visitors and mold contamination

March 17, 2011

I read the article in the files about visiting someone with MCS but it did not

mention what someone should do coming into the home who has just been in a WDB

where there is visible mold.

For example, when my husband goes out to a meeting in a church basement, what

does he have to do before he can wander through the house without making me sick

again?

Right now he is showering, putting on clean clothes, taking his used clothes in

a plastic bag upstairs into the laundry area (right off the bedroom).

We don't know if this is sufficient. He thought he could just toss his clothes

in the drier, but I say that won't do anything and that he has to wash them with

Borax...

I also want to know if he can leave those clothes in the basement and use them

the next day, or if this will just contaminate the basement again?

Then, what do I do about friends? I can't go to their houses with their moldy

basements. Can I let them into my house? (I suppose in the warmer weather I can

meet friends outside? -- my main concern is what to do about my husband who goes

out 2 - 3 x a day)

I realize that each person's sensitivity differs. I would like to start with

the most reasonable guidelines for sensitive individuals and then, if I need to,

I'll be more stringent. In the meantime, I'm totally pissed off right now at

having been subjected to another dose of toxic mold spores when I was feeling so

very good and I need to vent a bit. Thanks for 'listening.'

Janis

March 18, 2011

I have to tell anyone who comes to my home no scents

In a message dated 3/18/2011 11:27:26 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

surellabaer@... writes:

Had this problem with the synagogue my husband went to. It was bad moldy

and eventually nothing he could do would be enough and now he goes somewhere

else. It was very upsetting to both of us.

Sorry! Surella

March 18, 2011

Had this problem with the synagogue my husband went to. It was bad moldy and

eventually nothing he could do would be enough and now he goes somewhere else.

It was very upsetting to both of us.

Sorry! Surella

>

> I read the article in the files about visiting someone with MCS but it did not

mention what someone should do coming into the home who has just been in a WDB

where there is visible mold.

>

> For example, when my husband goes out to a meeting in a church basement, what

does he have to do before he can wander through the house without making me sick

again?

>

> Right now he is showering, putting on clean clothes, taking his used clothes

in a plastic bag upstairs into the laundry area (right off the bedroom).

> We don't know if this is sufficient. He thought he could just toss his

clothes in the drier, but I say that won't do anything and that he has to wash

them with Borax...

>

> I also want to know if he can leave those clothes in the basement and use them

the next day, or if this will just contaminate the basement again?

>

> Then, what do I do about friends? I can't go to their houses with their moldy

basements. Can I let them into my house? (I suppose in the warmer weather I can

meet friends outside? -- my main concern is what to do about my husband who goes

out 2 - 3 x a day)

>

> I realize that each person's sensitivity differs. I would like to start with

the most reasonable guidelines for sensitive individuals and then, if I need to,

I'll be more stringent. In the meantime, I'm totally pissed off right now at

having been subjected to another dose of toxic mold spores when I was feeling so

very good and I need to vent a bit. Thanks for 'listening.'

>

> Janis

>

March 18, 2011

Hi Janis,

Tell your husband to switch churches.

God Bless,

Joe

......................................

>

> I read the article in the files about visiting someone with MCS but it did not

mention what someone should do coming into the home who has just been in a WDB

where there is visible mold.

>

> For example, when my husband goes out to a meeting in a church basement, what

does he have to do before he can wander through the house without making me sick

again?

March 18, 2011

I was told that borax does absolutely nothing in terms of decontaminating

clothes. Ever since my initial exposure 10/09 I was told to use borox now Im

told it's useless. Also, you wash contaminated clothing in your washer and dryer

you run the risk of contaminating you those appliances as well. The only way

that I can see to avoid that is by taking the clothes in question to the laundry

mat and washing them there, but wait... mold can also be in the laundry mat not

to mention the fabric softener and dryer sheets all the other customers use in

the machines.

This is what upsets me the most, one person says something works while another

says it doesn't. One " notable professional " says to do it one way while his

" esteemed collage " says to do it another. No one actually knows and its just a

matter of sheer luck that we ever get better but yet we shell out thousands of

dollars to get advice from " professionals " who dont have a clue as to what their

talking about. Im just thankful the good Lord has answered my prayers and i seem

to be making progress.

> We don't know if this is sufficient. He thought he could just toss his

clothes in the drier, but I say that won't do anything and that he has to wash

them with Borax...

>

> Janis

>

March 18, 2011

I find the differing opinions almost everywhere, not just on this issue. In an

indoor air q group where most people are professionals, they have alot of

differing opinions on almost everything. I don't think they are clueless but

have gotten information from various sources and also view the elements of the

problem differently.

I have a job that at time is complex and I ask people for help and people come

up w different angles on same thing, all w alot of experience and knowledge. I

notice that when the problem is *clear, everyone is in agreement on how to solve

it. When the problem is not clear, there is alot of disagreement bec people see

different things as being at the heart of the problem. I think the problem is

A, someone else thinks it's B, so we have different solutions.

On laundry, of course the problem is clear but in this case there is any

controlled studies, so people have solutions based on 'facts', facts about

toxins and facts about cleaners but not had any studies to confirm this or that

works. It is exasperating but it isn't unusual. That's when we all go back to

'what works for you' " doctrin " .

>

> I was told that borax does absolutely nothing in terms of decontaminating

clothes.

March 18, 2011

Barb,

What you identify as the 'what works for you' " doctrin " is

precisely what we must deal with and solve.

And that is the hardest for us to accept. Because we need more.

We would like, and some insist, on a definitive answer. And when

that definitive answer doesn't work they get angry (justified) at the

person who offered the definitive answer.

Which is the first clue for qualifying someone for giving advise. If

they offer definitive advise then that is the first clue they really

don't understand and appreciate the uniquely individual nature of

what we are experiencing.

Some people, including occasionally on this group, get upset

because we won't tell them precisely what to do or offer a

guarantee that it will work. We had an infamous case like this a

few months back. They kept pushing and pushing over and over

for specific, definitive answers about what kind of mold, how

much mold, how to test for mold, and where to go that doesn't

have mold. They moved and slowly discovered the new place had

more mold and they were getting new symptoms.

That person later contacted me and said they had found help and

it was purely medical without any exposure component, and it

was definitely not from mold afterall. (Not sure I quite believe it

was that absolute and simple).

Others take our guidance and turn it into a prescription that must

work. Because they rely too much on an outside authority they

ignore obvious conditions and warning signs (which the outsider

has no way of seeing for themselves) and end up in a situation no

better than, sometimes worse than, what they just had.

Others insist on what brand and model of air purifier will cure

them, or which vitamin, or distilled vs filter water. Which brand of

paint or essential oil or vacuum cleaner is best. Not realizing they

may be too specific, not seeing the forest for the trees.

Another more recently flooded this group (and others) with some

extremely serious symptoms, complaints, and accusations about

how they were deliberately being harmed. Suddenly, that person

is no longer posting. But in this case it had a happy ending.

They kept fighting with a landlord instead of moving. Once they

were convinced to leave the house they moved into a hotel room

and were 90% better within 48 hours. They started looking for a

new home and found one they insisted was too small, not

supportive of their higher standard of living, wrong neighborhood,

etc, BUT... the environmental conditions were fantastic. They no

longer post or contact me because they have a safe place to live

and they are getting healthier.

BTW, they moved all their belongings into the new place and had

no problem with cross-contamination.

I emphasize this to reinforce the point you made, Barb, of " what

works for you. " Not everybody has to leave the house naked and

flee. Some do and it is absolutely necessary that they do. But not

everybody does. It's not always mold. It's often mold PLUS other

exposures.

It takes detective work with careful challanging of a series of

guesses. Which means we must be forgiving of ourselves when

we continue to make mistakes. Some in the past have insisted

that this is horrible advise because they can't afford to make

mistakes, they need accurate directions right now. Unfortunately,

if that approach hasn't worked before then it won't work now. And

we must then be willing to make mistakes as we learn what

works, what doesn't work, and how we know. For ourselves.

What works for one may harm another. What harms one of us

may heal another. We must keep this in mind as we share our

experiences, support others with our stories, and struggle with

each other's always changing situation.

BTW, there have been lots of awesome postings lately doing

exactly what I just described. There are a group of you who are

true leaders and I encourage you to continue.

Carl Grimes

Healthy Habitats LLC

-----

I find the differing opinions almost everywhere, not just on this issue. In an

indoor air q group where most people are professionals, they have alot of

differing opinions on almost everything. I don't think they are clueless but

have gotten information from various sources and also view the elements of the

problem differently.

I have a job that at time is complex and I ask people for help and people come

up w different angles on same thing, all w alot of experience and knowledge. I

notice that when the problem is *clear, everyone is in agreement on how to solve

it. When the problem is not clear, there is alot of disagreement bec people see

different things as being at the heart of the problem. I think the problem is A,

someone else thinks it's B, so we have different solutions.

On laundry, of course the problem is clear but in this case there is any

controlled studies, so people have solutions based on 'facts', facts about

toxins and facts about cleaners but not had any studies to confirm this or that

works. It is exasperating but it isn't unusual. That's when we all go back to

'what works for you' " doctrin " .

>

> I was told that borax does absolutely nothing in terms of decontaminating

clothes.

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March 19, 2011

Barb,

What you identify as the 'what works for you' " doctrin " is

precisely what we must deal with and solve

Carl and Barb: What you say is true. The major problem is that most of the

individuals, particularly the new members, keep harping on the issue of molds

and my. They do not understand that the WDB is a complex mixture of fungi,

bacteria and their by-products. The health problems arise from an exposure to

this complex environment. Therefore, it is impossible to determine which of the

contaminants (e.g. fungus, mycotoxins, endotoxins, beta glucans, extracellular

proteins) that are person adversely responds to. Therefore, what works for one

individual may not work for another. Probably the most overlooked indoor

contaminants are the Actinomycetes (Streptomyces, Mycobacterium, Nocardia as

examples). These organisms can set up serious respiratory disease, e.g.

Hypersensitivity pneumonitis, Mediastinal sarcoidosis), etc. If a person has

lung disease, then what are they responding to? These are some of the problems

that victims of WDB are facing.

Jack Dwayne Thrasher, Ph.D.

Toxicologist/Immunotoxicologist/Fetaltoxicologist

www.drthrasher.org

toxicologist1@...

Off: 916-745-4703

Cell: 575-937-1150

Lee Crawley, M.ED., LADC

Trauma Specialist

sandracrawley@...

916-745-4703 - Off

775-309-3994 - Cell

This message and any attachments forwarded with it is to be considered

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Thank you in advance for your compliance.

March 20, 2011

I cannot keep plants in the house cause the mold in the soil makes me sick

Janet

In a message dated 3/20/2011 9:45:18 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,

urbanpinetrees3@... writes:

These gram-positive bacteria may be why my son has problems being around

soil which has been turned up. It seems to cause neurological symptoms (or

immune response). Of course he reacts to mold and other chemicals as well, so

it could be VOC's released.

-Kate

>

> Barb,

>

> What you identify as the 'what works for you' " doctrin " is

> precisely what we must deal with and solve

>

> Carl and Barb: What you say is true. The major problem is that most of

the individuals, particularly the new members, keep harping on the issue of

molds and my. They

March 20, 2011

These gram-positive bacteria may be why my son has problems being around soil

which has been turned up. It seems to cause neurological symptoms (or immune

response). Of course he reacts to mold and other chemicals as well, so it could

be VOC's released.

-Kate

>

> Barb,

>

> What you identify as the 'what works for you' " doctrin " is

> precisely what we must deal with and solve

>

> Carl and Barb: What you say is true. The major problem is that most of the