Guest guest Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 We are looking at a house to rent. It is an older home that has been renovated 18 months ago. It seems really good. But, I found one cross piece of wood in the attic that has a white substance on it. One area looked a bit like lichen. It was overhead so I could not see it too clearly. Does anyone know if there is a toxic mold that is white? Should I be concerned? Kathleen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Kathleen, There are several questions you are asking. 1. Yes, there are white molds. And other substances can be white and fuzzy, especially minerals from evaporated moisture. 2. Not all molds always produce mycotoxins, regardless of the color, but many do. 3. Dr Thrasher's comments should be scrupulously considered. There is much, much more to consider than mycotoxins. 4. Another question is should you be concerned with the white substance on one cross-piece of wood in the attic? Most likely not. Here's why: a. Even if it is mold, and it probably is, did it grow because of conditions in the attic? If so, then the house has a problem. If not, then it most likely grew on the wood before it was installed and the house should be okay. If it grew after it was put in the attic why did only that single piece of wood have enough moisture to grow mold? Which means it probably didn't grow in the attic and is what many call " lumberyard mold. " True lumberyard is different than other molds which grow on the suface of damp wood. This is one time when a sample may be helpful. If it is Ceratocystis, Ophiostoma or other related molds then it grew before it was installed. If it is typical molds like Penicillium, Aspergillus, Cladosporium, etc then we don't know where it grew. So you need to know if the house has a history of leaks, if the climate is conducive to condensation in the attic, or other reason why it grew in the house. Now, if it grew in the house how could it have done so only on one piece and not others? b. Regardless of when it grew on the wood, can it get into the house where you live? If not, it will be of no greater concern than a rotting piece of wood laying on the ground outside the house. This is harder to answer because I don't know how the house is built, if there are pathways between the attic and the living space, or if the living space is under less pressure than the attic. Without that pressure difference nothing in the attic will migrate to where you breath. If you are reacting while in the house then attic " stuff " wasn't being pressured into the living space while you were there and it hasn't accumulated on surfaces either. Which is why I say it probably isn't a problem - but I don't have much information. Mold spore sampling won't answer any of these questions. Rely on a professional assessment of moisture, materials, systems, history and your own experience while in the house. Carl Grimes Healthy Habitats LLC ----- We are looking at a house to rent. It is an older home that has been renovated 18 months ago. It seems really good. But, I found one cross piece of wood in the attic that has a white substance on it. One area looked a bit like lichen. It was overhead so I could not see it too clearly. Does anyone know if there is a toxic mold that is white? Should I be concerned? Kathleen ---------- The following section of this message contains a file attachment prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. ---- File information ----------- File: DEFAULT.BMP Date: 16 Jun 2009, 0:10 Size: 358 bytes. Type: Unknown Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Kathleen, Carl makes very good points. Whether or not the mold is toxic is not the important question. As Carl indicted, how the mold (if it is mold) got there is the most important issue. If the damaged section of wood is an isolated piece that was installed with mold, it is not likely a problem. Since you are looking to rent the house, perhaps you can get some more information on the renovations that took place 18 months ago. If the renovations included roof repairs or other work in the attic, a concern could exist regarding whether or not appropriate containment measures were employed. If extensive work was done that could have involved water damage and mold in any areas of the home, culturable and spore trap air samples along with settled dust samples for ERMI or culture analysis could be in order. Good luck. Connie Morbach Sanit-Air, Inc. > > Kathleen, > > There are several questions you are asking. > > 1. Yes, there are white molds. And other substances can be white > and fuzzy, especially minerals from evaporated moisture. > > 2. Not all molds always produce mycotoxins, regardless of the > color, but many do. > > 3. Dr Thrasher's comments should be scrupulously considered. > There is much, much more to consider than mycotoxins. > > 4. Another question is should you be concerned with the white > substance on one cross-piece of wood in the attic? Most likely > not. Here's why: > > a. Even if it is mold, and it probably is, did it grow because of > conditions in the attic? If so, then the house has a problem. If not, > then it most likely grew on the wood before it was installed and > the house should be okay. If it grew after it was put in the attic > why did only that single piece of wood have enough moisture to > grow mold? Which means it probably didn't grow in the attic and > is what many call " lumberyard mold. " True lumberyard is different > than other molds which grow on the suface of damp wood. This is > one time when a sample may be helpful. If it is Ceratocystis, > Ophiostoma or other related molds then it grew before it was > installed. If it is typical molds like Penicillium, Aspergillus, > Cladosporium, etc then we don't know where it grew. So you > need to know if the house has a history of leaks, if the climate is > conducive to condensation in the attic, or other reason why it > grew in the house. Now, if it grew in the house how could it have > done so only on one piece and not others? > > b. Regardless of when it grew on the wood, can it get into the > house where you live? If not, it will be of no greater concern than > a rotting piece of wood laying on the ground outside the house. > This is harder to answer because I don't know how the house is > built, if there are pathways between the attic and the living space, > or if the living space is under less pressure than the attic. Without > that pressure difference nothing in the attic will migrate to where > you breath. If you are reacting while in the house then attic " stuff " > wasn't being pressured into the living space while you were there > and it hasn't accumulated on surfaces either. > > Which is why I say it probably isn't a problem - but I don't have > much information. Mold spore sampling won't answer any of > these questions. Rely on a professional assessment of moisture, > materials, systems, history and your own experience while in the > house. > > Carl Grimes > Healthy Habitats LLC > > ----- > We are looking at a house to rent. It is an older home that has been > renovated 18 months ago. It seems really good. But, I found one cross > piece of wood in the attic that has a white substance on it. One area > looked a bit like lichen. It was overhead so I could not see it too clearly. > Does anyone know if there is a toxic mold that is white? Should I be > concerned? > Kathleen > > > > ---------- > > The following section of this message contains a file attachment > prepared for transmission using the Internet MIME message format. > If you are using Pegasus Mail, or any other MIME-compliant system, > you should be able to save it or view it from within your mailer. > If you cannot, please ask your system administrator for assistance. > > ---- File information ----------- > File: DEFAULT.BMP > Date: 16 Jun 2009, 0:10 > Size: 358 bytes. > Type: Unknown > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2010 Report Share Posted March 15, 2010 As Carl said. There is white mold. Also, most of the Actinobacteria are while to a pale cream color. However, some are pigmented, but usually when exposed to light. This is particularly true with the chromophobe group of Mycobacteria. You said that the home had been remediated. How well documented is the remediation. It is recognized that at least 50 % of the microbial growth is hidden from view, e.g. attic, crawl space, wall cavities, under kitchen cabinets. I had a case where the only mold growth was under the kitchen cabinets, hallway wall cavities and Den wall cavity where the water leakage occurred. The infant born into this home died from Reye's Syndrome with aflatoxins isolated from the liver. The point I am trying to make is that visual inspection does not necessarily mean the home is from microbial growth. Insist upon full disclosure to the contamination. As Carl has pointed out before, air samples are not necessarily indicative of damage. Jack-Dwayne: Thrasher, Ph.D. Toxicologist/Immunotoxicologist/Fetaltoxicologist www.drthrasher.org toxicologist1@... Off: 916-745-4703 Cell: 575-937-1150 L. Crawley, M.ED., LADC Trauma Specialist sandracrawley@... 916-745-4703 - Off 775-309-3994 - Cell This message and any attachments forwarded with it is to be considered privileged and confidential. The forwarding or redistribution of this message (and any attachments) without my prior written consent is strictly prohibited and may violate privacy laws. Once the intended purpose of this message has been served, please destroy the original message contents. If you have received this message in error, please reply immediately to advise the sender of the miscommunication and then delete the message and any copies you have printed. Thank you in advance for your compliance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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