'd be

better off when she's gone...

Jackie

[Guest guest]

First of all, how awful what you went through!

In response to your question about the breaking point...

For me it was kind of gradual, but it had to do with my kids. I had

long been aware that there was something " not right " about my mother -

the negativity, the outrageous accusations, the random mental health

diagnoses that she would come up with for me, etc. Sometimes I felt

like it would be much easier just to cut off contact with her, but

then I would feel guilty for thinking that way, remember that there

were many good times (though as I got older they became increasingly

fewer and farther between), and get hoovered back in.

After I had my second daughter, I started therapy and treatment for

postpartum depression. As my therapist helped me to examine

underlying issues, it became clear to her that my mother was the

biggie, and she encouraged me to invite her to some of my sessions. I

was dead set against this, and hadn't shared anything about my PPD or

therapy with her at all, then one time on the phone, I had allowed

myself to get dragged into a big, hideous argument. I was crying,

etc. At first I started to break away before it got too bad by

saying, " Goodbye Mom, I am not going to do this. I will talk to you

another time. I love you. " Before I could hang up, she said, " Yeah,

right. " That cut to the bone and I was sucked back in. Anyway, after

the conversation went on a while longer, she said, " You need

therapy! " I broke my vow never to tell her about my " issues " and

sobbed, " I've been in therapy for a freakin' year and a half! "

Suddenly she got all fakey sympathetic - " Oh I'm so glad you're

finally getting help. " Blah blah blah (She had decided that I was

bipolar, something my therapist vehemently disagrees with - as do I.

I have also been seen by a psychiatrist, since my therapist does not

prescribe meds, and the psychiatrist doesn't think I'm bipolar

either.) Anyway, she did end up coming to therapy with me for a

couple of months. She promised to pay for half of those sessions,

since they were in addition to my regular therapy sessions, but she

never did.

Those therapy sessions, although they did absolutely nothing to

improve my relationship with my mother, helped me to finally see her

for who she is. I used to excuse the horrible things she would say

when she was raging, thinking she surely couldn't think those things

about me - it was just said in the heat of anger and she really

didn't mean it. In therapy she verified that she really does believe

that I'm self-centered, that I deliberately set out to hurt her, that

my goal in moving one town away (to a better school district - that

was our actual motivation) was to hurt her and keep her grandchildren

from her, that I've allowed my husband to " poison " my mind against

her, the list goes on. I've been split bad for a while now. She never

saw the therapy sessions as a chance for both of us to work on our

relationship. She was just there to " help poor Tara " and let my

therapist know what an awful, messed up person I really am. UGH. She

even said at one point, " Why are you so enmeshed with me? " I guess

that was one point she was right about. I hope she likes her VERY LC

because I ain't enmeshed no more!

Anyway, during the course of these sessions, there was a week that

was fraught with peril - my brother was visiting from Alaska (we live

in NY) and of course, everything had to be perfect. I didn't go along

with her every whim. She ended up blowing up in front of my kids and

then blatantly lying to my daughter, then 2 1/2, who said, " Why did

you yell at my mommy? " (Yes, my kids are very verbal) I was about to

jump in with " Mommy and Grandma had a disagreement, but everything is

ok honey. We still love each other. " Before I had a chance, my mother

(Nada?) said, " Your mommy yelled at me first. " Not only hadn't I

yelled, I had very calmly whispered so as not to get sucked into her

argument and not to scare the kids. My kids knew this, and we talked

about it on our way home (this had all happened as we were leaving so

that I could, ironically, go to a therapy appointment, and my mother

thought I should stay around and so something she wanted me to and be

very late to my appointment.) This might seem a bit minor, but it was

the straw that broke this camel's back. I told my therapist that it

was like the security system in my head went off. She started to mess

with my kids and their reality - they had seen and heard what had

happened - and lights started flashing, sirens wailing, and the gates

in my head came crashing down.

Now she and my father see them once a week with us. No unsupervised

contact. This might not seem like very LC to some of you, but it is

to us. There are no phone calls in between, there is no discussion of

anything other than stuff like the weather, etc. They are angry and

have tried various ways of trying to get us to relent, but I'm done.

The only reason I am keeping this up is for my kids. They love their

grandparents very much. I'm wondering how I'm going to handle it when

they start asking why they never go to spend the night over there

anymore, etc. They are now 5 and 3 and they used to do tons of stuff

with my parents. There had always been subtle undermining of my

husband and myself but for some reason that incident showed me that

my kids weren't safe from her, and I was just done.

Sorry that was so very long!!!!

Tara

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> I am just curious, when did you finally realize enough was enough

and

> you could no longer tolerate abusive behavior from your BPD parent?

> When did you really realize that you were being abused? Did you get

> angry, or how did you feel?

>

> For me, as I indicated in another post it came after she used me up

> for everything I had, and then still asked for more. She is really

bad

> with money, and completely irresponsible about it. I've been

> continually rescuing her when she couldn't pay her hotel bill,

> couldn't afford her medication for a lung infection, couldn't pay

her

> $1500 cell phone bill (who the hell was she talking to??), couldn't

> pay her rent, when she got in trouble with the IRS, etc. I've been a

> student for most of this time, so I actually don't have an income,

and

> as such I've had to put mostly all of this on my credit card. I've

> missed out on every spring break and so many other things because

the

> money I set aside went to my mom. I also felt guilty spending any

> money on myself.

>

> Recently I got to the point where I couldn't afford the monthly

> payments on my credit cards, and I was (still am) totally broke and

> restricted financially because of all of this debt. I had to say no

> when she asked me for rent money, and I felt horrible. She told me

all

> of these stories about how hard it is to find housing in her area

and

> they don't care about homeless people, on and on. I really felt

like I

> was about to just let my mom become homeless and not do anything

about

> it. The problem was if I helped her, I would end up ruining my

credit

> and generally impairing myself financially in ways I can't handle. I

> guess not having good credit was the endpoint for me.

>

> When I started to get mad was when she kept asking me after I said

no:

>

> 1) She asked me for $500 to pay her phone bill, and she said her

phone

> would be turned off in 2 days if she didn't pay it. I said no

because

> I really had nothing left, and I felt horrible about it. Then she

> calls me 4 days later and acts like nothing happened. She tells me

> that she called the phone company and worked something out.

>

> 2) Next she asked me to ask my father's father for money for her so

> she could pay the rent and wouldn't be homeless. This is her

> ex-husband's father, and they got divoriced 15 years ago.

>

> 3) Then, her landlord offered to sell her cars for her to pay for

the

> rent. He sold the first one for most of the money, and was selling

the

> other one for the rest of the amount owed. She called and asked for

> $700 so that she could still have a car. (There is public

> transportation in the area to take her to work.)

>

> I can't even say how these things made me feel, but I'm sure you all

> can guess. I felt like I was doing my best to hold up a wall that I

> was convinced would fall at any moment if I let go. Then I ran out

of

> energy and absolutely could not hold it up anymore, so I let go,

> expecting it to come crashing down, ready for the consequences.

Then,

> it didn't fall down at all. It didn't even crumble a little. And

now I

> feel so fucking used and stupid, and angry. And I'm not holding up

> that damn wall ever again.

>

> I know this is really long, but this is the first time in my life I

> have anyone with whom I can talk about these things. There was even

> more, but I cut it out because this post is way too long. Thanks for

> reading it if you actually made it to the end.

>

> I would really like to know what caused you all to realize that

things

> weren't right.

>

> Melany

>

[Guest guest]

First of all, how awful what you went through!

In response to your question about the breaking point...

For me it was kind of gradual, but it had to do with my kids. I had

long been aware that there was something " not right " about my mother -

the negativity, the outrageous accusations, the random mental health

diagnoses that she would come up with for me, etc. Sometimes I felt

like it would be much easier just to cut off contact with her, but

then I would feel guilty for thinking that way, remember that there

were many good times (though as I got older they became increasingly

fewer and farther between), and get hoovered back in.

After I had my second daughter, I started therapy and treatment for

postpartum depression. As my therapist helped me to examine

underlying issues, it became clear to her that my mother was the

biggie, and she encouraged me to invite her to some of my sessions. I

was dead set against this, and hadn't shared anything about my PPD or

therapy with her at all, then one time on the phone, I had allowed

myself to get dragged into a big, hideous argument. I was crying,

etc. At first I started to break away before it got too bad by

saying, " Goodbye Mom, I am not going to do this. I will talk to you

another time. I love you. " Before I could hang up, she said, " Yeah,

right. " That cut to the bone and I was sucked back in. Anyway, after

the conversation went on a while longer, she said, " You need

therapy! " I broke my vow never to tell her about my " issues " and

sobbed, " I've been in therapy for a freakin' year and a half! "

Suddenly she got all fakey sympathetic - " Oh I'm so glad you're

finally getting help. " Blah blah blah (She had decided that I was

bipolar, something my therapist vehemently disagrees with - as do I.

I have also been seen by a psychiatrist, since my therapist does not

prescribe meds, and the psychiatrist doesn't think I'm bipolar

either.) Anyway, she did end up coming to therapy with me for a

couple of months. She promised to pay for half of those sessions,

since they were in addition to my regular therapy sessions, but she

never did.

Those therapy sessions, although they did absolutely nothing to

improve my relationship with my mother, helped me to finally see her

for who she is. I used to excuse the horrible things she would say

when she was raging, thinking she surely couldn't think those things

about me - it was just said in the heat of anger and she really

didn't mean it. In therapy she verified that she really does believe

that I'm self-centered, that I deliberately set out to hurt her, that

my goal in moving one town away (to a better school district - that

was our actual motivation) was to hurt her and keep her grandchildren

from her, that I've allowed my husband to " poison " my mind against

her, the list goes on. I've been split bad for a while now. She never

saw the therapy sessions as a chance for both of us to work on our

relationship. She was just there to " help poor Tara " and let my

therapist know what an awful, messed up person I really am. UGH. She

even said at one point, " Why are you so enmeshed with me? " I guess

that was one point she was right about. I hope she likes her VERY LC

because I ain't enmeshed no more!

Anyway, during the course of these sessions, there was a week that

was fraught with peril - my brother was visiting from Alaska (we live

in NY) and of course, everything had to be perfect. I didn't go along

with her every whim. She ended up blowing up in front of my kids and

then blatantly lying to my daughter, then 2 1/2, who said, " Why did

you yell at my mommy? " (Yes, my kids are very verbal) I was about to

jump in with " Mommy and Grandma had a disagreement, but everything is

ok honey. We still love each other. " Before I had a chance, my mother

(Nada?) said, " Your mommy yelled at me first. " Not only hadn't I

yelled, I had very calmly whispered so as not to get sucked into her

argument and not to scare the kids. My kids knew this, and we talked

about it on our way home (this had all happened as we were leaving so

that I could, ironically, go to a therapy appointment, and my mother

thought I should stay around and so something she wanted me to and be

very late to my appointment.) This might seem a bit minor, but it was

the straw that broke this camel's back. I told my therapist that it

was like the security system in my head went off. She started to mess

with my kids and their reality - they had seen and heard what had

happened - and lights started flashing, sirens wailing, and the gates

in my head came crashing down.

Now she and my father see them once a week with us. No unsupervised

contact. This might not seem like very LC to some of you, but it is

to us. There are no phone calls in between, there is no discussion of

anything other than stuff like the weather, etc. They are angry and

have tried various ways of trying to get us to relent, but I'm done.

The only reason I am keeping this up is for my kids. They love their

grandparents very much. I'm wondering how I'm going to handle it when

they start asking why they never go to spend the night over there

anymore, etc. They are now 5 and 3 and they used to do tons of stuff

with my parents. There had always been subtle undermining of my

husband and myself but for some reason that incident showed me that

my kids weren't safe from her, and I was just done.

Sorry that was so very long!!!!

Tara

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> I am just curious, when did you finally realize enough was enough

and

> you could no longer tolerate abusive behavior from your BPD parent?

> When did you really realize that you were being abused? Did you get

> angry, or how did you feel?

>

> For me, as I indicated in another post it came after she used me up

> for everything I had, and then still asked for more. She is really

bad

> with money, and completely irresponsible about it. I've been

> continually rescuing her when she couldn't pay her hotel bill,

> couldn't afford her medication for a lung infection, couldn't pay

her

> $1500 cell phone bill (who the hell was she talking to??), couldn't

> pay her rent, when she got in trouble with the IRS, etc. I've been a

> student for most of this time, so I actually don't have an income,

and

> as such I've had to put mostly all of this on my credit card. I've

> missed out on every spring break and so many other things because

the

> money I set aside went to my mom. I also felt guilty spending any

> money on myself.

>

> Recently I got to the point where I couldn't afford the monthly

> payments on my credit cards, and I was (still am) totally broke and

> restricted financially because of all of this debt. I had to say no

> when she asked me for rent money, and I felt horrible. She told me

all

> of these stories about how hard it is to find housing in her area

and

> they don't care about homeless people, on and on. I really felt

like I

> was about to just let my mom become homeless and not do anything

about

> it. The problem was if I helped her, I would end up ruining my

credit

> and generally impairing myself financially in ways I can't handle. I

> guess not having good credit was the endpoint for me.

>

> When I started to get mad was when she kept asking me after I said

no:

>

> 1) She asked me for $500 to pay her phone bill, and she said her

phone

> would be turned off in 2 days if she didn't pay it. I said no

because

> I really had nothing left, and I felt horrible about it. Then she

> calls me 4 days later and acts like nothing happened. She tells me

> that she called the phone company and worked something out.

>

> 2) Next she asked me to ask my father's father for money for her so

> she could pay the rent and wouldn't be homeless. This is her

> ex-husband's father, and they got divoriced 15 years ago.

>

> 3) Then, her landlord offered to sell her cars for her to pay for

the

> rent. He sold the first one for most of the money, and was selling

the

> other one for the rest of the amount owed. She called and asked for

> $700 so that she could still have a car. (There is public

> transportation in the area to take her to work.)

>

> I can't even say how these things made me feel, but I'm sure you all

> can guess. I felt like I was doing my best to hold up a wall that I

> was convinced would fall at any moment if I let go. Then I ran out

of

> energy and absolutely could not hold it up anymore, so I let go,

> expecting it to come crashing down, ready for the consequences.

Then,

> it didn't fall down at all. It didn't even crumble a little. And

now I

> feel so fucking used and stupid, and angry. And I'm not holding up

> that damn wall ever again.

>

> I know this is really long, but this is the first time in my life I

> have anyone with whom I can talk about these things. There was even

> more, but I cut it out because this post is way too long. Thanks for

> reading it if you actually made it to the end.

>

> I would really like to know what caused you all to realize that

things

> weren't right.

>

> Melany

>

[Guest guest]

First of all, how awful what you went through!

In response to your question about the breaking point...

For me it was kind of gradual, but it had to do with my kids. I had

long been aware that there was something " not right " about my mother -

the negativity, the outrageous accusations, the random mental health

diagnoses that she would come up with for me, etc. Sometimes I felt

like it would be much easier just to cut off contact with her, but

then I would feel guilty for thinking that way, remember that there

were many good times (though as I got older they became increasingly

fewer and farther between), and get hoovered back in.

After I had my second daughter, I started therapy and treatment for

postpartum depression. As my therapist helped me to examine

underlying issues, it became clear to her that my mother was the

biggie, and she encouraged me to invite her to some of my sessions. I

was dead set against this, and hadn't shared anything about my PPD or

therapy with her at all, then one time on the phone, I had allowed

myself to get dragged into a big, hideous argument. I was crying,

etc. At first I started to break away before it got too bad by

saying, " Goodbye Mom, I am not going to do this. I will talk to you

another time. I love you. " Before I could hang up, she said, " Yeah,

right. " That cut to the bone and I was sucked back in. Anyway, after

the conversation went on a while longer, she said, " You need

therapy! " I broke my vow never to tell her about my " issues " and

sobbed, " I've been in therapy for a freakin' year and a half! "

Suddenly she got all fakey sympathetic - " Oh I'm so glad you're

finally getting help. " Blah blah blah (She had decided that I was

bipolar, something my therapist vehemently disagrees with - as do I.

I have also been seen by a psychiatrist, since my therapist does not

prescribe meds, and the psychiatrist doesn't think I'm bipolar

either.) Anyway, she did end up coming to therapy with me for a

couple of months. She promised to pay for half of those sessions,

since they were in addition to my regular therapy sessions, but she

never did.

Those therapy sessions, although they did absolutely nothing to

improve my relationship with my mother, helped me to finally see her

for who she is. I used to excuse the horrible things she would say

when she was raging, thinking she surely couldn't think those things

about me - it was just said in the heat of anger and she really

didn't mean it. In therapy she verified that she really does believe

that I'm self-centered, that I deliberately set out to hurt her, that

my goal in moving one town away (to a better school district - that

was our actual motivation) was to hurt her and keep her grandchildren

from her, that I've allowed my husband to " poison " my mind against

her, the list goes on. I've been split bad for a while now. She never

saw the therapy sessions as a chance for both of us to work on our

relationship. She was just there to " help poor Tara " and let my

therapist know what an awful, messed up person I really am. UGH. She

even said at one point, " Why are you so enmeshed with me? " I guess

that was one point she was right about. I hope she likes her VERY LC

because I ain't enmeshed no more!

Anyway, during the course of these sessions, there was a week that

was fraught with peril - my brother was visiting from Alaska (we live

in NY) and of course, everything had to be perfect. I didn't go along

with her every whim. She ended up blowing up in front of my kids and

then blatantly lying to my daughter, then 2 1/2, who said, " Why did

you yell at my mommy? " (Yes, my kids are very verbal) I was about to

jump in with " Mommy and Grandma had a disagreement, but everything is

ok honey. We still love each other. " Before I had a chance, my mother

(Nada?) said, " Your mommy yelled at me first. " Not only hadn't I

yelled, I had very calmly whispered so as not to get sucked into her

argument and not to scare the kids. My kids knew this, and we talked

about it on our way home (this had all happened as we were leaving so

that I could, ironically, go to a therapy appointment, and my mother

thought I should stay around and so something she wanted me to and be

very late to my appointment.) This might seem a bit minor, but it was

the straw that broke this camel's back. I told my therapist that it

was like the security system in my head went off. She started to mess

with my kids and their reality - they had seen and heard what had

happened - and lights started flashing, sirens wailing, and the gates

in my head came crashing down.

Now she and my father see them once a week with us. No unsupervised

contact. This might not seem like very LC to some of you, but it is

to us. There are no phone calls in between, there is no discussion of

anything other than stuff like the weather, etc. They are angry and

have tried various ways of trying to get us to relent, but I'm done.

The only reason I am keeping this up is for my kids. They love their

grandparents very much. I'm wondering how I'm going to handle it when

they start asking why they never go to spend the night over there

anymore, etc. They are now 5 and 3 and they used to do tons of stuff

with my parents. There had always been subtle undermining of my

husband and myself but for some reason that incident showed me that

my kids weren't safe from her, and I was just done.

Sorry that was so very long!!!!

Tara

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> I am just curious, when did you finally realize enough was enough

and

> you could no longer tolerate abusive behavior from your BPD parent?

> When did you really realize that you were being abused? Did you get

> angry, or how did you feel?

>

> For me, as I indicated in another post it came after she used me up

> for everything I had, and then still asked for more. She is really

bad

> with money, and completely irresponsible about it. I've been

> continually rescuing her when she couldn't pay her hotel bill,

> couldn't afford her medication for a lung infection, couldn't pay

her

> $1500 cell phone bill (who the hell was she talking to??), couldn't

> pay her rent, when she got in trouble with the IRS, etc. I've been a

> student for most of this time, so I actually don't have an income,

and

> as such I've had to put mostly all of this on my credit card. I've

> missed out on every spring break and so many other things because

the

> money I set aside went to my mom. I also felt guilty spending any

> money on myself.

>

> Recently I got to the point where I couldn't afford the monthly

> payments on my credit cards, and I was (still am) totally broke and

> restricted financially because of all of this debt. I had to say no

> when she asked me for rent money, and I felt horrible. She told me

all

> of these stories about how hard it is to find housing in her area

and

> they don't care about homeless people, on and on. I really felt

like I

> was about to just let my mom become homeless and not do anything

about

> it. The problem was if I helped her, I would end up ruining my

credit

> and generally impairing myself financially in ways I can't handle. I

> guess not having good credit was the endpoint for me.

>

> When I started to get mad was when she kept asking me after I said

no:

>

> 1) She asked me for $500 to pay her phone bill, and she said her

phone

> would be turned off in 2 days if she didn't pay it. I said no

because

> I really had nothing left, and I felt horrible about it. Then she

> calls me 4 days later and acts like nothing happened. She tells me

> that she called the phone company and worked something out.

>

> 2) Next she asked me to ask my father's father for money for her so

> she could pay the rent and wouldn't be homeless. This is her

> ex-husband's father, and they got divoriced 15 years ago.

>

> 3) Then, her landlord offered to sell her cars for her to pay for

the

> rent. He sold the first one for most of the money, and was selling

the

> other one for the rest of the amount owed. She called and asked for

> $700 so that she could still have a car. (There is public

> transportation in the area to take her to work.)

>

> I can't even say how these things made me feel, but I'm sure you all

> can guess. I felt like I was doing my best to hold up a wall that I

> was convinced would fall at any moment if I let go. Then I ran out

of

> energy and absolutely could not hold it up anymore, so I let go,

> expecting it to come crashing down, ready for the consequences.

Then,

> it didn't fall down at all. It didn't even crumble a little. And

now I

> feel so fucking used and stupid, and angry. And I'm not holding up

> that damn wall ever again.

>

> I know this is really long, but this is the first time in my life I

> have anyone with whom I can talk about these things. There was even

> more, but I cut it out because this post is way too long. Thanks for

> reading it if you actually made it to the end.

>

> I would really like to know what caused you all to realize that

things

> weren't right.

>

> Melany

>

[Guest guest]

First of all, how awful what you went through!

In response to your question about the breaking point...

For me it was kind of gradual, but it had to do with my kids. I had

long been aware that there was something " not right " about my mother -

the negativity, the outrageous accusations, the random mental health

diagnoses that she would come up with for me, etc. Sometimes I felt

like it would be much easier just to cut off contact with her, but

then I would feel guilty for thinking that way, remember that there

were many good times (though as I got older they became increasingly

fewer and farther between), and get hoovered back in.

After I had my second daughter, I started therapy and treatment for

postpartum depression. As my therapist helped me to examine

underlying issues, it became clear to her that my mother was the

biggie, and she encouraged me to invite her to some of my sessions. I

was dead set against this, and hadn't shared anything about my PPD or

therapy with her at all, then one time on the phone, I had allowed

myself to get dragged into a big, hideous argument. I was crying,

etc. At first I started to break away before it got too bad by

saying, " Goodbye Mom, I am not going to do this. I will talk to you

another time. I love you. " Before I could hang up, she said, " Yeah,

right. " That cut to the bone and I was sucked back in. Anyway, after

the conversation went on a while longer, she said, " You need

therapy! " I broke my vow never to tell her about my " issues " and

sobbed, " I've been in therapy for a freakin' year and a half! "

Suddenly she got all fakey sympathetic - " Oh I'm so glad you're

finally getting help. " Blah blah blah (She had decided that I was

bipolar, something my therapist vehemently disagrees with - as do I.

I have also been seen by a psychiatrist, since my therapist does not

prescribe meds, and the psychiatrist doesn't think I'm bipolar

either.) Anyway, she did end up coming to therapy with me for a

couple of months. She promised to pay for half of those sessions,

since they were in addition to my regular therapy sessions, but she

never did.

Those therapy sessions, although they did absolutely nothing to

improve my relationship with my mother, helped me to finally see her

for who she is. I used to excuse the horrible things she would say

when she was raging, thinking she surely couldn't think those things

about me - it was just said in the heat of anger and she really

didn't mean it. In therapy she verified that she really does believe

that I'm self-centered, that I deliberately set out to hurt her, that

my goal in moving one town away (to a better school district - that

was our actual motivation) was to hurt her and keep her grandchildren

from her, that I've allowed my husband to " poison " my mind against

her, the list goes on. I've been split bad for a while now. She never

saw the therapy sessions as a chance for both of us to work on our

relationship. She was just there to " help poor Tara " and let my

therapist know what an awful, messed up person I really am. UGH. She

even said at one point, " Why are you so enmeshed with me? " I guess

that was one point she was right about. I hope she likes her VERY LC

because I ain't enmeshed no more!

Anyway, during the course of these sessions, there was a week that

was fraught with peril - my brother was visiting from Alaska (we live

in NY) and of course, everything had to be perfect. I didn't go along

with her every whim. She ended up blowing up in front of my kids and

then blatantly lying to my daughter, then 2 1/2, who said, " Why did

you yell at my mommy? " (Yes, my kids are very verbal) I was about to

jump in with " Mommy and Grandma had a disagreement, but everything is

ok honey. We still love each other. " Before I had a chance, my mother

(Nada?) said, " Your mommy yelled at me first. " Not only hadn't I

yelled, I had very calmly whispered so as not to get sucked into her

argument and not to scare the kids. My kids knew this, and we talked

about it on our way home (this had all happened as we were leaving so

that I could, ironically, go to a therapy appointment, and my mother

thought I should stay around and so something she wanted me to and be

very late to my appointment.) This might seem a bit minor, but it was

the straw that broke this camel's back. I told my therapist that it

was like the security system in my head went off. She started to mess

with my kids and their reality - they had seen and heard what had

happened - and lights started flashing, sirens wailing, and the gates

in my head came crashing down.

Now she and my father see them once a week with us. No unsupervised

contact. This might not seem like very LC to some of you, but it is

to us. There are no phone calls in between, there is no discussion of

anything other than stuff like the weather, etc. They are angry and

have tried various ways of trying to get us to relent, but I'm done.

The only reason I am keeping this up is for my kids. They love their

grandparents very much. I'm wondering how I'm going to handle it when

they start asking why they never go to spend the night over there

anymore, etc. They are now 5 and 3 and they used to do tons of stuff

with my parents. There had always been subtle undermining of my

husband and myself but for some reason that incident showed me that

my kids weren't safe from her, and I was just done.

Sorry that was so very long!!!!

Tara

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> I am just curious, when did you finally realize enough was enough

and

> you could no longer tolerate abusive behavior from your BPD parent?

> When did you really realize that you were being abused? Did you get

> angry, or how did you feel?

>

> For me, as I indicated in another post it came after she used me up

> for everything I had, and then still asked for more. She is really

bad

> with money, and completely irresponsible about it. I've been

> continually rescuing her when she couldn't pay her hotel bill,

> couldn't afford her medication for a lung infection, couldn't pay

her

> $1500 cell phone bill (who the hell was she talking to??), couldn't

> pay her rent, when she got in trouble with the IRS, etc. I've been a

> student for most of this time, so I actually don't have an income,

and

> as such I've had to put mostly all of this on my credit card. I've

> missed out on every spring break and so many other things because

the

> money I set aside went to my mom. I also felt guilty spending any

> money on myself.

>

> Recently I got to the point where I couldn't afford the monthly

> payments on my credit cards, and I was (still am) totally broke and

> restricted financially because of all of this debt. I had to say no

> when she asked me for rent money, and I felt horrible. She told me

all

> of these stories about how hard it is to find housing in her area

and

> they don't care about homeless people, on and on. I really felt

like I

> was about to just let my mom become homeless and not do anything

about

> it. The problem was if I helped her, I would end up ruining my

credit

> and generally impairing myself financially in ways I can't handle. I

> guess not having good credit was the endpoint for me.

>

> When I started to get mad was when she kept asking me after I said

no:

>

> 1) She asked me for $500 to pay her phone bill, and she said her

phone

> would be turned off in 2 days if she didn't pay it. I said no

because

> I really had nothing left, and I felt horrible about it. Then she

> calls me 4 days later and acts like nothing happened. She tells me

> that she called the phone company and worked something out.

>

> 2) Next she asked me to ask my father's father for money for her so

> she could pay the rent and wouldn't be homeless. This is her

> ex-husband's father, and they got divoriced 15 years ago.

>

> 3) Then, her landlord offered to sell her cars for her to pay for

the

> rent. He sold the first one for most of the money, and was selling

the

> other one for the rest of the amount owed. She called and asked for

> $700 so that she could still have a car. (There is public

> transportation in the area to take her to work.)

>

> I can't even say how these things made me feel, but I'm sure you all

> can guess. I felt like I was doing my best to hold up a wall that I

> was convinced would fall at any moment if I let go. Then I ran out

of

> energy and absolutely could not hold it up anymore, so I let go,

> expecting it to come crashing down, ready for the consequences.

Then,

> it didn't fall down at all. It didn't even crumble a little. And

now I

> feel so fucking used and stupid, and angry. And I'm not holding up

> that damn wall ever again.

>

> I know this is really long, but this is the first time in my life I

> have anyone with whom I can talk about these things. There was even

> more, but I cut it out because this post is way too long. Thanks for

> reading it if you actually made it to the end.

>

> I would really like to know what caused you all to realize that

things

> weren't right.

>

> Melany

>

[Guest guest]

WOW! WOW! I'm so glad you " snapped " and got out of there. That

sounded like something from a horror film.

Tara

Hi Everyone,

>

> I am just curious, when did you finally realize enough was enough

and

> you could no longer tolerate abusive behavior from your BPD parent?

> When did you really realize that you were being abused? Did you get

> angry, or how did you feel?

>

> For me, as I indicated in another post it came after she used me up

> for everything I had, and then still asked for more. She is really

bad

> with money, and completely irresponsible about it. I've been

> continually rescuing her when she couldn't pay her hotel bill,

> couldn't afford her medication for a lung infection, couldn't pay

her

> $1500 cell phone bill (who the hell was she talking to??), couldn't

> pay her rent, when she got in trouble with the IRS, etc. I've been

a

> student for most of this time, so I actually don't have an income,

and

> as such I've had to put mostly all of this on my credit card. I've

> missed out on every spring break and so many other things because

the

> money I set aside went to my mom. I also felt guilty spending any

> money on myself.

>

> Recently I got to the point where I couldn't afford the monthly

> payments on my credit cards, and I was (still am) totally broke and

> restricted financially because of all of this debt. I had to say no

> when she asked me for rent money, and I felt horrible. She told me

all

> of these stories about how hard it is to find housing in her area

and

> they don't care about homeless people, on and on. I really felt

like I

> was about to just let my mom become homeless and not do anything

about

> it. The problem was if I helped her, I would end up ruining my

credit

> and generally impairing myself financially in ways I can't handle.

I

> guess not having good credit was the endpoint for me.

>

> When I started to get mad was when she kept asking me after I said

no:

>

> 1) She asked me for $500 to pay her phone bill, and she said her

phone

> would be turned off in 2 days if she didn't pay it. I said no

because

> I really had nothing left, and I felt horrible about it. Then she

> calls me 4 days later and acts like nothing happened. She tells me

> that she called the phone company and worked something out.

>

> 2) Next she asked me to ask my father's father for money for her so

> she could pay the rent and wouldn't be homeless. This is her

> ex-husband's father, and they got divoriced 15 years ago.

>

> 3) Then, her landlord offered to sell her cars for her to pay for

the

> rent. He sold the first one for most of the money, and was selling

the

> other one for the rest of the amount owed. She called and asked for

> $700 so that she could still have a car. (There is public

> transportation in the area to take her to work.)

>

> I can't even say how these things made me feel, but I'm sure you

all

> can guess. I felt like I was doing my best to hold up a wall that I

> was convinced would fall at any moment if I let go. Then I ran out

of

> energy and absolutely could not hold it up anymore, so I let go,

> expecting it to come crashing down, ready for the consequences.

Then,

> it didn't fall down at all. It didn't even crumble a little. And

now I

> feel so fucking used and stupid, and angry. And I'm not holding up

> that damn wall ever again.

>

> I know this is really long, but this is the first time in my life I

> have anyone with whom I can talk about these things. There was even

> more, but I cut it out because this post is way too long. Thanks

for

> reading it if you actually made it to the end.

>

> I would really like to know what caused you all to realize that

things

> weren't right.

>

> Melany

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

>

> Bunny

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

WOW! WOW! I'm so glad you " snapped " and got out of there. That

sounded like something from a horror film.

Tara

Hi Everyone,

>

> I am just curious, when did you finally realize enough was enough

and

> you could no longer tolerate abusive behavior from your BPD parent?

> When did you really realize that you were being abused? Did you get

> angry, or how did you feel?

>

> For me, as I indicated in another post it came after she used me up

> for everything I had, and then still asked for more. She is really

bad

> with money, and completely irresponsible about it. I've been

> continually rescuing her when she couldn't pay her hotel bill,

> couldn't afford her medication for a lung infection, couldn't pay

her

> $1500 cell phone bill (who the hell was she talking to??), couldn't

> pay her rent, when she got in trouble with the IRS, etc. I've been

a

> student for most of this time, so I actually don't have an income,

and

> as such I've had to put mostly all of this on my credit card. I've

> missed out on every spring break and so many other things because

the

> money I set aside went to my mom. I also felt guilty spending any

> money on myself.

>

> Recently I got to the point where I couldn't afford the monthly

> payments on my credit cards, and I was (still am) totally broke and

> restricted financially because of all of this debt. I had to say no

> when she asked me for rent money, and I felt horrible. She told me

all

> of these stories about how hard it is to find housing in her area

and

> they don't care about homeless people, on and on. I really felt

like I

> was about to just let my mom become homeless and not do anything

about

> it. The problem was if I helped her, I would end up ruining my

credit

> and generally impairing myself financially in ways I can't handle.

I

> guess not having good credit was the endpoint for me.

>

> When I started to get mad was when she kept asking me after I said

no:

>

> 1) She asked me for $500 to pay her phone bill, and she said her

phone

> would be turned off in 2 days if she didn't pay it. I said no

because

> I really had nothing left, and I felt horrible about it. Then she

> calls me 4 days later and acts like nothing happened. She tells me

> that she called the phone company and worked something out.

>

> 2) Next she asked me to ask my father's father for money for her so

> she could pay the rent and wouldn't be homeless. This is her

> ex-husband's father, and they got divoriced 15 years ago.

>

> 3) Then, her landlord offered to sell her cars for her to pay for

the

> rent. He sold the first one for most of the money, and was selling

the

> other one for the rest of the amount owed. She called and asked for

> $700 so that she could still have a car. (There is public

> transportation in the area to take her to work.)

>

> I can't even say how these things made me feel, but I'm sure you

all

> can guess. I felt like I was doing my best to hold up a wall that I

> was convinced would fall at any moment if I let go. Then I ran out

of

> energy and absolutely could not hold it up anymore, so I let go,

> expecting it to come crashing down, ready for the consequences.

Then,

> it didn't fall down at all. It didn't even crumble a little. And

now I

> feel so fucking used and stupid, and angry. And I'm not holding up

> that damn wall ever again.

>

> I know this is really long, but this is the first time in my life I

> have anyone with whom I can talk about these things. There was even

> more, but I cut it out because this post is way too long. Thanks

for

> reading it if you actually made it to the end.

>

> I would really like to know what caused you all to realize that

things

> weren't right.

>

> Melany

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

>

> Bunny

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Tara,

You have found a great way to deal with your parents and your

children. I admire the fact that you did take the necessary steps

to protect your children. In the future, even if they should be

disappointed about not spending more time with their grandparents,

it will not compare with the disappointment you are protecting them

from! However, I think you will be able to deal with this issue as

well as you have been able to come up with a solution to current

visits with their grandparents. You are a good parent!

(I don't think apologies are necessary for the length of anyone's

posts. This is what we are here for!)

Sylvia

>

> First of all, how awful what you went through!

>

> In response to your question about the breaking point...

>

> For me it was kind of gradual, but it had to do with my kids. I

had

> long been aware that there was something " not right " about my

mother -

> the negativity, the outrageous accusations, the random mental

health

> diagnoses that she would come up with for me, etc. Sometimes I

felt

> like it would be much easier just to cut off contact with her, but

> then I would feel guilty for thinking that way, remember that

there

> were many good times (though as I got older they became

increasingly

> fewer and farther between), and get hoovered back in.

>

> After I had my second daughter, I started therapy and treatment

for

> postpartum depression. As my therapist helped me to examine

> underlying issues, it became clear to her that my mother was the

> biggie, and she encouraged me to invite her to some of my

sessions. I

> was dead set against this, and hadn't shared anything about my PPD

or

> therapy with her at all, then one time on the phone, I had allowed

> myself to get dragged into a big, hideous argument. I was crying,

> etc. At first I started to break away before it got too bad by

> saying, " Goodbye Mom, I am not going to do this. I will talk to

you

> another time. I love you. " Before I could hang up, she

said, " Yeah,

> right. " That cut to the bone and I was sucked back in. Anyway,

after

> the conversation went on a while longer, she said, " You need

> therapy! " I broke my vow never to tell her about my " issues " and

> sobbed, " I've been in therapy for a freakin' year and a half! "

> Suddenly she got all fakey sympathetic - " Oh I'm so glad you're

> finally getting help. " Blah blah blah (She had decided that I was

> bipolar, something my therapist vehemently disagrees with - as do

I.

> I have also been seen by a psychiatrist, since my therapist does

not

> prescribe meds, and the psychiatrist doesn't think I'm bipolar

> either.) Anyway, she did end up coming to therapy with me for a

> couple of months. She promised to pay for half of those sessions,

> since they were in addition to my regular therapy sessions, but

she

> never did.

>

> Those therapy sessions, although they did absolutely nothing to

> improve my relationship with my mother, helped me to finally see

her

> for who she is. I used to excuse the horrible things she would say

> when she was raging, thinking she surely couldn't think those

things

> about me - it was just said in the heat of anger and she really

> didn't mean it. In therapy she verified that she really does

believe

> that I'm self-centered, that I deliberately set out to hurt her,

that

> my goal in moving one town away (to a better school district -

that

> was our actual motivation) was to hurt her and keep her

grandchildren

> from her, that I've allowed my husband to " poison " my mind against

> her, the list goes on. I've been split bad for a while now. She

never

> saw the therapy sessions as a chance for both of us to work on our

> relationship. She was just there to " help poor Tara " and let my

> therapist know what an awful, messed up person I really am. UGH.

She

> even said at one point, " Why are you so enmeshed with me? " I guess

> that was one point she was right about. I hope she likes her VERY

LC

> because I ain't enmeshed no more!

>

> Anyway, during the course of these sessions, there was a week that

> was fraught with peril - my brother was visiting from Alaska (we

live

> in NY) and of course, everything had to be perfect. I didn't go

along

> with her every whim. She ended up blowing up in front of my kids

and

> then blatantly lying to my daughter, then 2 1/2, who said, " Why

did

> you yell at my mommy? " (Yes, my kids are very verbal) I was about

to

> jump in with " Mommy and Grandma had a disagreement, but everything

is

> ok honey. We still love each other. " Before I had a chance, my

mother

> (Nada?) said, " Your mommy yelled at me first. " Not only hadn't I

> yelled, I had very calmly whispered so as not to get sucked into

her

> argument and not to scare the kids. My kids knew this, and we

talked

> about it on our way home (this had all happened as we were leaving

so

> that I could, ironically, go to a therapy appointment, and my

mother

> thought I should stay around and so something she wanted me to and

be

> very late to my appointment.) This might seem a bit minor, but it

was

> the straw that broke this camel's back. I told my therapist that

it

> was like the security system in my head went off. She started to

mess

> with my kids and their reality - they had seen and heard what had

> happened - and lights started flashing, sirens wailing, and the

gates

> in my head came crashing down.

>

> Now she and my father see them once a week with us. No

unsupervised

> contact. This might not seem like very LC to some of you, but it

is

> to us. There are no phone calls in between, there is no discussion

of

> anything other than stuff like the weather, etc. They are angry

and

> have tried various ways of trying to get us to relent, but I'm

done.

> The only reason I am keeping this up is for my kids. They love

their

> grandparents very much. I'm wondering how I'm going to handle it

when

> they start asking why they never go to spend the night over there

> anymore, etc. They are now 5 and 3 and they used to do tons of

stuff

> with my parents. There had always been subtle undermining of my

> husband and myself but for some reason that incident showed me

that

> my kids weren't safe from her, and I was just done.

>

> Sorry that was so very long!!!!

>

> Tara

.......

[Guest guest]

Tara,

You have found a great way to deal with your parents and your

children. I admire the fact that you did take the necessary steps

to protect your children. In the future, even if they should be

disappointed about not spending more time with their grandparents,

it will not compare with the disappointment you are protecting them

from! However, I think you will be able to deal with this issue as

well as you have been able to come up with a solution to current

visits with their grandparents. You are a good parent!

(I don't think apologies are necessary for the length of anyone's

posts. This is what we are here for!)

Sylvia

>

> First of all, how awful what you went through!

>

> In response to your question about the breaking point...

>

> For me it was kind of gradual, but it had to do with my kids. I

had

> long been aware that there was something " not right " about my

mother -

> the negativity, the outrageous accusations, the random mental

health

> diagnoses that she would come up with for me, etc. Sometimes I

felt

> like it would be much easier just to cut off contact with her, but

> then I would feel guilty for thinking that way, remember that

there

> were many good times (though as I got older they became

increasingly

> fewer and farther between), and get hoovered back in.

>

> After I had my second daughter, I started therapy and treatment

for

> postpartum depression. As my therapist helped me to examine

> underlying issues, it became clear to her that my mother was the

> biggie, and she encouraged me to invite her to some of my

sessions. I

> was dead set against this, and hadn't shared anything about my PPD

or

> therapy with her at all, then one time on the phone, I had allowed

> myself to get dragged into a big, hideous argument. I was crying,

> etc. At first I started to break away before it got too bad by

> saying, " Goodbye Mom, I am not going to do this. I will talk to

you

> another time. I love you. " Before I could hang up, she

said, " Yeah,

> right. " That cut to the bone and I was sucked back in. Anyway,

after

> the conversation went on a while longer, she said, " You need

> therapy! " I broke my vow never to tell her about my " issues " and

> sobbed, " I've been in therapy for a freakin' year and a half! "

> Suddenly she got all fakey sympathetic - " Oh I'm so glad you're

> finally getting help. " Blah blah blah (She had decided that I was

> bipolar, something my therapist vehemently disagrees with - as do

I.

> I have also been seen by a psychiatrist, since my therapist does

not

> prescribe meds, and the psychiatrist doesn't think I'm bipolar

> either.) Anyway, she did end up coming to therapy with me for a

> couple of months. She promised to pay for half of those sessions,

> since they were in addition to my regular therapy sessions, but

she

> never did.

>

> Those therapy sessions, although they did absolutely nothing to

> improve my relationship with my mother, helped me to finally see

her

> for who she is. I used to excuse the horrible things she would say

> when she was raging, thinking she surely couldn't think those

things

> about me - it was just said in the heat of anger and she really

> didn't mean it. In therapy she verified that she really does

believe

> that I'm self-centered, that I deliberately set out to hurt her,

that

> my goal in moving one town away (to a better school district -

that

> was our actual motivation) was to hurt her and keep her

grandchildren

> from her, that I've allowed my husband to " poison " my mind against

> her, the list goes on. I've been split bad for a while now. She

never

> saw the therapy sessions as a chance for both of us to work on our

> relationship. She was just there to " help poor Tara " and let my

> therapist know what an awful, messed up person I really am. UGH.

She

> even said at one point, " Why are you so enmeshed with me? " I guess

> that was one point she was right about. I hope she likes her VERY

LC

> because I ain't enmeshed no more!

>

> Anyway, during the course of these sessions, there was a week that

> was fraught with peril - my brother was visiting from Alaska (we

live

> in NY) and of course, everything had to be perfect. I didn't go

along

> with her every whim. She ended up blowing up in front of my kids

and

> then blatantly lying to my daughter, then 2 1/2, who said, " Why

did

> you yell at my mommy? " (Yes, my kids are very verbal) I was about

to

> jump in with " Mommy and Grandma had a disagreement, but everything

is

> ok honey. We still love each other. " Before I had a chance, my

mother

> (Nada?) said, " Your mommy yelled at me first. " Not only hadn't I

> yelled, I had very calmly whispered so as not to get sucked into

her

> argument and not to scare the kids. My kids knew this, and we

talked

> about it on our way home (this had all happened as we were leaving

so

> that I could, ironically, go to a therapy appointment, and my

mother

> thought I should stay around and so something she wanted me to and

be

> very late to my appointment.) This might seem a bit minor, but it

was

> the straw that broke this camel's back. I told my therapist that

it

> was like the security system in my head went off. She started to

mess

> with my kids and their reality - they had seen and heard what had

> happened - and lights started flashing, sirens wailing, and the

gates

> in my head came crashing down.

>

> Now she and my father see them once a week with us. No

unsupervised

> contact. This might not seem like very LC to some of you, but it

is

> to us. There are no phone calls in between, there is no discussion

of

> anything other than stuff like the weather, etc. They are angry

and

> have tried various ways of trying to get us to relent, but I'm

done.

> The only reason I am keeping this up is for my kids. They love

their

> grandparents very much. I'm wondering how I'm going to handle it

when

> they start asking why they never go to spend the night over there

> anymore, etc. They are now 5 and 3 and they used to do tons of

stuff

> with my parents. There had always been subtle undermining of my

> husband and myself but for some reason that incident showed me

that

> my kids weren't safe from her, and I was just done.

>

> Sorry that was so very long!!!!

>

> Tara

.......

[Guest guest]

Thanks , You answered questions for me as well. I think that when my mom

passes, I'll grieve, but I think it will be more for what should have been

rather than what was. -

mitchell_kristin wrote: Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

Those are the selfish reasons its easier but I feel for her that her

life was so miserable that she is finally at peace.

Like you, I thought my mom would outlive everyone, even with her 1,00

made up illnesses. I've posted before about all the ones she made up-

some are funny- elephantitis of the ankles, walking around with full

frontal brain atrophy, obsession with bowels and laxatives, I could

go on and on about all of her illnesses.

She was also bipolar (I'm still not sure of all the differences

between bipolar and BPD) and would go into deep depressions, usually

in the winter. She was manic in summer- this was when she would rage-

and depressed in winter. It was this way for years, but the last

year and a half she was alive she was in a deep depression she

couldn't get out of. She didn't rage, didn't leave her apartment

much, and her self injury became more severe. Her suicide attempts

became more serious instead of just attention grabbers.

When she died, I knew instinctively she committed suicide, but my ex

husband insisted her body gave out- she had stopped eating entirely

and was wasting away. I knew better and when cause of death was

confirmed, I was right.

I felt guilty over her death for a long time, but she was in so much

pain, and caused so much pain, that her being gone seems better for

everyone in my family and for her.

There are times I really miss her, when she first died I actually

missed the phone calls and the 10 minute long messages she would

leave me saying absolutely nothing.

My life is much more peaceful now, but I realized recently I was

still living with so much pain over my upbringing and " survival "

skills from childhood that no longer work as an adult. Until I

started reading " Surviving Borderline Parent " I had no clue about all

of my guilt and all of the negative messages I still believed.

She has been dead for a while and I'm still reeling from things, but

this group and the book have been a Godsend to me.

This group was the first time I ever felt I could express things and

have people actually believe me and to know there are others like me.

I hate there are so many of us, but we are all here to share our pain

and feel some validation for all the hell we've been through.

Sorry this is so long, I don't mean to go on and on, but sometimes it

happens...

Love to everyone!

>

> so, it is easier now that she's gone ? I don't mean to

sound " cold " or

> anything, but deep inside me, I can't wait for that day to

come...but she

> goen on and on...like the energizer bunny...she'll probably outlive

all of

> us !!

>

> Jackie

>

>

> I never got a chance to answer this when it first came up, so sorry

> I'm late!

> I feel like my whole life before my mom died was a breaking point!!!

> Her attempts at attention became much much severe as she got older.

> There were so many breaking points, but I never went NC with her. I

> was in limited contact, but she had no respect for boudaries and

> would wait for hours at my home for me to arrive. Usually when I

> came home she would have cut herself and be bleeding all over the

> porch. Her self injury got really bad the last few years of her

life.

>

>

---------------------------------

Don't pick lemons.

See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Guest guest]

Thanks , You answered questions for me as well. I think that when my mom

passes, I'll grieve, but I think it will be more for what should have been

rather than what was. -

mitchell_kristin wrote: Hi Jackie,

You don't sound cold to me, before my mom died I did wish for it

many times.

To answer your question, now I worry about sounding cold, life is

easier now that she's gone. I can answer my phone without worrying,

I can come to work without having to explain to everyone at work that

my mom calls constantly- no matter how much I ask her not to, I can

come home without worrying she is standing on my doorstep bleeding,

hoidays are not such an issue, I don't feel like I'm being hit by a

bus all the time, my life is definitely more manageable.

Those are the selfish reasons its easier but I feel for her that her

life was so miserable that she is finally at peace.

Like you, I thought my mom would outlive everyone, even with her 1,00

made up illnesses. I've posted before about all the ones she made up-

some are funny- elephantitis of the ankles, walking around with full

frontal brain atrophy, obsession with bowels and laxatives, I could

go on and on about all of her illnesses.

She was also bipolar (I'm still not sure of all the differences

between bipolar and BPD) and would go into deep depressions, usually

in the winter. She was manic in summer- this was when she would rage-

and depressed in winter. It was this way for years, but the last

year and a half she was alive she was in a deep depression she

couldn't get out of. She didn't rage, didn't leave her apartment

much, and her self injury became more severe. Her suicide attempts

became more serious instead of just attention grabbers.

When she died, I knew instinctively she committed suicide, but my ex

husband insisted her body gave out- she had stopped eating entirely

and was wasting away. I knew better and when cause of death was

confirmed, I was right.

I felt guilty over her death for a long time, but she was in so much

pain, and caused so much pain, that her being gone seems better for

everyone in my family and for her.

There are times I really miss her, when she first died I actually

missed the phone calls and the 10 minute long messages she would

leave me saying absolutely nothing.

My life is much more peaceful now, but I realized recently I was

still living with so much pain over my upbringing and " survival "

skills from childhood that no longer work as an adult. Until I

started reading " Surviving Borderline Parent " I had no clue about all

of my guilt and all of the negative messages I still believed.

She has been dead for a while and I'm still reeling from things, but

this group and the book have been a Godsend to me.

This group was the first time I ever felt I could express things and

have people actually believe me and to know there are others like me.

I hate there are so many of us, but we are all here to share our pain

and feel some validation for all the hell we've been through.

Sorry this is so long, I don't mean to go on and on, but sometimes it

happens...

Love to everyone!

>

> so, it is easier now that she's gone ? I don't mean to

sound " cold " or

> anything, but deep inside me, I can't wait for that day to

come...but she

> goen on and on...like the energizer bunny...she'll probably outlive

all of

> us !!

>

> Jackie

>

>

> I never got a chance to answer this when it first came up, so sorry

> I'm late!

> I feel like my whole life before my mom died was a breaking point!!!

> Her attempts at attention became much much severe as she got older.

> There were so many breaking points, but I never went NC with her. I

> was in limited contact, but she had no respect for boudaries and

> would wait for hours at my home for me to arrive. Usually when I

> came home she would have cut herself and be bleeding all over the

> porch. Her self injury got really bad the last few years of her

life.

>

>

---------------------------------

Don't pick lemons.

See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

[Guest guest]

Thank you so very much. Now if I can get rid of some of these fleas

I've got...

Tara

> >

> > First of all, how awful what you went through!

> >

> > In response to your question about the breaking point...

> >

> > For me it was kind of gradual, but it had to do with my kids. I

> had

> > long been aware that there was something " not right " about my

> mother -

> > the negativity, the outrageous accusations, the random mental

> health

> > diagnoses that she would come up with for me, etc. Sometimes I

> felt

> > like it would be much easier just to cut off contact with her,

but

> > then I would feel guilty for thinking that way, remember that

> there

> > were many good times (though as I got older they became

> increasingly

> > fewer and farther between), and get hoovered back in.

> >

> > After I had my second daughter, I started therapy and treatment

> for

> > postpartum depression. As my therapist helped me to examine

> > underlying issues, it became clear to her that my mother was the

> > biggie, and she encouraged me to invite her to some of my

> sessions. I

> > was dead set against this, and hadn't shared anything about my

PPD

> or

> > therapy with her at all, then one time on the phone, I had

allowed

> > myself to get dragged into a big, hideous argument. I was crying,

> > etc. At first I started to break away before it got too bad by

> > saying, " Goodbye Mom, I am not going to do this. I will talk to

> you

> > another time. I love you. " Before I could hang up, she

> said, " Yeah,

> > right. " That cut to the bone and I was sucked back in. Anyway,

> after

> > the conversation went on a while longer, she said, " You need

> > therapy! " I broke my vow never to tell her about my " issues " and

> > sobbed, " I've been in therapy for a freakin' year and a half! "

> > Suddenly she got all fakey sympathetic - " Oh I'm so glad you're

> > finally getting help. " Blah blah blah (She had decided that I was

> > bipolar, something my therapist vehemently disagrees with - as do

> I.

> > I have also been seen by a psychiatrist, since my therapist does

> not

> > prescribe meds, and the psychiatrist doesn't think I'm bipolar

> > either.) Anyway, she did end up coming to therapy with me for a

> > couple of months. She promised to pay for half of those sessions,

> > since they were in addition to my regular therapy sessions, but

> she

> > never did.

> >

> > Those therapy sessions, although they did absolutely nothing to

> > improve my relationship with my mother, helped me to finally see

> her

> > for who she is. I used to excuse the horrible things she would

say

> > when she was raging, thinking she surely couldn't think those

> things

> > about me - it was just said in the heat of anger and she really

> > didn't mean it. In therapy she verified that she really does

> believe

> > that I'm self-centered, that I deliberately set out to hurt her,

> that

> > my goal in moving one town away (to a better school district -

> that

> > was our actual motivation) was to hurt her and keep her

> grandchildren

> > from her, that I've allowed my husband to " poison " my mind

against

> > her, the list goes on. I've been split bad for a while now. She

> never

> > saw the therapy sessions as a chance for both of us to work on

our

> > relationship. She was just there to " help poor Tara " and let my

> > therapist know what an awful, messed up person I really am. UGH.

> She

> > even said at one point, " Why are you so enmeshed with me? " I

guess

> > that was one point she was right about. I hope she likes her VERY

> LC

> > because I ain't enmeshed no more!

> >

> > Anyway, during the course of these sessions, there was a week

that

> > was fraught with peril - my brother was visiting from Alaska (we

> live

> > in NY) and of course, everything had to be perfect. I didn't go

> along

> > with her every whim. She ended up blowing up in front of my kids

> and

> > then blatantly lying to my daughter, then 2 1/2, who said, " Why

> did

> > you yell at my mommy? " (Yes, my kids are very verbal) I was about

> to

> > jump in with " Mommy and Grandma had a disagreement, but

everything

> is

> > ok honey. We still love each other. " Before I had a chance, my

> mother

> > (Nada?) said, " Your mommy yelled at me first. " Not only hadn't I

> > yelled, I had very calmly whispered so as not to get sucked into

> her

> > argument and not to scare the kids. My kids knew this, and we

> talked

> > about it on our way home (this had all happened as we were

leaving

> so

> > that I could, ironically, go to a therapy appointment, and my

> mother

> > thought I should stay around and so something she wanted me to

and

> be

> > very late to my appointment.) This might seem a bit minor, but it

> was

> > the straw that broke this camel's back. I told my therapist that

> it

> > was like the security system in my head went off. She started to

> mess

> > with my kids and their reality - they had seen and heard what had

> > happened - and lights started flashing, sirens wailing, and the

> gates

> > in my head came crashing down.

> >

> > Now she and my father see them once a week with us. No

> unsupervised

> > contact. This might not seem like very LC to some of you, but it

> is

> > to us. There are no phone calls in between, there is no

discussion

> of

> > anything other than stuff like the weather, etc. They are angry

> and

> > have tried various ways of trying to get us to relent, but I'm

> done.

> > The only reason I am keeping this up is for my kids. They love

> their

> > grandparents very much. I'm wondering how I'm going to handle it

> when

> > they start asking why they never go to spend the night over there

> > anymore, etc. They are now 5 and 3 and they used to do tons of

> stuff

> > with my parents. There had always been subtle undermining of my

> > husband and myself but for some reason that incident showed me

> that

> > my kids weren't safe from her, and I was just done.

> >

> > Sorry that was so very long!!!!

> >

> > Tara

> ......

>