Re: Oh dear, I apologize for apologizing for Kahlil Gibran

April 20, 2012

Remember the immortal words of Jung himself. " I am glad I am Jung and not a

Jungian. " And remember too that some Jungians like Alice have avoided becoming

one of the " Jungians " Jung was referring to...

>

> Subject: Oh dear, I apologize for apologizing for Kahlil Gibran

> To: JUNG-FIRE

> Date: Friday, April 20, 2012, 5:06 PM

>

> Â

>

> Of course I had not read but only skimmed before I

> was carried away by that glory of double negatives exploding

> everthing I every thought about fortunate or otherwise into

> fireworks.

>

> I probably run with a rougher crowd -- although somewhere in

> the illustrated Jung (the books for therapists, not the ones

> for artists) are some suggestions of the rotters we all

> are.

>

> Among the five dear people who moved underground these last

> 18 months was one who seemed to have expired from too much

> niceness, having expelled everthing but love and light from

> his vocabulary. He was an astrologer.

>

> Jane Axtell

>

April 21, 2012

Will someone please list the qualities that makes one a " Jungian " ? Is this a personal prejudice of a few or are there actually well-known traits that makes that particular group such an undesirable lot?

Thanks in advance,Jim

Remember the immortal words of Jung himself. " I am glad I am Jung and not a Jungian. " And remember too that some Jungians like Alice have avoided becoming one of the " Jungians " Jung was referring to...

>

> Subject: Oh dear, I apologize for apologizing for Kahlil Gibran

> To: JUNG-FIRE

> Date: Friday, April 20, 2012, 5:06 PM

>

> Of course I had not read but only skimmed before I

> was carried away by that glory of double negatives exploding

> everthing I every thought about fortunate or otherwise into

> fireworks.

>

> I probably run with a rougher crowd -- although somewhere in

> the illustrated Jung (the books for therapists, not the ones

> for artists) are some suggestions of the rotters we all

> are.

>

> Among the five dear people who moved underground these last

> 18 months was one who seemed to have expired from too much

> niceness, having expelled everthing but love and light from

> his vocabulary. He was an astrologer.

>

> Jane Axtell

>

April 21, 2012

Perhaps the double negative was meant as written: That Jungians don't run around assisting the LESS unfortunate. (It's very difficult to help the less unfortunate, but almost anyone is MORE unfortunate in some dimension of life.) This would make the Jungian behavior honorable and wise.

Of course it is always more interesting to be an originator (although more difficult in another way) since there is nothing to be learned but reality.

This reminds me a bit of a brother who had run those Briggs Meyers test on employees to understand how to work with them better. He own score ended with a J for "judgmental" which he described as a quick decider. "If it turns out I am wrong I can always change the decision."

Nineteen years later at the next tribal gathering he was more realistic about how is position made that easy. What if Jung turns out to have been wrong? For Jung it was easy to include more awareness, but how does a Jungian make such a shift? (There actually are right answers.)

Will someone please list the qualities that makes one a "Jungian"? Is this a personal prejudice of a few or are there actually well-known traits that makes that particular group such an undesirable lot?Thanks in advance,Jim

Remember the immortal words of Jung himself. "I am glad I am Jung and not a Jungian." And remember too that some Jungians like Alice have avoided becoming one of the "Jungians" Jung was referring to...> > Subject: Oh dear, I apologize for apologizing for Kahlil Gibran> To: JUNG-FIRE > Date: Friday, April 20, 2012, 5:06 PM

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Of course I had not read but only skimmed before I> was carried away by that glory of double negatives exploding> everthing I every thought about fortunate or otherwise into> fireworks.> > > > I probably run with a rougher crowd -- although somewhere in> the illustrated Jung (the books for therapists, not the ones> for artists) are some suggestions of the rotters we all> are.> > > > Among the five dear people who moved underground these last> 18 months was one who seemed to have expired from too much> niceness, having expelled everthing but love and light from> his vocabulary. He was an astrologer.> > > > Jane Axtell> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

April 21, 2012

Buber, from I and Thou

Good people and evil,wise and foolish,beautiful and ugly...confront him( the other) as Thou.In a wonderful way,from time to time,...he(I) can be effective,helping,healing,educating,raising up,saving.Love is responsibility of an I for a Thou....from the blessedly protected man...to him who is all his life nailed to the cross of the world,and who ventures to bring himself to the dreadful point-to love all men.

Oh dear, I apologize for apologizing for Kahlil Gibran

> To: JUNG-FIRE

> Date: Friday, April 20, 2012, 5:06 PM

>

> Of course I had not read but only skimmed before I

> was carried away by that glory of double negatives exploding

> everthing I every thought about fortunate or otherwise into

> fireworks.

>

> I probably run with a rougher crowd -- although somewhere in

> the illustrated Jung (the books for therapists, not the ones

> for artists) are some suggestions of the rotters we all

> are.

>

> Among the five dear people who moved underground these last

> 18 months was one who seemed to have expired from too much

> niceness, having expelled everthing but love and light from

> his vocabulary. He was an astrologer.

>

> Jane Axtell

>

April 21, 2012

Don't you think Buber is a bit hoity toity in his one way listings.. good deeds

belong to the I " helping,healing,educating,raising up,saving " although Thou is

all over the place -- " Good people and evil,wise and foolish,beautiful and

ugly " .

The truth is that amy particular I is likely to be sloppily needing help,

healing, education and a bit of raising. In the therapeutic structure one cannot

demand that the needs of " I " be met by the fee-paying Thou. (Probably why

therapists were expected to have therapists.)

People teach me " stuff " all the time, improving me with " stuff " I would never

have volunteered to study. I quit doing astrology for most folks nearly a decade

ago now, mainly because I couldn't bear the naive expectation of being able to

discover all answers.

I was more naive in my day, but either the answers were in the library, or no

one knew them. It was understood that you had to grow into some things.

I'm about to start a new topic about the culture, but hey, activity is good,

isn't it?

Jane Axtell

>

> >

> > Subject: Oh dear, I apologize for apologizing for Kahlil Gibran

> > To: JUNG-FIRE

> > Date: Friday, April 20, 2012, 5:06 PM

>

> >

> > Of course I had not read but only skimmed before I

> > was carried away by that glory of double negatives exploding

> > everthing I every thought about fortunate or otherwise into

> > fireworks.

> >

> > I probably run with a rougher crowd -- although somewhere in

> > the illustrated Jung (the books for therapists, not the ones

> > for artists) are some suggestions of the rotters we all

> > are.

> >

> > Among the five dear people who moved underground these last

> > 18 months was one who seemed to have expired from too much

> > niceness, having expelled everthing but love and light from

> > his vocabulary. He was an astrologer.

> >

> > Jane Axtell

> >

>

April 21, 2012

I don't know, Buber doesn't strike me as hoity toity .Conneced at a deeper level,reflective, I would say.He makes it clear how difficult the task is to love everyone. He indicates that it is only when we see the other as a thou, not an it( no matter whom) that this lifting/helping of other can occur.Excerpts do not always impart what the lengthy context imples or says, unfortunately. In the longer passage,p. 15 (for anyone interested) he indicates that this perception of other as thou is not always possible, but when we can move into this zone, we connect and can be of potential help to others and they to us.When I relate to other as thou,and not it, it seems to be genuinely felt and recipricated on some level,and almost always evokes a much deeper communication beyond ego.It's difficult to remain in this mindframe, and therein lies the problem.

- Per therapists, I think Jungian therapists can relate their humanness w/ in the context of therapy to a certain extent, no?This is a bonding/connecting experience for the client as well, and engenders the client's therapeutic growth (just my experience). And of course, doing one's own work in therapy is always important.

Oh dear, I apologize for apologizing for Kahlil Gibran

> > To: JUNG-FIRE

> > Date: Friday, April 20, 2012, 5:06 PM

>

> >

> > Of course I had not read but only skimmed before I

> > was carried away by that glory of double negatives exploding

> > everthing I every thought about fortunate or otherwise into

> > fireworks.

> >

> > I probably run with a rougher crowd -- although somewhere in

> > the illustrated Jung (the books for therapists, not the ones

> > for artists) are some suggestions of the rotters we all

> > are.

> >

> > Among the five dear people who moved underground these last

> > 18 months was one who seemed to have expired from too much

> > niceness, having expelled everthing but love and light from

> > his vocabulary. He was an astrologer.

> >

> > Jane Axtell

> >

>

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