Weight

January 8, 2002

I can't definitely say that there's a connection, but

our friend has done two liver cleanses, without having

changed anything else in his lifestyle, and has lost

about 25 pounds.

Jan Bolen

--- SHARON GANNON <sgannon56@...> wrote:

> Can you tell me if doing a liver cleanse will help

> with my weight issues? I'm not having gall bladder

> attacks or any other health issues, but I have

> gained

> sixty lbs in the last ten years, and I am wondering

> if

> doing a series of the liver cures would help.

>

> =====

> Sharon

>

> Check out my new improved photo page -

> photos./sgannon56

>

> __________________________________________________

>

January 9, 2002

HI,

I have done several liver cleanses and it has really helped my weight. I'm

not terribly overweight, but, I'm also not where I want to be. The liver is

the organ that takes the fat out and if it isn't taking fat out of the body,

then it is putting fat on. If you've let your liver become a fatty liver.

You can read more about the liver and weight issues here

http://www.liverdoctor.com I have read all of her books and she really

seems to know her stuff especially the liver. She even gives Dr. 's

liver cleanse as a way to quickly cleanse the liver in one of her books.

She has a liver cleansing diet that cleanses the liver slowly.

~Karma

Steps to a healthy body - Cleanse, Nourish, Rebuild, and Protect.

http://loaves-n-fishes.com

http://www.karma.awarenesshealth.com

> Can you tell me if doing a liver cleanse will help

> with my weight issues? I'm not having gall bladder

> attacks or any other health issues, but I have gained

> sixty lbs in the last ten years, and I am wondering if

> doing a series of the liver cures would help.

>

---

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January 9, 2002

On Tue, 8 Jan 2002 09:07:27 -0800 (PST), SHARON GANNON wrote in

<20020108170727.86174.qmail@...>:

>Can you tell me if doing a liver cleanse will help

>with my weight issues? I'm not having gall bladder

>attacks or any other health issues, but I have gained

>sixty lbs in the last ten years, and I am wondering if

>doing a series of the liver cures would help.

I have not observed a direct link between liver cleanses and

weight loss.

What might happen is that your energy level soars and you are more

motivated to move your body and do things which burn calories.

Also, it requires a certain mindset - to optimize one's health -

to do liver cleanses. That same mindset can induce the making

of an improved diet and exercise plan.

Heidrun Beer

Workgroup for Fundamental Spiritual Research and Mental Training

http://www.sgmt.at

January 9, 2002

About liver cleanses and weight:

Maybe it's interesting to know that I have done 3 liver cleanses and I was

at my mininum weight already... I didn't loose _any_ weight on the liver

cleanses, which at this point is good. So my conclusion is that you only

loose weight when you have additional fat to loose, and your liver doesn't

eat into the rest of you during a liver cleanse.

Ilana... who is intending to do about 20 liver cleanses before I'm done.

(CFS patient)

On Wed, 9 Jan 2002, Heidrun Beer wrote:

> On Tue, 8 Jan 2002 09:07:27 -0800 (PST), SHARON GANNON wrote in

> <20020108170727.86174.qmail@...>:

>

> >Can you tell me if doing a liver cleanse will help

> >with my weight issues? I'm not having gall bladder

> >attacks or any other health issues, but I have gained

> >sixty lbs in the last ten years, and I am wondering if

> >doing a series of the liver cures would help.

>

> I have not observed a direct link between liver cleanses and

> weight loss.

>

> What might happen is that your energy level soars and you are more

> motivated to move your body and do things which burn calories.

> Also, it requires a certain mindset - to optimize one's health -

> to do liver cleanses. That same mindset can induce the making

> of an improved diet and exercise plan.

>

> Heidrun Beer

>

> Workgroup for Fundamental Spiritual Research and Mental Training

> http://www.sgmt.at

>

January 9, 2002

One person told me he had just done his 45th liver cleanse and got out

a stone the size of a quarter. I have no reason to disbelieve him.

Leo

--------------

>

> > On Tue, 8 Jan 2002 09:07:27 -0800 (PST), SHARON GANNON wrote in

> > <20020108170727.86174.qmail@w...>:

> >

> > >Can you tell me if doing a liver cleanse will help

> > >with my weight issues? I'm not having gall bladder

> > >attacks or any other health issues, but I have gained

> > >sixty lbs in the last ten years, and I am wondering if

> > >doing a series of the liver cures would help.

> >

> > I have not observed a direct link between liver cleanses and

> > weight loss.

> >

> > What might happen is that your energy level soars and you are more

> > motivated to move your body and do things which burn calories.

> > Also, it requires a certain mindset - to optimize one's health -

> > to do liver cleanses. That same mindset can induce the making

> > of an improved diet and exercise plan.

> >

> > Heidrun Beer

> >

> > Workgroup for Fundamental Spiritual Research and Mental Training

> > http://www.sgmt.at

> >

January 9, 2002

Hi Ilana,

What improvements have you noticed from doing the liver flushes?

Re: Weight

> About liver cleanses and weight:

>

> Maybe it's interesting to know that I have done 3 liver cleanses and I was

> at my mininum weight already... I didn't loose _any_ weight on the liver

> cleanses, which at this point is good. So my conclusion is that you only

> loose weight when you have additional fat to loose, and your liver doesn't

> eat into the rest of you during a liver cleanse.

>

> Ilana... who is intending to do about 20 liver cleanses before I'm done.

> (CFS patient)

>

> On Wed, 9 Jan 2002, Heidrun Beer wrote:

>

> > On Tue, 8 Jan 2002 09:07:27 -0800 (PST), SHARON GANNON wrote in

> > <20020108170727.86174.qmail@...>:

> >

> > >Can you tell me if doing a liver cleanse will help

> > >with my weight issues? I'm not having gall bladder

> > >attacks or any other health issues, but I have gained

> > >sixty lbs in the last ten years, and I am wondering if

> > >doing a series of the liver cures would help.

> >

> > I have not observed a direct link between liver cleanses and

> > weight loss.

> >

> > What might happen is that your energy level soars and you are more

> > motivated to move your body and do things which burn calories.

> > Also, it requires a certain mindset - to optimize one's health -

> > to do liver cleanses. That same mindset can induce the making

> > of an improved diet and exercise plan.

> >

> > Heidrun Beer

> >

> > Workgroup for Fundamental Spiritual Research and Mental Training

> > http://www.sgmt.at

> >

September 4, 2002

Let me just tell you that I am thin and I am in more pain then anything so I

definitly do not think weight is a factor.. I almost thought if I gained

weight that I wouldn't be in as much pain but that probably isn't true.....

September 4, 2002

At 12:52 PM 9/3/02 -0400, you wrote:

> > My

> > husband thinks that the doctor feels that if I lose 20 pounds that my

> > problem (PA) will go away because he keeps bringing up my weight.

> >

>

>Suzy - what a crock! I'm more than 100 lbs. overweight and my rheumy has

>never even mentioned my weight being a factor. Of course, I'm not stupid - I

>know less weight on my joints would certainly make them feel better. But PA

>is AUTOIMMUNE!!! It's your immune system and not your hips and butt that are

>causing your joints to flare!

>Tell your doctor, and your husband, that they are way offtrack.

>Hang in there,

>I

>I lost 60 lb. slowly following a 1500 calorie diabetic diet which is not

>really a diet but a dramatic change in my eating habits. the weight has

>now been off a year and I must say my PA misery has improved dramatically.

>I'm not diabetic and I continue to follow along anyway because I feel so

>much better .I have less pain, less stiffness and less fatigue.I'm 5'6''

>and was 192 lb....I now hang 132-134lb. Whenever i cheat on the carbs i

>really feel lousy all over. I find stone ground whole wheat has made a

>huge difference.Dumping the simple carbs made me feel way less fatigued.

>For the PA I take indomethicin 75 mg every 12 hrs...now I'm mostly down to

>one and I take Trazadone to help me stay asleep. Weight loss may not help

>for everone but for me seemed to help turn a corner. At 46 I set out on my

>self challenge one day at a time. I'm now 47 and am so glad i decided to

>believe in me , for me.....hope this helps someone.....Mo..PS the rheumy

>mentioned weight once and the primary never mentioned it......

>

September 4, 2002

I would have to disagree with you on that one. I had weight loss surgery 14

months ago and have lost 126lbs. Before I lost that weight my knees could no

longer support my weight because of my PA. Now that that weight is gone my

joints feel much better, though the PA still gives me trouble. So, taking that

weight off has improved my pain, not to say that thin people don't suffer as

much pain or more than heavy people.

Re: [ ] Re: weight

Let me just tell you that I am thin and I am in more pain then anything so I

definitly do not think weight is a factor.. I almost thought if I gained

weight that I wouldn't be in as much pain but that probably isn't true.....

September 5, 2002

At 05:56 PM 9/4/02 -0500, you wrote:

>Original Message -----

> From: taylorniki@...

>

> Sent: Wednesday, September 04, 2002 4:19 PM

> Subject: Re: [ ] Re: weight

>

> ,

congratulations on your effort!! for me i'm not sure if it was the weight

loss, the improved dietary choices, the improvement to my self esteem or a

combination..........but i'm not complaining! i'm not pain free /stiffness

free but i'm feeling better and coping better........Mo

September 5, 2002

In a message dated 9/4/2002 5:51:28 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

taylorniki@... writes:

> Let me just tell you that I am thin and I am in more pain then anything so I

>

> definitly do not think weight is a factor.. I almost thought if I gained

> weight that I wouldn't be in as much pain but that probably isn't true

I talked to the rheumy yesterday about weight and PA. She said it would be

benefical for other health reasons to lose weight, but probably didn't matter

as much with PA. Definitely weight is a factor in OA on the hips and knees,

but she didn't seem to feel with the inflammatory A's like PA and RA that it

was as much of a factor. I still need to take off a good bit for the

diabetes and am considering bariatric surgery, but am a bit scared of it.

I'd like to hear if anyone has had good or bad experience with it.

[Moderator's note: , in a previous post said that she " had weight

loss surgery 14 months ago and has lost 126lbs. " You might want to contact her

directly, although as far as I know this is a perfectly legitimate topic to

discuss on the forum since it's at least indirectly related to PA (although

excess weight may have no bearing on the frequency of flare-ups, it does cause

additional stress on already inflamed joints). Her post is at:

/message/22006

-- Ron]

September 6, 2002

Well, since Ron said its ok to talk about my weight loss surgery here, and a few

people have asked about it, I will be happy to share my story.

My husband and I were trying two years ago to get pregnant. I went off all of

the PA meds except for 5mg of Prednisone and darvacets for pain. We tried for 6

months without luck and I figured that because of my weight it is probably

interfering with getting pregnant, I took this as a sign that I needed to pursue

weight loss surgery.

I found out that my insurance (my husband is active duty military and we have

Tricare) covered weight loss surgery so I got a referral from my primary doc to

a surgeon in my area who did weight loss surgery. This doctor said I was an

excellent candidate for the surgery since I was 295lbs and 5'1 " in height. He

performed the same weight loss surgery you hear alot about on TV (Carnie ,

the singer, had this type) called the RNY or Roué En Y. This is the surgery

which is reserved for people who have the most weight to loose and has been

found to be the most successful. The surgeon made my stomach only able to hold

2 ounces after surgery, now I am able to eat 5-7 ounces per meal.

Having PA actually was the deciding factor for my insurance company approving

the surgery for me. Since my weight was so high, it had gotten so that my

knees, since they had problems with PA could not support my weight if, for

example, I was sitting on the floor and then had to get up. I always had to

hold on to something and " work " myself up with alot of deep breaths and a few

tries.

Here is the tough part of my weight loss surgery journey. My insurance denied

my first request for the surgery because I was on the 5mg of Prednisone, they

worried that it would interfere with healing from the surgery. They were not

willing to budge on this subject even though my surgeon said he had operated on

plenty of patients who were taking Prednisone at a much high dosage than me and

did just fine. So, since I knew that my only solution to this weight problem

was this surgery, I called the insurance company and asked them if I went off

the Prednisone would they approve the surgery, they said yes, so I did. Believe

me, it was the worst time of my life! I had been on something for my PA for

years and to suddenly go to taking nothing but just pain meds was not fun at

all. By the time it was a few days before surgery I could no longer get up off

the couch or the toilet without my husband's help and walking was extremely

painful, but I knew that it was all going to be worth it after the surgery. The

PA was so bad the day of surgery that even the morphine they gave me for the

pain of the surgery, didn't even touch the PA! Two days after the surgery I got

permission from the surgeon to go back on the Prednisone, which I gratefully

did!

Now that I am 14 months (on Sept. 2nd) I am truly amazed at all the changes and

my weight loss of 126lbs, and believe it or not I am still losing! The doc's

goal for me is 125, but I will be happy at 130, 140. I am so very grateful that

I was able to get this surgery as I know for myself, being obese my entire life,

I was not going to lose the weight with traditional dieting. It has helped my

joints feel so much better. I am still taking the prednisone for the PA as my

husband and I are currently trying again to get pregnant. I don't really have

much joint pain right now, its mostly muscle pain. I can jump up and down

again, stand on my tiptoes, I can walk in the mall for a good while now without

the PA bothering me, I can get up off the floor without getting help from anyone

or holding on to anything. There are just too many things to mention that I can

do now that I couldn't do before!

For those of you interested in learning more about this surgery, I would send

you first to Obesityhelp.com to start learning about the different types of

weight loss surgery. This will also give you information about whether your

insurance company covers surgery and doctors in your area who do the surgery.

If anyone has any questions for me personally, I am happy to answer and share

details about my journey. I can honestly say it was the best decision I have

ever made for myself, it saved my life.

Bloomington, MN