Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and Lyme disease

[Guest guest]

,

What kind of blood test for mold?

I also have lyme and am wondering how much is mold. I have the multisuseptable

HLA.

I think the theives might hav ekilled some mold but the toxins are left behind.

Others can chime in about that one.

Robin

>

> hello

> Looking for some opinions here. I have Lyme disease, been in treatment 3

yrs, not much success until recently off abx using alternative stuff.

>

> I had a blood test for mold and it yielded high titers to aspergillus

fumigatus and niger (niger was very high), candida albicans, aerobasidium,

penicillium notatum, helminthosporidium, and cladosporidium. The lab was

supposed to do chaetomium and stachy, but did not for some reason. We live a

block from the beach and back up to an open space/field, and the conditions are

foggy and cold.

>

> Then I had the HLA " Shoemaker " blood typing done (from the book Mold Warriors)

and had two genotypes for being unable to detox mold.

>

> We have not seen mold in house but my husband went into crawl space and

diffused Thieves Oil anyway. Then he tore open a few walls and we sprayed

Orange Oil into the walls (he works for a termite company and they did it for

free). There was originally a musty smell coming from somewhere and it's gone.

>

> Could I be not recovering from Lyme because of mold? How do I find out where

the mold is if we have it? There are so many charlatan mold testers and

remediators etc.....I just really want to find out if there is toxic mold

growing somewhere that is making me sick.

>

> Thoughts?

>

[Guest guest]

Robin,

At some point you are going to have to bite the bullet and choose which of the

confusing " facts " and " opinions " you are going to trust.

If you choose wrong you can use that information to try again. And you keep

going and keep refining until you eventually find improvement.

No one has the definitive answers you seek and need. Which means you, like me,

and others are ultimately alone in this. We can be there for each other and we

can get ideas and learn but we have to create our own answers.

You are driving yourself crazy and increasing your stress by the obsessive drive

for absolute certainty and perfection. Our challenge is to make critical choices

with insufficient knowledge.

Take a breath, make some choices, and see what happens. Then let us know so we

can be there for you whether successful or something less.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

(fm my Blackberry)

[] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and

Lyme disease

,

What kind of blood test for mold?

I also have lyme and am wondering how much is mold. I have the multisuseptable

HLA.

I think the theives might hav ekilled some mold but the toxins are left behind.

Others can chime in about that one.

Robin

>

> hello

> Looking for some opinions here. I have Lyme disease, been in treatment 3

yrs, not much success until recently off abx using alternative stuff.

>

> I had a blood test for mold and it yielded high titers to aspergillus

fumigatus and niger (niger was very high), candida albicans, aerobasidium,

penicillium notatum, helminthosporidium, and cladosporidium. The lab was

supposed to do chaetomium and stachy, but did not for some reason. We live a

block from the beach and back up to an open space/field, and the conditions are

foggy and cold.

>

> Then I had the HLA " Shoemaker " blood typing done (from the book Mold Warriors)

and had two genotypes for being unable to detox mold.

>

> We have not seen mold in house but my husband went into crawl space and

diffused Thieves Oil anyway. Then he tore open a few walls and we sprayed

Orange Oil into the walls (he works for a termite company and they did it for

free). There was originally a musty smell coming from somewhere and it's gone.

>

> Could I be not recovering from Lyme because of mold? How do I find out where

the mold is if we have it? There are so many charlatan mold testers and

remediators etc.....I just really want to find out if there is toxic mold

growing somewhere that is making me sick.

>

> Thoughts?

>

[Guest guest]

Carl,

you are right..

Robin

>

> Robin,

>

> At some point you are going to have to bite the bullet and choose which of the

confusing " facts " and " opinions " you are going to trust.

>

> If you choose wrong you can use that information to try again. And you keep

going and keep refining until you eventually find improvement.

>

> No one has the definitive answers you seek and need. Which means you, like me,

and others are ultimately alone in this. We can be there for each other and we

can get ideas and learn but we have to create our own answers.

>

> You are driving yourself crazy and increasing your stress by the obsessive

drive for absolute certainty and perfection. Our challenge is to make critical

choices with insufficient knowledge.

>

> Take a breath, make some choices, and see what happens. Then let us know so we

can be there for you whether successful or something less.

>

> Carl Grimes

> Healthy Habitats LLC

> (fm my Blackberry)

>

>

[Guest guest]

Anyone?

>

> hello

> Looking for some opinions here. I have Lyme disease, been in treatment 3

yrs, not much success until recently off abx using alternative stuff.

>

> I had a blood test for mold and it yielded high titers to aspergillus

fumigatus and niger (niger was very high), candida albicans, aerobasidium,

penicillium notatum, helminthosporidium, and cladosporidium. The lab was

supposed to do chaetomium and stachy, but did not for some reason. We live a

block from the beach and back up to an open space/field, and the conditions are

foggy and cold.

>

> Then I had the HLA " Shoemaker " blood typing done (from the book Mold Warriors)

and had two genotypes for being unable to detox mold.

>

> We have not seen mold in house but my husband went into crawl space and

diffused Thieves Oil anyway. Then he tore open a few walls and we sprayed

Orange Oil into the walls (he works for a termite company and they did it for

free). There was originally a musty smell coming from somewhere and it's gone.

>

> Could I be not recovering from Lyme because of mold? How do I find out where

the mold is if we have it? There are so many charlatan mold testers and

remediators etc.....I just really want to find out if there is toxic mold

growing somewhere that is making me sick.

>

> Thoughts?

>

[Guest guest]

mold can only be removed, not sprayed with a smelly oil. We have discussed this

oil thing to death here, read the archives. Why not take the VCS test on

Shoemakers site, or would it test positive for LYme?

>

> hello

> Looking for some opinions here. I have Lyme disease, been in treatment 3

yrs, not much success until recently off abx using alternative stuff.

>

> I had a blood test for mold and it yielded high titers to aspergillus

fumigatus and niger (niger was very high), candida albicans, aerobasidium,

penicillium notatum, helminthosporidium, and cladosporidium. The lab was

supposed to do chaetomium and stachy, but did not for some reason. We live a

block from the beach and back up to an open space/field, and the conditions are

foggy and cold.

>

> Then I had the HLA " Shoemaker " blood typing done (from the book Mold Warriors)

and had two genotypes for being unable to detox mold.

>

> We have not seen mold in house but my husband went into crawl space and

diffused Thieves Oil anyway. Then he tore open a few walls and we sprayed

Orange Oil into the walls (he works for a termite company and they did it for

free). There was originally a musty smell coming from somewhere and it's gone.

>

> Could I be not recovering from Lyme because of mold? How do I find out where

the mold is if we have it? There are so many charlatan mold testers and

remediators etc.....I just really want to find out if there is toxic mold

growing somewhere that is making me sick.

>

> Thoughts?

>

[Guest guest]

The VCS test will most definitely test positive for lyme biotoxins. Not only

that, the test is either unreliable or toxins are not in the aqueous tissue of

the eye on a constant basis. i take this test and test neg then pos then neg. I

also have lyme.

Regarding thieves oil, this is being used by many in lymeland and touted as a

remedy, so its no wonder people come to the list thinking it is.

Its a difficult and frustrating process to retrain deeply embedded learnings

about mold. Not only is society bombarding us, the alternative community is as

well.

I have lyme as well. If the thieves oil kills mold...

the dead spores still contain mycotoxins.

Its best to remove the mold properly, safely and control the source that caused

the mold to grow.

You may not be recovering from lyme because of mold. Mold illness will

compromise the immune system, increase inflammtory responses and back up detox

even more.. do you have very hard herxes?

What tests did you have for the mold?

Robin

>

>

> mold can only be removed, not sprayed with a smelly oil. We have discussed

this oil thing to death here, read the archives. Why not take the VCS test on

Shoemakers site, or would it test positive for LYme?

>

>

[Guest guest]

I had the Esoterix IGG mold allergy panel for my part of the country. The doc

requested stachy and chaetomium but those came back " test not performed " for

whatever reason.

Esoterix is now owned by Labcorp.

I don't have very hard herxes, no. I don't really notice herxes at all

actually. Did in the beginning of Lyme treatment 3 yrs ago though.

I have two " mold " genes in my HLA test. No Lyme toxin susceptibility.

> >

> > hello

> > Looking for some opinions here. I have Lyme disease, been in treatment 3

yrs, not much success until recently off abx using alternative stuff.

> >

> > I had a blood test for mold and it yielded high titers to aspergillus

fumigatus and niger (niger was very high), candida albicans, aerobasidium,

penicillium notatum, helminthosporidium, and cladosporidium. The lab was

supposed to do chaetomium and stachy, but did not for some reason. We live a

block from the beach and back up to an open space/field, and the conditions are

foggy and cold.

> >

> > Then I had the HLA " Shoemaker " blood typing done (from the book Mold

Warriors) and had two genotypes for being unable to detox mold.

> >

> > We have not seen mold in house but my husband went into crawl space and

diffused Thieves Oil anyway. Then he tore open a few walls and we sprayed

Orange Oil into the walls (he works for a termite company and they did it for

free). There was originally a musty smell coming from somewhere and it's gone.

> >

> > Could I be not recovering from Lyme because of mold? How do I find out

where the mold is if we have it? There are so many charlatan mold testers and

remediators etc.....I just really want to find out if there is toxic mold

growing somewhere that is making me sick.

> >

> > Thoughts?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

My Western Blot came back neg.

 Has anyone had a Lab. Corp CD-57 run? I read that shows it in the tissues.

Still need to run HLA.

Sorry, what are you referring to as herxes?

Kathy

From: catherine <ce_hansen@...>

Subject: [] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and

Lyme disease

Date: Thursday, August 19, 2010, 1:37 PM

I had the Esoterix IGG mold allergy panel for my part of the country. The doc

requested stachy and chaetomium but those came back " test not performed " for

whatever reason.

Esoterix is now owned by Labcorp.

I don't have very hard herxes, no. I don't really notice herxes at all

actually. Did in the beginning of Lyme treatment 3 yrs ago though.

I have two " mold " genes in my HLA test. No Lyme toxin susceptibility.

[Guest guest]

Thanks.. I called Labcorp and they had individual codes for each mold.. these

will only show exposure though not current infection. I am assumuming a super

high IgG might indicate something more recent or problematic?

I;ll ask if they have the esoterix panel.

Shoesmaker says in his book that mold toxic folks can have harder herxes.. maybe

its the multisuseptables this applies to though my husband is also a MS and he

did fine with the herxing and is doinf fine with the mold.

Thank you..

Robin

>

> I had the Esoterix IGG mold allergy panel for my part of the country. The

doc requested stachy and chaetomium but those came back " test not performed " for

whatever reason.

>

> Esoterix is now owned by Labcorp.

>

> I don't have very hard herxes, no. I don't really notice herxes at all

actually. Did in the beginning of Lyme treatment 3 yrs ago though.

>

> I have two " mold " genes in my HLA test. No Lyme toxin susceptibility.

>

>

[Guest guest]

yes.. the cd 57 can indicate lyme infection even with a neg WB.. its important

to get your WB from IgeneX or another lyme literate lab. Labcorp and Quest leave

out important bands.

A neg WB does not indicate you do not have lyme.

My cd 57 is low but so is my husbands and again.. he is fine.. it is used as a

diagnostic tool along with symptoms and past history of tick bites as well as

the WB.

A herxheimer effect is when you kill of bacteria or fungus for that matter in

your body and either (1) the bacteria releases its toxins (endotoxin I believe

which like a mycotoxin is a biotoxin, neutotoxin) which causes intensified

symptoms or new symptoms (2) the body is reacting to the debris in an

inflammatory manner causing increase in symptoms or new symptoms.

Some people describe it as a bad flu.. some people it can take them out life

CFS.. body aches, pains.. intensified neuro symptoms. brain fog, psychiattic

symptoms from inflammation in brain.. my daughter had to have help up and down

the stairs when she was herxing. Other times her little finger would shake

uncontrollably.

I feel like I am being run over by a caravan of trucks non stop and often become

very depressed.

Robin

>

> My Western Blot came back neg.

>

>  Has anyone had a Lab. Corp CD-57 run? I read that shows it in the tissues.

Still need to run HLA.

>

> Sorry, what are you referring to as herxes?

>

> Kathy

>

[Guest guest]

I have CFS and tested positively for lyme with CD 57. But I also have

hypermobility and possible Ehlers Danlos Syndrome (I wouldn't know until I

finally went in for the DNA test). To be honest, I am still skeptical about much

of this. I know that I exhaust easily, that I have a lot of body pain, that I am

depressed, inflamed (my sed rate always higher than normal), that I don't sleep

well without pharmaceuticals, which themselves contribute to the exhaustino, but

though I have a doctor interested in treating me with antibiotics and with

cholestyramine, I can't bring myself to do it. Part of it is the treatment

itself would be hard, never mind the herxing; I don't tolerate meds well, and

especially antibiotics, which just make me feel really sick. Part of it is just

skepticism; I don't want to be a guinea pig hanging out in still murky

territory. And part of it is cost. I know insurance would not pay for the

antibiotics, not long term. So I don't know. Are you being treated, Robin? How

is that going? For myself, I think I'd just like to find a mold-free (as much as

possible), MCS safe place to live in peace, and money so that I can ride the

waves of worsening symptoms out and work on days I feel OK, which, with all this

mold exposure, don't really exist anymore.

________________________________

From: listspub <listspub@...>

Sent: Thu, August 19, 2010 5:36:31 PM

Subject: [] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and

Lyme disease

yes.. the cd 57 can indicate lyme infection even with a neg WB.. its important

to get your WB from IgeneX or another lyme literate lab. Labcorp and Quest leave

out important bands.

A neg WB does not indicate you do not have lyme.

My cd 57 is low but so is my husbands and again.. he is fine.. it is used as a

diagnostic tool along with symptoms and past history of tick bites as well as

the WB.

A herxheimer effect is when you kill of bacteria or fungus for that matter in

your body and either (1) the bacteria releases its toxins (endotoxin I believe

which like a mycotoxin is a biotoxin, neutotoxin) which causes intensified

symptoms or new symptoms (2) the body is reacting to the debris in an

inflammatory manner causing increase in symptoms or new symptoms.

Some people describe it as a bad flu.. some people it can take them out life

CFS.. body aches, pains.. intensified neuro symptoms. brain fog, psychiattic

symptoms from inflammation in brain.. my daughter had to have help up and down

the stairs when she was herxing. Other times her little finger would shake

uncontrollably.

I feel like I am being run over by a caravan of trucks non stop and often become

very depressed.

Robin

>

> My Western Blot came back neg.

>

> Â Has anyone had a Lab. Corp CD-57 run? I read that shows it in the tissues.

>Still need to run HLA.

>

> Sorry, what are you referring to as herxes?

>

> Kathy

>

[Guest guest]

________________________________

From: listspub <listspub@...>

Sent: Thu, August 19, 2010 3:36:31 PM

Subject: [] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and

Lyme disease

 

yes.. the cd 57 can indicate lyme infection even with a neg WB.. its important

to get your WB from IgeneX or another lyme literate lab. Labcorp and Quest leave

out important bands.

A neg WB does not indicate you do not have lyme.

My cd 57 is low but so is my husbands and again.. he is fine.. it is used as a

diagnostic tool along with symptoms and past history of tick bites as well as

the WB.

A herxheimer effect is when you kill of bacteria or fungus for that matter in

your body and either (1) the bacteria releases its toxins (endotoxin I believe

which like a mycotoxin is a biotoxin, neutotoxin) which causes intensified

symptoms or new symptoms (2) the body is reacting to the debris in an

inflammatory manner causing increase in symptoms or new symptoms.

Some people describe it as a bad flu.. some people it can take them out life

CFS.. body aches, pains.. intensified neuro symptoms. brain fog, psychiattic

symptoms from inflammation in brain.. my daughter had to have help up and down

the stairs when she was herxing. Other times her little finger would shake

uncontrollably.

I feel like I am being run over by a caravan of trucks non stop and often become

very depressed.

Robin

>

> My Western Blot came back neg.

>

>  Has anyone had a Lab. Corp CD-57 run? I read that shows it in the tissues.

>Still need to run HLA.

>

> Sorry, what are you referring to as herxes?

>

> Kathy

>

[Guest guest]

I'll have to talk my doc. into running the cd 57. I had a tick bite years ago.

Thanks for explaining  the herx reaction.  I've heard of it referred to as

" die off " , feeling chills when you're not sick that go away when the

antiviral,  like olive leaf,  clears a virus. 

I didn't know you could anyone could get such a bad herx, causing new symptoms.

I'm so sorry for your daughter. 

I'll try to express what's going on.  Magnesium especially or food I feel

sensations I never felt before.  It's like a sensory over-reaction from the

inside out  I feel the sensations like almost tingling & then numb though the 

tissues if the area that's involved -even from  eating an orange.   I can't

fully describe it. It travels from left to right, or in the thoratic area.

 It travels from the left to the right, head to toe. It sounds weird & makes no

sense. It It seems to be way my body's handling energy is screwed up. Now I feel

the energy from lightening & emf's. so computers are a drag now.

It was going away with applied kin. & cranial sacral. If anyone has had this,

please share.

Kathy

From: sally braithwaite-marshalll <mustangsally2254@...>

Subject: Re: [] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds,

and Lyme disease

Date: Thursday, August 19, 2010, 6:36 PM

 

________________________________

From: listspub <listspub@...>

Sent: Thu, August 19, 2010 3:36:31 PM

Subject: [] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and

Lyme disease

 

yes.. the cd 57 can indicate lyme infection even with a neg WB.. its important

to get your WB from IgeneX or another lyme literate lab. Labcorp and Quest leave

out important bands.

A neg WB does not indicate you do not have lyme.

My cd 57 is low but so is my husbands and again.. he is fine.. it is used as a

diagnostic tool along with symptoms and past history of tick bites as well as

the WB.

A herxheimer effect is when you kill of bacteria or fungus for that matter in

your body and either (1) the bacteria releases its toxins (endotoxin I believe

which like a mycotoxin is a biotoxin, neutotoxin) which causes intensified

symptoms or new symptoms (2) the body is reacting to the debris in an

inflammatory manner causing increase in symptoms or new symptoms.

Some people describe it as a bad flu.. some people it can take them out life

CFS.. body aches, pains.. intensified neuro symptoms. brain fog, psychiattic

symptoms from inflammation in brain.. my daughter had to have help up and down

the stairs when she was herxing. Other times her little finger would shake

uncontrollably.

I feel like I am being run over by a caravan of trucks non stop and often become

very depressed.

Robin

>

> My Western Blot came back neg.

>

>  Has anyone had a Lab. Corp CD-57 run? I read that shows it in the tissues.

>Still need to run HLA.

>

> Sorry, what are you referring to as herxes?

>

> Kathy

>

[Guest guest]

 I wonder if it''s all an EMF issue. I felt better after moviing here until we

got the computers & sattelite going. Our phone wires  are under ground.

Does anyone know if satellite receivers for TV's give off emf's? I feel weird

from flat screen  tv's too. I guess I'm screwed. Too many emf's in our world

now.  It's all since the mold.

From: KathyB <calicocat477@...>

Subject: Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and Lyme disease

Date: Thursday, August 19, 2010, 7:43 PM

I'll have to talk my doc. into running the cd 57. I had a tick bite years ago.

Thanks for explaining  the herx reaction.  I've heard of it referred to as " die

off " , feeling chills when you're not sick that go away when the antiviral,  like

olive leaf,  clears a virus. 

I didn't know you could anyone could get such a bad herx, causing new symptoms.

I'm so sorry for your daughter. 

I'll try to express what's going on.  Magnesium especially or food I feel

sensations I never felt before.  It's like a sensory over-reaction from the

inside out  I feel the sensations like almost tingling & then numb though the 

tissues if the area that's involved -even from  eating an orange.   I can't

fully describe it. It travels from left to right, or in the thoratic area.

 It

travels from the left to the right, head to toe. It sounds weird & makes no

sense. It It seems to be way my body's handling energy is screwed up. Now I feel

the energy from lightening & emf's. so computers are a drag now.

It was going away with applied kin. & cranial sacral. If anyone has had this,

please share.

Kathy

[Guest guest]

Have you discussed with any of the lyme groups at . I have Bart with mold

exposure later. Have you read any of the books on Lyme, like the Insights Into

Lyme Disease Treatment: 13 Lyme-Literate Health Care Practitioners Share Their

Healing Strategies, When Antibiotics Fail: Lyme Disease and Rife Machines, with

Critical Evaluation of Leading Alternative Therapies

>

> I have CFS and tested positively for lyme with CD 57. But I also have

> hypermobility and possible Ehlers Danlos Syndrome (I wouldn't know until I

> finally went in for the DNA test). To be honest, I am still skeptical about

much

> of this. I know that I exhaust easily, that I have a lot of body pain, that I

am

> depressed, inflamed (my sed rate always higher than normal), that I don't

sleep

> well without pharmaceuticals, which themselves contribute to the exhaustino,

but

> though I have a doctor interested in treating me with antibiotics and with

> cholestyramine, I can't bring myself to do it. Part of it is the treatment

> itself would be hard, never mind the herxing; I don't tolerate meds well, and

> especially antibiotics, which just make me feel really sick. Part of it is

just

> skepticism; I don't want to be a guinea pig hanging out in still murky

> territory. And part of it is cost. I know insurance would not pay for the

> antibiotics, not long term. So I don't know. Are you being treated, Robin? How

> is that going? For myself, I think I'd just like to find a mold-free (as much

as

> possible), MCS safe place to live in peace, and money so that I can ride the

> waves of worsening symptoms out and work on days I feel OK, which, with all

this

> mold exposure, don't really exist anymore.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi AN,

Im about where you are. I have cans of CSM on my countertop. I heard a fellow

CFS-er talk about extreme mold avoidance on a CFS board and that caught my

attention since we just remediated for stachy and I have the HLA type. Then I

ran into a man at the gro store who hears me talk to my neighbor who I also ran

into about mold.. he walks up and tells me.. I recovered from mold illness.. I

would love to talk with you.. then he tells me he was being treated for lyme and

it wasnt lyme. it was mold.. he also did not have a positive WB. I dont know his

cd57 but I know who was treating him and I feel certain she checked. He says the

abx made him worse because he had a fungal infection.

He tells me he ran into some other people (not on these lists that I know of and

this strikes me) that advised him to leave his house when they heard he had

water damage.. he did an ERMI and ran.. he left everything but clothes he took

in bags and a few appliances.. one a TV. He started getting better then he got

clothes out and was slammed.. got rid of them and the TV.

He and family are in a rented house that he did not check for mold, but looks

like its all OK and eventually did sell the car. He went back into old house

wearing a respirator to get a tie to wear to a function and he said the tie put

him back so bad he thought he was going to die.. so I got from him.. leave and

leave it all behind.

He did CSM until he felt is was beginning to make him feel worse rather than

better (about 4 months), antifungals, antiviral, rife, ionized water, sauna and

other things. He thinks he's about 90% in less than a year.

I got from the woman on the CFS list that when you get as clean as possbible (he

did cross contaminate his new home) that your body can calm down (shoemaker

markers I think) enough to be able to tolerate the CSM or whatever treatment.

Since our remediation (or it was the reconnective healing seminar I went to.. I

believe in all kinds of ways to heal at this point since my sister had a

miraculous healing) I am tolerating abx and herbs better. I had to go on abx

soon after the remeidation for a new tick bite that presented with a quick

worsening of symptoms.. I didnt know I was bitten for a while then we reallized

it later and treated.

So my plan is to leave. My problem I am relocating near my parents who recently

had water damage worse than mine and did ont ahve a proper remediation. So how

to work with that.

I hear you about getting to a place where you can start to allow your body to

heal, calm down. Thats what I am understanding and then as you feel ready you

might want to experiment.

I have breathlessness, allergic type symptoms but no IgE for molds, exreme

weakness, fatigue where I can do but in spurts and not much exertion. I feel

brain inflammation and have for years starting in my sinuses then goes right up

into my brain which leads to a drop dead depression or close to catatonic state

at times, brain fog, dropping my memory. Ive lately had these more and noticed

them associated with my laundry room ( use natural products but??) and recently

when I browsed in a new suitcase that must be loaded with chemicals. I also have

shakes and crazy buzzing feelings, like live wires all under my skin at times

that methyl b12 and glut were helping alot until I started having more energy

and being off the sofa more.

I am on alot of herbs at full dose: samento, enula, banderol, olive leaf extract

and starting to have pain and herx. I'll see how it goes before I back off.

Since the herbs are also antifungal, I am not sure what is going on. I am taking

chlorella, EDTA chelation complex and modifilan.. I often skip the latter two

becasue they are at night and I forget.

I tested neg on real time labs test for mycotoxins in urine and am not sure

about that test because it is a random urine and toxins might be sequestered in

fat..?? I am running some shoemaker labs next. Getting out of the house as clean

as possible will in the least help me see ig it helps me in anyway feel better..

Ive gone back and forth on how well or not the house was remediated and if that

really matters.

I hope this is helpful and does not ramble too much. You might try a smidge of

CSM at some point? there are natural alternatives that are milder that might

help. If the CSM is too harsh, I might try those. You can also pulse CSM and

ramp up to whatever works for you.. Ive talked with a few folks who have used it

and many use differently.

Ive heard that its harder to detox while still in a sick environment.. or do any

treatment for that matter.

Robin

>

> I have CFS and tested positively for lyme with CD 57. But I also have

> hypermobility and possible Ehlers Danlos Syndrome (I wouldn't know until I

> finally went in for the DNA test). To be honest, I am still skeptical about

much

> of this. I know that I exhaust easily, that I have a lot of body pain, that I

am

> depressed, inflamed (my sed rate always higher than normal), that I don't

sleep

> well without pharmaceuticals, which themselves contribute to the exhaustino,

but

> though I have a doctor interested in treating me with antibiotics and with

> cholestyramine, I can't bring myself to do it. Part of it is the treatment

> itself would be hard, never mind the herxing; I don't tolerate meds well, and

> especially antibiotics, which just make me feel really sick. Part of it is

just

> skepticism; I don't want to be a guinea pig hanging out in still murky

> territory. And part of it is cost. I know insurance would not pay for the

> antibiotics, not long term. So I don't know. Are you being treated, Robin? How

> is that going? For myself, I think I'd just like to find a mold-free (as much

as

> possible), MCS safe place to live in peace, and money so that I can ride the

> waves of worsening symptoms out and work on days I feel OK, which, with all

this

> mold exposure, don't really exist anymore.

>

>

[Guest guest]

I can feel like my nerves are little frayed wires all over my body and like

cluster bombs of nerves are exploding. Methyl b12 and trandermal glutathone have

helped alot but its back a tad since I am able to move around more.

Im not sure how much is lyme, methlylation issues/b12 & glut, or toxins... mold

or lyme biotoxins. I also have heavy metals dumping with KPU and methylation

therapy and most likley have chemical poisoning from pesticides which were

improperly and over used when I was a child. Or all of the above.

History of tick bite is def a clue to look into...

Robin

>

>

> I'll have to talk my doc. into running the cd 57. I had a tick bite years ago.

Thanks for explaining  the herx reaction.  I've heard of it referred to as

" die off " , feeling chills when you're not sick that go away when the

antiviral,  like olive leaf,  clears a virus. 

>

> I didn't know you could anyone could get such a bad herx, causing new

symptoms. I'm so sorry for your daughter. 

>

> I'll try to express what's going on.  Magnesium especially or food I feel

sensations I never felt before.  It's like a sensory over-reaction from the

inside out  I feel the sensations like almost tingling & then numb though the 

tissues if the area that's involved -even from  eating an orange.   I can't

fully describe it. It travels from left to right, or in the thoratic area.

>

>  It travels from the left to the right, head to toe. It sounds weird & makes

no sense. It It seems to be way my body's handling energy is screwed up. Now I

feel the energy from lightening & emf's. so computers are a drag now.

>

> It was going away with applied kin. & cranial sacral. If anyone has had this,

please share.

>

> Kathy

>

>

[Guest guest]

My problems is getting a mainstream doc. to consider it. I went to the list's

reccomended doc. who says I have a lot of yeast. Problem is he wants skin

testing before treating, & believes in allergy shots.  Why can't he just give a

script? Some won't change their protocols.   I have burning pain, numbness, &

balance problems.

The other issue, after getting treatment with another doc. using an EAV, the

burning went away.  It's a form of accupunture. So what does that mean?

How do you all get enough C? Deficiency can cause problems. I had to quit extra

after reaction resembling a heart attack  in the WTB.  Can't eat citrus

since  gastritis in teens.

 ER said it was thrush that most likely was in the esophagus.

Do any take C made from

tapicoa?

I have bumps on the back of my tongue since last antibiotic last fall for what

they called bronchitis. Alternative doc. agrees. I've been using HFS yeast

fighters, which aren't enough.

Kathy

>>>

From: listspub <listspub@...>

Subject: [] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and

Lyme disease

Date: Thursday, August 19, 2010, 10:55 PM

I can feel like my nerves are little frayed wires all over my body and

like cluster bombs of nerves are exploding. Methyl b12 and trandermal glutathone

have helped alot but its back a tad since I am able to move around more.

Im not sure how much is lyme, methlylation issues/b12 & glut, or toxins... mold

or lyme biotoxins. I also have heavy metals dumping with KPU and methylation

therapy and most likley have chemical poisoning from pesticides which were

improperly and over used when I was a child. Or all of the above.

History of tick bite is def a clue to look into...

Robin

[Guest guest]

my son just started on tapioca c, seems to tolerate it. sue v

>Do any take C made from

>tapicoa?

>

>

[Guest guest]

The allergy shots do work if you have an allergy to mold. Allergy shots are the

most natural way to treat allergies so I can't understand why people don't

consider being tested for allergies and taking the shots. I have been taking

them for 2 years and I have seen a mark difference in my health. It was not

always like this. I had several rounds of allergy shots since I was 24 years

old and none worked as well as the ones I am taking now. My doctor has been so

great at working with my body. If I feel the shots are too much, he allows me

to listen to my body and cuts back on the serum. In the past I would end up with

whelps as big as golf balls and miserable for days after the shots. The shots

my last MD gave me were a little rough the first few months but after about 3

months, my health got better and better. It is bad enough to be ill from mold

period but to have an allergy to mold while living in a sick building is double

trouble. Being tested for mold allergies should be part of anyone health care

who is living in a sick building. I can't understand why people dispute the

shots so much. A good allergist also recommends that a person leaves the

mold. There is no way of getting around the mold but to leave. I know for some

it is hard. It was very hard for me. I ended up in one mold environment after

another. I was out of work and caring for my sick mother on top of me being

sick so life was tough. I could not afford to move either but we finally did. I

don't think I could have lived too much longer in the environment.

>

> My problems is getting a mainstream doc. to consider it. I went to the list's

reccomended doc. who says I have a lot of yeast. Problem is he wants skin

testing before treating, & believes in allergy shots.  Why can't he just give a

script? Some won't change their protocols.   I have burning pain, numbness, &

balance problems.

>

> The other issue, after getting treatment with another doc. using an EAV, the

burning went away.  It's a form of accupunture. So what does that mean?

>

> How do you all get enough C? Deficiency can cause problems. I had to quit

extra after reaction resembling a heart attack  in the WTB.  Can't eat citrus

since  gastritis in teens.

>  ER said it was thrush that most likely was in the esophagus.

> Do any take C made from

> tapicoa?

>

>

> I have bumps on the back of my tongue since last antibiotic last fall for what

they called bronchitis. Alternative doc. agrees. I've been using HFS yeast

fighters, which aren't enough.

>

> Kathy

[Guest guest]

OK so don't we ALL have an allergy to mold here? Wouldn't all benefit from

skin testing and shots?

I guess I have a mold allergy since I have IGG positive tests.

I am seeing an allergist end next week, by the way. I want to see what she says

about all this. It's too confusing. Are we colonized with mold if we have a

" mold issue " ? Are our homes infested with mold that is making us sick? Are we

working in buildings infested with mold?

>

>

> The allergy shots do work if you have an allergy to mold. Allergy shots are

the most natural way to treat allergies so I can't understand why people don't

consider being tested for allergies and taking the shots. I have been taking

them for 2 years and I have seen a mark difference in my health. It was not

always like this. I had several rounds of allergy shots since I was 24 years

old and none worked as well as the ones I am taking now. My doctor has been so

great at working with my body. If I feel the shots are too much, he allows me

to listen to my body and cuts back on the serum. In the past I would end up with

whelps as big as golf balls and miserable for days after the shots. The shots

my last MD gave me were a little rough the first few months but after about 3

months, my health got better and better. It is bad enough to be ill from mold

period but to have an allergy to mold while living in a sick building is double

trouble. Being tested for mold allergies should be part of anyone health care

who is living in a sick building. I can't understand why people dispute the

shots so much. A good allergist also recommends that a person leaves the

mold. There is no way of getting around the mold but to leave. I know for some

it is hard. It was very hard for me. I ended up in one mold environment after

another. I was out of work and caring for my sick mother on top of me being

sick so life was tough. I could not afford to move either but we finally did. I

don't think I could have lived too much longer in the environment.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Kathy: Do you know if they have installed Smart Meters in your area? People in

Dallas are having a hard time since they arrived here.

From what I understand, it is a digital signal from the meters so that they do

not have to be read at the location. Throwing people for a loop here. D

>

>

>

>  I wonder if it''s all an EMF issue. I felt better after moviing here until we

got the computers & sattelite going. Our phone wires  are under ground.

>

> Does anyone know if satellite receivers for TV's give off emf's? I feel weird

from flat screen  tv's too. I guess I'm screwed. Too many emf's in our world

now.  It's all since the mold.

>

[Guest guest]

I'm not sure where you are, but Janette Hope in Santa Barbara is fabulous.  She

specializes in environmental illness/wellness and has been my " hope " since I've

become so ill.  My traditional doctor insisted upon giving me one more medicine

or inhaler, even though I pleaded that it seemed they were making me worse. 

I'm

on a detoxification program through Dr. Hope that has really helped.  She

treats

the individual and doesn't " paint " us all with the same treatment brush.  I

take

a lot of supplements designed to detox my body.  She doesn't bill insurance, so

it can be expensive, but two years' worth of other doctors just treating the

symptoms and not addressing the cause was expensive and led to my current

disability, I do believe.  This treatment remains, at least for me, my best

hope

for eventually being able to work again. 

There are Environmental doctors out there who are aware of chemical

sensitivities and have discovered alternative methods of testing/treatment.  I

got tired of trying to convince medical providers of my unique reactions to

drugs/treatment that are embraced by medicine and patients.  We need doctors

who

are willing to trust our reactions and respond accordingly, at least as I see

it.

Good luck...

________________________________

From: KathyB <calicocat477@...>

Sent: Fri, August 20, 2010 5:29:17 AM

Subject: [] Re: HLA Shoemaker genotype, blood titers to molds, and

Lyme disease

 

My problems is getting a mainstream doc. to consider it. I went to the list's

reccomended doc. who says I have a lot of yeast. Problem is he wants skin

testing before treating, & believes in allergy shots.  Why can't he just give a

script? Some won't change their protocols.   I have burning pain, numbness, &

balance problems.

The other issue, after getting treatment with another doc. using an EAV, the

burning went away.  It's a form of accupunture. So what does that mean?

How do you all get enough C? Deficiency can cause problems. I had to quit extra

after reaction resembling a heart attack  in the WTB.  Can't eat citrus

since 

gastritis in teens.

 ER said it was thrush that most likely was in the esophagus.

Do any take C made from

tapicoa?

I have bumps on the back of my tongue since last antibiotic last fall for what

they called bronchitis. Alternative doc. agrees. I've been using HFS yeast

fighters, which aren't enough.

Kathy

[Guest guest]

I think it's a good idea personally, to have allergy testing and IgE,IgG,ect.

but exactly what that proves or shows might mean different things.

I had interdermal allergy testing right after my exposure, it showed I was

highly allergic to mold, a few years later I had IgG, IgE testing that showed ,

anaplaxtic, systemic,cytotoxic levels to certain molds but I never went back to

be tested for more.

now, several years later, and practiceing advoidance, I have been re-tested and

show no allergies at all, no IgE responces to molds.

now I never got allery shots, I started a routine of washing my sinuses, this

not only helps with allergies, but also with chemical re-exposures. sometimes

you can be kept reacting by something that gets lodged in your sinuses.

now, there are chemicals/toxics that can be tested by allergy testing and it's

than said that you have a allery to that, I dont believe that, I think it maybe

if you become over sensitive to something it may show up with the act of

placeing that same substance under your skin. doesn't nessasarely mean you now

have a allergy to it and well remain allergic to it the rest of your life, just

what I think.

we cant have allergy testing for everything we are exposured to in a WDB. I've

also read that haveing a very high exposure can cause a allergy reaction to that

substance.

I've also read that allergies can can and they can go.

a true allergy, you are probably born with.

> >

> >

> > The allergy shots do work if you have an allergy to mold. Allergy shots are

the most natural way to treat allergies so I can't understand why people don't

consider being tested for allergies and taking the shots. I have been taking

them for 2 years and I have seen a mark difference in my health. It was not

always like this. I had several rounds of allergy shots since I was 24 years

old and none worked as well as the ones I am taking now. My doctor has been so

great at working with my body. If I feel the shots are too much, he allows me

to listen to my body and cuts back on the serum. In the past I would end up with

whelps as big as golf balls and miserable for days after the shots. The shots

my last MD gave me were a little rough the first few months but after about 3

months, my health got better and better. It is bad enough to be ill from mold

period but to have an allergy to mold while living in a sick building is double

trouble. Being tested for mold allergies should be part of anyone health care

who is living in a sick building. I can't understand why people dispute the

shots so much. A good allergist also recommends that a person leaves the

mold. There is no way of getting around the mold but to leave. I know for some

it is hard. It was very hard for me. I ended up in one mold environment after

another. I was out of work and caring for my sick mother on top of me being

sick so life was tough. I could not afford to move either but we finally did. I

don't think I could have lived too much longer in the environment.

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Nope, not everyone who is ill from mold have an allergy to mold. It is still

good to have the test to either rule the allergy out or to be treated for the

allergy. ICG positive does not necessarily mean you are allergic to mold.

I agree, it can be quite confusing!

>

> OK so don't we ALL have an allergy to mold here? Wouldn't all benefit from

skin testing and shots?

>

> I guess I have a mold allergy since I have IGG positive tests.

>

> I am seeing an allergist end next week, by the way. I want to see what she

says about all this. It's too confusing. Are we colonized with mold if we have

a " mold issue " ? Are our homes infested with mold that is making us sick? Are

we working in buildings infested with mold?

>