Re: T-2® Trichothecene Mycotoxin Urine Test Kit

[Guest guest]

I suggest that you look up Stachybotrys and its mycotoxins at wikipedia. Also

look up T-2 toxin at wikipedia. Wikipedia does a good review for the layman.

Whomever is pushing the T-2Toxin test must demonstrate to the public that the

laboratory is registered with CLIA. That the laboratory has passed all CLIA

inspections with respect to the validation of the test. The T-2 test kit was

developed to detect T-2 toxins in animal feed, not human urine. I read in a

post that the pusher of this test claims it was developed by the military.

The military is not CLIA nor is it the FDA. FDA regulates human testing via

CLIA.

I am tired of wasting my energy on this matter. If you wish to use test that

will not be accepted in the court of law and does not tesst for the mycotoxins

produced by Stachybotrys then waste your money, but not my time.

Jack D. Thrasher, Ph.D.

Toxicologist/Immunotoxicologist/Fetaltoxicologist

www.drthrasher.org

toxicologist1@...

Off: 916-745-4703

Cell: 575-937-1150

L. Crawley, M.ED., LADC

Trauma Specialist

sandracrawley@...

916-745-4703 - Off

775-309-3994 - Cell

This message and any attachments forwarded with it is to be considered

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Thank you in advance for your compliance.

[Guest guest]

Here is website on T-2- Test kits. They were developed for testing of T-1 Toxin

in foods not human urine.

Also, T-1 Toxin studied by the Army and yellow rain is produced by Fusarium, not

Stachybotrys

http://www.vicam.com/aw/myco/?gclid=COjn9PLW85sCFQ6jagodzDAm-g

Jack D. Thrasher, Ph.D.

Toxicologist/Immunotoxicologist/Fetaltoxicologist

www.drthrasher.org

toxicologist1@...

Off: 916-745-4703

Cell: 575-937-1150

L. Crawley, M.ED., LADC

Trauma Specialist

sandracrawley@...

916-745-4703 - Off

775-309-3994 - Cell

This message and any attachments forwarded with it is to be considered

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(and any attachments) without my prior written consent is strictly prohibited

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message in error, please reply immediately to advise the sender of the

miscommunication and then delete the message and any copies you have printed.

Thank you in advance for your compliance.

[Guest guest]

---

Carl, I know your post was for but this is the first time I have read

that tricothecine can be from food. I NEVER knew that certain foods can cause

tricothecine to show up in the urine. Are these foods the typical yeasty or high

sugar foods like bread, pasties etc? Can Candida in the body cause a high

triocthecine level? Thank you. Diane

In , " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...> wrote:

>

>

> Without getting into the specifics of your testing, we must be clear

> about what various tests can and cannot do. Your question is

> assumes a direct connection from Stachybotrys to a mycotoxin in

> the body. Actually, it also assumes that a sample was collected

> and analyzed which showed Stachybotrys and you were exposed

> to the Stachy and it produced Tricothesines in your body and that

> is what what made you ill. But there are a lot of assumptions

> here.

>

[Guest guest]

Diane,

I may have mis-spoke with that illustrative point. I should have

used the word " mycotoxin " instead of listing a specific mycotoxin

such trichothecine. Sorry if I confused any of you.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

>

>

> ---

> Carl, I know your post was for but this is the first time I have read

that tricothecine can be from food. I

> NEVER knew that certain foods can cause tricothecine to show up in the urine.

Are these foods the typical

> yeasty or high sugar foods like bread, pasties etc? Can Candida in the body

cause a high triocthecine level?

> Thank you. Diane

>

> In groups (DOT) com, " Carl E. Grimes " <grimes@...> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Without getting into the specifics of your testing, we must be clear

> > about what various tests can and cannot do. Your question is

> > assumes a direct connection from Stachybotrys to a mycotoxin in

> > the body. Actually, it also assumes that a sample was collected

> > and analyzed which showed Stachybotrys and you were exposed

> > to the Stachy and it produced Tricothesines in your body and that

> > is what what made you ill. But there are a lot of assumptions

> > here.

> >

>

>

[Guest guest]

I must be dead in the head, I missed that. GREAT QUESTION Dianne. I will wait

for the answer but sure makes alot of sence. Candida is a b*%#h.

>

>

> Without getting into the specifics of your testing, we must be clear

> about what various tests can and cannot do. Your question is

> assumes a direct connection from Stachybotrys to a mycotoxin in

> the body. Actually, it also assumes that a sample was collected

> and analyzed which showed Stachybotrys and you were exposed

> to the Stachy and it produced Tricothesines in your body and that

> is what what made you ill. But there are a lot of assumptions

> here.

>

[Guest guest]

Carl, I wasnt confused till I just read this...Ha ha

> >

> >

> > Without getting into the specifics of your testing, we must be clear

> > about what various tests can and cannot do. Your question is

> > assumes a direct connection from Stachybotrys to a mycotoxin in

> > the body. Actually, it also assumes that a sample was collected

> > and analyzed which showed Stachybotrys and you were exposed

> > to the Stachy and it produced Tricothesines in your body and that

> > is what what made you ill. But there are a lot of assumptions

> > here.

> >

>

>

[Guest guest]

OT: Carl, Is there any equipment that measures dryer exhaust outside. I live on

the third floor and the washers are down on the ground floor, A girl next

balcony over has a washer but most people use the washers downstairs. I thought

being on a hight level I would be away from the exhaust. I have tried living on

every level through the years at differt complexes.

Sometimes the fumes are so strong I can't believe this is allowed. One woman

uses pinsole to wash. I have always wanted to get some legislator to do

something about putting dryer exhaust vents in new construction away from

windows. I don't understand why nothing is ever done about this issue. Just

wondering if there is some way to measure the chemicals? Thanks,

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Chris: As Carl knows, there is much written on the subject of cereal grains and

trichothecenes. You can do a

Google search and find the following:

Foroud NA, Eudes F. 2009 Trichothecens in Cereal Grains. Int J Mol Sci

10:147-73.

National Research Council. 1993 Protection against trichothecene mycotoxins.

In the treatise by the NRC, 1993 The species and genera of molds that produce

trichothecenes are discussed beginning on page 21. The trichothecenes are of

two basic types: simple and macrocyclic. The simple ones are characterized by

Fusarium species, e.g. -T-2 toxin, while the macrocyclics are produced by

Stachybotrys (Saratoxins, Roridins, etc.). The molds that produce

trichothecenes are: Fusarium, Acremonium, Trichoderma, Trichothecium,

Myrothecium, Stachybotrys and possibly Cylindrocarpon.

If you look at the paper by Furoud and Eudes you will find that the

trichothecenes found in cereal grains are mainly from Fusarium species, which

means simple trichothecenes, e.g. T-2 toxins.

The urine test detects mainly macrocyclic trichothecenes which can be produced

by Trichoderma viridae, Stachybotrys and Myrothecium.

Finally, Candida sp do not produce trichothecenes. The danger of Candida

species comes from gliotoxin, which is also produced by Aspergillus flavus,

niger, terreus and fumigatus. Gliotoxn has been detected in the sera of cancer

patients with Aspergillosis in infections resulting from these four species.

You can find the these papers on Gliotoxin by doing an entrez pubmed search for

RE gliotoxin aspergillosis cancer patients.

Finally, I would like to point out once again regarding fine particles and the

indoor environment. There is a fairly recent paper by Reponen et al, 2007 (do a

google search) for Reponen T. Fungal fragments in mold houses, Atmos Environ

2007 41:8140-49) shows that fine fungal fragements less than the size of spores

are predominant and up to 500 times more concentrated than fungal spores in

indoor environments. Dr. Reponen adequately reviews the literature on this

subject which includes the papers by Brasel and Gorny. These fine particles

contain mycotoxins and other toxins produced by molds and bacteria.

You need to educate yourself in order to understand what is going on in the

ibiocomplexity of the ndoor environment resulting from microbial growth (molds

and bacteria).

Jack D. Thrasher, Ph.D.

Toxicologist/Immunotoxicologist/Fetaltoxicologist

www.drthrasher.org

toxicologist1@...

Off: 916-745-4703

Cell: 575-937-1150

L. Crawley, M.ED., LADC

Trauma Specialist

sandracrawley@...

916-745-4703 - Off

775-309-3994 - Cell

This message and any attachments forwarded with it is to be considered

privileged and confidential. The forwarding or redistribution of this message

(and any attachments) without my prior written consent is strictly prohibited

and may violate privacy laws. Once the intended purpose of this message has been

served, please destroy the original message contents. If you have received this

message in error, please reply immediately to advise the sender of the

miscommunication and then delete the message and any copies you have printed.

Thank you in advance for your compliance.

[Guest guest]

Dr Thrasher,

A quick addition for the group about the very small partical sizes

you mentioned. One way to measure exposure is by particle

count. As the spores and growth structures fragment the number

of particles increase. But the total weight (mass), another way of

measuring potential exposure, of mold spores and fragments in

the air stays the same.

discussed at the Orlando conference in April another

way in which exposure can increase. Not only do the number of

particles increase, but the surface area of the particles increase

as they get smaller. Which means the exposure can increase

even more than just from more particles even though the total

mass remains the same. This is not considered in traditional

toxicological or epidemiological studies.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

Chris: As Carl knows, there is much written on the subject of cereal

grains and trichothecenes. You can do a

Google search and find the following:

Foroud NA, Eudes F. 2009 Trichothecens in Cereal Grains. Int J Mol Sci

10:147-73.

National Research Council. 1993 Protection against trichothecene

mycotoxins.

In the treatise by the NRC, 1993 The species and genera of molds that

produce trichothecenes are discussed beginning on page 21. The

trichothecenes are of two basic types: simple and macrocyclic. The

simple ones are characterized by Fusarium species, e.g. -T-2 toxin, while

the macrocyclics are produced by Stachybotrys (Saratoxins, Roridins,

etc.). The molds that produce trichothecenes are: Fusarium,

Acremonium, Trichoderma, Trichothecium, Myrothecium, Stachybotrys

and possibly Cylindrocarpon.

If you look at the paper by Furoud and Eudes you will find that the

trichothecenes found in cereal grains are mainly from Fusarium species,

which means simple trichothecenes, e.g. T-2 toxins.

The urine test detects mainly macrocyclic trichothecenes which can be

produced by Trichoderma viridae, Stachybotrys and Myrothecium.

Finally, Candida sp do not produce trichothecenes. The danger of

Candida species comes from gliotoxin, which is also produced by

Aspergillus flavus, niger, terreus and fumigatus. Gliotoxn has been

detected in the sera of cancer patients with Aspergillosis in infections

resulting from these four species. You can find the these papers on

Gliotoxin by doing an entrez pubmed search for RE gliotoxin

aspergillosis cancer patients.

Finally, I would like to point out once again regarding fine particles and

the indoor environment. There is a fairly recent paper by Reponen et al,

2007 (do a google search) for Reponen T. Fungal fragments in mold

houses, Atmos Environ 2007 41:8140-49) shows that fine fungal

fragements less than the size of spores are predominant and up to 500

times more concentrated than fungal spores in indoor environments. Dr.

Reponen adequately reviews the literature on this subject which includes

the papers by Brasel and Gorny. These fine particles contain mycotoxins

and other toxins produced by molds and bacteria.

You need to educate yourself in order to understand what is going on in

the ibiocomplexity of the ndoor environment resulting from microbial

growth (molds and bacteria).

Jack D. Thrasher, Ph.D.

Toxicologist/Immunotoxicologist/Fetaltoxicologist

www.drthrasher.org

toxicologist1@...

Off: 916-745-4703

Cell: 575-937-1150

L. Crawley, M.ED., LADC

Trauma Specialist

sandracrawley@...

916-745-4703 - Off

775-309-3994 - Cell

This message and any attachments forwarded with it is to be considered

privileged and confidential. The forwarding or redistribution of this

message (and any attachments) without my prior written consent is

strictly prohibited and may violate privacy laws. Once the intended

purpose of this message has been served, please destroy the original

message contents. If you have received this message in error, please

reply immediately to advise the sender of the miscommunication and

then delete the message and any copies you have printed. Thank you in

advance for your compliance.