Re: holding the opposites

[Guest guest]

And should add, inflation isn't some failing, but is part of process

(think: opportunity!), a blessing, Integration from awareness:

" ...It is not man as such who has to be regenerated or born again as a

renewed whole, but, according to the statements of mythology, it is

the hero or god who rejuvenates himself. These figures are generally

expressed or characterized by libido-symbols (light, fire, sun, etc.),

so that it looks as if they represented psychic energy. They are, in

fact, personifications of the libido.

Now it is a fact amply confirmed by psychiatric experience that all

parts of the psyche, inasmuch as they possess a certain autonomy,

exhibit a personal character, like the split-off products of hysteria

and schizophrenia, mediumistic 'spirits'; figures seen in dreams, etc.

Every split-off portion of libido, every complex, has or is a

(fragmentary) personality. At any rate, that is how it looks from the

purely observational standpoint.

But when we go into the matter more deeply, we find that they are

really archetypal formations. There are no conclusive arguments

against the hypothesis that these archetypal figures are endowed with

personality at the outset and are not just secondary personalizations.

In so far as the archetypes do not represent mere functional

relationships, they manifest themselves as daimones, as personal

agencies. In this form they are felt as actual experiences and are not

" figments of the imagination, " as rationalism would have us believe.

Consequently, man derives his human personality only secondarily from

what the myths call his descent from the gods and heroes; or, to put

it in psychological terms, his consciousness of himself as a

personality derives primarily from the influence of quasi-personal

archetypes.

Numerous mythological proofs could be advanced in support of this

view. .... It is, then, in the first place the god who transforms

himself, and only through him does man take part in the

transformation. ... " ~CGJUNG, in CW5, SYMBOLS OF TRANSFORMATION

Dare say we're mere cauldrons, all that crazy union ahappening.

[Guest guest]

And how and who assists the mass mind collective along the human journey? The realization that we live as individuals, bit by bit uniting opposites, branching out, growing... that fractal image wakes up. Takes a strong vessel to sail these seas. 

[Guest guest]

So the mass mind is a noun,an entity. We are the individual parts of it;our on-going daily function,uniting opposites, Why? As for fuel/food for the collective mind? So the collective mind thus fed must be becoming more whole, more conscious.We must go about our daily, difficult jobs of uniting the opposites.So there is no free will, we are here to perform a function?

Thanks Deborah,

Gail

Re: holding the opposites

And how and who assists the mass mind collective along the human journey? The realization that we live as individuals, bit by bit uniting opposites, branching out, growing... that fractal image wakes up. Takes a strong vessel to sail these seas.

[Guest guest]

Job Candidate: Humans

Job Description: Uniting Opposites

Employer: Collective Mind

Objective? Why, why, why?

Length of Service: Infinity?

Re: holding the opposites

And how and who assists the mass mind collective along the human journey? The realization that we live as individuals, bit by bit uniting opposites, branching out, growing... that fractal image wakes up. Takes a strong vessel to sail these seas.

[Guest guest]

The mass mind is an entitiy. The collective unconcious is an entity. Humanity as a whole can be described as an entity, ie: the human race. Entities have function,but that is not necessarily all that they have, nor do they necessarily have only one. I am a psychologist. It is my function. It does not define my existance or my individuality or my place in the universe. It is just a function I have. While we can easily argue that I am pre disposed to this function, I am not compelled to it and did not, in fact, chose to pursue it until I was well in my 40's. I also bake and decorate a mean wedding cake and spent some time as a baker--another of my functions, if you will--but left that to do else. I am not sure that having the function of adding to the human collective mind (assuming that that is a pre-established function--arguably incorrect if one considers the number of human beings who add virtually nothing to that mind and may actually detract from it...) limits free will any more than any other limitation of humanity--say not being able to fly unassisted, for example.

Re: holding the opposites

And how and who assists the mass mind collective along the human journey? The realization that we live as individuals, bit by bit uniting opposites, branching out, growing... that fractal image wakes up. Takes a strong vessel to sail these seas.

[Guest guest]

Yes, if it is only one function or purpose, I agree. But I understood the entry as all behavior is organized toward that goal including instinct and self directed behavior, perhaps without our consciousness of the fact?

Re: holding the opposites

And how and who assists the mass mind collective along the human journey? The realization that we live as individuals, bit by bit uniting opposites, branching out, growing... that fractal image wakes up. Takes a strong vessel to sail these seas.

[Guest guest]

 

Yes, if it is only one function or purpose, I agree. But I understood the entry as all behavior is organized toward that goal including instinct and self directed behavior, perhaps without our consciousness of the fact?

*The original statement was: " And

how and who assists the mass mind collective along the human journey? The realization that we live as individuals, bit by bit uniting opposites, branching out, growing... that fractal image wakes up. Takes a

strong vessel to sail these seas.Just thought i'd point out. --

Take more time, cover less ground.

~ Merton - Dancing In The Waters of LifeAbove all, don't wish to become a future Buddha.

Your only concernas thought follows thought,should be to avoid clinging to any of them.

~Dogen Zenji (1200 - 1253) 

To

practice self-liberating thoughts, whatever thought arises in your mind, just look at it and let go and relax. Look straight at its essential nature and let go and relax; it will be self-liberated. Do not

concern yourself with what you are thinking about. Do not concern yourself with the object of your thoughts, whether it is a person or a thing. Just look at the essence of the thought itself.

~From The Melody of Dharmata: Verses on the Profound View of the Middle Way, by Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso Rinpoche, translated by Ari Goldfield & Jim , P.47.

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.

[Guest guest]

With all of the capitalization,and highlighting,your post sounds a bit

"oppositional" in nature. Just thought I'd point that out :-) Perhaps uniting the opposites needs to occur on an individual level first, toward increased consciousness, in this case, when posting one's ideas?

Re: holding the opposites

Yes, if it is only one function or purpose, I agree. But I understood the entry as all behavior is organized toward that goal including instinct and self directed behavior, perhaps without our consciousness of the fact?

*The original statement was: "And how and who assists the mass mind collective along the human journey? The realization that we live as individuals, bit by bit uniting opposites, branching out, growing... that fractal image wakes up. Takes a strong vessel to sail these seas.

Just thought i'd point out.

--

Take more time, cover less ground.

~ Merton - Dancing In The Waters of Life

Above all, don't wish to become a future Buddha.

Your only concern

as thought follows thought,

should be to avoid clinging to any of them.

~Dogen Zenji (1200 - 1253)

To practice self-liberating thoughts, whatever thought arises in your mind, just look at it and let go and relax. Look straight at its essential nature and let go and relax; it will be self-liberated. Do not concern yourself with what you are thinking about. Do not concern yourself with the object of your thoughts, whether it is a person or a thing. Just look at the essence of the thought itself.

~From The Melody of Dharmata: Verses on the Profound View of the Middle Way, by Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso Rinpoche, translated by Ari Goldfield & Jim , P.47.

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.

[Guest guest]

no... it was merely meant to be indicative... google, unfortunately, does not allow for sensitive highlighting such as i would have preferred.that said, i must also add that i found your comments on it - the ones i was responding to - somewhat oppositional too...

as we've said before on this forum, pity we can't see each other and hear tones of voice... i'm sure nine tenths of that sort of misunderstanding would be cleared up in a trice.beautiful day here in my rainbow filled meditation room... i wish you the same

--

Take more time, cover less ground.

~ Merton - Dancing In The Waters of LifeAbove all, don't wish to become a future Buddha.

Your only concernas thought follows thought,should be to avoid clinging to any of them.

~Dogen Zenji (1200 - 1253) 

To

practice self-liberating thoughts, whatever thought arises in your mind, just look at it and let go and relax. Look straight at its essential nature and let go and relax; it will be self-liberated. Do not

concern yourself with what you are thinking about. Do not concern yourself with the object of your thoughts, whether it is a person or a thing. Just look at the essence of the thought itself.

~From The Melody of Dharmata: Verses on the Profound View of the Middle Way, by Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso Rinpoche, translated by Ari Goldfield & Jim , P.47.

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.

[Guest guest]

I think it's quite difficult being human.And to be peaceful, to be conscious, for all of us, is difficult on an individual level. When it comes down to it, all we can do is manage/cleanse our own fears,etc. and this will then affect the world in a positive manner, how could it not? This is very difficult work. Because we are all self-oriented we do not always see our affect on other people, other living things, the environment,etc. We all have to address this as individuals And I think this is the essence of the original post. It is indeed profoundly difficult work for us all.Thank you,it is a most beautiful day,and best wishes to you Mike and to all....

Re: holding the opposites

no... it was merely meant to be indicative... google, unfortunately, does not allow for sensitive highlighting such as i would have preferred.

that said, i must also add that i found your comments on it - the ones i was responding to - somewhat oppositional too...

as we've said before on this forum, pity we can't see each other and hear tones of voice... i'm sure nine tenths of that sort of misunderstanding would be cleared up in a trice.

beautiful day here in my rainbow filled meditation room... i wish you the same

--

Take more time, cover less ground.

~ Merton - Dancing In The Waters of Life

Above all, don't wish to become a future Buddha.

Your only concern

as thought follows thought,

should be to avoid clinging to any of them.

~Dogen Zenji (1200 - 1253)

To practice self-liberating thoughts, whatever thought arises in your mind, just look at it and let go and relax. Look straight at its essential nature and let go and relax; it will be self-liberated. Do not concern yourself with what you are thinking about. Do not concern yourself with the object of your thoughts, whether it is a person or a thing. Just look at the essence of the thought itself.

~From The Melody of Dharmata: Verses on the Profound View of the Middle Way, by Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso Rinpoche, translated by Ari Goldfield & Jim , P.47.

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.

[Guest guest]

This speaks to me on the subject.

THE CONJUNCTION “OR”

Yannis Ritsos translated by Kimon

Friar

Then brazen Ares bellowed as loud as

nine

Or ten thousand men who scream as

they clash in battle.

Illiad

When the spear

of Diomedes, guided by the hand of the goddess,

pierced into the

side of the savage god, then helmeted Ares

bellowed so

loudly that both the Achaeans and the Trojans were

terrified,

because it was

(says the Poet) as though nine or ten thousand

frenzied

warriors had roared together,

Oh that “or”

an expression of

both mocking and noble accuracy,

the ambiguous

smile of a uncommunicable and unparticipating

wisdom

that turns

derisively against itself and others

knowing full

well that accuracy is unachievable,

that accuracy

does not exists (and this is why

the pompous tone

of certainty is unforgivable – may God help us ).

“OR,”

conjunction, humble consequence of the mystery of

ambiguity,

deep correlation

among the multiplicity of essences and

phenomena,

it is with you

we adjust to the difficulties of life and dream,

to the many

nuances and versions between black to invisible white.

June 8, 1969

To: JUNG-FIRE From: ekutn@...Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2011 14:00:40 -0400Subject: Re: holding the opposites

I think it's quite difficult being human.And to be peaceful, to be conscious, for all of us, is difficult on an individual level. When it comes down to it, all we can do is manage/cleanse our own fears,etc. and this will then affect the world in a positive manner, how could it not? This is very difficult work. Because we are all self-oriented we do not always see our affect on other people, other living things, the environment,etc. We all have to address this as individuals And I think this is the essence of the original post. It is indeed profoundly difficult work for us all.Thank you,it is a most beautiful day,and best wishes to you Mike and to all....

Re: holding the opposites

no... it was merely meant to be indicative... google, unfortunately, does not allow for sensitive highlighting such as i would have preferred.

that said, i must also add that i found your comments on it - the ones i was responding to - somewhat oppositional too...

as we've said before on this forum, pity we can't see each other and hear tones of voice... i'm sure nine tenths of that sort of misunderstanding would be cleared up in a trice.

beautiful day here in my rainbow filled meditation room... i wish you the same

--

Take more time, cover less ground.

~ Merton - Dancing In The Waters of Life

Above all, don't wish to become a future Buddha.

Your only concern

as thought follows thought,

should be to avoid clinging to any of them.

~Dogen Zenji (1200 - 1253)

To practice self-liberating thoughts, whatever thought arises in your mind, just look at it and let go and relax. Look straight at its essential nature and let go and relax; it will be self-liberated. Do not concern yourself with what you are thinking about. Do not concern yourself with the object of your thoughts, whether it is a person or a thing. Just look at the essence of the thought itself.

~From The Melody of Dharmata: Verses on the Profound View of the Middle Way, by Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso Rinpoche, translated by Ari Goldfield & Jim , P.47.

Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.