Guest guest Posted September 25, 2008 Report Share Posted September 25, 2008 Joan, I realize that you are on the regulatory board, but I wonder how clear the legislation actually is regarding counselors who have pursued CAT training, e.g. DTR. Elissa White and I spent a morning with Hamilton and heads of other State Ed Departments involved in the licensure process.( I'm not sure of the date, but I recall that hard copies of the application forms for licensure were available in the building). We asked specifically about scopes of practice for each field. Hamilton stated that counselors who had completed CAT training via alternate routes could include CAT processes in their practices. They could not, however, become LCATs. Since then, I have never heard him say anything to the contrary. When we asked him about the reverse situation, i.e., LCATS doing counseling, he was evasive. I thought of Hamilton's responses that day when I read how upset list members were about a call for mental health providers that included counselors and intentionally left out CATs. To me this is further evidence that here in NYS, CATS are still lowest on he therapy totem pole. As a result, I continue to believe we should have gotten ourselves licensed under the umbrella of counseling, following the model in PA. As CATs we lack the numbers we need to make changes. Licensed or not, we are still not on the same playing field as counselors even though their scopes of practice are delineated in the same bill that defines our scope of practice. I understand that CATs were determined not to lose their identities as CATs, but identity is something we carry, a mantle we take with us wherever we go. That we need a sense of professional identity is clear; however it is not. easy to maintain. So many CAT positions are in departments of recreation, rather than in departments focused on counseling or psychotherapy. We can be proud of ourselves for holding onto our professional identities, and in our cases as dance/movement therapists, but it is also true that we have not made as much headway as we would have liked. This painful reality reinforces my continuing belief that CATs in NY should have joined with the counselors and created a single license, Those of us who are lucky enough to be viewed as dance movement therapists and as counselors or psychotherapists often have (1)bosses familiar with our work or our predecessors' work, (2) have created jobs, (3) have pursued additional education, or were grandfathered in during the initial licensure offering. That ADTA has been around for decades and we still are blazing trails, highlights DMT's continuing struggle for recognition and acceptance. Acceptance comes from education and spreading the word. One way dance and drama therapists do that is by training clinicians from other professions. That is why the alternate route to credentialing is so important. If counselors from other states and countries can, through the alternate route, become credentialed CATs free to practice, shouldn't that be true for New York counselors as well? I know that licensure is different from registry and certification and that national credentials do not guarantee eligibility for state licenses. The opposite is true as well. DMTs who graduate with Masters degrees in DMT can get licensed in NYS because the state only requires 1500 hours of supervised work, much less than what the ADTA requires, and half of what the counseling licensure process requires. I suspect that the differences between the educational requirements for counseling and the CATs explain why Mr. Hamilton has changed (if he has) his interpretation of the law since Elissa and I met with him and the heads of related State Ed departments. Someone should inform the regulatory board and the Board of Regents that creative arts therapists, as do all trained mental health practitioners, use counseling/psychotherapy skills that mesh with their theoretical frameworks. What makes CATs different is our emphasis on creative and holistic processes, something that many practitioners higher on the therapy totem pole (e.g., medical doctors, social workers, counselors, etc.) are now working to emulate. Collaboration and cross pollination accepted in other fields, generates fresh ideas and research. If we are to grow CAT and dance/movement therapy in particular, we have to make use of our connection to NBCC and let New York State know that dmts have counseling skills recognized by NBCC and that licensed counselors who become DTRs should be able to incorporate DMT into their practices. Dani Fraenkel ________________________________________________________ le L. Fraenkel, Ph.D., ADTR, NCC, LCAT, LMHC, CGP Director, Kinections @ Imagine Square 718 University Avenue Rochester, NY 14607 Tel: FAX: >> Dear all, i> > sorry for my late entry into this discussion. I just want to clarify that > actually, counselors cannot practice CAT in New York, even with training. > This is a detail in the legislation. The law allows the already licensed > professions, that is social work, psychology, psychiatry, psychiatric > nurses, to practice CAT if they are appropriately trained. However the > " new " professions of counseling, marriage and family therapy, and > psychoanalysis cannot practice CAT, even if they are trained, unless they > get a license to do so. The legislation had to give some leeway to the > already licensed professions so as not to disenfranchise already > practicing professionals, or draw significant opposition to the > legislation. But nobody else can practice outside of their licensed > profession without the appropriate license. > > Yours, > Joan Wittig > > Tara may be eligible for a LCAT with a masters in expressive therapies. My >> understanding is that someone can practice CAT as a LMHC IF they are >> trained in the field. But they can;'t call themselves a licensed creative >> arts therapist. >> Re: Re: Important Licensure Concerns >> >> >> Sorry Tara. The issue you are caught in is " reciprocity " . That happened >> to me with my LMFT from California. States don't just accept licenses >> from somethere else. I applied early enough under the grandfathering >> option and didn't have to get another degree to do it. I don't think >> that is an option any more. >> Perhaps there are M.A. programs that will accept your credits (as >> equivalent )and just add new courses to comply with the license. Many of >> us go through this when moving to another state.. >> Don't give up. Good luck. >> Judi Levy, LCAT, ATR-BC, LP, LMFT >> >> -------------- Original message from " Tara Mooney " >> : -------------- >> >> >> Just a note to say I got fully rejected for the LMHC in NYS (which I >> had in MA) with a master's in expressive arts therapy and almost 15 >> years of clinical experience. They said to basically go back and get >> another degree. Huh! >> -t >> >> >>>>> >>>>>> , >>>>>> Since you seem to have more of a grasp on this whole licensure >> thing then >>>>>> most... my question is: If I take a BA position with an >> organization that >>>>>> has their mental health license, with a title that is not that >> of creative >>>>>> arts therapist, but I'm still practicing drama therapy, can I >> get my >>>>>> license-or is that illegal and should I leave the state this >> instant or hide >>>>>> away somewhere where no one can find me and just pay my student >> loans from >>>>>> that undisclosed location? >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> Em >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Mia de Bethune >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Mia de Bethune >>> >> >> >> > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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