Guest guest Posted October 23, 2010 Report Share Posted October 23, 2010 Kathy, Most pre-sale inspections are honest and do catch problems. Errors happen and some inspectors are better than others.. Not just mold. Could be a missed cracked slab or a wiring problem or... You have to realize that we are outlayers on this board. Yes we are sick. Yes, so are many others. But how many people do you know in your everyday life that have been made severely ill from poor IAQ or have ended up in litigation for a bad inspection? So, its not accurate to say inspectors don't do a good job. Just some inspectors. That doesn't mean those who have been harmed do not deserve help and respect. In a message dated 10/23/2010 9:27:06 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, calicocat477@... writes: Add how do we get honest purchase inspections? Sellers can lie on disclosures. If you don't have money for an attorney what does the average person do? Go to small claims to get something? How do we present a case & the right evidence. Some of us couldn't swing the tests. It should be a law to use moisture meters in inspections as evidence. Some things to think about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 Kathy, my story is quite similar. Thankfully, my inspector did not have me sign the dreaded release, so I'm going after his insurance. Twice I have bought homes and twice the inspectors missed major problems that have brought me to financial ruin. If I ever have the money to buy again, I am skipping the inspector and having only specialists look at it: structural engineer, HVAC specialist, mold expert. In terms of renting, you're right: the contracts are one-sided. There are ways to get help--in my state, there are tons of resources for tenants--but depending on the city, the laws may be skewed towards the landlord. When I first moved to this state, I moved into a moldy house--of course I didn't realize it was moldy. I got a clue when water splashed from the cats dish formed mildew within 24 hours! There was so much moisture--a leak in the crawl space, heavy rains, no gutters, etc. Thankfully, I was just outside the city, so there were no city laws requiring me to go through a lenghty process to get help. Thus, I could do a " constructive eviction " --basically a self-eviction based on the fact that the place was uninhabitable. I called a tenant helpline and got help with how to do that legally. I was out in just a couple of days. The landlord took my deposit and I took her tool small claims. I did my research. I found an older case in which she had kept a tenant' deposit, claiming she hadn't cleaned. Guess what? That tenant took photos that showed before and after photos of mold and mildew and how she cleaned it. The landlord had tried to claim that she didn't know mold existed in the house. When I sprung that evidence on her, even the judge broke his facade of neutrality to congratulate me on my research! Needless to say I won--plus punitive damages!! So that was a triumph. But of course, I shouldn't have had to do that. When landlords are issued or receive renewal of certificates of occupancy, moisture and mold ought to be inspected--but baring an obvious problemof sheets of black mold, that's just not on the radar. That coud be a target of activism--start with city inspections. Sorry, all, if there are any typos. My iPhone likes to substitute odd words when I misspell. Sent from my iPhone On Oct 24, 2010, at 10:27 AM, " Tug " <tug_slug@...> wrote: Kathy, once my inspector completed his inspection and assured me everything there was ok and I signed on the dotted line that pretty much released everyone else from any liabilities. I could have went after the HOA and the inspector but without the $25K I was going to need for litigation and the specialists to prove my case I was pretty much on my own. The condo has been remediated twice but to date after Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 Oh, I'm sorry your keyboard broke! I had to laugh at how cute it was to see a broken laptop in action--like a little kid was typing or a meandering cat happened across it. Thanks for the smile! Sent from my iPhone On Oct 24, 2010, at 10:49 AM, " barb b w " <barb1283@...> wrote: (First off need to mention m laptop keboard broke this am so it ma be hard to read m posts ntil it is fixed or I get a new laptop). CSM, I have discovered that dilted w more water and sipped slowl , is more tolerated b m gi sstem. > > Sharon, > > We're all frustrated. Mainstream has no idea. How do we change it? > I've been ignored by 2 doc's so far. Won't run a mold antibody test from Shoemakesr book. Look the other way, say insurance won't pay for it. > > Wouldn't hurt them to give an anti fungal a trial. The thing is they need to realize we need for years. > > Not all can handle CSM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 have you checked the laws in your state against inspections?  Here you have 4 years, if someeone did not properly disclose, inspection problems, contractors, etc. Check the laws.  The dotted line dos not mean the end.  Did the HOA disclose ? If they knew they had previous problems they should have disclosed again different in every state.  God Bless !! dragonflymcs Mayleen ________________________________ From: Tug <tug_slug@...> Sent: Sun, October 24, 2010 11:27:01 AM Subject: [] Re: Law changes?  Kathy, once my inspector completed his inspection and assured me everything there was ok and I signed on the dotted line that pretty much released everyone else from any liabilities. I could have went after the HOA and the inspector but without the $25K I was going to need for litigation and the specialists to prove my case I was pretty much on my own. The condo has been remediated twice but to date after two separate inspections one by an independant mold remediator the other by an industrial hygienists the unit still has mold and is uninhabitable. Once the unit goes on the market I will do everything in my power (legally) to make sure the next owner doesnt buy the townhouse w/o knowing about the mold problem. I was told that the last 3 owners of that particular unit all let the unit go into foreclosure but even though I know their names from mail that has been sent to the address I cant get ahold of them to find out why they allowed the condo to go into foreclousre. If I could find one of the previous owners that would testify their was mold in the crawl space than maybe I would have a case against the HOA , the bank and the seller but havent been able to locate any of the previous owners as of yet. This is the third day at my sisters house and my thinking is MUCH clearer and its given me a new sense of drive to legally go after the individuals who did this to me and make them reimburse me for my losses. There was a three foot horizontal crack where sewage was seeping through the foundation. there's no way the seller couldnt see it but proving it is a completely different story. Hopefully you'll be able to see this picture. The pool of water is a 6 inch hole that was immediately filled with sewage minutes after it was dug. As you can see by the crack in the foundation had the seller gone down into the crawl space which he had he would have noticed the crack but never mentioned it in the disclosure and the inspector never mentioned it on his reports http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l79/tug_slug/P1010101.jpg > Add how do we get honest purchase inspections? Sellers can lie on disclosures. > > If you don't have money for an attorney what does the average person do? Go to >small claims to get something? How do we present a case & the right evidence. >Some of us couldn't swing the tests. > > > It should be a law to use moisture meters in inspections as evidence. Some >things to think about. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 Mold tort and mold personal injury is extremely hard to win (for all the reasons we know; it has nothing to do with rightness or justice, it has to do with which side tells the better story and it has to do with " experts " that are in the pockets of insurance and defense counsel) and so nobody will do it on a contingency basis, unless there is a certainty of winning and unless the parties that are being brought to court have a lot of money, so that the effort is worth it. So mold cases that usually go forward are those in which a housing developer or construction company is to blame. The ones that go forward aren't against HOAs with little in the reserves. It's not the laws that are the question; it's that you have to have at least twenty grand--any good attorney tells potential clients that, because in reality, it can cost much, much more than that. From: dragonflymcs <dragonflymcs@...> Subject: Re: [] Re: Law changes? Date: Monday, October 25, 2010, 12:25 AM have you checked the laws in your state against inspections?  Here you have 4 years, if someeone did not properly disclose, inspection problems, contractors, etc. Check the laws.  The dotted line dos not mean the end.  Did the HOA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 24, 2010 Report Share Posted October 24, 2010 HOA's have Insurance policies too. I myself am weiry of attornies who want monies up front. I do not trust those. Many advertise they do mold, the truth is very few are up to date at all with the issue.  Nor do they know what they are doing. I say keep calling around for an attorney, read the laws not what you are told by an attorney. You would not believe the difference since it leads to interpretation sometimes. Knowledge.   God Bless !! dragonflymcs Mayleen ________________________________ From: Advocate Now <advocate_now@...> Sent: Sun, October 24, 2010 9:02:53 PM Subject: Re: [] Re: Law changes?  Mold tort and mold personal injury is extremely hard to win (for all the reasons we know; it has nothing to do with rightness or justice, it has to do with which side tells the better story and it has to do with " experts " that are in the pockets of insurance and defense counsel) and so nobody will do it on a contingency basis, unless there is a certainty of winning and unless the parties that are being brought to court have a lot of money, so that the effort is worth it. So mold cases that usually go forward are those in which a housing developer or construction company is to blame. The ones that go forward aren't against HOAs with little in the reserves. It's not the laws that are the question; it's that you have to have at least twenty grand--any good attorney tells potential clients that, because in reality, it can cost much, much more than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 25, 2010 Report Share Posted October 25, 2010 I've talked to the leading mold attorney in my state, as well as lesser attorneys. I have read the laws, also. HOA insurance companies usually have mold exlusions in their policies--ours does. No reputable attorney asks for money upfront except for a retainer. I used to be a paralegal, so I have intimate knowledge of the process. Most of us are sunk without money sitting around to pay attorney's fees--that's just the sad fact of the matter. Contigency cases are only done in personal injury cases--almost never in fraud or breach of contract suits--and only when there's a certain certainty of winning. That's why it's easy to find and hire an attorney for a car accident injury claim, where one party is cleary responsible, but not for mold. Sent from my iPhone On Oct 24, 2010, at 9:48 PM, dragonflymcs <dragonflymcs@...> wrote: HOA's have Insurance policies too. I myself am weiry of attornies who want monies up front. I do not trust those. Many advertise they do mold, the truth is very few are up to date at all with the issue. Nor do they know what they are doing. I say keep calling around for an attorney, read the laws not what you are told by an attorney. You would not believe the difference since it leads to interpretation sometimes. Knowledge. God Bless !! dragonflymcs Mayleen ________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 25, 2010 Report Share Posted October 25, 2010 once attornys heard my case was federal thhey wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole In a message dated 10/25/2010 8:22:46 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, advocate_now@... writes: I've talked to the leading mold attorney in my state, as well as lesser attorneys. I have read the laws, also. HOA insurance companies usually have mold exlusions in their policies--ours does. No reputable attorney asks for money upfront except for a retainer. I used to be a paralegal, so I have intimate knowledge of the process. Most of us are sunk without money sitting around to pay attorney's fees--that's just the sad fact of the matter. Contigency cases are only done in personal injury cases--almost never in fraud or breach of contract suits--and only when there's a certain certainty of winning. That's why it's easy to find and hire an attorney for a car accident injury claim, where one party is cleary responsible, but not for mold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 25, 2010 Report Share Posted October 25, 2010 The greatest cost is for the water damage. Much of those procedures also handle the mold concerns. The extra cost for the mold is often a smaller portion of the total cost. It is almost always a mistake to push the mold over the water damage. It gives those responsible, including the insurance company, an easy way out. Also, they want you to believe that if there is mold then nothing is covered. They are still responsible for the water damage and the mold exclusion (or cap) only applies to the extras beyond the water. If the adjuster does not respond quickly enough for the water to be removed and the structure dried before the mold has a chance to grow then the mood is subsequent to the water and they can often be held liable for the mold despite their exclusions. Carl Grimes Healthy Habitats LLC (fm my Blackberry) [] Re: Law changes? Mayleen I dont know about all HOA's insurance policies but I can tell you the insurance that insured the HOA I lived in didnt cover mold. They will pay for the damages caused by the water leak but they under no circumstances cover mold. > > HOA's have Insurance policies too. I myself am weiry of attornies who want > monies up front. I do not trust those. Many advertise they do mold, the truth > is very few are up to date at all with the issue.  Nor do they know what they > are doing. I say keep calling around for an attorney, read the laws not what > you are told by an attorney. You would not believe the difference since it leads > to interpretation sometimes. Knowledge.  >  > > God Bless !! > dragonflymcs > Mayleen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 25, 2010 Report Share Posted October 25, 2010 The attorney I referred to told me this too. She said that when making a claim against insurance, talk about damage and not mold. Sent from my iPhone On Oct 25, 2010, at 9:07 PM, " Carl Grimes " <grimes@...> wrote: It is almost always a mistake to push the mold over the water damage. It gives those responsible, including the insurance company, an easy way out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 25, 2010 Report Share Posted October 25, 2010 Medicaid is at it all time high on bad. Dr's dropping like flies. When I told the neuro, he went to his computer, I helped him pull it up, he saved the file with my name. He also read while I was there. Then along comes medicaid problems. Back to scatch.  He was the only provider in my area for his specialty. Many will suffer at the hands of MEDICAID. In Arizona transportation was cut to appointments even for those for whom it was a life or death situation. People cannot get to dialysis appointments etc. Try to put it on CD, I hope he looks listens ........Good Luck !   God Bless !! dragonflymcs Mayleen ________________________________ From: KathyB <calicocat477@...> Sent: Mon, October 25, 2010 3:04:36 PM Subject: [] Re: Law changes?  It's good to hear mainstream reading the paper. No I haven't. I had the book in hand w test pages, Neuro didn't seem to want to look at it so far.  I'll put the paper on a CD & send it to the Neuro. I'm so sorry about Medicaid problems. Kathy From: dragonflymcs <dragonflymcs@...>  Re: [] Re: ] Law changes?  Have you taken them the CIRS-WDB paper ?? My neuro was excited to see it. Then MEDICIAD messed it all up and had a problem with him, nothing to do with me or patients.   The other lady is so fustrated.....................we both are sick and tired of idiots God Bless !! dragonflymcs Mayleen < Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 Excellent specifics, Connie. The PPE should be covered also. Because the surfaces should be cleaned of dust that takes care of most of the mold. Carl Grimes Healthy Habitats LLC (fm my Blackberry) [] Re: Law changes? In some cases, the costs associated with containment should also be covered, If the water damage is Category 3 or 3, the IICRC S500 recommends the use of partitions and HEPA-filtered negative air to control the spread of contaminants to non-affected areas. Connie Morbach, M.S., CHMM, CIE sanit-air.com > > The greatest cost is for the water damage. Much of those procedures also handle the mold concerns. The extra cost for the mold is often a smaller portion of the total cost. > > It is almost always a mistake to push the mold over the water damage. It gives those responsible, including the insurance company, an easy way out. > > Also, they want you to believe that if there is mold then nothing is covered. They are still responsible for the water damage and the mold exclusion (or cap) only applies to the extras beyond the water. > > If the adjuster does not respond quickly enough for the water to be removed and the structure dried before the mold has a chance to grow then the mood is subsequent to the water and they can often be held liable for the mold despite their exclusions. > > Carl Grimes > Healthy Habitats LLC > (fm my Blackberry) > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 26, 2010 Report Share Posted October 26, 2010 All policies vary so it is hard to just state anything for a fact. Then they should fix the water damage and be liable for the mess they left behind just the same .  Just an opinion.  Sorry about all your pain.  God Bless !! dragonflymcs Mayleen ________________________________ From: Tug <tug_slug@...> Sent: Mon, October 25, 2010 6:01:53 PM Subject: [] Re: Law changes?  Mayleen I dont know about all HOA's insurance policies but I can tell you the insurance that insured the HOA I lived in didnt cover mold. They will pay for the damages caused by the water leak but they under no circumstances cover mold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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